Help Me Decide: Top Law School or SIPA MPA?
Hello,
I am a long time lurker. I wanted your opinions on what would be the best way to get a comfortable job in a F500 company making at least six figures. I am interested in finance and consulting and i graduated from an undergraduate business school (Haas). Most of my experience is related to public service and teaching children, but I want to make a transition in my career. I applied broadly to some professional schools (not B-School since I do not have enough work experience) and I have the following options.
- Go to a top law school (top 5) and try to transition later in my career.
- Go to Columbia SIPA or UChicago to get an MPA and go from there.
- Go to the above schools, work, and then apply to B-School.
My grades and standardized test scores are as high as they can be, and my dream would be to get an MBA from a top school and go from there. What say you?
I would do; top 5 law -> work -> top MBA -> whatever da fuck you want in life
i was thinking that too, but aren't b schools docking points against older applicants these days? by the time i graduate from law school and work 2-3 years, i will be 29-30.
I think with that background the whole age thing won't matter that much, that would only affect you if your a regular applicant. If you have killer gmat, killer gpa, went to top 5 law, worked at a good firm, and have been involved then there is no reason why they shouldn't accept you
I went to a top 7 law school and worked at two of the Vault top 20 law firms in Banking and Corp/Securities with experience on major deals for 3 years. This past year I went through the Bschool application process with a score that is above the average at every Bschool and admissions was a crapshoot - got interviews virtually everywhere I applied but only hit on about 50% of them. Going to Yale in the fall though and I can fill you in on what happens after that.
My advice: if you can get into a top 5 law program then try and tack on the JD/MBA - Yale offers JD/MBA in 3 years so you aren't having to do an extra year or 2 in school and I think Northwestern has starting offering this accelerated option as well.
you graduated from haas and most of your exp is public service and teaching children...
I don't understand. What is the point in getting a separate masters degree, especially if you intend to get an MBA later on, anyway? Take a finance job at a F500 company now. Do it for a coupl'a years and then get your MBA.
Whatever you do, don't spend 5 years getting two worthless degrees. Worst case do JD / MBA at a top school. Just lie on your application and say that you want to leverage your experience in some realistic sounding way by getting a JD / MBA and you should be all set.
the reason my work experience is so poor and i didn't get a finance job after graduation had nothing to do with my grades or personality. it was because i was an international student back then and companies gave me a hard time because they did not want to spend the extra money to sponsor me.
i will be attending columbia for law school most likely but the problem is that i would have to get into the b school separately and i dont like my chances for that. turtle, where did you apply for b school and where all did you get into? thanks.
Isn't that BS though? They must have X spots or between X and Y spots for JD / MBA students. Of course they review your application to b-school in conjunction with the law school. It wouldn't make sense any other way. Otherwise they might have years where 50 people get in to the joint program and other years where zero get in. You should disregard what they say and apply anyway.
yeah that is what i thought so too but they showed me the number of ppl who get in and the statistics did not look too pretty
WSOlurker,
I'm going to tell you what other people are either too misinformed or too cognitively lazy to (exception Ravenous/Ronaldo7): law school + law career is a poor formula for business school, and you face an uphill battle. The higher up you go with business schools, the more they feel that lawyers ALREADY HAVE a career, and SOMETHING MUST HAVE GONE WRONG for you to want such a drastic and expensive career change.
Two years out of law school and you presumably haven't made much progress in whittling down your student loans. The money is good in Big Law, and in cash terms, it's better than F500 finance (though fortunately for you, F500 Finance Leadership prefers older candidates). It's hard to see the rationale in taking a paycut, jack up the opportunity cost, and add to your already considerable debt pile.
If you go to law school, commit to a legal career, or something at least tangentially connected to it. B-school is essentially a golden reset + turbo-accelerator for your early career, which makes perfect sense if you're a teacher in your early/mid-20s or a policy analyst etc, but not if you're a 29 year old lawyer.
The MPA is a much more diffuse degree that may provide you more intellectual satisfaction than professional options, which doesn't seem like the right balance if your goal is something cushy in F500 Finance. MPA students at top schools tend to make good conversationalists, some with substance and others without. It's a fuzzier proposition that doesn't require you to be as academically robust as law school does (GPA + LSAT), nor does it require you to be as well-rounded and accomplished as b-school does (GMAT + resume + personal qualities). As institutions within their parent universities, the policy schools usually are on the weaker end of the power balance with the business schools and law schools, which is ironic given that politics is a power game (where the business school usually has a slim or large lead, exception: Yale). I know a number of successful MPAs with interesting careers, but almost always they doubled up with a JD or an MBA. The exceptions that come to mind are HKS and SIPA, though I've seen more duds at SIPA than HKS.
******** BOTTOM LINE ADVICE **********
My advice to you, then, is is to either go to law school and commit to that career, or if you want to keep b-school door open, then select the public policy program or law program with the coziest back-door relationship with its sister b-school (as Ravenous suggested). In your case, it looks like you'll have to talk to Harris, SIPA, Chicago Law and Columbia Law students and see which ones have been able to successfully chum up the admissions office of their peer b-school, and how they did it, and whether that's something you can replicate.
Between the two, here are the figures for internal finance positions Columbia Business/Corporate Development, 2.3% Rotational/leadership development, 1.5% (total GM is 6.3%) Real Estate Finance, 1.7% Corporate/Biz Devpt within marketing, 1.3% http://www7.gsb.columbia.edu/recruiters/sites/default/files/pdfs/CBS_20…
Chicago Company Finance/Treasury 6.5% Internal M&A 0.6% General Management (includes rotation programs) 8.5% Business Development 2.7% http://www.chicagobooth.edu/employmentreport/functions.aspx
Between the two, it looks like on a percentage basis, you'll get more F500 Finance from Chicago. I should note that for Investment Banking they're absolutely equal.
wow thanks so much for the advice. this seems like it is the credited approach. i am just worried about biglaw being a giant waste of time pushing paper. pay is important to me but significant work is important as well. i feel like finance would open more doors as i get older.
on a side note, if columba b school would be harder to get into via the law school (as well as booth), would it be a better choice to try to attend nyu law with stern instead since stern is seen as a lower ranked b-school? what is stern's reputation these days and if i had to the choice, which degree would be stronger, the stern mba or harvard/columbia mpa?
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