Is it a waste to pursue a "smart" major?
If I want to break into IB/PE, is it a "waste" to pursue something difficult like CS or engineering? These majors are so much harder, yet if I successfully break in to finance, it's likely I'll never use these skills again.
Is there any advantage to pursuing these? For example, do employers give you some type of advantage since, at least on paper, you're smart? For those of you who pursued these majors... was it worth it?
There's absolutely no disadvantage, and PE recruiters actually prefer more quantitative majors.
Finance technicals are a "check the box," so if you have a degree elsewhere and can go through the same technicals, you're a much better candidate since you have the "smart" degree like you said.
Which "smart" degree should I get to be a Investment Banker or PE? Math, CS or engineering?
Math, CS, Engineering, Physics, and Statistics are all the "quantiest" majors, and will be viewed the "hardest."
That depends on your interests. If you like number crunching and estimation for real world problems then applied math, engineering, and maybe physics would be good. Most pure math degrees get to the point where the things you study seem more like philosophy than what most folks think of as mathematics, which some really enjoy. CS is typically more theoretical than most people expect, programming is often more of a means to an end than it is the subject of the course.
major in what you’re interested in - I did math and cs to banking bc econ didn’t interest me at all. it never held me back (only helped) during recruiting, even though my gpa was comparatively much lower than a lot of other people’s (landed at one of GS/EVR/MS/PJT, so it definitely worked out)
Nice! Were you at a target?
Target w/o a business school (but significant investing / finance clubs that I did not do either)
This might change if you’re at a non-target / semi-target (esp if there’s a business school that most of the recruiting runs through), but I feel like Engineering should place well regardless
You may not directly use Python or whatever but learning to logically approach complex coding problems has to be good for your brain in general and make you better at your job. Idk.
Majoring in Math, CS or Statistics is a great way to look smart but not get super obscure finance technicals
I think you also shouldn’t discount what you’ll enjoy the most in college. I had some friends who genuinely loved their STEM majors and couldn’t imagine doing something softer. personally I did econ and math + stats and at times enjoyed the stats classes more than econ.
Second this. I was a biochemistry major now doing banking, and I wouldn't change it looking back. Loved the classes and the major, but when it came time to pick a career, that was a different conversation.
Looking back majoring in CS was the best choice I ever made. Nothing replaces (1) being technical, (2) the signaling from a technical major, (3) the career flexibility you have from a CS major.
Yes, it’ll be harder, but people will be more understanding. And if you try hard, you should do fine.
I did CS and the downside was I had to learn all my technicals outside of class (didn't take any finance courses in school), but definitely helped with recruiting I think because it differentiated me from all the kids that are finance/econ majors.
Only nuance is that a 4.0 GPA in a finance/econ major is still better than a 3.0 (or worse) in CS. Know way too many kids that tried to do a CS/math/engineering major to try to look smart and ended up tanking their GPA.
GPA is always more important than major. I look at a 3.5 GPA. I cringe - seeing CS and Business makes me realize what happened but I'm still hesitant to push a guy like that because I know others in my group aren't as savvy and know what's giong on.
kids get hired at Goldman with 3.5s - if you’re actually “cringing” at a 3.5 on a resume, then you’re insecure about where you work and trying to compensate by only hiring the “””””best””””” candidates
LOOK, yes I came from an IVY with a top GPA with an easy major. I judge people because my pedigree was what got me in, not my smartness.
Yeah, I'm extremely insecure. I just use GPA as a measure of how hard you work.
Could you explain what you mean by "what happened" in this case?
I've asked and heard other people ask this question many times at networking events/resume reviews from alumni analysts to MDs and the answer is always major doesn't matter (I'm at a liberal arts target). But at the same time, you still have to show that you are interested in finance. You can do this by taking some intro econ, accounting, math courses. You should also be able to talk about how your major can be relevant to IB. I personally feel like if you don't think you can hold a 3.6-3.7 in a major, you should consider an easier major.
Depends on school. At a non-target, it's a huge positive if you can do a "smart" major and still get good grades. At a top target (HYPS type places) or a well known liberal arts school (Williams, Amherst type places), you can major in anything and will still get looks and supers if you network, but there if you major in like Physics with a 3.85 you're damn near guaranteed to get a super at the least.
lol who MS'd this is literally what happened to me & many of my friends, at one of the above in a BS major with high gpa and got an offer
I'm not in the roles you mention but hopefully my experience can give you an idea of how these degrees are seen in business. I graduated in pure mathematics so of course I use only about 10% of what I learned in my actual job but it has opened some doors for me.
When new data science projects were being launched they needed someone with knowledge of the business to join the team of data scientists to assist them in understanding the figures and what they mean. It would have been preferable if someone more senior than me joined the team (as it is more of a managing position, I'm not actually coding or anything, just giving direction to the scientists) but I was told by my boss that I got picked due to my quantitative background as it would be easier for me to get quickly acquantited with the statistical methods and indicators they use than someone with a traditional business background. Now having two massive data science projects in a leading position with expected profits in the millions is probably the most valuable bullet point in my resume.
I assume something similar would play out if you were in a PE firm and the next move was to acquire a company with a big data business model and they needed someone to get in to ensure the models the company produced weren't just bs (87% of data science projects fail).
What does data science have to d owith banking? If you wern't taklinga bout banking, then yes, very well said Holder
When you say a "difficult" field of study, I assume you mean STEM in essence. I studied math at an "okay at best" state school. To answer your first question - it is not a waste to pursue a difficult field of study even if you only intend to have a career in finance.
The advantage: you will think much more methodically than your peers and be able to communicate complex thoughts more effectively. When presenting investment ideas, I constantly go back to my first class about proofs. I use the same tools that I learned in that class to test my ideas before presenting them or to poke holes in other theses. From the outside, people will be impressed at how pointed and relevant your questions are especially if you have no prior experience in the vertical. The secret that folks miss: you aren't processing new information live. You're understanding new information through mental frameworks that you already understand very well. When folks present theories / investment ideas, there's 2-3 procedures I run through mentally to see if there are "obvious" flaws. I say obvious because they will stick out to you because of the mental lens you use. From the outside, people will write it off as someone being "naturally smart."
You might want to come back with "I can learn to think critically in an econ class and it is more applicable since the concepts discussed in class are related to IB." With regards to the first point, generally speaking, I would trust the math department over the econ department at 95% of schools to teach methodical thinking. This does not apply to top schools as I imagine that being a econ. major at Yale is rigorous / challenging. With regards to the second, you're right - the concepts may not directly apply across fields but the skill you build is transferable. I have no hard data but I'm willing to bet that nearly 80% of NFL players were multi-sport athletes. As a fun example, there is a handful of Australian kickers in the NFL (5-10 last time I checked). Nearly all of them started playing soccer but didn't continue playing due to one reason or another. All of them had great leg strength and thought, "let's give American football a try."
Think about how the skills you'll develop in your STEM major will transfer to other areas of your career (really life).
If one of the quant majors interests you then go after it, just make sure you have a high gpa. If it doesn't interest you, I wouldn't pursue the quant major if your end goal is ib/pe. Pick finance/econ/acct and join some finance clubs. Then do whatever interests you in your free time, and have some fun.
Sorry I meant to reply to the thread, not your specific comment
I am convinced that a mathematical logic or proofs class should be mandatory in high schools.
I'd definitely major in what interests you the most. For me, that happened to be Econ + CS, but for you it could be something completely different. I go to a LAC and have talked with alumni in IB who majored in Political Science, Math, CS, International Studies, Art History, History, etc. As long as you can show that you are truly interested in finance and can keep your GPA at a decent level, you have nothing to worry about. (According to the people I have spoken with)
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