IB is still a disgusting amount of money...

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Was just thinking about it today. I choose the EB I'm at because I wanted to be a career banker and they pay top of the street. My first year I made over 200k. My father has been an tenured professor at HYPSM for almost 20 years and is one of the best in his field. He has 10 years of higher education and is smarter than I'll ever be. Pretty sure I out-earned him in my first year. People bitch about private school for their kids, NY taxes, and high rent. But even including all that, we still have a pretty fucking good comp. There's so many people working double shifts 16 hours a day on minimum wage just to feed their kids. They work a few hours more than us but the work is actually, not in IB-terms, but actually, dogshit.

Not to mention they're getting an eighth of our pay. And we're over here bitching about how we're working 80 hours a week when half of that is just sitting around. There's been so many people recently complaining about how IB is dying because they money isn't enough to "live on". Well, change your fucking standards. 30 years ago you could've been a fucking mailman and raised a nice suburban family. The world (and income equality in America) has changed but we're still better off than 99% of people.  

Edit:

Arguments I've seen so far:

1. We are not rich. I don't own a Gulfstream or LaFerrari.

Response: The common man's definition of rich isn't a Gulfstream or LaFerrari. Making over 200k my first year is 4 times the median wage in NYC. It puts me in the 97% of earners in the U.S. as a first year graduate. It may not be good enough for you, but it's enough for me. 

 

2. We worked harder than the state school humanities grad.

Response: Yes, you did. However, we need to consider that not everyone was raised in the same mindset. It's not a fair comparison. 

People who succeed (forgive my arrogance) like me and you often over-allocate attribution of their success to themselves. There are a lot of environmental factors that impact us. There are a lot of environmental factors that push us to succeed. These might be our parents, socioeconomic status, friends, schools we went to, media we read and watched, or whatever else. I'm all for shitting on Diversity like the average Asian WSO member but I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about everything in general.

These people don't know that they should go to college. These are the people you see in some video starting a high school fight because they got slightly insulted and they have to defend their reputation, thus getting expelled or sent to juvie and destroying their college opportunities. 

I think this situation arises in two ways. First of all, it is the soceoeonomically disadvantaged whites, yellows, browns, blacks, and purples. All races, who don't have any parental guidance and live in shitty environments because they're poor. Second of all, it is the (predominantly white) parents who are still living in a world of 40 years ago, where being a mailman could earn you a life in the suburbs. Wealth inequality has changed. America has changed. This is no longer possible. Stop coal mining. 

 

3. Rich people are better suited to IB roles?

Response: I'm not sure how this responds to my argument but it was there and it was funny so I added it here

 

4. Hours worked averages IB pay the fuck out.

Response: Ok. I'm (obviously) at Centerview so admittedly its a bit different for me. But people did the math below too. You'd have to work 130 (128 actually) hours a week of minimum wage hard labor to hit 100k. However, THERE IS NO OPPORTUNITY FOR ADVANCEMENT. Do you seriously think a guy can keep working 130 hours a week in NYC for 100k for 30-40 years? Come on man. The median income of NYC is 57k for a reason.

 

5. My dad is a lazy professor and destroying higher education. 

Response: True... But in all seriousness, TLDR, I was not comparing the actual job, but the quality of the person doing the job, because I considered that to be much more important. This sub judges the person by the job he has. I was judging the opposite. My apologies for that shitty analogy. 

if you don't want to read my defense of research and academia below, the point was that there are people of intellect (not just professors) who are not in IB. Think about that for a second. There are smart people not in IB! WOAH. But according to this forum's supposed metrics, they don't make a living wage. As people commented below, IB should not be the only career for smart people to make a decent living. Smart people should not have to work 100 hours a week for a decent living. That was kind of the implied point.

 

 

 

Comments (111)

 
  • Intern in IB - Gen
Aug 24, 2020 - 11:36am

Definitely agree. However, I can guarantee you in the next 5 replies someone will find some way to still bitch about not making enough or feeling satisfied with their career.

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Most Helpful
Aug 24, 2020 - 2:35pm

You can't possibly think $200k a year is a disgusting amount of money in NYC, let alone anywhere in the NE.

And we do pay too much in taxes. I don't get what all the fuss is about. If you feel like you're being paid too much, just cut a check to the IRS or whatever. Or better yet just give it away to someone who you think doesn't make enough. 

I don't have a Gulfstream or a LaFerrari, or a Yacht sailing out in the mediterranean....how can I possibly think I make a lot of money.

Do we make a living wage that allows us to live comfortably? Sure.

It's not easy to get to where you're at. You likely worked very hard to get where you are at today. Do you really think the kids in HS that barely did their homework, or bothered to study for the SATs deserve to be where you're at? What about people who never bothered to study in college or even slightly focus on career outcomes? 

They majored in gender studies at a 3rd rate state school and now complain that they are among the 99%.........you could've seen that trajectory from a mile away.

You can't be too shocked if you end up poor if making money was never on your agenda. That's all I have to say.

thots & prayers
 
  • NA in IB-M&A
Aug 24, 2020 - 7:11pm

Yes we all had to “work hard” to get into finance, but I put that in quotations because many people, if not the majority, have somewhat of a regimented path to get get in. Aside from the few non-target and diversity hires, the formula of prep high school to target university to investment bank is pretty fool proof. High finance is a pretty exclusive club that objectively does not like to allow people who aren’t like them to join. There are huge groups of every day, working class people, that have the option to work overtime and will struggle to crack $200k with similar analyst hours, even at the most senior positions. It’s pretty ignorant to think, in my opinion, that we do anything more important than these professions to deserve that amount of money as a 22 year old. Think about all the bankers you work with that got a seat through some nepotistic act, or come from wealthy family backgrounds. It’s pretty much just perpetuating the cycle. Rich people stay rich, poor people stay poor. There will always be outliers, but such is life. Be happy with what you have. Side note - fuck all these finance meme pages who who glamorize and jizz over prestige and finance culture. So fucking stupid

 
Controversial
  • Intern in IB-M&A
Aug 24, 2020 - 9:14pm

Lol what? Quote button is fucked so I'll just do this

 

"Aside from the few non-target and diversity hires, the formula of prep high school to target university to investment bank is pretty fool proof. "

 

Are you implying that diversity hires do not have an easier time in recruiting than their counterparts, or that diversity hires are not as equally privileged as their peers? Shit like this is a total dick-slap in the face to non-diversity candidates. Oh, poor them. Poor diversity only highschool events and leadership spots, poor affirmatives action in colleges, poor continued diversity only events and leadership spots, poor diversity quotas at diversity specific hiring at jobs, poor quantifiable lower standards and diversity preference when going for an MBA. Good thing diversity students from a non-target work just as hard as their non-target peers (they don't need to) or even work harder coming for a target (also not true) just because they are diversity. 

 

Also, sorry to say, wealthier kids typically are better prepared and are more deserving of IB jobs than poor students. They have the right social skills, the right activities (gold etc) for bonding with clients, often a higher intelligence (largely genetic but throw MS anyway) and a MUCH better work-ethic as these kids have often been grinding since birth. Also, nepotism isn't really that big of a deal anymore, and you're free to make connections with anyone you want to. The amount of direct family or family-friend instant job offers has probably been reduced to a negligable amount. I go to school with two kids who have MDs are parents, and they are the most over-prepared kids you will ever meet. 

 

Sidenote - I'm a poor kid with shitty parents who attends a semi-target, before you start hurling harassment at me for being part of the 1% or whatever the fuck makes you feel better

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  • Analyst 1 in IB - Gen
Aug 25, 2020 - 10:38am

This attitude is so toxic. You're so quick to pat yourself on the back for thinking about "career outcomes", that you're willing to blindly ignore wage stagnation just to stick it to someone who might have worked just as hard as you but chose a different purpose.

Newsflash, working in IB isn't the only noble work. Many people choose other career paths, that doesn't mean they deserve to struggle. That's stupid. Considering that a rising tide really does lift all boats, where is the motivation to see inequality stymied so that maybe you can get a LaFerrari?

I just think this complacency with considering yourself as the only person that deserves to make liveable earnings is pretty pathetic. There are so many other smart, hardworking people that if the only job to make solid pay is IB, then that should ring alarms off LOUDLY.

 
Aug 29, 2020 - 1:49pm

IB isn't a noble profession, but there's also not any reason that the nobility of a given profession should be tied to the compensation earned by someone in that profession.  There are myriad non-IB professions where folks don't struggle, but folks who do struggle struggle (aside from disabled ppl or others w/ extraordinary circumstances) struggle because one of the following (i) Their job, while it may be difficult, is one that literally any able-bodied person can do, making them highly replaceable, making their labor not that valuable, (ii) they aren't smart, hard-working, and conscientious (I'm going to get blow-back for this, but everyone knows there are a ton of these ppl out there), (iii) they make bad career decisions and/or are bad w/ money.  If someone can find me the multitude of financially secure ppl who work low-skill jobs and are unintelligent, lazy and bad w/ money I'll retract.  Yeah - there are wealthy heirs who fit those criteria, but they'll squander that money and its not as though anyone else has a right to it anyhow. 

 

Also, wage stagnation means very little if over the same period of time the price of durable consumer goods plummets and employee non-wage benefits increase 30-50%.  I think that anyone would rather be able to buy more w/ less money than less w/ more money.    

I come from down in the valley, where mister when you're young, they bring you up to do like your daddy done

 
  • Analyst 2 in IB-M&A
Aug 25, 2020 - 1:08pm

This is the guy whining about how making over 200k in a first year in IB isn't enough. That's 4 times the median wage in NYC. That puts you in the 97th percentile AS a first year graduate. I don't think the definition of "rich" for the common man is having a gulf stream. 

 

And so many people weren't raised in the mindset of success that we were. So many people were never told to study for school. So many people never understood that you have to look past the present in life. Because their parents never taught them. I watch all these stupid reddit videos of high schoolers acting big-dick, fighting each other, not caring about the fact that they're going to get suspended for 2 weeks or moved to juvie because they attacked the guy who made fun of them. I'm just thinking, "what are you doing to your future?" But the fact is, they were unaware. It's not their fault. If anything, it's their parents. It's the class divide in America. 

We are the ones who succeeded. We want to attribute that success completely to ourselves. But the truth is, even those of us who came from the humblest of backgrounds (I grew up poor), we still had a ton of help. We had this vision of success that no one else has.

 
  • Intern in HF - RelVal
Aug 29, 2020 - 6:40am

LMAO neither "do your hw" or "study for the SAT" is proof of working hard. A lot of people have done that better than us in this world. But that doesn't give them a $200K salary, neither should us.

 
  • Analyst 2 in IB - Ind
Aug 24, 2020 - 2:43pm

Had a friend at Moelis and he said he made under minimum wage when he calculated how many hours he was working lol. Wouldn’t say IB even at a boutique is the promised land.

 
Aug 24, 2020 - 6:16pm

I mean I get the sentiment but it's pretty easy to disprove:

Assuming in the worst-cast scenario your friend is working 100 hours a week every week for a year and isn't comatose (just humor me) 

100 hours a week * $15 nyc minimum wage * 52 weeks a year = 78000 

Now let's give your friend the benefit of the doubt and say he meant post-tax. Even if he was working 100 hours a week for an entire year, he would need to make less than ~115000 that year for that to be true as per https://smartasset.com/taxes/new-york-tax-calculator#coKJV8nJyg. Look, the job and hours suck in many ways, but let's not pretend that someone with a bachelor's degree deserves a six-figure salary with no sacrifice. 

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  • Analyst 2 in IB - Ind
Aug 24, 2020 - 8:07pm

I get your points and I’m not sure what his math was as this was mentioned in passing a couple years ago and I work at a different firm, but things to keep in mind:

  1. People in other jobs are OT eligible, IB isn’t
  2. Bonuses are obviously highly variable so he probably didn’t include that (sign on is 1 time bonus, could be mid bucket/bottom bucket in any particular year, could have a pandemic/financial crisis that could destroy your bonus, etc.
  3. What tax rate did you use? Tax brackets make a big difference, especially in NYC (1/3rd of your pay goes to the gov so even if you make 150K gross, you’re already down to 100k after taxes).

My point is that IB at the junior level is ok pay for a recent college grad, but it’s nothing glamorous. You are basically working 2.5 FT jobs and don’t wind up keeping much of your comp given ridiculous taxes & generally high COL, and if you have any student loans you have 0 money.

 
Aug 24, 2020 - 2:59pm

Agreed but I was thinking about this / talking to someone the other day.

When people draw comparisons to "well other people work just as hard" I totally agree. I'm not the only person that's worked a long week. One thing I think others don't understand is the STRESS that comes along with a job like this. You can downplay it as much as you want but at the end of the day there is A LOT of mental exhaustion and stress that others just can't fathom.

The flip is also true... people working 80 hours a day in the heat doing roofing grind just as hard, but much of it is physical and not mental. The same way I don't know what it's like to work 3 months straight in the blistering heat, others don't comprehend the mental stress either. Not saying one is better / easier, just that oftentimes this consideration is lost in a "fuck you, no... fuck you" type of discussion.

 
Aug 24, 2020 - 3:39pm

If it makes you feel any better, tenured professors at HYPLMNOP are destroying higher education and are often worthless leeches. So don't feel too bad. Your dad probably doesn't put in more than 15 hours of real, actual work in any given week.

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Funniest
Aug 24, 2020 - 11:22pm

Harvard Yale Penn LSU Michigan North Florida Oregon Princeton

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

 
  • Research Associate in Research - Other
Aug 24, 2020 - 5:56pm

You have any evidence to back this up? At least some kind of rationale would be fine.

 

They don't just hand out tenureship to anyone. Being a professor isn't all that easy to begin with. 

 

I'm guessing this might be like medical doctors and how the AMA puts a ceiling on number of physicians actually is ruining healthcare availability?

 
Aug 24, 2020 - 6:12pm

Have you ever known any professors? Their primary job is research. They may teach a class a week, and the TA does all of the grading and answering questions. Research does not generally fill a 40-hour work week. Being a professor is one of the easiest jobs in the world. Becoming a professor, especially a tenured professor, is not easy because the job is so cushy that there is far more demand than supply of professorships, but once obtained, it's a ridiculously easy job. For law and business faculty, it's a ridiculously easy job that also pays really well, which is why it's so damn difficult to become a professor. You'll notice that in many cases, professors at even crappy state schools often have elite educational backgrounds--there is just a ton of demand for the job and little supply of the job. 

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  • Analyst 2 in IB-M&A
Aug 24, 2020 - 11:52pm

rEsEArCh dOeS nOt fIlL A FoRTy hOuR wEek. Would you believe me if I told you he does 40-50 hours of work a week in computational mechanics? Probably not. Research (in STEM) isn't a joke. It's hours of pouring over math from papers published by peers in your field of speciality, programming simulations, and doing graduate level math. Also, I'd place more blame on the students we let into HYPSM. He told me his first year he taught there he was so excited, until all of the students underperformed his class so he had to make it easier. He kind of lost his excitement of teaching and focused on research (like every other professor) after that. Maybe let in less prep school boys and diversity admits and more smart people? But WSO wouldn't like that because they're all from prep schools... You're a fucking accountant who probably didn't take anything after calc 1 though... How would you even begin to understand what research is.

 
Aug 24, 2020 - 11:55pm

I've done research in neuroscience with professors. A lot of it is boring and slow with grants coming from places that aren't your first choice.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

 
Aug 25, 2020 - 12:37am

Wow, 40 hours a week! Whoa! He's more a slave than an employee! Maybe we should all feel bad that your father doesn't make as much as a Wall Street banker. He teaches 1 class a week and spends time working on things he finds interesting. And he has near perfect job security. Woe is he. 

At some point were you actually going to make a point backing your position that we should feel bad for this Ivy League professor father of yours? 

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  • Intern in IB - Ind
Aug 24, 2020 - 9:22pm

I agree with you honestly when it comes to the EB model. It's just when it does come to BB's at this point the comp gap (at least at the analyst level what I know) is too large and doesn't keep up with living costs in the city as nicely.

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  • Analyst 1 in IB - Gen
Aug 24, 2020 - 10:00pm

I talk about this all the time. It really is messed up.The hardest working person is also probably the poorest..None of us work harder than the sub-Saharan farmers walking miles just for drinking water...I get that's an extreme but the sentiment remains the same. 95% of it really comes down to your environment/upbringing and it's a shame. 

 
  • Summer Associate in Other
Aug 24, 2020 - 10:46pm

I think you need to account for the fact that your father has a much more stable job. Bankers can be laid off in a few weeks if the economy takes a downturn, but your father will be alright

Array
 
Aug 24, 2020 - 11:02pm

What's your father's field? If your father is a tenured professor at HYPSM and he's in STEM, economics, psychology, business, or some other useful field, the odds are that he rakes in some serious money through speaking engagements and consulting work. Almost no tenured professor from a major university solely depends on their salary. 

 
Aug 24, 2020 - 11:05pm

Forgetting your background, you're absolutely right. The key is to view this from a relative standpoint - aside from finance and CS, no one makes as much in their first year out of college (please don't name some anecdotal story about some kid you know who went to the NBA). Yes, out of all professions the hours are the worst bar none but think of the upsides this does offer: 1) you will likely be able to live in manhattan (albeit with roommates but better than living with roommates in astoria or the bronx) with some cash leftover to do fun things, 2) despite most people likely using banking as a stepping stone of a job (not you, I know), one can still take home a considerable amount of money in a two year period as an analyst and 3) if you're not spending like an asshole (I certainly did this), you can walk away pretty early in life with a decent (read: not wealthy by any means) amount of cash and take some time to dedicate to yourself if you decided that you hated the industry. Just a few examples but something to think about 

 
Aug 25, 2020 - 5:15am

Say it again for the people in the back OP.

"Full speed ahead, damn the torpedoes." -U.S. Navy General Farragut
 
Aug 25, 2020 - 9:15am

The privilege in some of the comments lol. Everyone forgets that not only is there physical stress associated with working multiple minimum wage jobs, but the mental stress of fearing not being able to provide for your family, let alone yourself, is something we won't understand. Take a minute to appreciate your position in life - you could have been on a totally different path making much less and physically working much more.

 
  • Analyst 1 in IB - Gen
Aug 25, 2020 - 10:47am

The way you guys are comfortable being taking advantage of (as workers, just like the majority of others with stagnant wages) is baffling. You can believe in capitalism and pay dynamics that actually work. Capitalism is a social system even though it isn't socialism. It's supposed to do its job by working for everyone.

 

:
30 years ago you could've been a fucking mailman and raised a nice suburban family.

 

All you all can talk about is being the fortunate few who made it to IB and can actually live without struggling. There's no consideration that pay in this country might be in a very bad place. Look around, the US is like a 3rd world country for some people. It's not healthy.

 
Aug 25, 2020 - 10:50am

OP - Don't let comments discourage your thinking.

You have the right attitude and have put things into perspective, at such a young age. Good for you.

Life is not always fair, irrespective of how hard you work. So to go about life thinking you deserve to make $500k because you studied hard for the SAT and in college is grossly misguided. 

 

 
Aug 25, 2020 - 11:04am

Ah, one of the few places on the internet where someone at 22 can make $200k and be told it’s not a lot of money AND have people argue about diversity hires despite not being brought up at all by OP. 

“The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly salary.” - Nassim Taleb
 
  • Intern in IB - Gen
Aug 25, 2020 - 11:50am

Generally first-years in tech at the top 10-15 companies make more like 175 k to 250 k and it seems like there is a lot less disparaging in tech than in finance both from the people who actually work in the industry and the public. And before anyone says its hard to get, Google alone hires more SWEs than all of the BB and EBs combined every year. 

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  • Analyst 2 in IB-M&A
Aug 25, 2020 - 12:58pm

Tech comp is abnormally high the first 4 years. Still, MOST FAANG hire's don't make 175k to 250k. SWE at Citadel or Jane Street is something like 250k and that's top of the line for a SWE. Source: Most of my friends are in tech and not Finance and I went to HYPSM. For most people at FAANG, it actually goes down the fifth year because changes in comp structure. Compare to IB where your comp doubles ever 4 years. Also, a lot of comp is in terms of stock grants.

 
  • Investment Manager in HF - Other
Aug 25, 2020 - 2:33pm

First year at top quant funds is $250k, that is relatively standard for top funds (if you include signing bonus). Citadel will tend to be higher (300-350 with a few outliers). From there the ceiling is still high, but so are the filters, not many people get too far up that ladder.  

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Aug 26, 2020 - 1:22am

The comments about 5th year comp aren’t correct. Refreshers exist at just about every reputable tech firm. And RSUs at large companies are as good as cash right now. 

“The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly salary.” - Nassim Taleb
 
Aug 25, 2020 - 2:34pm

>People who succeed (forgive my arrogance) like me and you often over-allocate attribution of their success to themselves. There are a lot of environmental factors that impact us. There are a lot of environmental factors that push us to succeed. These might be our parents, socioeconomic status, friends, schools we went to, media we read and watched, or whatever else. I'm all for shitting on Diversity like the average Asian WSO member but I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about everything in general.

 

Did you just watch a Ted talk or something?  What does this have to do with IB comp? Do you have anything to add or did you just want to parrot Scott Galloway? Guess what, the world isn't fair and it never was. Go ask the people in Carthage what they thought of Rome. If you want to get ahead these days you have work your ass off, and even then only a few of us will get ahead. Look around you, the masses of people with college degrees are mostly cubicle drones - is it a great life? Hell no, but it pays the bills and gets you to Cancun once a year, and for most people that's enough. There has always been an elite ruling class, a nobility class and the rest are serfs. At least we've managed sandwich a middle class in there large enough to keep the masses at bay. Look around what's going on today, there middle class is shrinking and the have-nots are taking notice and smashing things. Keep telling people they have it hard, unfair and there's an evil plutocracy (maybe?) stealing all their wealth and future and you have the perfect storm for a revolution. Sound familiar?? 

 
Aug 26, 2020 - 12:40am

lol dude, you're 200k in NYC is quickly $130K after taxes and that stupid city tax. Then factor in your insane COL or substandard COL for flexing a 2 bed 2 bath into a 3 bed? You'll quickly realize 200k is "a shit ton" in NYC by any standards.

 
  • Intern in IB - Ind
Aug 26, 2020 - 5:04pm

not making centerview money by any means but thank you for saying this

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Aug 26, 2020 - 11:16pm

OP is right. We're all making boat loads of money.

Let's face it. If you're making 6 figures straight out of college, you're a lucky son of a bitch and you should be thankful to God or whoever else you want to be thankful to.

GDP per capita in the US is $63,000. Most Americans never make $100+K. Even if they do, it's usually at the end of their careers, not at the beginning. 

Shoot as high as you can, but don't be a spoiled brat thinking "$100K in NYC is nothing". You're still living better than majority of Americans. You folks want proof? Maybe the fact that nearly every other discussion on this forum seems to be about 1st year analysts trying to decide which super expensive watch they want to buy with their first bonus.

 

 
Aug 28, 2020 - 1:36pm

This just comes off as a thinly-veiled flex about your own situation and privilege under the guise of guilt-tripping your peers to appear woke.

Banking and consulting require a hell of a lot of hurdles to get through if you don't go to a supertarget, not to mention you're trading your physical wellbeing and probably a few years off your lifespan for this salary. I knew a lot of 1st generation students at my school who couldn't afford to do anything besides banking because of their loads of student debt and the obligation to support their family. Not going into banking and taking an easier job like consulting or doing jack at a family office you got into through a connection was a privilege that students who didn't have to worry about money or supporting themselves only had. I personally know people who developed cardiac problems because of their stint at ib and eventually had to exit before they worked themselves to death.

Don't downplay all the costs - mental, physical, relationships that go into ib just because you might not experience it as severely as others when you want to discuss comp. When is the last time you've heard of a minimum wage worker or postman dying from overworking or collapsing on the job?

 
Aug 28, 2020 - 1:38pm

I don't think the issue is really jr IB comp per se, those are just market numbers. The problem is how low the bottom of the scale is relative to what is actually livable, and the fact the structure of compensation at the top of the scale is subject to "market" forces (ahem Fed largesse) in good times, and government support in bad times.

High compensation will never just be about putting in enough hours. It's about being in the right space, at the right, time, with the right skillset... and/or getting a lot of help from Uncle Sam and the taxpayer.

 
Aug 28, 2020 - 3:32pm

If you really feel guilty, find ONE kid who fits your description of underprivileged that’s just starting high school or 8th grade. Sponsor that kid. Pay for his physicals and braces. make sure he’s getting organic Food and multivitamins.  Coach him on his math English and in SATs. Get him into a good school. Be the change you seek. Be a mentor. 
 

Actually, for $6000/yr per kid, I’ll do it for you. If you’re going to bitch try to fix...

 
Aug 28, 2020 - 8:21pm

By far one of the best threads I have read in a while, thanks for taking the time and to bother to write this.

SafariJoe, wins again!
 
Aug 29, 2020 - 6:41am

Bless you for this post. Not in IB but hedge fund, but honestly 100% everything you said i couldn't agree with you more. I felt like I was really working hard and my pay was similar to yours. Straight out of school and not long in my pay skyrocketed and I didnt have to think about whether I could afford something (within reason) I never flaunted it, it was just nice, so when I wanted to spend on something special I could. I did the work though because I really enjoyed it, I never complained about pay, and somehow thought that it was reasonable for a 24 year old to make 200k a year given the skills required. It wasn't rocket science.

Sad thing is the guy right above me, made 10 times more than I did, and the guy at the top above him made 10x what he did. It was never enough for them and they did everything to run that place lean. I mean good for them but the ironic thing is that they never listened to the analysts they hired to help them make good decisions, they made horrible decisions, we would take all the shit and be told we were all replaceable, so double down and oh yeah the partners are going on vacation for a month. Assholes drove up in 200-400k exotic cars and acted so humble about it like they actually "worked hard" and "earned it". But honestly they were grade A greedy fucks, most people in finance are, and it took me getting fired and now 9 months without a job hemorrhaging my assets to wake up and realize what a gigantic messed up circle jerk that high finance is. And I still have it better than most people who have worked their entire lives now to lose everything in a few short months.

It sickens me, and I have a hard time getting excited at the prospect of going back to that kinda place.

 

 
Aug 29, 2020 - 6:05pm

I always say how hard it is to live in NYC as a junior banker / HF / PE investor, because until you're making like $500k cash you're slumming it, especially if you walk out of school with student loans (like me) and have to live in Manhattan because of your hours. You're in an industry that you're supposed to be at the top of the financial heap, but living in a 1 bedroom facing a wall or a small studio in a decent building certainty doesn't feel like that.  When you go on Streeteasy and you see that a nice 2 bedroom costs $2M is really defeating. Obviously, we have that possibility working in this industry, but until you get their it feels like you're slumming it and are no better off that the kid in marketing in Ohio making $45k a year. Hopefully NYC prices fall more during COVID, that'll make it more achievable hopefully.  

 
Aug 29, 2020 - 6:34pm

Get over yourselves. People in IB aren’t typical geniuses and they aren’t nearly as important to society as some of you believe or try to at least pretend.  The geniuses I know that went into IB move on to something far more valuable to society and self gratifyIng within in a decade. The pay is descent for the hours involved. With my reduced work load from COVID 19 I’m making over thousand dollars an hour. My best job only paid $300-600 an hour depending on how productive I was. I owned that business and I was doing something that helped tens of thousands of people.  Would take the pay cut any day if I could go back to that situation. Now I haven’t worked even 40 hours in 2 decades. However I put in 11 years averaging over 80 hours to get to my 20-30 hour weeks. I’ve crunched the numbers on the Gulf Stream and other small jets. Not a good investment even if convenient. With COVID 19 being an obvious risk since January, I’m up 40% year to date. Having even half ownership in a jet would have been a huge loss while there was such easy pickings with the Markets. 

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