Mar 04, 2013

How much does your first job determine your career path in finance?

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VC

11y

I took the one less traveled by, And that has made all the difference.

PE

11y

One of my networking contacts started by serving lunch on the stock exchange floor. Now he's a managing director at a large hedge fund.

I don't think it matters all that much.

Authored by: Certified Private Equity Professional - Vice PresidentCertified Private Equity Pro

target for life

AM

11y

7xEBITDA:
One of my networking contacts started by serving lunch on the stock exchange floor. Now he's a managing director at a large hedge fund.
I don't think it matters all that much.

WTF? Was this shit like in the 60's or something. There was some dude that was a janitor at GS before becoming partner but that happened in the 20's. Stories like that don't fly anymore. Top school --> Top Insitution front office analyst role ---> Buyside/Other firm Exit Ops or Bust!

................

?

11y

target for life:
7xEBITDA:
One of my networking contacts started by serving lunch on the stock exchange floor. Now he's a managing director at a large hedge fund.
I don't think it matters all that much.

WTF? Was this shit like in the 60's or something. There was some dude that was a janitor at GS before becoming partner but that happened in the 20's. Stories like that don't fly anymore. Top school --> Top Insitution front office analyst role ---> Buyside/Other firm Exit Ops or Bust!

I hope you're kidding, or you must be one gigantic douche.

Obviously this kind of stuff is less likely today, but that doesn't mean that your career path won't change over time. You start off your career at age 22. You most likely retire when you are in your 60's. If you think you can map out a 40+ year career when you are in your 20's and have it go from one step to the next without anything unexpected happening, you are gonna get a rude awakening when your mapped out road through life hits its first pothole.

I think it matters to an extent but not in the way you might be thinking. I don't think your first job determines your career path in the sense that if you don't get a top group at a top bank at age 22 you won't be successful, but more in the sense that many people go after their first job because they think that's what they want to do, and then stay in that career path for most of their career because they find that they truly enjoy it.

I would agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

O

11y

^shut up

If your dreams don't scare you, then they are not big enough. "There are two types of people in this world: People who say they pee in the shower, and dirty fucking liars."-Louis C.K.

HF

11y

It doesn't matter my boss (Hf manager) worked at a store for like 10 years before he went off and started his fund. If you are (actually) smart then you will find a way to where you belong.

Authored by: Certified Hedge Fund Professional - 1st Year AnalystCertified Hedge Fund Pro

ST

11y

This is currently on the WSO front page.

//www.wallstreetoasis.com/blog/interview-with-head-of-currency-strategy-a…

HowardRoark:
Marc Chandler has been covering the global capital markets in one fashion or another for nearly 25 years, working at economic consulting firms and global investment banks. Read more about Marc's bio below
1) Your background isn't the traditional one in the finance world. Can you talk a little about it?

So, I have a masters in American History and a masters in International Relations. What this meant was that I didn't have the same amount of business knowledge in comparison to my peers, so I had to catch up on the quantitative business skills. However, I do think that I gained a lot of liberal arts skills, which are crucial. These skills can be fundamental abilities that can be transferred. I believe my previous work has helped me developed three abilities which are important: thinking well, writing well, and speaking well.

This is especially true now. Since the end of the financial crisis, people in the profession have realized that the Masters in Business Administration is too narrowly focused, and many top heads are modifying their courses to encourage critical thinking, as well as more "soft skills" that may prove useful.

So your first job matters very little, I would say. People make it to the top from all walks of life. In fact, very few IBD MD's started as analysts. You see a lot coming from the industry they currently cover in their respective coverage groups or they come in after getting their MBA's (or some other form of higher education like Marc Chandler here). Now, the elitist pricks might say that this is because all of the good analysts are able to make the jump to the buyside, which may be true to a certain extent, but don't let that deter you from your goal.

target for life

AM

11y

design:
This is currently on the WSO front page.
//www.wallstreetoasis.com/blog/interview-with-head-of-currency-strategy-a…

HowardRoark:
Marc Chandler has been covering the global capital markets in one fashion or another for nearly 25 years, working at economic consulting firms and global investment banks. Read more about Marc's bio below
1) Your background isn't the traditional one in the finance world. Can you talk a little about it?

So, I have a masters in American History and a masters in International Relations. What this meant was that I didn't have the same amount of business knowledge in comparison to my peers, so I had to catch up on the quantitative business skills. However, I do think that I gained a lot of liberal arts skills, which are crucial. These skills can be fundamental abilities that can be transferred. I believe my previous work has helped me developed three abilities which are important: thinking well, writing well, and speaking well.

This is especially true now. Since the end of the financial crisis, people in the profession have realized that the Masters in Business Administration is too narrowly focused, and many top heads are modifying their courses to encourage critical thinking, as well as more "soft skills" that may prove useful.

So your first job matters very little, I would say. People make it to the top from all walks of life. In fact, very few IBD MD's started as analysts. You see a lot coming from the industry they currently cover in their respective coverage groups or they come in after getting their MBA's (or some other form of higher education like Marc Chandler here). Now, the elitist pricks might say that this is because all of the good analysts are able to make the jump to the buyside, which may be true to a certain extent, but don't let that deter you from your goal.

So another example of a dude from another era? You guys are competent enough to realize that the world is dynamic right?

Isn't the phrase "Past returns are not indicative of future returns" stamped across every meaningful financial product?

I put zero weight in these stories as people like them have no value in today's society, I'm not talking about the experienced vet but the newbie with the background.

I want to aggregate thoughts on how to gauge how your first job might impact your future career in todays era (post 2000).

ST

11y

Best Response

target for life:
So another example of a dude from another era? You guys are competent enough to realize that the world is dynamic right?
Isn't the phrase "Past returns are not indicative of future returns" stamped across every meaningful financial product?

I put zero weight in these stories as people like them have no value in today's society, I'm not talking about the experienced vet but the newbie with the background.

I want to aggregate thoughts on how to gauge how your first job might impact your future career in todays era (post 2000).

Post-2000 info is meaningless. These people are in the middle of their lives. They're still young enough to have the opportunity to change their career trajectories. If you want to see where someone ends up, you have to see the full body of work. All we really have to go off of are people "from another era", as you so quaintly put it.

HF

11y

target for life:
design:
This is currently on the WSO front page.
//www.wallstreetoasis.com/blog/interview-with-head-of-currency-strategy-a…

HowardRoark:
Marc Chandler has been covering the global capital markets in one fashion or another for nearly 25 years, working at economic consulting firms and global investment banks. Read more about Marc's bio below
1) Your background isn't the traditional one in the finance world. Can you talk a little about it?

So, I have a masters in American History and a masters in International Relations. What this meant was that I didn't have the same amount of business knowledge in comparison to my peers, so I had to catch up on the quantitative business skills. However, I do think that I gained a lot of liberal arts skills, which are crucial. These skills can be fundamental abilities that can be transferred. I believe my previous work has helped me developed three abilities which are important: thinking well, writing well, and speaking well.

This is especially true now. Since the end of the financial crisis, people in the profession have realized that the Masters in Business Administration is too narrowly focused, and many top heads are modifying their courses to encourage critical thinking, as well as more "soft skills" that may prove useful.

So your first job matters very little, I would say. People make it to the top from all walks of life. In fact, very few IBD MD's started as analysts. You see a lot coming from the industry they currently cover in their respective coverage groups or they come in after getting their MBA's (or some other form of higher education like Marc Chandler here). Now, the elitist pricks might say that this is because all of the good analysts are able to make the jump to the buyside, which may be true to a certain extent, but don't let that deter you from your goal.

So another example of a dude from another era? You guys are competent enough to realize that the world is dynamic right?

Isn't the phrase "Past returns are not indicative of future returns" stamped across every meaningful financial product?

I put zero weight in these stories as people like them have no value in today's society, I'm not talking about the experienced vet but the newbie with the background.

I want to aggregate thoughts on how to gauge how your first job might impact your future career in todays era (post 2000).

Stop worrying, the cream rises to the top no matter the circumstances. For now and as long as humanity doesn't go dystopian or something. If you can charm the right people you can do well.

Authored by: Certified Hedge Fund Professional - 1st Year AnalystCertified Hedge Fund Pro

?

11y

ackman hired his fishing instructor who didn't know any finance at all...

IB

11y

couchy:
ackman hired his fishing instructor who didn't know any finance at all...

http://www.forbes.com/sites/monteburke/2012/06/29/the-fishing-guide-who…

Here is a link to this story if anyone hasn't read it. The man won life, plain and simple. You don't have to have the 'presteej' that seems to be so popular on these boards (but having prestigious things on your resume makes things easier). Smart people who work hard at doing what they love will most of the time be successful.

Mean Reversion Stocks

target for life

AM

11y

MindOverMonkey:
couchy:
ackman hired his fishing instructor who didn't know any finance at all...

http://www.forbes.com/sites/monteburke/2012/06/29/the-fishing-guide-who…

Here is a link to this story if anyone hasn't read it. The man won life, plain and simple. You don't have to have the 'presteej' that seems to be so popular on these boards (but having prestigious things on your resume makes things easier). Smart people who work hard at doing what they love will most of the time be successful.

Boss story but outlier. Unless you are born into a connected family, what are the chances you get in good with the CEO of a megafund. Never mind the lowly analysts & possibly a MD but the CEO. Dude was smart & had balls but seriously this can't be a success story.

Its like the kid whose dad is an MD at BX gets him hookups at GS, MS & the like, does a few relevant internships & then jumps to the buyside. That doesn't count as networking or skill in my opinion. That's just luck, an incredible amount of luck.

?

11y

warren buffet started as a janitor at MIT

?

11y

It matters at least somewhat. If you start out in fixed income sales, you aren't going into private equity. If you start out in banking, you aren't going to be a convert trader. Of course, there are exceptions to every rule, but they're not the type of thing you should bank on.

I believe that if you are good, you can make a good career no matter where you start, but certain paths become harder to go down depending on where you start. It's just a function of having certain skills obtained on the job.

?

11y

IMHO it doesn't make that much of a difference. I think people that end up at the top or bottom would have ended up their respectively no matter what. Someone who goes to a shit school and gets a shit job but is 100% determined to make it to the top can probably do that regardless of their first job. The same applies the other way around.

Now there is no doubt that having your first job as an excellent one makes it easier to get to the top, but by no means is it the be all end all.

Data Room Meaning

O

11y

This is a finance board (basically). Tracking is immensely important. If you want to work in finance, odds are (yep, we're talking on average) that the first job you get after college will be the most important job you ever have. Anyone who pretends otherwise is either:

a) Lying, or

b) Looking only at outliers.

https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/resources/skills/strategy/strategic-analysis

O

11y

holla_back:
This is a finance board (basically). Tracking is immensely important. If you want to work in finance, odds are (yep, we're talking on average) that the first job you get after college will be the most important job you ever have. Anyone who pretends otherwise is either:
a) Lying, or

b) Looking only at outliers.

I don't know lol... how much experience have you had in the finance industry? I just have a hard time imagining that the first couple years after college will be the most influential years of your life no matter what.

If your dreams don't scare you, then they are not big enough. "There are two types of people in this world: People who say they pee in the shower, and dirty fucking liars."-Louis C.K.

?

11y

First job is always matters in any field, and in finance it is important because you learn many practical things or concept about finance which you never learned in curriculum. And you always get your first job on the basis of your concept clarity and knowledge as you don’t have any job experience before.

HF

11y

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Authored by: Certified Hedge Fund Professional - Assistant Portfolio ManagerCertified Hedge Fund Pro

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