I want to be a Trader. Am I delusional? Undelude me.

I quit my job in IBD after 2+ years about 3-4 weeks ago. I quit because I hated the job - I did not hate the hours. I hated that I worked for people I did not really respect, that the job was not challenging and was the same old stuff day after day, that there was too much selling/skewing/straight up BS/lying. Also I had no time to explore other career options while doing that job, and by the time I would have had time, I would have spent too much time being a banker.

I have a lot of my own capital saved up. I have spent the past 3-4 weeks studying trading, markets, and trying to understand the industry better. My sister works in S&T (but just started) for CS and is always saying I NEED to explore this industry as she thinks it is a great fit for me personality-wise.

Here's me:
- I'm smart, in terms of I have good logic, I went to an Ivy and double-majored, and I have near-perfect test scores across the board. However, when you guys say like "the JSC guys are all brilliant", what do you mean? Do you mean they are actually brilliant, or they just have a wealth of knowledge in their heads? I've only met a handful of brilliant people in my life. Are there really brilliant people all over trading desks? (That would be intimidating but also a welcome challenge).
- I've worked 100 hour weeks for 2 years. I will work 2-3x harder than any other trader to learn, absorb, synthesize, and apply.
- The markets absolutely fascinate me. The constantly shifting landscape, the uncertainty, the "puzzle-solving", the foreseeing/planning.... it makes me grow a big one.
- I love games like Chess, Poker, Pentago, etc. I suck at Chess because I haven't put in the time. I paid for like half of college playing poker.
- Personality is too subjective and qualitative to discuss, but from discussions with friends I feel I have the right one for trading.


So with that personals ad up, my question is how to break into the industry. Is the best idea to just keep learning, reading, soaking up information, and then just calling/emailing:
1) Prop Shops
2) BB S&T desks
and saying "Listen, I want to do this. I'm really f'in serious. I will do anything as long as I can be part of your firm."

Will this work? What can I add to my profile, what can I elaborate on, that would get me a chance to do this? I'm basically afraid that without a track record of trading, and also a very lightly managed portfolio, I have no shot. Rather than blasting 30 firms and hoping someone takes a flyer on me, I would like to be as prepared as possible with my current background. How can I do that?

Call me egotistical, but I'm very confident that I have every capability to be as good at many types of trading, as anyone else. I just need the opportunity, and if I get one nugget of good advice on how to get that opportunity, thank you WSO.

 

Why didn't you ask people in the S&T division at your bank? Why can't you ask your sister to ask these questions for you at her bank? Why don't you just go into a HF full of smart people and do something like ITAP? Why can't you just ask your Ivy network these questions?

I honestly think this is one of the overdone "I'm too prestigous/ smart/ muscular " troll posts.

Because WSO is the last place you should ask if you have all those resources.

 
couchy:
Why didn't you ask people in the S&T division at your bank? Why can't you ask your sister to ask these questions for you at her bank? Why don't you just go into a HF full of smart people and do something like ITAP? Why can't you just ask your Ivy network these questions?

I honestly think this is one of the overdone "I'm too prestigous/ smart/ muscular " troll posts.

Because WSO is the last place you should ask if you have all those resources.

Agreed...

Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.
 

you're missing a big part of what it takes to be trader at a jr level.

to address your points one by one: - yes, there are "brilliant" people in trading as you describe it. however there are a vast majority of not so brilliant people who make a very good living. brilliance has little to do with sitting in a trading seat. - ib is completely different from trading in terms of workload. if i see 100hrs a week in ib, i don't make the assumption that they will work harder than any of my current jr traders. it's a different intensity, different skillset and different motivation. - the "puzzle solving", following global markets etc does not become a significant part of your job for a very long time. you will spend a few years building spreadsheets, learning the nuts and bolts of settlement, pnl, hedging, flows, client base, any issuance things that are all product specific. - yes, those games have a correlation to being a good trader. however, most people vastly overestimate their skill in these games. additionally i have seen very strong chess/poker players fail miserably in a trading seat. - personality is tough to nail. what would you do if you just started 6 months ago, you're sitting at the desk at 5:30 with no one else around and someone calls up and goes "bid 100 10s"? everyone loves the idea of strolling into the office and destroying the rest of the street and pulling in a fat bonus with 10hr days but reality is much different.

 
Best Response

it will be tough. here's another serious response to you.

i just finished recruiting for structuring and quant roles, and the process took 5 months. my background: target undergrad with good GPA, IBD analyst stint, then grad school in physics at target, finished degree, went into consulting (market was flattening when i was finishing my thesis, not a good time to recruit). decided to make the switch around the end of last year, seriously solicited interviews and HH interest starting in april.

recruiting was tougher than in normal times. there is a flood of experienced traders/quants out there and you are up against all of them. the first job will be the hardest to get, i was told - very true.

ironically, the job i am at is at a firm that HH'd me - they saw a research item on my linked in profile that matched their strategy. that made it all the easier. so for starters, update you profile.

i had some other good leads via HH's as well. i don't know what to say other than persistence. i interviewed at a bunch of places that were spinoffs from prop desks at US and european banks. it's still a lousy market even now. i literally had one cancel on me an hour before the scheduled interview.

if you really want to do it, you can, but prepared to wait. and yes, heard on the street, and all the standard S&T interview books are de rigeur. i literally had questions pulled straight from those books with a few numbers changed. if you have done any trading on your own, try not to brag. they will tear you to pieces. i actually downplayed the range of strategies i use for my own account because i didn't want to leave my nose open.

i'm having more fun than in my old job or certainly in IBD. if you have your heart set on it, go for it, but you may be in for a hell of a wait

 

You could pay it forward to me! XD

haha... but seriously

If your dreams don't scare you, then they are not big enough. "There are two types of people in this world: People who say they pee in the shower, and dirty fucking liars."-Louis C.K.
 

Thanks so much guys. This is perfect info and exactly what I meant by undelude me. Sounds like I need to talk to some more junior folks in the field to get a better sense of the recruiting approach and what specific skills and experiences are necessary. Also thanks to folks who pm'd me, I'll get back to you ASAP.

 

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