How to break into Institutional Sales/PWM at a BB firm after UG
I am currently a 1st year at a large retail Asset Management company that is a household name and I would like to try to break into a sales career at a BB (or good mid-tier firm) in either the Institutional Sales or PWM (non retail) and I do not know how to go about it.
I would prefer Institutional Sales over PWM , but I would do it.
My company, has HNW, but that is 500K -5MM, so I could do that, but I would prefer to work at a larger firm. I dont really have the money (and I have too much debt) to really pursue a top MBA, so I dont really know how to go about this.
Any thoughts or am I stuck here or am I stuck in the retail world...
What is your role at the AM shop?
The job entails a little bit of everything. I am licensed though
that doesn't help. are you an internal wholesaler? are you an investment analyst? are you operations?
also, what's the attraction of inst'l versus retail? not bashing institutional, but it's not as sexy as everyone thinks it is in my opinion. I personally hate institutional business.
and if your AM shop is a household name, what type of firm were you thinking about? if you're thinking of moving from alliance bernstein/BlackRock to Morgan Stanley/Goldman Sachs, the firms are both huge but just have dramatically different focuses.
if you have specific PWM questions, I'm happy to oblige, but I think we need some more clarity on exactly what you want and why you want it, because institutional sales and PWM are both sales, sure, but they are completely different roles.
if you really want inst'l sales, look through the forums on S&T
As mentioned above, need more info on what your current role is and what you are looking for. Ins't sales is very broad, do you want to be on an S&T desk, what type of product? EQ, FI? You could also do Inst't sales at an AM firm selling to pensions, endowments and foundations etc. You mention PWM, but not retail, what do you mean by that?
Ok so I work at a large Asset Management company i guess my role is operations. I answer calls, process trades, transfer calls, etc etc etc. We primarily manage retirement accounts, brokerage accounts, etc.
Since you are in PWM, I will keep it PWM. It seems that my future is sales, and that is fine. What I am looking for is a role in which I can advise people who have substantial income on various products/services that my firm does not offer. I also want to make a good sum of money (200kish...). According to the Vault Guide to PWM, people at the BBs are pulling way more than that.
I do not want to work at a wirehouse and go independent. I would be open to joining a team of advisors, but I do not know anyone in my city and have only been here for two months and this place is very clickish. As I also stated, I cannot afford to get a Top MBA. My company will pay for CFP, CFA, and local MBA though.
I am trying to establish a career plan. So please bear with me if this is jumbled. I would say that with a year or two of experience, I definitely fit more in the PWM side than Institutional Sales roles.
Also, brofessor, why do you hate the institutional business?
much better! the reason you want PWM sounds like the reason I left retail banking, limited product set. here's the upside: you can make a lot more than 200k in PWM if you're a rainmaker. the downside: it's tough as hell. I wrote a 4 part blog on PWM, it may have a lot of answers to your questions.
not sure what you mean by work at a wirehouse and go independent, you shouldn't already have one foot out the door before you start, but you could also mean you don't want to be a solo practitioner, which is fine. I'm on a team and that's how I got in. it's extraordinarily tough and really more a matter of luck than any specific practices. teams hire based on need and value. I've seen people get hired directly onto teams because of a family connection and I've seen people (like myself) who worked their way onto a team, there's no formula. the best advice I can give you is just get into PWM, even if it's in a more admin/operational role, just make sure it's at a large enough firm where you can meet other advisors.
I hate institutional business because it's a different beast than retail. institutional has nothing to do with dollar amount in my eyes, it's all about whose money is it. retail means you're dealing with the person who controls and benefits from the money, institutional you're dealing with a fiduciary, or someone who isn't the sole benefactor of the money board of trustees on university endowment, company pension, etc. they're usually adhering to an IPS, evaluating performance quarterly, and having some sort of mandate from their stakeholders. it sounds sexy, but here's where it sucks: you're constantly under the gun for performance on a quarterly basis. it's very difficult to build a personal relationship with someone when a board is always changing hands. furthermore, most boards put their accounts up for competition every 3 years, so every 3 years you are going to lose some business, no matter how long you've had it.
I prefer building relationships with people and being able to have periods of under performance but explaining it in the context of someone's long term plan. not all institutions are short sighted, but the vast majority are. for example, if you have a value bias, you've lagged the past several years as netflix and tesla have kicked your ass. that doesn't mean my style of investing is wrong, but if I tried to show 8 quarters of lagging performance to a board of directors without recommending any changes...I'm fucked. it's something called the institutional imperative, and it exists because stakeholders (pensioners, school alumni, donors, etc.) constantly demand excellence and so the trustees (fiduciaries) have to answer to them, leading to overactivity, shortsightedness, and ultimately lagging performance (unless you're a Swensen cub).
one thing we haven't addressed is internal networking, you currently have the emails of everyone in your organization through your intranet, USE IT. get coffee with people on the trading floor, PWM guys, etc. PWM and salespeople are social by nature, so it won't be impossible to get in front of them. just call them up early in the morning or late in the day when they're not in the middle of client issues, you might be pleasantly surprised.
best of luck, and check out my blog as well as posts by other PWM guys, many issues have already been addressed int he past
Leave me out of this. Thx.
If I am looking at institutional sales, I really dont know what I would do. I am interested in Foreign Exchange, Equities of Fixed Income Products. When I originally looked into S&T, I always looked at the T and never the S. Then I read the Greg Smith book, and how he was in sales and I found that interesting (plus I realized that I do not have the quantitative chops to be a trader), so I am interested in institutional sales also. I am seeing what retail sales (selling lots of stock to individual investors), and I want to do the large transactions with sophisticated clients.
Question - if someone interested in going into Financial Advising or PWM, limited options to AXA, MassMutual, or low name shops, is it worthwhile to take it? It is experience and something to build on rather than nothing.
absolutely not. do not, under any circumstances, work for those firms as a financial advisor.
What would you recommend then, if I may ask?
Entry Level Institutional Sales (Originally Posted: 02/18/2013)
I am currently a senior at a non- to semi-target school. I am interested in finding an entry level institutional sales position and have reached out to multiple HS (I went to a HS with solid alumni) and college alumni, but most don't have any open positions or offered to "keep an ear open".
My questions are:
1). How do I follow up with the alumni who offer to "keep an ear open"? In a couple of weeks should I offer to meet with them for coffee in NYC to get some face time so they know I am serious about finding an IS job?
2). Are there any firms that are still hiring entry-level institutional salespeople?
Side note - my job search started late because I was studying abroad from August-January.
Any and all help is appreciated.
1) 9.9 times out of 10 people who are going to 'keep an ear open' forget about it as soon as the conversation ends. Your follow up call will be to remind them to do anything at all; not to get an update on leads or anything in the 'pipeline'. Be polite; but know this. 2) I don't have an answer
ive always had problems with number 1
You're kind of behind the 8 ball because you're a senior. You'll have to continue to network. Reach out to 50+ people at least. Definitely reach out to your current contacts, they could invite you onto the trading floor etc.
Try trade organizations i.e. Security Traders Association.
Thank you for the advice so far - I told the "keep an ear open" salesman that I would be in NYC next week on two days (even though I had no plan to be in NYC) just to see if he'd be available to meet for lunch/coffee. Luckily he responded and has time to meet so now I have plans to be in NYC. Reaching out to another contact to see if they want to meet up that day too. If anyone has any more advice, especially on this coffee chat I'd appreciate it!
Breaking into Institutional Sales- Cold Emailing (Originally Posted: 09/20/2010)
Hey Guys
Recently I have been trying to position myself for a junior role on an institutional sales desk. Previously I had spent the last three years in a middle office role. I decided to cold email certain sales desk group heads with the hope of starting a dialogue. I also attached a copy of my resume with the email.
The question for you guys is should I follow up with a phone call. If so, how long should I wait to call? Also, any other advice or tips on how I could better position myself for a junior role on an institutional sales desk are greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Call them directly or reach out to alumni. Act as if.
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