Goldman Sachs Asset Management: Analyst Culture

Im curious about the culture at a Goldman Sachs for an analyst in the Asset Management division (GSAM): Specifically, I'd like to know:

  • How many hours per week they work.
  • If the work is stimulating and exciting (relative to other groups)
  • Salary and bonuses
    • Opportunities for a) exit and b) upward mobility

I've heard a lot of conflicting things, so I wanted to make sure I got my facts straight.

Thanks for your help!

 
Notepad:
Can you name a specific group you're interested in? It's very difficult to make a general statement about GSAM, since each group has a very specific role and culture.
PMd you
eriginal:
GS recently started an add campaign for one of their mutual funds on national TV, you guys think this a good sign?
Really good point, this warrents a post. See if you can find a youtube clip......
Get busy living
 
eriginal:
Tried to pull a clip, couldn't find one unfortunately. It was pretty standard and was playing during the game last night, apparently no one cared enough to record it...
Something like this is significant....
Get busy living
 
UFOinsider:
eriginal:
Tried to pull a clip, couldn't find one unfortunately. It was pretty standard and was playing during the game last night, apparently no one cared enough to record it...
Something like this is significant....

This is getting off track. But IMO it really doesn't signal any weakness on GS's part. If you've noticed, they also launched a 'community outreach' ad campaign. Just because they're becoming more public, as opposed to being viewed as a black box, doesn't signal weakness.

In fact, I'm sure they're reaching out to the public in this manner in a strategic move to improve their public image. There's nothing wrong with being friends with the public, who are friends with the politicians.

The mutual fund ad (I haven't seen it, nor can I find it), that's like saying that Blackrock is in trouble because they advertise their funds publicly. They're not, neither is GS. Nothing wrong with attracting some millionaires and business execs watching a baseball game (or whatever it was, maybe ballet).

 

Sure! I'll be heading into my junior year of college, so I'm looking for something where I can learn quite a bit about a lot of different things. Specifically, I was considering going to Fundamental Equity.

 

very buttoned-up culture, where employees are expected to selflessly serve the firm. not everyone's cup of tea. and, the claim that they "give Analysts more responsibility" just means that goldman works its analysts harder than other firms.

 

when i went to my superday there everyone i met with described how flat the organization is - meaning there's only a few titles but that everyone seems to interact with everyone and being able to tell someone senior to you their possibly wrong is something you should be comfortable doing

 
Nyctola:
when i went to my superday there everyone i met with described how flat the organization is - meaning there's only a few titles but that everyone seems to interact with everyone and being able to tell someone senior to you their possibly wrong is something you should be comfortable doing

i would love to see you doing this in any bank.

 

Very flat. All banks value their people, but at GS it seems to actually be true. They also have a promote from within attitude. A kid I knew started in dcm and was clearly a high flyer- they offered him an accelerated track to associate, but he wanted to be in MBD so they transferred him. You hear stories of people jumping around groups often and it seems rare to meet a VP or MD who didn't do their SA with GS years ago. Also agree with the allegiance to the firm remark above. People are expected and do put GS before their personal lives. While this is commonplace in IBD at any bank, you also see it in other divisions.

 
hundge at top rate:
A kid I knew started in dcm and was clearly a high flyer- they offered him an accelerated track to associate, but he wanted to be in MBD so they transferred him.

Huh... I wonder if I know the person you're talking about, sounds really familiar.

I also know someone else who was a top performer, and had the option to transfer groups to something quite different for their 3rd yr before b-school

 

My friend worked at GS for two years and this is what he had to say about the culture. GS feeds its bankers the Cool-Aid, in other words, everyone is expected to selflessly serve their master. When it comes to models and bottles, people at the firm tend to not care too much about splurging their money on expensive things, and would rather wear a Seiko watch to work instead of a Rolex. According to him, GS leaves the big spending and flashiness to MS bankers. But this maybe because of the people GS tend to hire, he said that he thinks GS hires the nerds, while all the cool people go to JPM and the snobby rich kids go to MS. He also told me that there were a lot of face-time in his group, and that he was worked really fucking hard. But some groups were chill, and some analysts actually enjoyed their groups, but it wasn't a common occurrence. He also mentioned that the partners are worshiped by everyone in the firm.

 
Antsman:
My friend worked at GS for two years and this is what he had to say about the culture. GS feeds its bankers the Cool-Aid, in other words, everyone is expected to selflessly serve their master. When it comes to models and bottles, people at the firm tend to not care too much about splurging their money on expensive things, and would rather wear a Seiko watch to work instead of a Rolex. According to him, GS leaves the big spending and flashiness to MS bankers. But this maybe because of the people GS tend to hire, he said that he thinks GS hires the nerds, while all the cool people go to JPM and the snobby rich kids go to MS. He also told me that there were a lot of face-time in his group, and that he was worked really fucking hard. But some groups were chill, and some analysts actually enjoyed their groups, but it wasn't a common occurrence. He also mentioned that the partners are worshiped by everyone in the firm.

Second that. GS likes people who are extremely smart but very humble. I'd say that most of the GS people I have met throughout the networking process are like that, very down to earth.

 
Antsman:
My friend worked at GS for two years and this is what he had to say about the culture. GS feeds its bankers the Cool-Aid, in other words, everyone is expected to selflessly serve their master. When it comes to models and bottles, people at the firm tend to not care too much about splurging their money on expensive things, and would rather wear a Seiko watch to work instead of a Rolex. According to him, GS leaves the big spending and flashiness to MS bankers. But this maybe because of the people GS tend to hire, he said that he thinks GS hires the nerds, while all the cool people go to JPM and the snobby rich kids go to MS. He also told me that there were a lot of face-time in his group, and that he was worked really fucking hard. But some groups were chill, and some analysts actually enjoyed their groups, but it wasn't a common occurrence. He also mentioned that the partners are worshiped by everyone in the firm.

From what I have heard, I would say this is spot on about GS, except that JPM and MS are all full of nerds too.

 
<span class=keyword_link><a href=//www.wallstreetoasis.com/finance-dictionary/what-is-alpha>alpha</a></span> mail:
It is very clear that all the people who have posted in this thread have never worked at GS and are just regurgitating hearsay. I guess goldman's PR and HR teams are doing their job.
Please enlighten me then :)
Get busy living
 
<span class=keyword_link><a href=//www.wallstreetoasis.com/finance-dictionary/what-is-alpha>alpha</a></span> mail:
It is very clear that all the people who have posted in this thread have never worked at GS and are just regurgitating hearsay. I guess goldman's PR and HR teams are doing their job.

I have interned at 2 out of GS/MS/JPM and have many friends from school and elsewhere that have interned/will work fulltime/are already fulltime at GS...

 
<span class=keyword_link><a href=//www.wallstreetoasis.com/finance-dictionary/what-is-alpha>alpha</a></span> mail:
It is very clear that all the people who have posted in this thread have never worked at GS and are just regurgitating hearsay. I guess goldman's PR and HR teams are doing their job.

i agree that some of these posts are just echoes of gs propaganda. but, if you really don't believe that any of these descriptions of goldman's culture are accurate, then you're clearly the one who has no idea what he's talking about.

 
<span class=keyword_link><a href=//www.wallstreetoasis.com/finance-dictionary/what-is-alpha>alpha</a></span> mail:
It is very clear that all the people who have posted in this thread have never worked at GS and are just regurgitating hearsay. I guess goldman's PR and HR teams are doing their job.

It is my experience through talking to analysts, associates, VPs and MDs at GS.

 

Another thing that I forgot to mention was the fact that even though the people don't splurge on brand name things, the culture is very elitist to the point where which High School someone went to is very much discussed. There is also a constant comparison with your peers on who is smarter, very cut throat I guess. Another thing is that my friend felt he was short changed, the reason is because he got a 20k bonus in his first year around December time frame, then he got his regular bonus of 70k in his second year in July. Other banks pay their analysts regularly so they get their full bonus. It might be 50k 1st yr and 70k 2nd yr, instead of what GS does with 20k 1st yr and 70 2nd yr (this is the famous GS discount). In summary, it's a terrible environment for anyone to work in, however, there are a lot of buyside opps and it has the brand name that everyone is killing themselves for.

 

division cultures aside, i think GS teams spend an inordinate amount of time together outside of work. pound for pound they run leaner than everybody else so the people work more, which explains partially why employee payout remains the highest per employee (skewed towards top hitters aside). the culture of 'oh we're the best/how can we keep on sustaining this aggressively' is the famous mixture of self-fulfilling prophecy (if they are the best they can afford to hire only the best etc.), nimbleness, paranoia, and what some deem arrogance and others call masked insecurity. i have a lot of respect for the guys there who are not caught up in the entire flaming bullshit of the firm and industry in general

 

I am also curious. Honestly, if I had my top choice I would pick NS, but somehow in the back of my mind I get the feeling (maybe just from this board) that it will be harder to get into a KKR or Carlyle from it. Isn't Industrials considered to be a good feeder?

Follow up question: why is FIG and TMT so good for private equity? The type of companies PE looks at is almost always consumer, industrial or NS. I feel like those would give the best prep for the actual work of a PE shop.

 
 

Tech is a huge PE market. Not like Groupon or Facebook, but more business services oriented. I think a lot of VC backed companies are beginning to get flipped to more financial buyers once they hit a developed stage since IPOs haven't been hot.

Media is starting to develop as a PE market with deals like GoDaddy, Endurance, and Alliance Films. Haven't seen that many deals in Telecom, however.

 

NRG exit opps on average aren't as "good" as other groups because the skill set is pretty esoteric/specialized (aka pigeonholed) and most generalist PE funds don't invest in the space (occasionally you'll see some pretty big deals such as KKR buying Samson, Apollo buying Noranda aluminum etc, but it's not very often).

Of course there are Natres focued PE firms (First Reserve, Limerock, Riverstone, Natural Gas Partners etc), but they tend to recruit associates from the more active energy groups in Houston (CS, Barcap etc)

 

one thing to note about GS nat res is that most oil & gas is run out of houston, while new york also covers things like chemicals, power, metals, cleantech, etc.

So just because goldman has been killing it in O&G deals lately, doesn't mean that translates to the new york experience. On the flip side, things like chemicals are pretty popular in the PE space and lets you avoid some of the "pigeonhole" issues associated with solely doing energy deals. Ex: Goldman was very recently sellside on the Apollo/Taminco LBO (largely run out of london though).

 
LeoMessi:
Both are solid, but industrials is typically considered the more desirable group. Culture, like the rest of Goldman, is to work your ass off

I'd think the hrs are long, but I was going more towards whether anyone knows if there's face time in those groups.

 

FWIW, I know a guy who worked at GS NR who got a KKR offer. I also know another guy who worked for a regional office at ML who also got a KKR offer. May I suggest, that the group doesn't really matter?

I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing. See my Blog & AMA
 
buybuybuy:
If your ultimate goal is BlackRock, then you should probably consider working at BlackRock.

If your goal is to sleep with Jessica Alba (pre-pregnancy), is Jessica Alba the first girl you sleep with? No. You build up by working at a smaller level and getting good enough to be with the best.

Remember that I'm going into my sophomore year now....I need some time to build the PM skills to get good enough to make a contribution to Blackrock.

 

" Goldman, unlike other firms on the Street, is famous for their 360-degree reviews of your performance as an employee -- gathering input about you from your colleagues, managers, subordinates and peers."

Goldman is the only firm on the Street that does this? What a joke.

 

I feel like everyone looks up to them to set the bar. They work very, very hard, but I feel that fewer people consider them a sweatshop than say, JP Morgan.

They are huge on developing their own culture. The few lateral hires they take must have great fit or the willingness to take on the GS culture. You'll find alot of their junior bankers become "cheerleaders" for the culture sometimes, even if their lives are hell. Unlike the usual corporate website BS about "teamwork," GS is extremely team oriented and most people tell you that it's definitely a valid statement of their corporate culture.

Also, lately they have been bucking the trend in regards to letting talent leave. They are encouraging analysts to stay on for a 3rd year, possibly do direct promote to associate. If they are interested in buyside opps, they highly encourage pursuing opps within the firm (GS PIA, Alpha fund, etc.).

 

And I agree with Go Illini, does anyone have the knowledge to answer my original question? Consider the Fundamental Equity group first within GSAM: I'm not looking for info about any of the in-house hedge funds or private equity stuff.

 

Goldman BO/MO is a lot better than most other things you would be able to get as a sophomore. However, junior summer is a different story.

Without reading the descriptions of each position, I would say networking opportunities with people in your desired division (i.e. IBD) should be a major factor if you end up having your pick.

 
PSH2:
Goldman BO/MO is a lot better than most other things you would be able to get as a sophomore. However, junior summer is a different story.

Without reading the descriptions of each position, I would say networking opportunities with people in your desired division (i.e. IBD) should be a major factor if you end up having your pick.

Thanks for the advice

 
tan86:
Internal wholesalers are responsible for pitching/selling internal products (in this case Goldman Sachs products) to GS financial advsiors (institutional and private client). The internal wholesalers need to be product experts and be prepared to answer questions from advisors and in some cases clients.

completely wrong. the group you are describing is channel marketing. internal wholesalers sell their products to anyone that manages assets, not just advisors within their own firm.

 
Chris_Marlin:
tan86:
Internal wholesalers are responsible for pitching/selling internal products (in this case Goldman Sachs products) to GS financial advsiors (institutional and private client). The internal wholesalers need to be product experts and be prepared to answer questions from advisors and in some cases clients.

completely wrong. the group you are describing is channel marketing. internal wholesalers sell their products to anyone that manages assets, not just advisors within their own firm.

......this makes more sense. PM'd you.
Get busy living
 
Best Response
Chris_Marlin:
tan86:
Internal wholesalers are responsible for pitching/selling internal products (in this case Goldman Sachs products) to GS financial advsiors (institutional and private client). The internal wholesalers need to be product experts and be prepared to answer questions from advisors and in some cases clients.

completely wrong. the group you are describing is channel marketing. internal wholesalers sell their products to anyone that manages assets, not just advisors within their own firm.

I have someone who works at my firm who used to be an internal wholesaler at MS. This is how he described his job. Perhaps it's different depending on the firm?

 

There are so many different groups in GSAM that it's impossible to generalize. If you're in PEG, you're going to be working banking hours, if you're in third party distribution and institutions, your hours are going to be much better to the tune of 8am-6pm. Not sure about the portfolio management groups, but if you're just coming out of college, you will most likely not be in those groups anyway.

 

Under GSAM, I'm being offered: 1. Investment Partners (IP) 2. Global Solutions Partners (GSP) - Portfolio Management 3. Private Equity Group (PEG)

and I'm being told if I start in one, I'll be able to laterally transfer to the other. Not sure if this actually possible?? Which would be most enjoyable since I can do all three?

 

Another "I'm a freshman/sophomore how can I get into PE/HF now" thread . . .

Look, you have the opportunity to intern at GS and you're quibbling over location? Stay in the US if you don't want a language barrier. Go out of the country if that appeals to you. It's fairly simple.

I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
 

If you can't speak French or German then it might hurt when you are trying to network. People in Chicago also might have better contacts in the US, while those in Europe should have better contacts in Europe. If you want to work in the US then you might want to take Chicago.

In terms of nightlife, it's going to be a much bigger adjustment for you to live in Paris or Berlin, but you'll be old enough to drink too. Tough call. It would be a good experience though.

 

Institutional relationship mgmt at large asset mgmt firms often involves pitching outside money. It is asset gathering/ capital introduction based work. Your products are your firm's funds and the pitch could be how your products could help improve the risk return of an institution's portfolio if such an institution were to outsource that particular strategy/focus. I've seen some of these guys do well.

 

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