Fraternities...Waste of Time or Potentially Helpful?

In general, do you think frats are a waste of time or are they a good experience?

Are Fraternities worth it?

You should consider joining a social fraternity an individual choice that will neither improve or decrease your chances of getting a job in finance.

Social Fraternity

The national fraternity can be a networking channel but pledging for access to this channel is probably a waste of time and money.

This is because your fraternity will require you to invest a considerable amount of time and effort into their chapter before and pledging, not to mention paying dues. This is not to say that fraternities are bad per se but joining them as a means of career advancement is a waste of resources.

Business Fraternity

Business fraternities can offer you some additional

At best, the network you develop can help you get a job or at least get your foot in the door. It can provide some interesting talking points during interviews, especially if you held one of the leadership positions (pres, vp, finance, etc).

At worst, it checks the box that you did something outside of your coursework while at university

Are you ready to step up your networking game?

The finance networking guide has detailed guidance on how to network with Wall Street professionals. Learn the most important skill for a successful career in finance.

Networking Mastery

Recommended Reading

 

No. Doing a frat was a huge waste of time and money at school, specifically at a non target. If you want the peak of your accomplishments to be in school, go for it. It's a little bit of a blanket statement but from what I experienced I wished I would have taken that time and put it to use elsewhere.

Ace all your PE interview questions with the WSO Private Equity Prep Pack: http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/private-equity-interview-prep-questions
 
westfald:
No. Doing a frat was a huge waste of time and money at school, specifically at a non target. If you want the peak of your accomplishments to be in school, go for it. It's a little bit of a blanket statement but from what I experienced I wished I would have taken that time and put it to use elsewhere.

If all you did was party, then I see what you're saying. But many people gain serious leadership skills and experience valuable personal growth in a fraternity. Yeah I know that sounded corney, but 'tis true.

 
Best Response
westfald:
No. Doing a frat was a huge waste of time and money at school, specifically at a non target.

I would like to disagree, in fact you can argue almost the opposite. If you are at a target and have added fraternal connections, that's just a bonus. You already have a leg up b/c you go to a better school and have recruiters come to you. On the flip side, you can join a fraternity at a non-target state school and be surrounded by a bunch of guys whom have parents/family that have potentially done very well for themselves. This is a generalized statement, but many people that join fraternities are either one of two things: 1) they enjoy the male comradely and the social aspect, 2) their father did it and/or it is of social stature. Unless you join the shittiest fraternity ever, you will likely be surrounded by kids who have some cash to burn and respectable families.

All being said, I'm obviously a proponent of fraternities. I think that it does teach you great leadership skills and how to manage people. If you can control a chapter of +80 guys that are all 19 and 20-somethings, then why can't you manage professionals. I know that in my interview process, I always drew examples of leadership from my time in my chapter.

Finally, if you want to join just for connections then stay on the sideline. You will add no value and no one will like you if you are there to try to leach off some kids second uncles friends brother who is an MD at Morgan Stanley.

 
SarahP:
You will learn how to love Abercrombie & Fitch and drive a big truck with loud pipes

If the "frat" wears abercrombie or hollister, it's not a real fraternity, it's a homosexual night club= AVOID AT ALL COSTS

if it is a real fraternity, members will be wearing polo ralph lauren or brooks brothers. that's when you know to join- good networking

 

Seriously, I would not join a frat just for the networking purposes. Except maybe the business ones like AKPsi and DSP, or something like that. Are you referring to these or social fraternities?

I was also able to leverage my experiences as president of my fraternity, running events, volunteering, risk management, dealing with university administrators, etc. during interviews. I also greatly enjoyed the people I was in the fraternity with and my time in it. I know friends who joined other frats, didn't like people and just went inactive. No one really even acknowledged them, and I can't imagine got much out of it.

----------------------------------------------------------------- Hug It Out
 
Ari_Gold:
Seriously, I would not join a frat just for the networking purposes. Except maybe the business ones like AKPsi and DSP, or something like that. Are you referring to these or social fraternities?

I was also able to leverage my experiences as president of my fraternity, running events, volunteering, risk management, dealing with university administrators, etc. during interviews. I also greatly enjoyed the people I was in the fraternity with and my time in it. I know friends who joined other frats, didn't like people and just went inactive. No one really even acknowledged them, and I can't imagine got much out of it.

Nah, I'm thinking about joining a social one. Again, a lot of you guys seem to be thinking about targets, but I'm at a non-target, so again, I'm wondering if this will help me at all in this regard. Once again, I'll use the example of if a Wharton grad who went to the same frat but not chapter as me looks at my resume if he may give me a slight bump since we were part of the same organization, even though we're not in the same chapter.

As for why I'm joining it. It can potentially help me network (some kids have connections, like this one guy whose dad was a partner at PWC, but probably not in i-banking/consulting), and because one of my friends joined this fraternity and I think it really helped him come out of his shell, so I'm hoping I can too. Plus, I hope to gain leadership and all that good stuff, and this seems like a decent social frat since they have the highest GPA on campus and whatnot. So some of you expressed concern that I'll be an A&F wearing d-bag, but there seem to be lots of different personalities in this fraternity, which I enjoy.

So yeah. Hope that clarifies my question.

 

i was not in a fraternity. frankly, i did not think i needed a bunch of people to confirm my identity and i certainly did not need the extra cost or submission associated with being a frat boy. Especially when i could enjoy the parties by way of friends or go to someone elses off campus open party. Yeah, that is a bit harsh. I know. Its just my lone wolf chewing on a raw bone, so take a grain of salt if you like.

Also, everyone keeps talking about the many leadership experiences, but there are few set positions in a fraternity to spin on a resume versus the number of members who just participate and socialize. I would say that makes these opportunities limited. i get the feeling you want to do this beyond just networking and leadership, IBREJECT and that youre just looking for something to tip the scales. i say go for it. you cant do everything for some future job.

as to your question regarding the wharton example...the answer is maybe. if all other aspects of your resume are in order, and its a close decision then i think youre likely to get the tip. of course theres a much stronger bond for same chapters, but frat boys tend to look out for each other across the nation - ive seen it in action.

 
wintonheights:
Also, everyone keeps talking about the many leadership experiences, but there are few set positions in a fraternity to spin on a resume versus the number of members who just participate and socialize. I would say that makes these opportunities limited. i get the feeling you want to do this beyond just networking and leadership, IBREJECT and that youre just looking for something to tip the scales. i say go for it. you cant do everything for some future job.

See here is your problem, you were not in one. You are incorrect with regard to positions and their ability to create leadership qualities. Yes, there can only be one President and one Vice President, etc. Where you argument becomes invalid is the simple fact that you have never been motivated by 80 people to do anything. There will always be those who just go for the social aspect, but if you care you will gain leadership qualities.

Think about it for half a second. Lets compare a fraternity to a bee hive. Can you have 80/80 members being leaders? or do you need some worker bees? I can promise you that if you feel passionate about the fraternity and its well being, you will develop leadership qualities.

All that being said, the OP probably doesn't need to rush if he is asking us if its "good for networking."

 

If you're religious at all, one compromise may be a religious organization. When the occasional Methodist sees "Wesley Foundation" on my resume, they usually smile and ask a few questions.

There's usually also a lot of leadership opportunities- especially if you're really passionate about what you believe in and you join a more moderate organization. Sometimes my religious work crops up when people ask me about leadership experiences, and discussing work involved with a reasonably moderate religious organization from a secular perspective isn't really taboo in an interview.

 

I would definitely say to join a fraternity but like other comments to do it for the social aspects as well. At my school, >75% of the people going into investment banking are greek. One house even had more than both the business fraternities combined this past year.

I've had alums in IB/PE look over my resume and hook me up with interviews.

And about PENN, their strongest fraternities are local chapters due to what happened there in the 90s, so don't count on that chapter helping out.

 

Well, despite being told that "(I) have a 95% chance of getting a bid", I didn't end up getting one, so this is all a moot point now. So, now that my ECs are going to suck unless I somehow manage to get a leadership position and I'm not going to have any fun whatsoever in college, I'm going to have to settle on being an accountant for the rest of my life and never making 6 figures while doing remedial shit over and over again. My life is awesome!

 

if your as negative and depressing-sounding in real life as you are on these boards, no wonder you didnt get a bid.

be more positive and upbeat about things. and for gods sake, change your user name - you're not a banking reject yet, but with that attitude you're well on your way there.

 
twilightgirl:
if your as negative and depressing-sounding in real life as you are on these boards, no wonder you didnt get a bid.

be more positive and upbeat about things. and for gods sake, change your user name - you're not a banking reject yet, but with that attitude you're well on your way there.

agreed. dude, youre a college sophomore. i didnt get a job in banking til my full-time offer. even if you dont get a FT offer out of college, you still have plenty of chances to get in. gotta work on the attitude, and youll be surprised at how many doors open up if ya do.

 
dew2229:
twilightgirl:
if your as negative and depressing-sounding in real life as you are on these boards, no wonder you didnt get a bid.

be more positive and upbeat about things. and for gods sake, change your user name - you're not a banking reject yet, but with that attitude you're well on your way there.

agreed. dude, youre a college sophomore. i didnt get a job in banking til my full-time offer. even if you dont get a FT offer out of college, you still have plenty of chances to get in. gotta work on the attitude, and youll be surprised at how many doors open up if ya do.

Trust me man, I don't enjoy being negative but there's a reason why I am this way. You have no idea how many times I've worked my ass off in my life only to come up with nothing. You have no idea how many times I've gone out of my way to help people out only to get tossed aside when I needed their help. So far, all of my goals in life haven't fallen through. By this time in my life, I expected to get into an ivy league school or respectable state school like Haas/Ross, secured some sort of finance or other job, get an investment banking internship, even at a MM. What are my results? A piece of shit state school that I'm embarrassed to tell people I go to (and btw, I sacrificed any social life outside of clubs in high school to get into the good schools, but of course, none of that effort went anywhere), got rejected from EVERY bank I contacted for an internship (TWICE! I tried last year...nothing, I try this year...nothing), my relatives have been absolutely useless in terms of getting me an internship, my school has no alumni database, so I can't contact any alums in banking, and I am not getting a 4.0 even at said piece of shit school. Now, my one hope for having a social life and maybe turning around my college career has gone to shit even though, again, I only had a 5% chance of not getting in and despite the fact that I payed for a couple of those fuckers' dinners while none of the other recruits did.

I've worked my ass off and nothing has worked out, and I'm probably killing myself on the inside with all the stress I'm putting on myself. I know I'm venting right now, but my life seriously so far has been one fucking disaster after another despite the fact that I try to be a good person (help others out) and that I try my best. So yeah, I am negative, but please understand that there's a reason why I am this way. At this point, I really don't know what to do with myself and my life. If anyone has any suggestions, I'm open to them, but I'm really wondering whether I should just accept the fact that I'm a dumbass/failure and just move on with my life instead of chasing lofty dreams that I'm obviously incapable of attaining.

 

^^^ Whoa, whoa, whoa, you really need to calm down man. your only a sophomore. Give it a chance, you should not be feeling this way. Here's some frat facts (from my experience): 1) It gets old after the first year & a half 2) Even though your "brothers" with all these guys, you still break off into groups of four or five guys and hangout/party/whatever just like any other clique at school 3) There were plenty of guys who were still introverted & I never saw them after living in the house 4) Doing accounting, if your not pulling all A's with nothing going on, a frat probably wouldn't be the best choice

In terms of getting a job, it's tough. I tried helping this Dartmouth kid w/ damn near straight A's , staked resume. I have a good friend who's a VP of deriv trading at MS, and she passed on him even with my recommendation mainly because he was a sophomore, so keep looking.

Ace all your PE interview questions with the WSO Private Equity Prep Pack: http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/private-equity-interview-prep-questions
 
westfald:
^^^ Whoa, whoa, whoa, you really need to calm down man. your only a sophomore. Give it a chance, you should not be feeling this way. Here's some frat facts (from my experience): 1) It gets old after the first year & a half 2) Even though your "brothers" with all these guys, you still break off into groups of four or five guys and hangout/party/whatever just like any other clique at school 3) There were plenty of guys who were still introverted & I never saw them after living in the house 4) Doing accounting, if your not pulling all A's with nothing going on, a frat probably wouldn't be the best choice

In terms of getting a job, it's tough. I tried helping this Dartmouth kid w/ damn near straight A's , staked resume. I have a good friend who's a VP of deriv trading at MS, and she passed on him even with my recommendation mainly because he was a sophomore, so keep looking.

Haha I guess man. Sorry, I just needed to vent all that and get that off my chest. I'm not going to lie though, I've been pretty upset/depressed with how things have been going so far (literally, nothing has gone according to my master plan), but I suppose that there is no point in crying over spilled milk now either.

At what point though do you think that I should give up on banking if nothing works out? The fact is that it is damn competitive and not everyone gets it. Given what has transpired so far, I need to face facts and realize that there is a greater than 75% chance that its not gonna happen, but when do you think I'll know for sure that its time to call it quits?

 

Buck the fuck up, man, and get a hold of yourself. This whole "woe is me" deal is getting real old real fast. Number 1, as has been pointed out to you many many many times thus far, you are a SOPHOMORE! As in still having a fucking "1" as the first digit of your age. As in "was ditching high-school PE three years ago."

Here's my path - I just got my first full time banking job at age 33 after 2 years of full-time volunteer work, 6 years in commercial property management, 8 consecutive dings from full time b-schools, attended a top-7 b-school as a part time MBA, a summer associate internship where I didn't get an offer, a position at a boutique where I worked my ass off for 6 months for FREE only to leave when it was clear the operation was falling apart, and a 6 month stint as a controller for a small manufacturing company.

Shut your incessantly yapping maw, get good grades, make some damn friends, involve yourself in this world that we call home and stop bitching about how nothing works out. Honestly, listening to you talk about your fucking "master plan" not working to perfection at age nine-fucking-teen is too much for me to bear.

 
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
Yes, I wouldn't go into the fraternity with the I'm here to network mentality- everyone will think you are a deutsche-bag. If, however, it comes up that one of your fraternity friends has connections to a particular company, it won't hurt to inquire further.
jhoratio:
Buck the fuck up, man, and get a hold of yourself. This whole "woe is me" deal is getting real old real fast. Number 1, as has been pointed out to you many many many times thus far, you are a SOPHOMORE! As in still having a fucking "1" as the first digit of your age. As in "was ditching high-school PE three years ago."

Here's my path - I just got my first full time banking job at age 33 after 2 years of full-time volunteer work, 6 years in commercial property management, 8 consecutive dings from full time b-schools, attended a top-7 b-school as a part time MBA, a summer associate internship where I didn't get an offer, a position at a boutique where I worked my ass off for 6 months for FREE only to leave when it was clear the operation was falling apart, and a 6 month stint as a controller for a small manufacturing company.

Shut your incessantly yapping maw, get good grades, make some damn friends, involve yourself in this world that we call home and stop bitching about how nothing works out. Honestly, listening to you talk about your fucking "master plan" not working to perfection at age nine-fucking-teen is too much for me to bear.

What they said. The thought of joining a group solely for its connections pisses me off because you're basically saying that you are using them for whatever advantage you can get out of them. Do you think I would want to have you as a brother? Fuck off. Friends aren't made for the purposes of using them, and friends for the sake of being friends seems like what you need in order to stay sane right now.

- Child Please.
 

Man, you sound depressed. College years are supposed to be most memorable days of your life! In that long-ass rant of yours, I saw a lot of things that were fundamentally wrong.

Firstly, at your age, if what you're doing seems like a "sacrifice", then you shouldn't be doing it. You do a major or a club activity because you like it, not because you think it's going to set you up for IBD. If doing something seems like sacrifice, then you're probably not going to be very good at it.

Secondly, you don't rush or try to make friends because it's going to help you career-wise. There's a specific term for what you're doing - it's called networking (it seems like you're making a meal of that too though). Network contacts are not people you can share your happiest moments with or just relax and grab a beer with. Make some friends!

Lastly, I seriously think you need to stop worrying about the future. You're a sophomore. Just make sure you get some work experience this summer (doesnt have to be IBD...just something related to your interests) and do well at school.

 

If you're in such a state of negativity, I think you should consult.

I did not know I wanted to work in finance until I was, what, 21? And I have had many setbacks, too, but a positive attitude towards life makes it more likely that things will turn around.

As for the frat debate, I'd have said definitely join. It's too much fun to miss out.

 

I personally just finished going through the SA interview process and without the help of my frat brothers on the street I would not have even gotten an interview. Coming from a non-target, any contacts you have are helpful.

That being said, if you are joining a fraternity for networking, you are going to get smashed. At least in the south, you need to join a fraternity for the people and the parties, not a job because you will hate the entire pledgeship process.

 

To Affirmative_: Dude, why does it matter? Why are you trying so hard to guess his school? University of Washington (State) in the 50-60's I believe.

To OP: Seriously. How did you "sacrifice" and work hard in High School and then only end up in the 100's? Hey man. No need to be so depressed. There are always chances in life. You're young, a U.S. citizen, and living in USA. Opportunities are abundant.

----------------------------------------------------------------- Hug It Out
 
Ari_Gold:
To Affirmative_: Dude, why does it matter? Why are you trying so hard to guess his school? University of Washington (State) in the 50-60's I believe.

To OP: Seriously. How did you "sacrifice" and work hard in High School and then only end up in the 100's? Hey man. No need to be so depressed. There are always chances in life. You're young, a U.S. citizen, and living in USA. Opportunities are abundant.

Because I want to.

Also Washington State is in the 100's.

I'm going to guess that OP goes to San Diego.

 

please dont just put the original poster on blast. try to be somewhat constructive. we have no idea about other things going on in this persons life right now or their personal history. a lot of people are on edge in this economy and fragile. no need to push them off with hard line taunts and degradation.

IBREJECT. you do need to take it easy tho. your posts worry me a bit. like some are saying, you seem exceptionally hard on yourself and potentially depressed. maybe you should talk to someone at school about it?

my advice: remember that some of lifes greatest lessons are learned in defeat and success is very often about persistence. hang in there. focus on what you can control, and do the best you can day by day.

and you should always dream big, cause if you fall short youll still be much further ahead than where you came from. i know theres often a harsh reality to buck up against (i dont think this applies to you tho, your school is decent and youre putting in the effort...tho it maybe a bit misguided) and some may say that im being glib, but there are a lot of geniuses who had it easy and never amounted to anything. there is no substitute for hard work.

 
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
haha this is getting really funny

why so serious IBreject?

No shiatsu this morning :(

But not seriously, I really didn't want that info leaked. Its a privacy issue as its going to be really easy now for people to ID me, especially since I was thinking about posting my resume so that people can help me out. So seriously, if you all don't mind, please either delete this thread or let it die for my privacy's sake. I'll PM/feel free to PM me as I'll be willing to continue any other convo in private, but I really don't want this info out there for anyone to see.

 

Just be careful about the frat you join, a lot of them are douchebags and will do nothing for your social, personal, or professional life.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer "Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee
 
D M:
Just be careful about the frat you join, a lot of them are douchebags and will do nothing for your social, personal, or professional life.

Yeah, you gotta talk to people at your school and find out which frats are the good ones. Not all frats are great. But find the right one and you're set.

 

True, but there are other reasons to join besides social ones. Yes, that's usually the main reason, but I'm proud to say my chapter really prided itself on character, academics, while also being top house. Now, I did go to a small school, so I never quite had the wild-ass SEC frat experience.

If you do go Greek, be fratty and blah blah, all that good stuff, just don't lose yourself or become an elitist cunt. And don't let in hurt your grades (much easier said than done).

 
swagon:
And don't let in hurt your grades (much easier said than done).

This is the main problem. It will hurt your grades (from what I've heard), but I'd still say it's worth it. I'd rather have an amazing college experience with tons of memories and friends even if it means having a slightly less GPA. You're only an undergraduate once. GPA doesn't really matter after a certain level anyways.

 

I joined a frat last year and I have mixed feelings about it. Yes, you do get to party with some really hot girls and get your dick wet. That is true. The problem is, there is a serious lack of seriousness among most of my fraternity. A lot of them smoke/drink all the time and just fuck around with school. But because their dad is CEO of some company, they are fine. Some guys are fine, but a lot of them are in fact douchebags. Maybe I just joined a slightly more douchy one.

 
Thedss:
I joined a frat last year and I have mixed feelings about it. Yes, you do get to party with some really hot girls and get your dick wet. That is true. The problem is, there is a serious lack of seriousness among most of my fraternity. A lot of them smoke/drink all the time and just fuck around with school. But because their dad is CEO of some company, they are fine. Some guys are fine, but a lot of them are in fact douchebags. Maybe I just joined a slightly more douchy one.

umm...get jobs and/or connections from the dads of your frat bros?

 

I joined a frat, and i'm not sure it was worth it.

Then again, German fraternities are a bit "rougher around the edges" than American ones. If you think US frats drink vigorously think again; much harder disciplining in the first semester e.g. no personal cell phone; you have to participate in fencing duels which means training on a daily basis - plus you're quite likely to graduate with a scar on your face (still the mark of the conservative, educated elite in Germany).

 
FinanceStudent28:
Seriously please elaborate on German Frat Life. That sounds ridiculous.

I'll let Mark Twain do the talking:

One day in the interest of science my agent obtained permission to bring me to the students` dueling-place. (...) It was observable that the young gentlemen neither bowed to nor spoke with students whose caps differed in color from their own. This did not mean hostility, but only an armed neutrality. It was considered that a person could strike harder in the duel, and with a more earnest interest, if he had never been in a condition of comradeship with his antagonist; therefore, comradeship between the corps was not permitted. At intervals the presidents of the five corps have a cold official intercourse with each other, but nothing further. For example, when the regular dueling-day of one of the corps approaches, its president calls for volunteers from among the membership to offer battle; three or more respond--but there must not be less than three; the president lays their names before the other presidents, with the request that they furnish antagonists for these challengers from among their corps. This is promptly done. It chanced that the present occasion was the battle-day of the Red Cap Corps. They were the challengers, and certain caps of other colors had volunteered to meet them. The students fight duels in the room which I have described, TWO DAYS IN EVERY WEEK DURING SEVEN AND A HALF OR EIGHT MONTHS IN EVERY YEAR. This custom had continued in Germany two hundred and fifty years.
...
The combatants were watching each other with alert eyes; a perfect stillness, a breathless interest reigned. I felt that I was going to see some wary work. But not so. The instant the word was given, the two apparitions sprang forward and began to rain blows down upon each other with such lightning rapidity that I could not quite tell whether I saw the swords or only flashes they made in the air; the rattling din of these blows as they struck steel or paddings was something wonderfully stirring, and they were struck with such terrific force that I could not understand why the opposing sword was not beaten down under the assault. Presently, in the midst of the sword-flashes, I saw a handful of hair skip into the air as if it had lain loose on the victim`s head and a breath of wind had puffed it suddenly away.

The seconds cried "Halt!" and knocked up the combatants` swords with their own. The duelists sat down; a student official stepped forward, examined the wounded head and touched the place with a sponge once or twice; the surgeon came and turned back the hair from the wound-- and revealed a crimson gash two or three inches long, and proceeded to bind an oval piece of leather and a bunch of lint over it; the tally-keeper stepped up and tallied one for the opposition in his book.

Then the duelists took position again; a small stream of blood was flowing down the side of the injured man`s head, and over his shoulder and down his body to the floor, but he did not seem to mind this. The word was given, and they plunged at each other as fiercely as before; once more the blows rained and rattled and flashed; every few moments the quick-eyed seconds would notice that a sword was bent--then they called "Halt!" struck up the contending weapons, and an assisting student straightened the bent one.

The wonderful turmoil went on--presently a bright spark sprung from a blade, and that blade broken in several pieces, sent one of its fragments flying to the ceiling. A new sword was provided and the fight proceeded.

full text: http://www.classicauthors.net/Twain/trampabroad/trampabroad4.html story actually takes place in my hometown!

academic fencing still takes place, more or less exactly as described - it's been following the same set of rules for centuries, so obviously no huge changes are to be expected. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academic_fencing

 

Yea, if you're transferring I'd definitely be careful about a frat. It's a great way to get involved on campus and meet people, but it's also a great way to screw your chances of getting an internship or FT job.

As long as you know the score and make sure you take care of your business, you should be fine joining a frat. Of course, everyone says they're going to do that and most don't.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer "Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee
 

I go to a smaller top school, and it really is a mixed bag. Some people love it, some people hate it, and some people are in-between. I think it's a great idea to rush and get a sense of what's out there, but I personally did not join a frat because of the time constraints involved and talking to older students. Unless a frat really jives with you and you can really see yourself as a member of the frat, then I don't think it is a great idea to pledge. Plus, if you have good friends in the frats you can still go to parties and not have to deal with everything else. I also find a lot of people become "consumed" by their fraternity / sorority and don't really have a broader social life, but again it varies from person to person.

 

I joined a fraternity first semester my freshman year, got a 3.4 during pledging at what I would like to think is an academically credible school, and haven't regretted any of it. The social benefits themselves make it worth it but other benefits exist. I would argue that being in a fraternity helped my GPA. I studied a lot with my fraternity brothers and i definitely think that helped me in the long run. Also, the network you have access to is incredible. Its one thing to contact an alumni from your university, but to contact an alum from your school that was in your fraternity gives you quite a leg up on the competition. My fraternity brother did just that and landed a BB IB summer internship.

 

The problem with frats is that you rush when you're 18 and almost no one has their shit together at that stage, let alone are thinking about getting into banking. If you're not a total fuckup though, you should absolutely rush.

 

I pledged for a business frat once, and they accepted girls as well since this was a professional frat. The main reason I pledged was to network and make connections with the alumni. However, at the end of the pledging process, I learned that the alumni brothers aren't exactly willing to network much, and I started to feel like I was paying to make friends as well. Plus, it felt like these students had no ambition to do anything other than just making sure they get a regular 9 to 5 job (not that it's bad...just thought there would at least be one person who wanted to not rely only on their career center and break into IB or something from a nontarget.). And the frat had all these directors for the smallest things so that anyone can say they are the director of bullshit. At the end of it, everything felt like bullshit & everyone seemed to be pretentious so I quit before initiation.

I don't regret not joining them, but occasionally, when I run into the students who were pledging with me, they don't even bother saying hi or acknowledging they made eye contact with me. It's like I'm shunned, which just pisses me off cause I was the only one who even ran for pledge class president in the first place (no one wanted the responsibility and they were afraid of having a more stressful pledging experience) and even though I was unsure about joining them, I made sure my pledge class didn't suffer. I did everything I can to make their life easier and prepared them for initiation as much as I can.

Yes, it does look bad when your president quits, but before I started pledging, I actually had travel plans which coincidentally was during the weekend of initiation so I prepared the vice president to take charge for that weekend from the beginning.

I don't know if what I did was wrong, but I don't regret any of it. To me, it was a fun experience as the pledge class president. I loved helping everyone, listening to their concerns, organizing everything & etc. I just didn't want to pay to join something that felt like it wasn't worth my time.

 
June Rose:
I pledged for a business frat once, and they accepted girls as well since this was a professional frat. The main reason I pledged was to network and make connections with the alumni. However, at the end of the pledging process, I learned that the alumni brothers aren't exactly willing to network much, and I started to feel like I was paying to make friends as well. Plus, it felt like these students had no ambition to do anything other than just making sure they get a regular 9 to 5 job (not that it's bad...just thought there would at least be one person who wanted to not rely only on their career center and break into IB or something from a nontarget.). And the frat had all these directors for the smallest things so that anyone can say they are the director of bullshit. At the end of it, everything felt like bullshit & everyone seemed to be pretentious so I quit before initiation.

I don't regret not joining them, but occasionally, when I run into the students who were pledging with me, they don't even bother saying hi or acknowledging they made eye contact with me. It's like I'm shunned, which just pisses me off cause I was the only one who even ran for pledge class president in the first place (no one wanted the responsibility and they were afraid of having a more stressful pledging experience) and even though I was unsure about joining them, I made sure my pledge class didn't suffer. I did everything I can to make their life easier and prepared them for initiation as much as I can.

Yes, it does look bad when your president quits, but before I started pledging, I actually had travel plans which coincidentally was during the weekend of initiation so I prepared the vice president to take charge for that weekend from the beginning.

I don't know if what I did was wrong, but I don't regret any of it. To me, it was a fun experience as the pledge class president. I loved helping everyone, listening to their concerns, organizing everything & etc. I just didn't want to pay to join something that felt like it wasn't worth my time.

I don't think OP is talking about a business frat. Nor a co-ed frat (sorority?).

 

I'm going to be a senior next semester.

I know frats that let seniors pledge. But should I do it?

I really want to do it for the network. I don't really care a whole lot about the social life, but that is also an excellent addition. I mean, my college life really isn't exciting, I had more fun in high school. So, I definitely wouldn't mind pledging.

 

AT my school the Greek system blows, sorority girls are ugly and fraternity guys are like all drug dealers/scum bags.

"For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?"
 
Warhead:
The idea that frat shenanigans and "getting pussy" is an integral part of the college experience is very sad.

+1

I don't get the appeal either. I had a ton of fun in college, made wonderful memories, and managed to network with people who are now very successful...and not one of us was in a fraternity/sorority.

 

Fraternity life is not all black and white. It depends on the school and self-personality. Smaller schools typically have significantly weaker "Greek life" than huge state schools do. I was reminded of this when I (accidentally) visited another chapter of my fraternity in a cross-country trip I did some time ago. They were completely different from us socially and fraternally.

Check out all of the fraternities before pledging to one. Some have very loose pledging programs while others are borderline illegal. Alumni networks are important; that's what differentiates a top house fraternity with one that is struggling to keep things running every year and definitely helps in landing good jobs. It's not worth joining a fraternity you won't get along too well with or benefit from later on down the road. (I did...sadly, it hasn't done much for me.)

(Potential case-in-point: My school's Delta Tau Delta chapter, the same fraternity Jon Stewart is a member of, has the biggest house on campus and most of its members, who usually take on the "softer" degrees, are pretty athletic and have no career problems post-graduation. This is despite some of their brothers destroying this same house over 20 years ago through neglect and a continuous stream of raging parties.)

 

I go to an SEC school where probably >60% of males are in a frat. The networking and cute girls are plentiful, but I just can't stand 80% of the people in them. I do kinda regret not pledging though, the networking you get from a fraternity is top notch.

 

if you do pledge, do it for the right reasons. networking, alcohol, and pussy are factors but they shouldn't be your main reason.

its more about fit and bringing together like minded individuals. after all, you're gonna be going through hell for at least a semester, and simply doing it for networking is not worth it

 
idrankmalk:
if you do pledge, do it for the right reasons. networking, alcohol, and pussy are factors but they shouldn't be your main reason.

^Yes.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." - IlliniProgrammer
 

Agree. I think that joining a frat for to get with other guys who are like yourself and share the same values is what it should mostly be about. It's tough to get a social circle like this on your own without pledging a frat. For me, I regretted not doing it in college, which is why I will likely pledge a grad chapter.

 

Aren't most of the SEC fraternities white-dominated and conservative/traditional though?

Not sure how the organizations with long traditions would accept an Asian.

 
ULNWI:
Aren't most of the SEC fraternities white-dominated and conservative/traditional though?

Not sure how the organizations with long traditions would accept an Asian.

there's a fraternity out there for everyone at most of the large schools.

some people at my school even started an LGBT co-ed fraternity.

 

I enjoy being in my fraternity. Not a very ambitious group of guys for the most part, but we have a good time overall. It's still nice to have a group of friends outside the frat though. I do feel as though my friends outside of the Greek system have had a somewhat less focused college experience than me but I understand why somebody would not want to be in Greek life. As our chapter adviser (who I despise with all my being) once told us, it's like running a business. Fuck that guy though. If you have no interest in taking a leadership role in a fraternity, I think you'd be shortchanging yourself by joining. You can go to the parties without being in the frat. However if you're interested in the leadership aspect, then you can get a lot out of it.

 

girls, booze, crazy adventures, life-long comradery...the best fraternity will always be the deployed military.

"It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems longer." - Albert Einstein
 
aicccia:
girls, booze, crazy adventures, life-long comradery...the best fraternity will always be the deployed military.

Congrats on tricking me to hop on the boat to revive an old thread.

"They are all former investment bankers that were laid off in the economic collapse that Nancy Pelosi caused. They have no marketable skills, but by God they work hard."
 

I second this -- one of the greatest tragedies of my life.

"They are all former investment bankers that were laid off in the economic collapse that Nancy Pelosi caused. They have no marketable skills, but by God they work hard."
 

Had the chance to join and didn't do it due to temporary stay in the US - otherwise... I would say it really depends on the quality of the fraternity and whether you have the time available.

I think it can make sense if you have like-minded people around you if you are in a new location/state.

 

That's how a close friend of mine got his job. It's not a terrible option if you can put up with the bullshit, but don't expect it to land you that GS gig you really want.

I personally could not deal with that shit.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer "Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee
 

Sounds like you're going to have a lame college experience. You're 17/18 bro have a good time. Whether or not you join a fraternity you should still drink, learn how to be social, meet girls, and maintain a good GPA. They don't have to be mutually exlcusive.

 

Honestly depends on whether you fit in with the house at your campus. Each chapter is different. Don't think too much about the networking, because it's a horrible reason to join a social fraternity. Join if you like the guys and are willing to embrace the meanings/secrets/rituals/etc. that the fraternity offers. It's as much of a growth opportunity as it is a networking or party opportunity.

 

Look, at UW, the frats are just party houses other than the professional organizations (Engineering frat, etc.). even the 'business frat' is a joke. Just don't expect to make connections in the frat.

My drinkin' problem left today, she packed up all her bags and walked away.
 

I joined one my freshman year and haven't regretted it since. First off, why wouldn't you want to party in college? Although it may not seem like it now, there are a lot of intangible skills that you stand to gain from the social aspect of fraternity life.

 

I am an alumni of a top tier fraternity that was highly regarded on my campus. There are a few things you need to take in consideration before entering the Greek system...

First and foremost, what percentage of your campus is Greek? I came from a school with one of the largest Greek systems in the country. Ipso facto, if you weren't in a fraternity/sorority on my campus... Your college experience probably sucked. If your school has a small community you should consider its quality. Not to say that there are smaller Greek communities around that command respect, but they are likely not as good of an experience.

Second, it is not something you should do in the hopes of networking into a job. Of course, anytime you make new contacts or meet large numbers of new people and establish relationships you greatly increase the chances, but I wouldn't hold my breathe. I will admit that if a resume of another fraternity brethren came across my desk I would go out of my way to accelerate him in the process as best I could (assuming credentials are within reason). That being said, you have to recognize the fact that it's unlikely you will run into many fellow brothers. It's a big world.

Lastly... I had the time of my life. We spent 4 years tearing it up. I don't want to bro out and say much more, but I will go through the rest of my life wishing that I could do it again. Massive parties, beautiful women and your buddies makes for a good time. You can find all of this regardless of your choice, but not every day of the week.

If you want advice on how to go through the process, or just want general guidance feel free to message me with any questions you might have.

Don't hump textbooks for 4 years. This is your last chance to really be young and stupid.

"I'm short your house"
 

I can tell you that no one I've met has ever regretted joining one. The people that are telling you not to are people that aren't in fraternities. I can tell you that personally it has helped me more than I ever could've imagined.

 

Figure out the fees so you can determine how much you are paying for each brother. A simple spreadsheet would work. The fees at our school are around 1200 for a year so that into each brother times 3 and 1/2 years due to pledging will allow you to see if you are really finding that true value. Orrr you could find some good friends you don't have to pay for and build social skills on your own. It's all up to you what you make of college. Force yourself to meet people and there will be no lonely nights.

 

Of course it is worth it, because I WOULD NEVER EVER DATE A GUY WHO ISN"T A FRAT STAR BACK IN COLLEGE. After college, that's a different story.

"I already know I'm going to Hell. So, at this point it's go big or go home"
 

Read from TFM (totalfratmove.com) if you're just going to join for connections, and aren't wanting to become a "fratstar" you're not going to enjoy your time. But I've always said that if you don't get hazed by a fraternity, life will do the hazing on it's own.

-RR
 

Go through the formal fall rush and see if there are any chapters that have similar interests and ideals to your own. It depends on the school, chapter, and pledge class but if you find a solid group of young professionals who are campus leaders and have young poon following them around - couldnt be a bad investment...

 

Incoming 1st year and member of a very well-known fraternity here; it has helped in 2 ways:

  1. Development-Joining a (good) fraternity helps your personal development during college in spades. It starts with rush, which requires you to "get out there" and be able to present a personable face to the brothers. My chapter does not haze, but pledges still have to develop time management skills, learn to integrate into a tight-knit organization and most importantly, act in a responsible manner-if you're still acting like a high schooler you will get dropped, if you even got a bid in the first place. Most important is once you're a brother-I served on exec board for 2 years and made meaningful impacts on both positions that I held during my term. In short, joining a fraternity guides brothers in what you could call accelerated development and gives you a lot of great answers to those bullshit HR questions like "tell me about a time you demonstrated leadership".

  2. Network-my school is a semi-target school, so having a large fraternity network in addition to my collegiate one was a huge help. Between SA/FT recruiting I probably spoke to 100 brothers who were happy to offer me advice, even if they couldn't help with a job. Ultimately, my initial contact into the firm that I'll be starting at soon was a fraternity alumni. I think my experience there is a great illustration of what a fraternity (or college) network can do-get you an initial contact that is willing to listen, but you still have to convince him that you're a cool person and can do the job well. It also helped if I was interviewing with someone who was Greek, but not in the same fraternity-as much as some college students like to talk shit about other fraternities, they're all very similar, and in an interview setting, that gives you and your interviewer a shared experience that helps establish a connection. Last, on the college level, my business school is very-Greek (overall campus participation is about 30%, b-school is probably over double that if you exempt the athletes), and so being part of the overall Greek community helped me be closer with my classmates, who will be a vital part of any student's future network.

Hope this helps, I'd be happy to answer more detailed questions

 

As far as I know, modern fraternities do not allow graduate members.

I do know that back in the 19th century when many of our organizations were getting founded, there were graduate students involved. University back then was a different beast; you 'graduated' when you had finished your course of study to the satisfaction of your supervising faculty member and took your final examination (often oral).

Many of our oldest chapters were founded by graduate students; reading the rolls, it's kind of interesting to learn. Some were law students (apparently you could go directly to law school).

In short though, you can't join a fraternity after undergrad.

I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
 
UFOinsider:

Is it worth joining a frat in grad school? One of the things I regret not doing is joining a fraternity in ugrad. How does graduate fraternity life compare?

I disagree with APAE. It is technically not allowed at the national level for most fraternities but the right fraternity will take you. This completely depends on the Greek life culture at the school and the chapter. I was rush chair and we've taken older guys if they were military or had legitimate reasons for rushing late. If you are doing a one year program, your time would be better spent participating in something else. I could see certain chapters at schools with a smaller Greek life take a MBA student. PM me if you have any specific questions.
 

Sales & trading Floors are very fratty so being in a frat can be super helpful. I also know I got my first internship in finance during my freshman year through a fraternity connection. It can be very helpful-but finance/networking should not be the reason you join or you will hate yourself.

 

Student status

Please explain

Looking for like minded individuals, not sheep. If a fraternity meets that criterion then I'm in. Otherwise, I have real brothers and will make my own friends.

Please advise

Get busy living
 

Student status = whether you are a graduate or undergraduate If you are an undergrad, all is well. Freshmen are always the primary rush candidates, and sometimes sophomores will be considered. Juniors are incredibly rare and usually have some compelling reason (transfer, military, varsity athlete, etc.) that the house feels they are a value-add.

Honestly, the farther out of undergrad you are, the less you're probably fit for a fraternity. When you're a wet-behind-the-ears 18-year-old sack of shit coming out of high school you are fine with enduring pledging. As a grown man in his 20s, you won't be, and that's not a bad thing.

Make friends on your own; leave the fraternities for those who found them at the appropriate time.

I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
 
Going Concern:

I know people that scooped up job stuff from their frat bros. So two big thumbs up for them. But, fraternity houses are dirty, the floors are sticky, and they smell.

...and sorosties walk the halls and occupy the beds nightly.
I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
 

Hey apple_ibank, very articulate answer. I'd love to hear more but the system won't let me message you or post any links. But e-mail me at zfaux XatX Bloomberg XdotX net

 

Hi everyone, I'm currently Military and happen to be very interested in S&T. I'm 22 now and currently have a year of college under my belt of college (community). I was wondering advice as to what my steps should be to get into a Fraternity afterwards, and finding an internship

 
Taj-Coleman:

Hi everyone, I'm currently Military and happen to be very interested in S&T. I'm 22 now and currently have a year of college under my belt of college (community). I was wondering advice as to what my steps should be to get into a Fraternity afterwards, and finding an internship

You shouldn't join a fraternity with the sole purpose of finding a job. There's much more to it than that. If you only do it for the job aspect, it will be very apparent, and frankly, you wouldn't like to be in that situation. The brothers will be able to tell if your intentions are sincere.

For example, we had a kid try to sneak his way in because of our fraternities political connections. He didn't care about anything we actually stood for and thought it was just going to be an easy way to get elected to an SGA position and connection to a job at a congressman's office. He was kicked out of pledging within a couple weeks and was blacklisted from every fraternity on campus and near by schools.

Only go Greek for the right reasons, a job could be part of the reason you join, but understand you are joining to be a brother for life.

 

Don't join a fraternity for the connections you will make 4 years from now. You join fraternities to build close friendships with the 20-100 people living together in the house. The best chance to get a job is from your friends parents.

So just make sure you get along with members of your house. That's who I would join.

Never really used the national network. I actually interviewed at a place where one of the VPs was in the same fraternity as me (another school), it was a nice conversation starter that's for sure.

 
same0:

Don't join a fraternity for the connections you will make 4 years from now. You join fraternities to build close friendships with the 20-100 people living together in the house. The best chance to get a job is from your friends parents.

So just make sure you get along with members of your house. That's who I would join.

Never really used the national network. I actually interviewed at a place where one of the VPs was in the same fraternity as me (another school), it was a nice conversation starter that's for sure.

100 guys living in the same house? Sounds really ga-FUN how do I join?

speed boost blaze
 
Texas Tea:

Anything north of the Mason-Dixon doesn't count.

Hell damn right.

But seriously, don't join a fraternity (social, business fraternity is obviously a different story) for the "exit ops" or as a stepping stone to banking. As a matter of fact, the reason you join one should be to be around your friends and have fun outside of thinking about school and life after college. Dont ruin the last 4 (perhaps 5) fun years of your life by trying to join a fraternity filled with people with the exact same goals as you.

Also, NEVER call a fraternity a "Frat" unless you are making fun of people that actually call it that, you will sound like a huge douche. Dont be that guy. Best of luck

 
DCDepository:

I visited the University of Richmond in the fall of 2002 (my senior year of high school). I did an overnight stay in a dorm. My host was a sophomore and was in a fraternity. I'll never forget what he said: "You never call a fraternity a 'frat'. You wouldn't call your country a cunt, would you?"

No, but I'd call my mother mom.

 

Join a fraternity that has a good reputation at the school you are going to (not necessarily one that is good nationally or at another school). Ultimately a fraternity is a good way to make a school smaller, helps introduce you to upperclassmen (that may have had solid internships or offers upon graduation), teaches you how to act in social situations/around girls and can be a heck of a lot of fun. Also, if the fraternity is any good, it will be hell to get through pledging but after it will help to enhance the remainder of your college experience. If you can take on a leadership role in the house this will also be a positive for your resume.

 

When you go to a rush event at a fraternity sneak away to the kitchen (or wherever they keep food). Look at the crackers; only join fraternities that have spiced/flavored crackers. Saltines and water crackers are a red flag. You're gonna wanna mask the flavor.

"Yes. Money has been a little bit tight lately, but at the end of my life, when I'm sitting on my yacht, am I gonna be thinking about how much money I have? No. I'm gonna be thinking about how many friends I have and my children and my comedy albums."
 
fraser24gt:
So what about no frat? I had a girlfriend coming in to school so it didn't really seem like I needed to be in a frat. Will this end up hurting me when it comes to networking, something to talk about in interviews, etc.?

Yes if you don't have any fratty stories to talk about you can kiss an internship offer goodbye. When they take interns, they want guys who can frat all summer long.

 

think about this way. a frat might help you a little bit getting into an internship or job, but say you spent that time pledging and partying and whatnot doing something else, like getting a job, or starting your own club, or something useful, you will be better off.

 

Not sure which firm you work at. Not sure you even work in the industry. In fact, I presume you are being sarcastic.

At any reputable firm, there is a sufficient process where no one, not even a senior MD, could unilaterally offer a kid a job after "pounding a few beers in the house." We require a great deal of internal consensus to make offers, and the best someone could do with a referral is to get a first round interview.

That said, we do prefer, on the margin, friends of our current analyst pool, provided they have 3.8+ GPAs, great experience, etc. It helps with the culture.

 

Bowl, I think, would rather meet strangers, you have your Elixir of Love, I have my Brightness Delicate. As long as it is in the beautiful grasslands, is enough. Today, this land of fleeting time, who will clean up? The world situation of Shame, flowers withered is silent, the whole roots of shed tears, buried not in the dust. A wandering past the terraced rice paddies, falling full of clothes, green grass - I get out of it a romantic, get out of the home-made impregnable fortress.

I always told myself not to think about you, but still in the sun, slowly you think. Think the figure under the sun, always make me obsessed, I passed out. The thoughts of the dough lightly tap the Aging, warm feelings slowly infected the dreams of reincarnation can not escape the entanglement of a "feeling" word, after all, dream dream, that no matter what the situation.

Suddenly begin to miss your face miss your warm smile, the heart suddenly rises to a desired immediately to see your impulses. Miss the kind of warm, hazy and misty smoke curling feeling!

While I was typing the side of tears, I know it is useless, but really. . . Sad! I love, love! I look up at the sky, the vastness of the sky, Altair and Vega, distant relative, daydream keep looking at the one regret of the Millennium, in the vicissitudes of the eyes, eternal freeze extremely poignant face! I can only use this all accept my pen and paper are pinned on only a fleeting my grief.

The cold wind through my clothes, cool earth wind melt away my tears, pick up decorated with broken messy mood, tell yourself, must strive to be happy! Because I know that, in the distance you have been along with me. You see, the sky, next to the moon, there is a particularly bright stars. Stars accompanied by the moon, the moon, accompanied by the stars, like, you accompanied me, and I accompanied you.

I do not know where to go, looked up, flying over the clouds as ever, only now come to a piece of paper long cool autumn night, a cup miss a pot of worry, to revisit the issues, I think, after all, I was a person, alone, through the lively The crowd, quiet to finish the unfinished road, nostalgic Ye Hao, nostalgia worth mentioning.

Long way to go, but not the head, chasing the pace of the 1st day heavy, I have been tired, just want to inhabit. Night, at least one of my own space, yes. I can not complain!

Dear, you remember, even if we have injuries have endured the pain, also deeply loved. Do not ask how far it always, do not ask the everlasting and to long, but please do remember must be happy.

 
Kounbcyxv:
Bowl, I think, would rather meet strangers, you have your Elixir of Love, I have my Brightness Delicate. As long as it is in the beautiful grasslands, is enough. Today, this land of fleeting time, who will clean up? The world situation of Shame, flowers withered is silent, the whole roots of shed tears, buried not in the dust. A wandering past the terraced rice paddies, falling full of clothes, green grass - I get out of it a romantic, get out of the home-made impregnable fortress.

I always told myself not to think about you, but still in the sun, slowly you think. Think the figure under the sun, always make me obsessed, I passed out. The thoughts of the dough lightly tap the Aging, warm feelings slowly infected the dreams of reincarnation can not escape the entanglement of a "feeling" word, after all, dream dream, that no matter what the situation.

Suddenly begin to miss your face miss your warm smile, the heart suddenly rises to a desired immediately to see your impulses. Miss the kind of warm, hazy and misty smoke curling feeling!

While I was typing the side of tears, I know it is useless, but really. . . Sad! I love, love! I look up at the sky, the vastness of the sky, Altair and Vega, distant relative, daydream keep looking at the one regret of the Millennium, in the vicissitudes of the eyes, eternal freeze extremely poignant face! I can only use this all accept my pen and paper are pinned on only a fleeting my grief.

The cold wind through my clothes, cool earth wind melt away my tears, pick up decorated with broken messy mood, tell yourself, must strive to be happy! Because I know that, in the distance you have been along with me. You see, the sky, next to the moon, there is a particularly bright stars. Stars accompanied by the moon, the moon, accompanied by the stars, like, you accompanied me, and I accompanied you.

I do not know where to go, looked up, flying over the clouds as ever, only now come to a piece of paper long cool autumn night, a cup miss a pot of worry, to revisit the issues, I think, after all, I was a person, alone, through the lively The crowd, quiet to finish the unfinished road, nostalgic Ye Hao, nostalgia worth mentioning.

Long way to go, but not the head, chasing the pace of the 1st day heavy, I have been tired, just want to inhabit. Night, at least one of my own space, yes. I can not complain!

Dear, you remember, even if we have injuries have endured the pain, also deeply loved. Do not ask how far it always, do not ask the everlasting and to long, but please do remember must be happy.
so gucci, mane
 

Ut cumque quis sit repellendus nobis libero esse. Dignissimos enim dignissimos facilis error rerum. Odit inventore voluptatem dolores molestias. Voluptatum molestiae debitis nostrum tenetur nostrum. Provident adipisci iste optio voluptas eaque est repellendus perferendis.

Corporis eveniet maxime nesciunt aut minus voluptatem quod. Voluptas voluptas delectus adipisci voluptates maiores aut et. Fugiat qui quam ducimus nihil. Dolor aliquid laboriosam laudantium exercitationem facilis nam quos repellat.

Dolorem ut vitae sit aut minima. Blanditiis quo a temporibus dolores quae.

 

Unde sit velit autem exercitationem ipsa. Officia quis nostrum est hic reiciendis eum. Ut ut quibusdam eaque quis rerum sit.

Dolor expedita voluptatem enim necessitatibus voluptas voluptas. Sunt dolor dignissimos qui autem aspernatur ducimus ut. Corporis quia rem sed a magnam dolore quidem vel.

Non commodi tenetur similique non deleniti voluptatem. Possimus alias quidem voluptatem deleniti quos quam harum. Impedit doloremque esse et. Ut vero voluptates accusantium aliquam aspernatur dolor. Error minus rem reprehenderit.

 

Suscipit et aliquid aliquid autem sit enim exercitationem. Et labore aperiam eligendi velit aut.

Dolorem quia dolores aut. Laboriosam officiis omnis voluptas sint. Consequatur totam animi harum non distinctio. Id sapiente nulla harum magnam officiis minus.

Ut quia assumenda nostrum commodi. Voluptatem possimus quas debitis aliquid ut ratione velit.

 

In neque aut provident earum temporibus. Cupiditate sit voluptatem ipsum iure esse. Soluta sunt id veniam deserunt.

Eos excepturi odio quibusdam delectus qui culpa sint. Nemo reiciendis fugiat nihil itaque deleniti quia iste distinctio. Sit qui quas fugit cumque.

Praesentium voluptatem odio eos est porro eius sapiente. Et molestiae eligendi laboriosam perferendis quaerat consequuntur ab quam. Delectus quod dolores est aut.

Voluptatem nesciunt quibusdam quidem error autem itaque asperiores adipisci. Ducimus magnam quis adipisci omnis voluptatem unde maiores. Quis quia et perferendis.

 

Inventore est voluptates fugiat dolores aut est consectetur. Quaerat tempore qui eum a. Et perspiciatis ducimus nesciunt repellat cumque iusto aliquid. Ea nihil rerum vitae. Assumenda sed et dolore quibusdam error. Aliquam fuga omnis vitae illum possimus ipsa sint est.

Aut sunt nesciunt doloribus voluptas eum. Omnis eaque excepturi est. Quia amet aliquam vel voluptas. Facilis odit sint veniam provident. Quo et impedit magnam ut et dicta.

Velit eligendi odio praesentium minus. Voluptatem ut repellat cupiditate est accusamus rerum. Ratione explicabo magnam molestias et voluptatum. Delectus quia qui repellendus molestiae. Cumque eos enim repellat et quis. Consequatur sapiente incidunt accusantium et.

Molestias sunt quae corporis officiis magni error animi. Dolorum quam nihil doloremque corrupti adipisci ad nihil quo. Aut non numquam iure laudantium tempora est molestiae perspiciatis. Nihil adipisci perferendis debitis fuga natus voluptates est. Tenetur harum consequatur nihil aut ut consequuntur. Ut eligendi harum id eveniet nulla velit.

 

Consequatur nesciunt qui ipsam necessitatibus accusantium nam. Suscipit consequatur expedita at accusantium vitae. Soluta qui esse inventore iusto.

Provident minus quod est et voluptates numquam. Nostrum aut molestias voluptas officia. Aut quasi quam quam consequatur in corrupti et amet. Velit rerum corrupti a ratione.

Eius repellendus ullam ea enim et officia qui libero. Libero quia vitae reprehenderit voluptatem eum voluptatibus sapiente. Cum iste sit molestiae fugiat.

Dolorum libero animi ut nemo vel. In non reprehenderit eos a consectetur corrupti. Et explicabo voluptas qui iusto. Corrupti aspernatur adipisci sed et est suscipit. Quia nihil ratione aliquid quod eum earum.

"If you want to succeed in this life, you need to understand that duty comes before rights and that responsibility precedes opportunity."

Career Advancement Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company 02 99.4%
  • Goldman Sachs 19 98.8%
  • Harris Williams & Co. (++) 98.3%
  • Lazard Freres 02 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 03 97.1%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Harris Williams & Co. 18 99.4%
  • JPMorgan Chase 10 98.8%
  • Lazard Freres 05 98.3%
  • Morgan Stanley 07 97.7%
  • William Blair 03 97.1%

Professional Growth Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Lazard Freres 01 99.4%
  • Jefferies & Company 02 98.8%
  • Goldman Sachs 17 98.3%
  • Moelis & Company 07 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 05 97.1%

Total Avg Compensation

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Director/MD (5) $648
  • Vice President (19) $385
  • Associates (86) $261
  • 3rd+ Year Analyst (13) $181
  • Intern/Summer Associate (33) $170
  • 2nd Year Analyst (66) $168
  • 1st Year Analyst (202) $159
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (144) $101
notes
16 IB Interviews Notes

“... there’s no excuse to not take advantage of the resources out there available to you. Best value for your $ are the...”

Leaderboard

1
redever's picture
redever
99.2
2
Secyh62's picture
Secyh62
99.0
3
BankonBanking's picture
BankonBanking
99.0
4
Betsy Massar's picture
Betsy Massar
99.0
5
dosk17's picture
dosk17
98.9
6
CompBanker's picture
CompBanker
98.9
7
kanon's picture
kanon
98.9
8
GameTheory's picture
GameTheory
98.9
9
DrApeman's picture
DrApeman
98.9
10
Jamoldo's picture
Jamoldo
98.8
success
From 10 rejections to 1 dream investment banking internship

“... I believe it was the single biggest reason why I ended up with an offer...”