Guidance

Hello,

    I'm currently a senior at a UC school, major in mathematics/economics, and graduating this June. Basically, my "back-story" is that I was on the pre-med track for the first two years college, and only switched to my current major at the start of my junior year. I currently have around a 3.4 GPA, but my major GPA is more like a 3.6/3.7 since I got a few F's in ochem and bio which really tanked my overall GPA. I've taken and got 99%ile in GRE, passed the SIE, and I know a little bit of Excel, MATLAB, Python, and R. 

Because I basically wasted 2 years of college as a biology major on the premed-track, I got a late start into finance, and only have one internship at a boutique IB which lasted a couple months, so nothing really impressive. But from this experience, I realized IB isn't really something I'm interested in, plus I'd probably have zero chance of getting into any of the "good" ones since some of these kids come from HYPSM and start recruiting their freshman year.

I realized I had a passion for math and finance, and quantitative finance would be something I could see myself happily doing. So I took really hard math classes to challenge myself (and 5-6 classes per quarter to graduate on time), and also self-studied for quant trading interviews. Unfortunately, because this realization of my career path occurred so late, I was new to how tough quant trading recruiting is, and despite applying to all of the elite firms, did not get through any of their processes fully.

I got to 2nd/3rd/ even 4th rounds at places like Flow/Akuna/Optiver/etc., but ultimately got cut out of the process by all of them. Basically, the mental math/sequence portions and HR portions were fine for me, but the Trader round is when I messed up because my fundamentals weren't strong enough. As for Akuna Capital, I got cut out at the personality round (???) so I don't know what that was about. I'm also probably just going to apply to Jane Street soon because their process seems fun and worst thing they can do is fail me at the resume screen, so might as well try.

I also suspect that applying so late (December/January) in retrospect probably didn't help my candidacy much. So my question is....where to go from here? What would you do in my situation? Some of these firms rejection emails included information about applications for next year already opening up in the summer basically, but I was wondering if I would still be considered a "new grad" for the 2022 cycle? I really would like to apply one more time to these places, because I felt like I was so close to getting a FT offer at a lot of these places, but one thing or another fell apart. Also, I did not apply to firms that require deep knowledge of Python, because I only have a mediocre knowledge of it. This is definitely something I could work on in the upcoming months, so I could apply to Belvedere, Volant Trading, etc. that emphasize programming skills and that I had avoided this cycle.

By now, I've finished going through Heard On the Street, Mark Joshi's book, Xinfeng Zhou's book, AoPS Volumes 1 and 2, a million glassdoor entries, etc. So I feel like next year I would actually have a good shot at getting into one of the trading firms, since I now know what to expect. But I should also still be searching for a job for this fall because I'd rather not be a bum in my parents basement. Btw I've also applied to a couple of financial engineering grad programs, but idk how good my chances are since I have zero research, my GPA isn't great, and my Letter of Recommendations are pretty bad.

So basically, I need a back-up plan right now. I realize its nearly February so I'm sort of freaking out; most companies seemed to have closed their hiring process and my parents (rightfully so) are basically asking me daily if I got a job or not. What jobs should I target? I'm thinking financial analyst/research analyst type roles for AM? Maybe I can apply to the big 4? Accounting jobs? I already got ghosted by Deloitte after submitting a lengthy hirevue recording, so not to keen about the big 4 but I'm willing to suck it up and apply to the other big4 if need be. Anyway, I'm willing to do whatever I need to do to really get "my foot in the door", or get some relevant experience. I don't need a flashy job straight out of college.

At this point, I am legitimately considering just cold-emailing funds and asking to become a research analyst for them for free, because of how desperate I am. I literally feel like I am going to be homeless by August, because after June idk if my parents are going to support me. Obviously that is a bit of an exaggeration, but I am getting a little worried because as a math major from a top 30 school, sure I'm not getting any of the top jobs any time soon, but I've gotten to the point where I am willing to be an unpaid intern for some random company.

Then again, it's my fault I'm in this situation, and I'm just trying to dig myself out of this hole. Any advice or insight would be greatly appreciated thanks! And also just want to say a big thank you because a lot of you have been incredibly helpful in these past few months :)


 

Most firms will insta-trash your app if you applied within the last 1-2 years. Of course you can always try using an alternate email but HR might remember your profile anyway.

The best pivot would be to tech/software. Tbh the expected comp is better for software engineering than most prop places anyway.

 

Thanks for the response! So would you recommend I slowly start learning Python in the upcoming months? I also need some job for this fall, and I'm pretty sure most tech firms have closed their applications for this cycle? So should I just continue to apply to financial analyst type roles while learning computer programming on the side?

 

This is firmly inaccurate as a sweeping statement to “most” firms. That said, Akuna blacklists and does so forever. Jane Street blacklists if you don’t do well enough in interviews. Optiver blacklists if you make and fail the final round. Flow does not blacklist as far as I know.

also no way top software comp >>> elite prop, as someone who chose the latter over the former

 

mans is considering tier 2s like Belvedere, so yeah software comp is definitely in play here.

Also you may want to weight comp by probability of getting fired your 1st yr from Optiver/Flow/SIG. I'm reviewing resumes right now and it's pretty insane how many jr level folks from these places I'm seeing considering the bonanza year.

 
Most Helpful

I would buy some time and see if you can push off your graduation date a bit. If someone asks why you need 5 years, you started of in different majors and got some Fs, realized medicine isn't for you and need time for the switch. It'll give you a change to bump up your GPA a bit as well.

Some firms might reject you again if you reapply, but there are tons of other places which you haven't applied to. Much better than Big 4 or any last minute job you get.

Spend some time networking and learning what it's really like on the trading floor. Books don't really do it justice, neither does glassdoor. Figure out how trades trade, how they hedge, how they come out with ideas, and how they make money.

 

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