how and when to leverage offer

Received an offer, but have interview coming up in a few days with a company that I have a stronger desire to be part of. i wish to leverage this offer so they can expedite the process. is it best to communicate to other company's hr before or after i speak with interviewers(non hr people)? how to best way to communicate to hr?

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Comments (112)

Jun 20, 2015

Also interested. Also how do you have an offer mid summer? Internships have barely begun

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Jun 20, 2015

I'd say the sooner the better. Just let them know you received and offer, but would rather work with them.

Jun 20, 2015

Yes, but don't let too much time pass lest CS figure out what you're doing.

Jun 20, 2015

Youre lucky to have an offer period in this market. You can try but i would strongly suggest just taking the CS offer before it is rescinded

I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you.

Jun 20, 2015

It's fine to do that, no real risk as long as you don't have to ask for an extension. If you have contacts at CS that can help you get into one of your preferred groups I'd just take CS though.

Also, didn't you post this same topic a while back saying you were a sophomore? As a sophomore you should be even happier to get an offer from any BB, even in the best of times almost all offers are reserved exclusively for juniors. Interning at CS as a sophomore will set you up to interview anywhere you want as a junior, so I wouldn't worry to much about getting into GS/MS right now.

Jun 20, 2015

Always leverage your offers...but do it in a polite way.

AUTHORED BY: Certified Private Equity Professional - 3rd+ Year Associate - Learn more.
Jun 20, 2015

You are a sophomore. Goldman has already wrapped up its accelerated processes (and that's where most sophomores who get in get in) and their OCR deadlines at all target schools typically are the second or third week of January. Morgan's got a sophomore rotational banking program but it's capped at only 10 kids a year.

Take your Credit offer. That on your resume as a sophomore will put you in a very strong position next year.

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Jun 20, 2015

Seems pretty simple. E-mail the decision maker and tell him that Firm B is your first choice but you got an expiring offer that is attractive from Firm A that you'll be forced to take if you don't hear back by x date. Do you really need someone on an online forum to write that out for you?

Jun 20, 2015

Vertigo - I don't need anyone to write my e-mails. Just am looking for thoughts and opinions; hence, asking people on a forum.

Thanks.

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Jun 20, 2015

There is no need to beat around the bush or try to be coy. Simply put, you want to work at Firm B, so tell Firm B that Firm A has made you an offer that is exploding by X (give yourself an extra 1-3 days at least just for a cushion) and although it is a great opportunity you feel the fit and experience will be much better at firm B. Then let them know that you appreciate their consideration and want to know if there is anything else they need ahead of making a final decision on your candidacy. Something along those lines, give or take a sentence or 2, should suffice and get you a response.

Jun 20, 2015

Tell them firm A's offering a signing bonus that is 5k more than what it really is so you end up with some extra cash :)

Jun 20, 2015

Let the other firm know, but be smart about it. Unless you are an experienced hire with tangible skills you are not going to want to press them too hard. Just let them know they are your 1st choice and the other company is pressing you for an answer.

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Jun 20, 2015

I was once in this exact scenario. I had the offer from my 2nd favorite choice. I emailed the recruiting contact at #1 choice bank, telling her my dilemma. She shot back a quick email saying that she would be in touch no later than a specific date. I gave her a call later in the afternoon on that day (she hadn't called all day and I was basically waiting by the phone).

She said that she was waiting for one more approval, that she couldn't say anything, and that she would call me tomorrow at the moment she heard. It seemed pretty positive, although these recruiters will never ever tell you until they 100% have approval.

She called the next day and extended me an offer. Keeping my end of the bargain (I had told her they were my #1 choice!), I verbally accepted on the spot. (assuming that nothing was glaringly wrong with my offer, of course)

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Jun 20, 2015

Thanks for the comments everyone. They are much appreciated and verify what I was thinking.

@Anthony - I am an experiencedhire. 2 years working at a BB.

@southernbelle - I hope the same thing that happened to you, happens to me! :)

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Jun 20, 2015

No.

Put it on your resume, apply to other places, talk about it during interviews.

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Jun 20, 2015

But I should still directly approach the HRs, right? I would assume that if I applied through the online resume drop, nobody would even look (although that's how I got my current internship)

Jun 20, 2015

Yeah, approach the HRs, tell them your background, but don't go overboard. Be discreet.

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Jun 20, 2015

should the fact that you received an offer to return be on your resume or is this frowned upon?

Jun 20, 2015

Approach other banks with an email / phone call to HR (or a contact within the bank) saying that you have an exploding offer from another bank but you are very keen to work for their bank and need to make a decision about the exploding offer in the next week... That should get you in for interviews shortly after that.

Jun 20, 2015

I thought most places ..... especially lehman were full....... and again I am not sure why you are looking at those places above goldman (unless its a group or culture issue). But you really do not need to bring it up because in the interview they will. Without fail if you have a Goldman Sachs Investment banking or wutever as your summer internship they will certainly ask you if you have an offer.... I would hesitate on then making a comment such as "what will you give me to come here".... I am not sure if anyone respond well to that cause I doubt they really much care what a college senior has to offer especially if they take an attitude like that going in. I would merely state you have the offer to return and if they ask you why you are not returning then either give reasons sucha as "Well I like your firm for xyz and have an interest in your _______ group" or "I really enjoyed my time there, but I had a few issues with a certain individual in the group that I didn't like their work ethic" or wutever thing you want to give.....

Jun 20, 2015

why do you care about the other banks? take GS unless you absolutely hate the place. then, stop interviewing and enjoy the rest of college. quit trying to rack up offers.

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Jun 20, 2015

The only reason I'm still interviewing is b/c the GS offer is in their Investment Management Controllers group and at Bear I'm interviewing for Prime Brokerage and at Lehman for Credit Risk Analyst.

I want to see if these are better opportunities than the GS one since controllers wasn't really where I wanted to go.

I had an internship at Bear last summer but the division (ops) doesn't extend FT offers to interns.

Jun 20, 2015

The CRA guys at Lehman don't give a crap if you have a controllers offer at GS and the Bear brokerage guys won't either. They're different industries. Just like nobody would give a crap at CS investment banking if you had an offer to work PWM at GS.

EDIT- in fact, thinking about it more, it will probably only hurt you MORE. If you go to Lehman and say you are thinking of going to be a controller at G/S it shows you really have no clue what kind of job you want to have coming out of college. Brokerage, credit risk, and controllers positions are completely different from each other; BBs want to hire people who know exactly what they are getting into and want to do that, rather than see a kid who is just trying to pimp himself out to get the best name on his resume, regardless of the position he is taking with them. This is the same reason why nobody applies to multiple positions at the same bank; it shows you lack direction in your career interests.

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Jun 20, 2015

Don't get into specifics about your GS offer. I would simply communicate that you have an exploding offer at GS but are still interested in going through the interview process with each bank. Above all else, do not treat the banks as if they need to sell you - this just pisses people off.

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Jun 20, 2015

well, the thing is is that it's not a plain-old vanilla controllers job b/c originally when i heard controllers i was like screw that i dont want to do accounting but this is within the investment management group doing the valuations for GS's hedge funds and mutual funds.

i think i'd take the GS job over the Bear one but not sure about Lehman.

what do you guys think?

GS's offer is 60+10+OT+yr-end bonus

Jun 20, 2015

GS seems like a good stint mate.
take it

Jun 20, 2015

Ok, so I called Lehman and said I had the exploding offer from Goldman on the 6th and the guy I spoke to said he'll see if he can push it up.

Now, what if they say they can't push it up, I'm going to be put in a tough spot b/c I'm not going back to Goldman and saying I need an extension, so basically I'll have to accept Goldman and go to Lehman and interview anyway.

But, the problem is, what if I go to the Lehman interviews and someone says to me, "so I heard you had that exploding offer from Goldman on the 6th, what did you do about that?" What am I supposed to do? Tell them I accepted it and am interviewing anyway? Lie and say I rejected them and then have them call up Goldman and ask and I"ll be screwed???

This can end VERY badly!!

What do you guys think I should do in this scenario?

Jun 20, 2015

Don't say anythng concrete.

If they push you, say you got an extension. People don't care as much as you might think.

Jun 20, 2015

MSG...just out of curiousity, when did you get an offer? shortly after the superday? I recently had an IMD superday in NY and interviewed with a few groups and am waiting on hearing back. Did you interview with numerous groups within IMD after the morning superday?? I really hit it off with one group in particular and am hoping to hear back soon. thanks for the help

Jun 20, 2015

Hey Polarbear... I actually interviewed within controllers for the controllers analyst and was placed within IMD. The superday was Friday and I got the call on Tuesday.

I sent thank-you emails right after the superday interviews and the one guy who got back to me was the guy from IMD and he requested me to work for his group and he actually called on the day after I got the offer to congratulate me and invite me in to meet everyone on the team.

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Jun 20, 2015

Congrats man...I cant say i know thr answer but good work

Jun 20, 2015

Just say stuff like..

hi, i recently recevived an offer from xyz for their abc position. obviously your firm are my top choice, and i was wondering if you can give me an update on the status of my application..etc..

don't worry, most BB will work with you to speed up your interview. they might also want you more, knowing someone else want you as well.. (depends on who, of course).

Good Luck!

Jun 20, 2015

If you have an offer, but want something more, definitely call them up. Say i have X, let me know what you can do.

AUTHORED BY: Certified Hedge Fund Professional - 3rd+ Year Analyst - Learn more.
Jun 20, 2015
Oreos:

If you have an offer, but want something more, definitely call them up. Say i have X, let me know what you can do.

Agreed. Once you have an offer in hand for another position it's more than fair to call them up and let them know that while you have an offer their position is your first choice. Short of that though, I wouldn't get cute with any innuendo about other interviews.

Cheers

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Jun 20, 2015

Excuse the ignorance but would you contact HR or your interviewers with the offer information?

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Jun 20, 2015
The Real Max:

Excuse the ignorance but would you contact HR or your interviewers with the offer information?

If you have an HR contact I would start with that.

Cheers

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Jun 20, 2015

always do this. Honestly at this point in the hiring cycle you may want to hint at alternative offers even if you dont have one. It will only make employers take you more seriously and pursue your candidacy quicker.

Jun 20, 2015

Yes finance in general is a VERY small world/niche. If the other banks didn't take you a month ago, why would they want you now? If you really want the other bank, I would contact them and just say your really interested and wanted to know if there were any SA positions still open. DONT bring up that you have an offer until they ask you. Whatever you do, dont lie.

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Jun 20, 2015

I received an exploding offer from my current bank. Summer offers are out and, in general, interviews are over for BB. I am focusing on trying to set up full time interviews. Instead of talking with recruiters (I am from a non-target), I was thinking about focusing on analysts/associates and getting a conversation going with them. Then, when the time comes, ask them if they wouldn't mind forwarding my resume for full time consideration.

Jun 20, 2015

Don't be greedy - it will come back to bite you

Do you SA program, get the FT offer, then start shopping if you want to.

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Jun 20, 2015

Fine line between networking (which is perfectly fine) and seeming like you're shopping already. Accelerated interviews for FT aren't until towards the end of summer anyway.

Jun 20, 2015

In most interviews I've had, they ask where I am in the process with other companies, so I don't think it would be inappropriate to mention. I wouldn't use it as a way to make yourself appear more attractive. Instead, think of it as giving the second bank a fair shot. Any chance you can also work with the 1st bank to get a little bit of extra time to consider their offer? It probably wouldn't hurt to ask.

Jun 20, 2015
TU_Math:

In most interviews I've had, they ask where I am in the process with other companies, so I don't think it would be inappropriate to mention. I wouldn't use it as a way to make yourself appear more attractive. Instead, think of it as giving the second bank a fair shot. Any chance you can also work with the 1st bank to get a little bit of extra time to consider their offer? It probably wouldn't hurt to ask.

Thanks for the advice. Is it a complete NO to ask about compensation in our initial chat (phone interview)? I figure that if the comp is lower than my first offer, there's no point in going onto the next round.

Jun 20, 2015

Absolutely....leverage all offers

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Jun 20, 2015

Why are they hiring an interm if there's no FT opportunity?

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Jun 20, 2015
SECfinance:

Why are they hiring an interm if there's no FT opportunity?

A lot of PE firms will hire interns with the explicit understanding that they won't be able to convert to a FT position; the reasons they do so are much the same as why companies also offer internships to sophomores.

OP, when it comes time for FT recruiting, having an offer can be a powerful tool:

  1. Shows that you're competent enough for at least one employer to hire you on
  2. Insurance. Assuming the offer isn't exploding any time soon, it's good to know that at the very least, you've got an offer and will have work after you graduate.
  3. Garnering FT interviews is much easier with an offer since you can just go up to recruiters at info sessions or career fairs/connections at banks and say that you have an offer from X but would like the opportunity to recruit with their bank, hopefully on an accelerated basis since your offer expires on whatever date. My offer was exploding, and this was a really productive way to get interviews for me.

Note that FT recruiting is pretty hard, though. There are fewer slots, and you're expected to know your stuff better.

Hope this was helpful.

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Jun 20, 2015

Cheap labor, extra work that doesn't justify another full-time associate, my guess.

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Jun 20, 2015

If they really want to, but they may not be so inclined - assuming this is a stupid question, but do they know exactly when your offer expires?

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Jun 20, 2015

Thanks for the response. And yes they do. Planning on calling HR on Monday after no response to emails

Jun 20, 2015

Unfortunately if they haven't responded to your emails and have said they're waiting on headcount numbers (which could take some time to arrive) it's likely you won't get an interview (or at least have the process wrapped up) by the time your offer expires - unless they really meant you'd get an interview and like you, and are willing to wrap the process up in 1-2 days max.

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Jun 20, 2015

You should probably take the exploding offer. BB recruiting at this time of year is very erratic from what I've seen.

Jun 20, 2015

judge it by your situation

say if Harvard sends you admit but.... say Tulsa sends you a good scholarship check---Harvard probably won't care.

However if UPenn sends out a nice check--wouldn't that be more convincing?

Next, talk about a range, dont' suggest a firm number. It seems that you will be asking for less, but it actually helps you more to get success.

Jun 20, 2015

I thought you were an MSF student?

Jun 20, 2015
Ipso facto:

I thought you were an MSF student?

Very observant. Yes, I'm trying to help someone that I know.

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Jun 20, 2015

if this is true, why would you take MM IB over PE anyway?

Jun 20, 2015

It would be alright, but will have a different level of weight based on what kind of PE firm gave you an offer.

If the fund is $1B+ in AUM, then I'd actually highly recommend taking the PE offer over the MM IM(your chances of doing meaningful work are better) unless we're talking about a decently reputable MM and not just a random boutique.

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Jun 20, 2015

"If the fund is $1B+ in AUM, then I'd actually highly recommend taking the PE offer over the MM IM"

yeah for sure, but it's not that big. The Toronto PE scene is nowhere near as developed as New York. In New York a fund with $1B AUM is considered Mid-cap, in Toronto it would actually be one of the top PE funds and most likely a top destination by graduating IBD analysts.

joefish, the pe fund is pretty flexible so I might actually try and do both in one summer if I can get the gig. I need to make up for a less than stellar gpa.

Jun 20, 2015

I'm doing two placements this summer as well.

If you can somehow do both, that would be great!

Jun 20, 2015

I'm exactly the same situation with Citi, CS and Merrill, any input would be great here! Any advice in picking?

Jun 20, 2015

From my experience in the past month, it only works when you are trading downward or between equals. For example, let's say you have an offer at one Tier 1 firm, and one Tier 2 firm.

Tier 2 wants you to sign even more now because they know you are good enough to get into Tier 1, so they have people from groups you want to get into call you and make promises that you will be placed into the group of your choice. Tier 1 firm tells you they want you here, but not bad enough to promise you a group (since they know they are your best offer).

Keep in mind though that no matter how hard I tried, people would "promise" that they would do their best to get me into group X, but no one would ever commit to it in writing.

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Jun 20, 2015

True, no matter what people say, there is not a 100% chance you will get into the group of your choice. IMHO, the group you're placed in as a summer is really not that big of a deal. It's only 10 weeks. My advice: take your top choice offer, perform well no matter what group you're placed in. This will give you more leverage when getting placed for full-time.

Jun 20, 2015

"My advice: take your top choice offer, perform well no matter what group you're placed in."

This is incredibly sound advice, your internship doesnt matter that much, just be sure to impress all those you work with and you will have your pick of litter come time to decide upon full-time.

Jun 20, 2015

i disagree

group is very important

obviously anything in GS IBD is better than Wachovia

but between similar firms, like Citi and JPM, u should go to the best group

Jun 20, 2015

i stand by my original point

group may be important for full time, but even then I think being at the top of your analyst class is more important. but as a summer, group is not really important

I also think you should be thankful for a summer internship and focus on getting the full-time offer rather than worry about exit opps

Jun 20, 2015

Doesn't usually work that way, HR has little say in group placement so I think you'd just piss them off. Just network ur ass off with the groups you want and take the better bank.

Jun 20, 2015

Placement comes after you join - the time lag will make it impossible

unless u kno ppl

Jun 20, 2015

You tell them who company A is and where they are located? What exactly is your dilemma

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Jun 20, 2015

If company A found out about it, wouldnt they be pissed?

Jun 20, 2015

also is that odd for company B to do? theyre the only firm whose ever asked me this

Jun 20, 2015

I'm just guessing here since I've never been in that situation, but maybe say it's an Elite Boutique. This way they'll know it's a Lazard/Rothschild/Jefferies type firm.

    • 1
Jun 20, 2015

You can tell them where. The offer has been extended, nobody is going to rescind it just because you played your hand at other places respectfully. They only care if you renege or lie, not if you play the game.

Jun 20, 2015

Agreed, there was a thread identical to this one. Basically, everyone said that you should tell them the name especially if it is an elite boutique.

Link

Jun 20, 2015

Isn't this a given if someone checks your LinkedIn per se? Just curious

Jun 20, 2015

My experience has been that they'll ask for a name 100% of the time.

Jun 20, 2015

would like to hear the responses to this, as i find my self in a similar situation

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Jun 20, 2015

Don't leverage openly, just ask for what you want and see what your boss says.
People generally don't like ultimatums, especially if you are working at a place where a group is pretty close-knit.

More is good, all is better

Jun 20, 2015

Well, that's what I plan on doing...saying I want to move to a more preferred location/group and gauging the response. Chances are his answer will be "not now, but maybe in a year or two", which is pretty uncertain, at which point I'll have to say I have an offer on the table. I really don't want to use it as a threat though -- I'd rather stay at my current firm but need certainty I could move relatively soon.

Jun 20, 2015

if he tells you "not now, maybe in a year or two" it is not "uncertain", it's a "no, get back to work".
Is the other job in the city you want to be in?

More is good, all is better

Jun 20, 2015

Yes, it is. Basically, I am not in NYC (though in an HQ city for my bank) and all my friends are in NYC.

Jun 20, 2015

I had a friend with an offer from another firm (same city) (trading/same desk on the new offer), and when she presented her resignation they basically refused to accept it and literally sat her down for two days trying to bribe her to stay. not first year of course. the point is, they know what they have to do to keep you with them. they have been through it before.
just remind them how much you like them etc etc ... but the tipping factor is really the city.
you have no guarantee your boss will be there in 2 yrs so why would you accept some vague promise..
and when you do leave... you can refer me to the desk where your spot is open. = )

Jun 20, 2015

The other half of my question hasn't been answered -- how good an idea is it to stay after they've found out I've been interviewing (and have an offer elsewhere)?

Jun 20, 2015

If you tell them what they want, and they give it to you, obviously they want to keep you. If they're not willing to match, then it is definitely time to gtfo of Dodge.

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Jun 20, 2015

ask you present firm for a counteroffer which you shop back to the hiring firm, assuming counteroffer is bigger by any appreciable %. if not, take the offer. it's that simple.

Jun 20, 2015

then just ask your group head for a transfer, raise(to accommodate the increase in the cost of living XD) and a recommendation, and if he can't or doesn't want to let you "spread your wings", then take the other job.
Keep in mind, he may be totally willing but not able to plug you, and what are you going to do then? Figure out your own priorities and don't get caught up in the emotions of the moment.
Another point to consider - which bank will enable you to build a better resume? if the smaller, worse bank gives you big projects and positions you as the rising star, then that does way more for your personal brand than being associated with a bigger better bank (without as much responsibility). You personal brand and your personal equity is much closer correlated with your earning capacity than the brand of the company you work for.
Can your boss help you get placed into a better group in NYC than what the bigger better bank is placing you in?

I wouldnt take the culture into consideration, if you are going to transfer to the NYC branch of your current company, it's not like you can take your current coworkers with you, you will essentially be starting in a new place, possibly with a different culture from what you are used to, and I would imagine you wouldn't be as interested in making friends with your coworkers, because you will have your old friends to hang with.

More is good, all is better

Jun 20, 2015

i highly doubt there will be a drawn out bidding war for a first year analyst, hard-ass negotiating is good when you have a lot of projects (and money) depending on you being there, and the company won't be able to find a quick replacement. Counter-counter-offering in his position will most likely lead to him getting let go from the current bank, and having his offer rescinded by the bigger better bank.

More is good, all is better

Best Response
Jun 20, 2015

I think that the only times that "leveraging an offer" is appropriate would be when asked about it during an interview and if you are (kindly) asking another bank to speed up their process. If during an interview you're asked if you have offers at other places, do mention if you have any outstanding offers. If you have an exploding offer from Bank A and are waiting for superday results from Bank B, do send a short and friendly note to HR from Bank B explaining the situation and asking when you might expect to hear back from Bank B. But, what you (and almost everyone else who asks this) are thinking of doing is inappropriate. The hiring process is not the same as the car buying process- you cannot just take an offer from one place and ask the next place to match it.

I would recommend emailing the MD and reiterating your interest in his/her bank and asking how you can best position yourself for recruiting. I would not bring up your offer. Mentioning your offer gives the wrong impression. Good luck.

AUTHORED BY: Certified Corporate Development Professional - Manager - Learn more.
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Jun 20, 2015

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