I’m in a position now where I have an offer at a bank that I’m somewhat happy with, but it’s by no means my first choice. It’s a smaller bank so don’t want to give too much info, but think somewhere between Lazard and Baird with regards to prestige. The issue is my offer expires next week, and I need to make a very tough decision.
I have a few banks that are definitely more prestigious that I’m waiting on (JPM, Centerview, BAML, etc) where I have had some good networking chats and a few people that said they will push my resume. Obviously all of those banks are extremely competitive though, and I’m in no way confident that I can land one. On one hand, I landed this offer without much networking and got really confident in my recruiting chances, but I also didn’t even make it to Goldmans super day so I don’t know why it would be any different at a place like JPM (my networking was similar at both).
I’m just worried that if I play this safe, I’m always going to wonder about what could have been and think I sold myself short, but on the other hand I would feel like the biggest idiot in the world if I turned down this offer and didn’t get any others. Any advice? The issue is from what I’ve heard, the banks I’m waiting on won’t be making offers for another month+, so it’s not like I can try to buy myself another week and that would solve things.
So correct me if I am wrong, but you have an offer at hand and nothing else. It doesnt seem like you have interviews anywhere else.
If you do not accept your offer, you are back to square one and could potentially have nothing else. You could try to reach out to other banks and say I have an offer that expires next week and need to be able to accelerate the interview process if given the opportunity to interview.
Wait until the day before and if you do not have an offer anywhere else, then accept this offer. It is a easy decision. "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"
I took the first offer I received this summer, one which is in a similar "prestige" range (though Lazard is exceptional by all accounts, so I'm not entirely sure if you simply mean to suggest that it's MM). If you don't have another offer, or even an upcoming superday on the table, failing to take this offer will leave you in a position of fewer and fewer options as the fall approaches.
Worst case scenario: you hate the bank/group/work, and you continue with your networking to swap to another firm for full time recruiting after your internship.
Thanks for the advice. Sorry if this was unclear, but my Lazard reference was saying this place is not as prestigious as Lazard. I was just trying to say that it’s a boutique that is more prestigious than Baird but less prestigious than Lazard to give people a general sense of what I was working with.
Makes sense, though I'm sure your LZ reference might also testify that they are a sweatshop. I guess the other way to approach your situation is to consider the group's characteristics. Are they the kind of team that will cut you off if you choose to split next year, or will they help you land another gig? Are they better/worse in their area of focus than the bank in general is? I don't know if these will apply to you, but those were some of the questions on my mind before I pulled the trigger.
Take the offer. Why gamble the start of your career like this
Honestly, the HARDEST thing to do is to get your foot at the door at all (at a reputable shop). Not talking stuff like TA at a Big 4 or M&A at a no-name boutique. If you have something that, in your words, is "between Lazard and Baird" that's a home-run. You can always lateral a year or two down the line, and not lose any time. Good associates are hard to find so if you think you'll still be doing IBD then, a lot of the prestige whores will have jumped ship for PE/VC, and there'll be openings at top firms then as well.
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. Best thing to do is leverage your offer now for an accelerated superday, but unless you LITERALLY have another offer by the time this one explodes, then accept your offer on the last day.
Something else to consider - your SA firm is by no means your FT firm. It is true that FT recruiting is tough with limited spots, but you are at the top of the competition coming in with summer experience at a reputable MM. Especially if you keep in touch with contacts at more desirable firms, FT recruiting is always an option and is usually dismissed by this forum as too competitive.
take the job why is this even a question
if you go to a let's say t3 bank you can always lateral up later in your career
if you dont get into banking you are going to be screwed
this has been answered before...and its easy
(keep in mind, i am a trader, and my response is rooted in how traders are expected to behave)
1) accept the exploding offer 2) continue to interview 3) if you get a "much better" offer, accept it and get confirmation....only THEN let the exploding offer know that you won't be able to take the job.
Thank them for the opportunity...but due to family circumstances out of your control, unfortunately you won't be able to continue with accepting their position, and you need to recuse yourself. Don't worry, there are 500 other kids who would love to take your place...and the firm won't have a problem filling your space, and your name will quickly be forgotten. You might be tempted to lie...but the smarter play is to keep the reason confidential (imagine if you needed to become a fulltime caregiver for a sick aging grandfather...you may use this exact same language "i'm sorry, but due to family circumstances, i sadly won't be able to continue with my position at xyz firm and need to terminate my employment contract. Thank you for the opportunity.").
Don't update LinkedIn or social media with your new position...just become a ghost...so you don't burn bridges.
This right here. Reneging is a scumbag move forsure but it's the best way to minmax your recruiting process.
Don't know who threw MS at you, is exactly what I'd suggest: accept the exploding offer, don't update your social media (keep it all low profile), continue with the other applications, if you get a better offer, politely recuse yourself in vague terms and accept the better offer. Yeah, it's a slight dick move to renege like this, but life's a game and you're just playing it.
Do not renege. A senior at my semi target got in big trouble after she reneged for a SA and couldn't recruit full time for OCR. Only renege if you're absolutely sure you can get the return offer for full time. And a lot of the Bulge Brackets know who reneged on who
companies that give out exploding offers are assholes...and they deserve to be reneged on if their applicants get better offer. You as a student looking for a great internship, or your 1st job out of college are already at a disadvantage....and firms that look to take advantage of that are scum...so i have no sympathy for them...and neither should you.
all that said...i would be more willing to play this game with a FT offer, rather than a summer internship, if your school mainly recruits via OCR and this strategy runs the risk of getting you barred from OCR.
Take the offer, don't look back, don't make excuses when people ask who you work for. The actual work you're doing is going to be the same. Maybe you work with the lower MM team at Bain on acquisitions instead of as sell side adviser for the unicorns they're unloading (you get my point). I'd tell you to look at tombstones of the group you have the offer from and to research the sponsors behind those companies if you're concerned with exit opportunities but you should really just accept the offer and go party for the rest of the summer.
Wall Street is a short street with a long memory. People move around in terms of jobs/offices and the word gets around. You don't wanna be that guy who starts his career on a lie.
Getting an IB internship is the most important thing at this stage. You'll get plenty of other opportunities to trade up in the game of life:
Also, look at the bios of anyone age 40+ whose career you'd like to have: I think what you'll see is a lot of guys who did IB, but not much skew toward the top banks.
Point being, getting into IB is a lot more important than getting a top brand. Doing anything to jeopardize the former for the latter wouldn't be rational.
Some might say that you're not really jeopardizing anything if you have an airtight-sounding scheme like the "family emergency" plan mentioned above. I'd agree, if I thought it was airtight. But I don't think it is.
The lower-tier firms have plenty of experience handing out offers before the higher-tier firms. They've been around the block a few times and I wouldn't just assume they do nothing to protect the offer. For example, after I accepted my internship offer I had an email from my school's career office an hour later congratulating me; not sure if the bank was just notifying them for stats or what, but certainly would've been hard to trade up after that.
Yes, can confirm the career office thing happening before at my school. But beyond just this - the bulge brackets keep track of who reneges. I know someone who reneged on a lower BB for a tier 2 BB, and the person was not given a return offer for FT because of it
Curious but why do people thing banks do exploding offers?
It does seem to put a candidate in a bad position and pressure they are not ready to face.
My gut says it has less to do with being assholes or afraid of losing a viable analysts. I think it has to do with higher ups not wanting to waste more time recruiting.
Especially for internships I’d rather just get guys signed then have to waste more time filling the pipeline. For full time offer then I would think exploding is a bad move and leaving you liable for guys reneging. If it was for an internship and someone reneged to trade up I’d be a bit pissed. For a full time kid to renege in an exploding offer I’d be more understanding. 2-3 months versus 2-3 years. And some stay longer.
its pretty simple - exploding offers put pressure on the candidate to choose a sure thing vs a free option to interview elsewhere and potentially get a better offer.
If a firm gives an exploding offer, for a job that starts 9+ months in the future, the only reason is they fear their candidates will get offers from "better" firms, and that they would choose the better firm over themselves. Its got nothing to do with dragging out the hiring process...and everything to do with snagging talent away from a competitor (at the expense of the candidate being able to make a fully informed choice, via the free market). If all firms recruited on the same schedule, and made offers on the same date, then this would go away...but then the better firms would always get the best people.
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