Moelis LA -- Business as Usual

First time poster, but thought you all might enjoy this.

A friend of mine is a first year analyst with Moelis NY. In addition to getting crushed himself, it appears little has changed in the LA office since 2008.

The analysts still place phenomenally. The second year class is going to Silver Lake (2), Carlisle, H.I.G., Apax, Centerbridge, Oaktree, and Onex.

It is still a sweatshop. Almost a quarter of the now second year class quit after one year. More interestingly, of the 10 summers, 6 received returns and none are coming back. That is a rare feat. (Apparently, there are a few VP's in that office who literally stay up until 4:00am alongside their analysts.)

Does the lifestyle justify the exit opps for you? Personally, there is no way I submit to that torture...

Comments (74)

Oct 23, 2014

You're correct about everything but buyside placement. Unless he's confusing second year class with the addition of the class above it, kids are only going to 3 of those funds.

Also saying a quarter of the second year class quit makes it seem huge but it was only 6 people so... (to be accurate 1/3 of their starting class quit by second year)

Oct 23, 2014

haha i got to USC in LA this is the place i'm aiming for

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Oct 23, 2014

I've heard Ken himself is aware of the problem, but states that banking is about winning and you can't win without the hours. The analogy he used to be exact was comparing the Clippers and the Bulls in the 90's, he claimed that the Bulls never complained that they played extra playoff games given the ultimate reward...

I guess it is all in the eye of the beholder.

Oct 23, 2014
bootsnapper:

I've heard Ken himself is aware of the problem, but states that banking is about winning and you can't win without the hours. The analogy he used to be exact was comparing the Clippers and the Bulls in the 90's, he claimed that the Bulls never complained that they played extra playoff games given the ultimate reward...

I guess it is all in the eye of the beholder.

What a fucking savage. Where'd he say that?

mbavsmfin:

I don't wear watches bro. Because it's always MBA BALLER time!

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Oct 23, 2014

@"notks" Must have misheard then. Where all are they going?

Oct 23, 2014

@"notks" Must have misheard then. Where all are they going?

Oct 23, 2014

Can confirm that none of the 6 summer returned. Among the six, one of them headed to HLHZ RX (LA office I believe) and the other MBB

Oct 23, 2014

@bootsnapper

Well since Ken doesn't leave before 1am, I'd say he's pretty aware of it, yes.

Oct 23, 2014

@BTbanker

I can respect that, if he expects others to do it he should too. So good to know.

Oct 23, 2014

I'd shoot myself if I was in my 50's, founded my own firm and was regularly in the office at 1 am. VP's at the office at 4 am? I can see why people wouldn't return or want to work there in general. I'm not at all against hard work but who the hell wants to put in analyst hours for their entire career?

Oct 24, 2014

It's true that NONE of the interns returned. That is nuts, and I think it is the answer to your question - that despite seeing the opportunities available after the two years, none of them bought in. I love my firm, and the culture of it is an extremely large reason why. It's the best career choice I ever made.

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Oct 24, 2014

Kind of unfair analysis all round -- here are the facts. There were 9 interns in LA and 5 received offers as they were all great. Of those 5, 2 actually transferred to Moelis NY, so they're staying but in a different office because NY hours are much better. NY is much bigger - 20 to 25 analysts per year so obviously, not all will place into mega funds! (Same story with our GS, MS folks and we all know that). Yet, the placements in NY for Moelis are great: TPG, Oaktree, HIG to name a few PE funds, all the distressed debt funds due to their restructuring group, and some smaller PE shops. Some others were promoted internally to associate and were paid a handsome 175,000 signing bonus to encourage this behavior in the future. Moelis is changing its anayst identity from being exit opps whores to a mix towards ANYTHING you want to do. Yet, the opps are fantastic and you receive support for them if that's what you want. Given the scale of sponsor sell-side work Moelis does, this makes a lot of sense. In fact a summer analyst was placed into Apollo PE immediately after the summer...this speaks to the strength of the Moelis brand. Even the kids that didn't get offers placed into top banks for full time. Moelis also still pays the second highest bonus numbers on the street (after Centerview) and kids learn a ton from the experience. So its a great place to be...in whichever office location

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Oct 24, 2014
alphasapphire:

Kind of unfair analysis all round -- here are the facts. There were 9 interns in LA and 5 received offers as they were all great. Of those 5, 2 actually transferred to Moelis NY, so they're staying but in a different office because NY hours are much better. NY is much bigger - 20 to 25 analysts per year so obviously, not all will place into mega funds! (Same story with our GS, MS folks and we all know that). Yet, the placements in NY for Moelis are great: TPG, Oaktree, HIG to name a few PE funds, all the distressed debt funds due to their restructuring group, and some smaller PE shops. Some others were promoted internally to associate and were paid a handsome 175,000 signing bonus to encourage this behavior in the future. Moelis is changing its anayst identity from being exit opps whores to a mix towards ANYTHING you want to do. Yet, the opps are fantastic and you receive support for them if that's what you want. Given the scale of sponsor sell-side work Moelis does, this makes a lot of sense. In fact a summer analyst was placed into Apollo PE immediately after the summer...this speaks to the strength of the Moelis brand. Even the kids that didn't get offers placed into top banks for full time. Moelis also still pays the second highest bonus numbers on the street (after Centerview) and kids learn a ton from the experience. So its a great place to be...in whichever office location

Aren't you the same kid who was inquiring about Moelis on the forums a few weeks back? How did you collect all this information in such a short span of time?

Oct 24, 2014

Linkedin and from friends who worked there.

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Oct 31, 2014

Seeing as Apollo's buyout fund doesn't have an analyst program, it's safe to say you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. Also, Moelis definitely doesn't pay the second highest bonus numbers on the street for analysts. Posters such as yourself are the reason why WSO is full of idiocy and misinformation.

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Oct 31, 2014

In case you have facts/numbers that prove otherwise, please post them here. From what I heard, Moelis paid a bunch of first year analysts this year and last year 80k bonuses. I'm not aware of any other firm besides Centerview paying higher

Oct 24, 2014

Moelis is a pure nightmare, even by banking standards. There are plenty of shops out there with equally good buyside placement but slightly better work-life balance. At my b-school, 6 students interned at Moelis this past summer. 2 got offers but neither are returning. They were working till 3 AM daily during a fucking internship.

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Oct 24, 2014
mbavsmfin:

Moelis is a pure nightmare, even by banking standards. There are plenty of shops out there with equally good buyside placement but slightly better work-life balance. At my b-school, 6 students interned at Moelis this past summer. 2 got offers but neither are returning. They were working till 3 AM daily during a fucking internship.

I've heard the exact same thing. And sure we're getting monkey shit left and right for dogging on a firm, but kids need to know what they're getting into. I wasn't going to say this because I don't like sharing personal information, but I live with someone that works there. He is extremely cynical about the place, and my other room mates and I comment on his physical deterioration through the past year. So I'm obviously biased and I can admit that. But at least I have a window into the firm from someone I live with which is a lot more than most people commenting can say.

GS/MS/JPM/BX/EVR/GHL/LAZ kick ass over Moelis any day of the week. Better buyside (except for LA), better hours, better culture, better people. If you don't any other strong options I can see why you would go Moelis. Otherwise, I see no reason why anybody should subject themselves to that nightmare of a shop.

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Oct 24, 2014

My classmate had such a horrible internship experience that he turned down the offer on the spot without a second thought. He interviewed at other boutiques and even less prestigious middle-market banks during full-time ocr. Last I heard he will be accepting an offer at either Greenhill or Evercore.

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Oct 24, 2014

Can't remember the last time I saw a sell side sponsor process being run my Moelis

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Oct 24, 2014

Bottom line is there are shops with better exit opps plus dramatically better culture & hours.

Funniest
Oct 24, 2014

Does this mean Moelis might be more inclined to respond to my cold email since no one wants to work there?

"Do you like Huey Lewis and the News?"

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Oct 24, 2014

so how many Moelis employees are on this thread? #yeahbuddyyyyyy

Oct 25, 2014

Honestly probably zero, dont you know that the only people that talk about deal flow/exit ops/top groups/hours/PE funds/HSW placement are all below the age of 20?

Oct 24, 2014

Are they swamped with constant deal flow? Why are they running their guys into the ground?

Best Response
Oct 24, 2014

They are definitely a busy shop, but their culture and approach to new business/deals is a bit different than LAZ/EVR/GHL/PWP/CV. In my opinion, it basically comes down to their DLJ heritage vs. the other boutiques which are largely more traditional/conservative (i.e. former MS/GS bankers)

1) Moelis is deal-hungry and they tend to pitch very aggressively for new business. This stems from the DLJ-heritage back in the day - they were the new kids on the block and built their business around areas the traditional white-shoe BB weren't as active in - lev fin/HY, sponsors. Note that they made a killing doing so. They are basically just following through with these same principles. This create a lot of work for juniors though.
2) Stemming from above, they tend to work on a significantly higher # of deals than the other boutiques, although a lot of these are smaller deal sizes. The other boutiques focus on a fewer number of deals, but their deals on average tend to be larger in size. From a junior perspective though, even a smaller deal can = a lot of work

Edit: To prove how intense the former DLJ was and how the current Moelis (basically legacy DLJ) is now, check out this infamous staffing memo from DLJ in 1994: //www.wallstreetoasis.com/files/DLJ%20Too%20Busy.pdf

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Oct 24, 2014

@Valk, you are a stud. You deserve a SB my friend.

I also lol-ed at that link

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Oct 24, 2014

It's be fun to get rowdy with Cantor at the holiday party.

Oct 24, 2014

Some folks here are focusing on distortion rather than stating true facts. DLJ and Moelis are not the same. Moelis LA and Moelis NY are not the same. Moelis in 2008 and Moelis in 2014 are not the same. Citing horror stories of DLJ to take a dump on Moelis is not a fair way to explain the situation. The fact of the matter is that in NY, the hours now are just like regular banking hours and the exit opps are still fantastic. Look at Linkedin and filter through data to verify that truth. Pay is still at the top of the street and there is still no better promotion package than Moelis if you want to do banking for a while. Calling Moelis deal-hungry, sweatshop, or saying VPs stay till 3am etc was all fair and true in 2008 but not even close today. Their restructuring practice (which is based in NY) is killing it even in this environment and like someone mentioned, Eric Cantor is their new wild-card. The firm has changed drastically for the better and people need to see that..or stay behind.

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Oct 24, 2014

I agree with you that the should not be compared and in all honesty any one of us would take an offer if it was extended to us. Personally I admire that they grind it out I would rather have that culture then a laid back and eventually get to it one. Lets be honest there was some humor and sarcasm to that note.

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Oct 25, 2014

I'm not trying to argue with you, but the thread is about Moelis LA (not NY) and I gave an honest answer.

You're 100% correct that DLJ and Moelis are not the same, and Moelis 2008 and Moelis 2014 are not the same. However, I will reiterate that the fundamental culture of Moelis LA is legacy DLJ LA. Yes, he firm has evolved since 2008 and the firm is composed of fewer and fewer DLJ alumni. However, the majority of the founding partners and heavy-hitters at Moelis LA are ex-DLJ LA...which tends to dictate office-wide culture

-Ken Moelis
-Navid Mahmoodzadegan and John Momtazee (the media rainmakers)
-Jeff Raich (heavy hitter in M&A)
-Warren Woo (LevFin rainmaker, although he left Moelis a few years ago)

These guys dominate the LA office full-stop. That is why I brought up the DLJ point.

And my point about working on more deals but smaller value holds true. As a quick example, if we quickly look at the Announced M&A data from the last 5 years (US only) from Mergermarket:
- EVR: ($568Bn | 316 deals)
- CV ($399Bn | 89 deals)
- GHL ($212Bn | 106 deals)
- PWP ($177Bn | 98 deals)
- Moelis ($196Bn | 285 deals)

Moelis definitely grinds out more deals than the other independent advisory houses. This is one driver of hours.

All in all, as others have already said, Moelis LA is a great shop, but it's just not for everyone.

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Oct 25, 2014
Valk:

I'm not trying to argue with you, but the thread is about Moelis LA (not NY) and I gave an honest answer.

You're 100% correct that DLJ and Moelis are not the same, and Moelis 2008 and Moelis 2014 are not the same. However, I will reiterate that the fundamental culture of Moelis LA is legacy DLJ LA. Yes, he firm has evolved since 2008 and the firm is composed of fewer and fewer DLJ alumni. However, the majority of the founding partners and heavy-hitters at Moelis LA are ex-DLJ LA...which tends to dictate office-wide culture

-Ken Moelis

-Navid Mahmoodzadegan and John Momtazee (the media rainmakers)

-Jeff Raich (heavy hitter in M&A)

-Warren Woo (LevFin rainmaker, although he left Moelis a few years ago)

These guys dominate the LA office full-stop. That is why I brought up the DLJ point.

And my point about working on more deals but smaller value holds true. As a quick example, if we quickly look at the Announced M&A data from the last 5 years (US only) from Mergermarket:

- EVR: ($568Bn | 316 deals)

- CV ($399Bn | 89 deals)

- GHL ($212Bn | 106 deals)

- PWP ($177Bn | 98 deals)

- Moelis ($196Bn | 285 deals)

Moelis definitely grinds out more deals than the other independent advisory houses. This is one driver of hours.

All in all, as others have already said, Moelis LA is a great shop, but it's just not for everyone.

Why do you know so much about Moelis? You either work(ed) there or are hellbent on a WSO smear campaign. Either way, interesting.

Oct 24, 2014

How does LA compare to NY though? In terms of exit opps, deal flow, culture?

Oct 24, 2014

LA for the exit ops, NY for the culture, you'll see more M&A as opposed to Rx in LA.

Obviously there is overlap as far as experience and opportunities, but those are the marginal differences.

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Oct 24, 2014

How's Moelis Chicago?

Oct 27, 2014

A lot smaller, though I heard they were expanding and on a hiring spree.

Oct 25, 2014

Never really like discussing firms without offers from them. But with that said, a close friend of mine worked there this summer and is now going to EVR NY. Dealflow was out of control and he was completely crushed - unsure whether he got a return offer but I wouldn't bet against it.

My school is sending 3 kids to Moelis LA for FT (2015 class), and the biggest rationale for signing for them was the exit opps. Personally, I would absolutely be sure that I want to do PE before signing. You need to be ready for those PE interviews 6 months into the job - so prep early and reap the rewards should you choose to go down that path.

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Oct 25, 2014

Let's dispel some myths here. Disclaimer: I have don't currently work for Moelis and have no reason for any bias.

1) Having long hours is very, very different from bad culture.

This is hard to understand for people who have not been in banking yet (quite a few on this website). But the basic idea is that the type of work + type of people around you determines your overall satisfaction with the company. Not the # of hours. To put this in perspective, imagine working 100 hours a week at a bank. One bank requires you to work on projects that are live (client has engaged and WILL BE PAYING THE FIRM). The other bank, you are doing market research and "preliminary discussion materials" about bullshit that will never even be used. Both 100 hours. Very different mindset. Moelis LA's work consists of almost entirely live deals. You are never pitching a client blind. Rarely anyone in the office has lost a pitch.

The people around you is also important. The Moelis LA office is an environment where you can wear casual clothes and dick around at 1AM while waiting for an email from your VP. You can't do that in A LOT of banks in North America. This probably means little to you now, but it plays a huge role in your overall happiness.

2) If you're obsessed with exit opps and success, you shouldn't scared of working hard.

I find it very interesting that people work their asses off to get into a good school, or network ferociously to land interviews, but are somehow fucking scared of working hard when it actually comes to the job. Some of the offices (GS TMT / FIG, LAZ, etc.) that get tossed around on this website work the exact same amount of hours as Moelis LA. And they have the best exit opps. Let's think about it this way:

"KKR wants the best candidate who have the best experience. Employee A works at an office where he pitched 3 deals and worked on one deal and closed zero. Employee B works at GS TMT or Moelis LA and has closed 4 deals in the exact same time period. Employee A has a good work-life balance. Do you really think KKR will ever hire employee A?"

You will find the average analyst out of Moelis LA to be significantly sharper than a kid from another bank from the sheer number of LIVE DEALS they do. Exit opps have a very direct correlation with amount of hours worked (except rare outliers). It just works that way.

3) Top analysts, at any office, will be crushed regardless of where you work.

If you're a star analysts, then everyone wants to work with you. Whether this is Moelis LA or some other bank, you will be asked to be on every deal. Again, it just works that way. The ones at the bottom will not work as much. This is true at Moelis, and this is true at any bank. Be careful where you're getting your information from.

4) Other remarks:

No, VPs do not stay until 4AM. Only on very rare occasions. This is also true at other top banks.

The Moelis NY office can't be compared to the LA one. Very different space.

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Oct 25, 2014
person1171:

Let's dispel some myths here. Disclaimer: I have don't currently work for Moelis and have no reason for any bias.

1) Having long hours is very, very different from bad culture.

This is hard to understand for people who have not been in banking yet (quite a few on this website). But the basic idea is that the type of work + type of people around you determines your overall satisfaction with the company. Not the # of hours. To put this in perspective, imagine working 100 hours a week at a bank. One bank requires you to work on projects that are live (client has engaged and WILL BE PAYING THE FIRM). The other bank, you are doing market research and "preliminary discussion materials" about bullshit that will never even be used. Both 100 hours. Very different mindset. Moelis LA's work consists of almost entirely live deals. You are never pitching a client blind. Rarely anyone in the office has lost a pitch.

The people around you is also important. The Moelis LA office is an environment where you can wear casual clothes and dick around at 1AM while waiting for an email from your VP. You can't do that in A LOT of banks in North America. This probably means little to you now, but it plays a huge role in your overall happiness.

2) If you're obsessed with exit opps and success, you shouldn't scared of working hard.

I find it very interesting that people work their asses off to get into a good school, or network ferociously to land interviews, but are somehow fucking scared of working hard when it actually comes to the job. Some of the offices (GS TMT / FIG, LAZ, etc.) that get tossed around on this website work the exact same amount of hours as Moelis LA. And they have the best exit opps. Let's think about it this way:

"KKR wants the best candidate who have the best experience. Employee A works at an office where he pitched 3 deals and worked on one deal and closed zero. Employee B works at GS TMT or Moelis LA and has closed 4 deals in the exact same time period. Employee A has a good work-life balance. Do you really think KKR will ever hire employee A?"

You will find the average analyst out of Moelis LA to be significantly sharper than a kid from another bank from the sheer number of LIVE DEALS they do. Exit opps have a very direct correlation with amount of hours worked (except rare outliers). It just works that way.

3) Top analysts, at any office, will be crushed regardless of where you work.

If you're a star analysts, then everyone wants to work with you. Whether this is Moelis LA or some other bank, you will be asked to be on every deal. Again, it just works that way. The ones at the bottom will not work as much. This is true at Moelis, and this is true at any bank. Be careful where you're getting your information from.

4) Other remarks:

No, VPs do not stay until 4AM. Only on very rare occasions. This is also true at other top banks.

The Moelis NY office can't be compared to the LA one. Very different space.

I think a popular misconception on this forum is that the analysts who work 120 weeks are somehow more qualified or better prepared for the buyside. Considering that 95%+ of the work that you do provides no educational value, I'd say that correlation is pretty overblown.

I wouldn't say people are scared to work hard so much as they don't see any incremental value in working Moelis LA hours.

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Oct 27, 2014

Just wanted to respond to a couple of your points to provide another perspective... Who knows? Maybe someone will find my opinions interesting.

"1) Having long hours is very, very different from bad culture."

I hear you, and you're making some fair points, especially on the deal work vs. non-deal work. However, at some point, probably after you haven't seen your roommate or gone out with your friends in 3 months, work just becomes work and it doesn't matter whether you're putting together a funds flow to close the sellside that's been killing you for months or if your doing buyer screens for some pitch you'll never win. Frankly, by my second year, there were lots of analysts actively trying to avoid live deals; live deals mean endless work and they'd rather have been staffed on internal research work or pitches, where there's at least a chance you'll lose and there'll be no more work (for a bit). I guess what I'm trying to say is that live deals aren't all that great, and even in the context of buyside recruiting at a place like Moelis (i.e. 7-9 months after you start working), it's highly unlikely you'll have seen anything through from start to finish anyway. Deal work is important, but don't think that working on something live is the cure to culture, hours, and recruiting.

"The Moelis LA office is an environment where you can wear casual clothes and dick around at 1AM while waiting for an email from your VP."

What banks are there where you can't do that when there's no one important around?

"2) If you're obsessed with exit opps and success, you shouldn't scared of working hard."

I guess my biggest issue here is the example you provide and with the statement that "You will find the average analyst out of Moelis LA to be significantly sharper than a kid from another bank from the sheer number of LIVE DEALS they do"

The problem is that: A) managing a deal process has a high learning curve but also really quickly diminishing returns - you should be familiar and comfortable managing a deal process the second or third time you do it, and B) PE firms are trying to figure out who's the best and brightest just a few months into the job (i.e. when everyone has 1-3ish deals on their resume - in fact, if you have too many deals on your resume, for example, showing 5 closed deals on your resume in the first few months with you as the sole analyst on all of them, I'm wondering how much you actually did / learned on these processes). Don't get me wrong, deal work certainly matters, but the problem is that PE recruiting is so early that deal work sometimes isn't as much of a differentiator as most analysts would expect.

I agree with your points 3 and 4, and just would add that the star doesn't always land the best job. If your constantly grinding on work, then you don't have time to prepare for recruiting and might have to forgo interviews in favor of dealwork, but on the other hand, you'll get good references (but then again, so will most people.)

Oct 25, 2014

None of the summers returned lol? Damn, that's saying a lot. And there's no amount of money in the world that would convince me to work like the Moelis folks, there are just far more valuable things to me than the money and exit ops to work marginally less.

Oct 26, 2014

Look at the data man - 4/9 didn't receive offers and of the 5 that received it, 2 transferred to NY. So its one thing to see these facts and then to say (despite being correct) that no one is 'returning' but the connotation is pretty different to the facts.

Oct 26, 2014
alphasapphire:

Look at the data man - 4/9 didn't receive offers and of the 5 that received it, 2 transferred to NY. So its one thing to see these facts and then to say (despite being correct) that no one is 'returning' but the connotation is pretty different to the facts.

Rebuttal:
1) 50% is still a horrible matriculation rate
2) It's harder to get an offer to the LA office, and NY's culture is slightly better. They could have transferred for the hopes of a better work environment

Oct 26, 2014

Forgive me, for this is slightly off topic, but how difficult is it for employees at Moelis's other offices to transfer to the LA office?

Oct 27, 2014

The Moelis name carries a lot of weight, the bakers at the LA office are some of the best in the world. That being said, they demand a significant amount from their analysts. Weigh your options, if you can't handle it, don't go, but your sacrificing potential golden exit ops.

Oct 28, 2014

There are so many false rumors in this thread. I just want to point out one in particular. I know the guy you are talking about that supposedly went from Moelis LA to Apollo PE. He's going to Apollo credit.

Oct 31, 2014

To change the topic slightly, is anyone familiar with Moelis Houston? How is it different/similar to NY/LA offices? I know they strictly do just advising on M&A deals.

Oct 31, 2014

Moelis base for incoming analysts is 90k. Everyone, stop posting information unless you know it is true.

Nov 1, 2014

The sort of analyst who avoids live deals to do pitches, is the sort of analyst who is unlikely to be successful at private equity (or anything for that matter). Guys, the world gets a lot more competitive from here on. Getting into PE is barely scratching the surface. I would argue that your career only really begins when you make MD / Partner, etc. Don't let your foot off the gas.

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Nov 8, 2014
mergersandacquisitions78:

The sort of analyst who avoids live deals to do pitches, is the sort of analyst who is unlikely to be successful at private equity (or anything for that matter). Guys, the world gets a lot more competitive from here on. Getting into PE is barely scratching the surface. I would argue that your career only really begins when you make MD / Partner, etc. Don't let your foot off the gas.

This is one of the truer statements I've ever read on WSO.

Nov 1, 2014

And for the record, I have never worked at Moelis, although I know several partners, and certianly have no axe to grind. Working at Moelis LA is the sort of experience which you will still draw from 15 years later. Its worth the pain. I can tell you that I've been working for almost 15 years, and the foundation you get as an analyst (when you get a good experience at a top team) stays with you for a long time. Don't underestimate it.

Also, aim for the best. I have worked for top banking teams, and one mediocre one (guaranteed bonus, turnaround situation), and there is a huge difference in analyst experience.

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Nov 8, 2014

This thread is hilarious.... You go into banking for 2 reasons... money/prestige or passion. You can divide passion into the "Bank and Die" mentality and the "2 and out to PE" mentality. MoCo affords people in the passion category who can crank and even if you dont always like it, take pride in what they do. Average comp at MoCo is $1.2 mm and Analysts exit to wherever they want.

Is it easy to do? No... but if it was the base wouldnt be 90... Apollo wouldnt be taking kids... and they wouldnt be paying Associates and above ridiculous sums of money.

Full disclosure I dont work at MoCo... but I would in a heart beat.

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Nov 8, 2014

This thread is hilarious.... You go into banking for 2 reasons... money/prestige or passion. You can divide passion into the "Bank and Die" mentality and the "2 and out to PE" mentality. MoCo affords people in the passion category who can crank and even if you dont always like it, take pride in what they do. Average comp at MoCo is $1.2 mm and Analysts exit to wherever they want.

Is it easy to do? No... but if it was the base wouldnt be 90... Apollo wouldnt be taking kids... and they wouldnt be paying Associates and above ridiculous sums of money.

Full disclosure I dont work at MoCo... but I would in a heart beat.

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Nov 8, 2014
DaBBzMan:

This thread is hilarious.... You go into banking for 2 reasons... money/prestige or passion. You can divide passion into the "Bank and Die" mentality and the "2 and out to PE" mentality. MoCo affords people in the passion category who can crank and even if you dont always like it, take pride in what they do. Average comp at MoCo is $1.2 mm and Analysts exit to wherever they want.

Is it easy to do? No... but if it was the base wouldnt be 90... Apollo wouldnt be taking kids... and they wouldnt be paying Associates and above ridiculous sums of money.

Full disclosure I dont work at MoCo... but I would in a heart beat.

Except it's not that cut and dry. There isn't anywhere near a one-to-one relationship among banking groups between the number of hours you put in and the the prestige/exit opps/pay/etc that you get out of it. Again, there are other groups that offer, on average, better exit opps, better hours, and equal or better pay than Moelis. Nobody has a "passion" for banking as an analyst, everyone at the analyst level is in it for exit opps/money/prestige, all of which can be had better elsewhere.

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Nov 9, 2014

Saying no-one may be true for the most part and especially in the US where banking is usually 2 years and out, but I know/have met a number of analysts who sincerely love working in IB and look forward to coming to work every day (myself included, for the most part)....

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Nov 9, 2014
Extelleron:
DaBBzMan:

This thread is hilarious.... You go into banking for 2 reasons... money/prestige or passion. You can divide passion into the "Bank and Die" mentality and the "2 and out to PE" mentality. MoCo affords people in the passion category who can crank and even if you dont always like it, take pride in what they do. Average comp at MoCo is $1.2 mm and Analysts exit to wherever they want.

Is it easy to do? No... but if it was the base wouldnt be 90... Apollo wouldnt be taking kids... and they wouldnt be paying Associates and above ridiculous sums of money.

Full disclosure I dont work at MoCo... but I would in a heart beat.

Except it's not that cut and dry. There isn't anywhere near a one-to-one relationship among banking groups between the number of hours you put in and the the prestige/exit opps/pay/etc that you get out of it. Again, there are other groups that offer, on average, better exit opps, better hours, and equal or better pay than Moelis. Nobody has a "passion" for banking as an analyst, everyone at the analyst level is in it for exit opps/money/prestige, all of which can be had better elsewhere.

Im assuming you are still in college and have never worked before? There is a HUGE misconception on here that the end all be all to a happy life is BB IB -> MF PE. Which is really sad.... Moelis Analysts are a 2 and Promote. Where as associates get comp'ed better than most/all other banks.

And to say you cant have a passion for finance is the dumbest thing I have heard in a while. People that have your attitude flame out quickly.... because you start realizing you cant force yourself to do a job you dont like no matter how much money you like. You have to love what you do or you wont make it. Thats moreso a life thing not just a finance banking thing. Analyst work sucks and is tedious but its paying your dues. For years people in the film/entertainment industry have worked for free as basically slaves to try getting into studios and production companies....

Sry if you dont have that passion for your chosen career....

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Nov 12, 2014

I've heard scary stories about Navid Mahmoodzadegan... really cutthroat guy from my understanding

Nov 12, 2014

Never regarded Moelis highly

If I filter alumni from my year and Moelis on LinkedIn, I see a couple of kids but no one impressive. The kids now at Carlyle, BX, H&F, Viking, etc none of them from Moelis.

Nov 13, 2014

Some of you are either manipulating facts or just plain silly. Look - instead of talking about hypothetical Linkedin searches, why dont we actually work with the real data and then attempt to understand what's really happening here. See this link: http://goo.gl/E7or4g

First, notice the filtering and play with it as much as you want -- you'll still see bunches of people from Moelis who work at Apollo, Oaktree, TPG, Silver Lake etc, contrary to some of the folks above who seem to be saying otherwise. Also, play with past firms - exchange Moelis for Evercore, Perella Weinberg etc and notice how the quality of buyside exits goes to complete shit, despite the old established Evercore and the small friendly legendary Perella Weinberg.

Secondly on the Apollo topic - Apollo has recently hired Moelis in the restructuring of the biggest LBO ever (TXU ~50bn) so don't say Moelis can't get placed into Apollo. One of the Moelis MDs' brother runs Healthcare at KKR and I can go on and on about Moelis' connections into PE and Distressed Debt.

Now understand another thing ... currently, Moelis is losing some representation on Linkedin in PE etc and there's a very specific reason for that - Moelis is only 7 years old so the analysts have really only been out for max 4-5 years. Of those, most have gone to the buyside but a lot of them are in grad school now simply due to this timing. Thats why Moelis' representation on Linkedin will definitely look a little thin now (yet so intimidating) only since a good proportion of its graduated analysts are in grad school. Give it another year or two when the firm graduates more analysts and some of the grad school folks get back to the buyside at more senior levels, only to hire more Moelis folk. This is a subtlety in the data and you've gotta read into it.

Understand one more thing - Moelis is known for great buyside placement - there's also a reason for that: great responsibility as an analyst, terrific deal flow, crazy MD to analyst ratio, extremely heavy sell-side PE representation and general aggressiveness of the firm. Not to mention, some unbelievable legacy connections from DLJ and UBS. So guys, please: keep this debate to whether you think working long hours here are worth it or not from a slightly more factual perspective. Insinuating that Moelis analysts dont get good buyside jobs because they aren't good enough or because the firm doesnt have ridiculous connections is just plain immature, not to mention so grossly inaccurate.

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Nov 13, 2014
joshwadner:

Some of you are either manipulating facts or just plain silly. Look - instead of talking about hypothetical Linkedin searches, why dont we actually work with the real data and then attempt to understand what's really happening here. See this link: http://goo.gl/E7or4g

First, notice the filtering and play with it as much as you want -- you'll still see bunches of people from Moelis who work at Apollo, Oaktree, TPG, Silver Lake etc, contrary to some of the folks above who seem to be saying otherwise. Also, play with past firms - exchange Moelis for Evercore, Perella Weinberg etc and notice how the quality of buyside exits goes to complete shit, despite the old established Evercore and the small friendly legendary Perella Weinberg.

Secondly on the Apollo topic - Apollo has recently hired Moelis in the restructuring of the biggest LBO ever (TXU ~50bn) so don't say Moelis can't get placed into Apollo. One of the Moelis MDs' brother runs Healthcare at KKR and I can go on and on about Moelis' connections into PE and Distressed Debt.

Now understand another thing ... currently, Moelis is losing some representation on Linkedin in PE etc and there's a very specific reason for that - Moelis is only 7 years old so the analysts have really only been out for max 4-5 years. Of those, most have gone to the buyside but a lot of them are in grad school now simply due to this timing. Thats why Moelis' representation on Linkedin will definitely look a little thin now (yet so intimidating) only since a good proportion of its graduated analysts are in grad school. Give it another year or two when the firm graduates more analysts and some of the grad school folks get back to the buyside at more senior levels, only to hire more Moelis folk. This is a subtlety in the data and you've gotta read into it.

Understand one more thing - Moelis is known for great buyside placement - there's also a reason for that: great responsibility as an analyst, terrific deal flow, crazy MD to analyst ratio, extremely heavy sell-side PE representation and general aggressiveness of the firm. Not to mention, some unbelievable legacy connections from DLJ and UBS. So guys, please: keep this debate to whether you think working long hours here are worth it or not from a slightly more factual perspective. Insinuating that Moelis analysts dont get good buyside jobs because they aren't good enough or because the firm doesnt have ridiculous connections is just plain immature, not to mention so grossly inaccurate.

MoCo also just did Momentive...

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Nov 14, 2014

double post

Nov 14, 2014
joshwadner:

Some of you are either manipulating facts or just plain silly. Look - instead of talking about hypothetical Linkedin searches, why dont we actually work with the real data and then attempt to understand what's really happening here. See this link: http://goo.gl/E7or4g

First, notice the filtering and play with it as much as you want -- you'll still see bunches of people from Moelis who work at Apollo, Oaktree, TPG, Silver Lake etc, contrary to some of the folks above who seem to be saying otherwise. Also, play with past firms - exchange Moelis for Evercore, Perella Weinberg etc and notice how the quality of buyside exits goes to complete shit, despite the old established Evercore and the small friendly legendary Perella Weinberg.

Secondly on the Apollo topic - Apollo has recently hired Moelis in the restructuring of the biggest LBO ever (TXU ~50bn) so don't say Moelis can't get placed into Apollo. One of the Moelis MDs' brother runs Healthcare at KKR and I can go on and on about Moelis' connections into PE and Distressed Debt.

Now understand another thing ... currently, Moelis is losing some representation on Linkedin in PE etc and there's a very specific reason for that - Moelis is only 7 years old so the analysts have really only been out for max 4-5 years. Of those, most have gone to the buyside but a lot of them are in grad school now simply due to this timing. Thats why Moelis' representation on Linkedin will definitely look a little thin now (yet so intimidating) only since a good proportion of its graduated analysts are in grad school. Give it another year or two when the firm graduates more analysts and some of the grad school folks get back to the buyside at more senior levels, only to hire more Moelis folk. This is a subtlety in the data and you've gotta read into it.

Understand one more thing - Moelis is known for great buyside placement - there's also a reason for that: great responsibility as an analyst, terrific deal flow, crazy MD to analyst ratio, extremely heavy sell-side PE representation and general aggressiveness of the firm. Not to mention, some unbelievable legacy connections from DLJ and UBS. So guys, please: keep this debate to whether you think working long hours here are worth it or not from a slightly more factual perspective. Insinuating that Moelis analysts dont get good buyside jobs because they aren't good enough or because the firm doesnt have ridiculous connections is just plain immature, not to mention so grossly inaccurate.

I actually don't like posting on WSO for sake of anonymity, but threads like these and the conviction of posters like you infuriate me.

I have worked in two of the firms being discussed here and I am currently at a MF PE. Moelis places well, but by no means has a monopoly on the "buyside" market among the boutiques. In fact it is very much on par with the others. All top kids from these boutique firms get almost the same looks from PEs and it very much boils down to how prepared/good the candidate is. As somebody else mentioned, having more time to prep aka. less time working on "live deals" can actually help - hence BX M&A's phenomenal placement into buyside (coupled with their brand). For example, at EVR the kids in the last two years placed at Apollo, KKR, H&F, Carlyle, WP, Silver Lake and there are multiple kids at those firms. Now there are a good 20 - 30 odd kids in their class I believe, so yes not everyone of them is at BX, but that is true of any firm, and I haven't even mentioned some of the top HFs kids have gone to.

I agree that Moelis has solid placement, but given their culture I would certainly not want to work there. I am pretty sure I would not have come out any smarter or placed any better if I had been there, but I would have been way more miserable. Also all boutiques poached partners from other top firms. Every top firm has someone that has a "solid" relationship with the PE shops. As I said, I work in a PE firm and part of my job is to maintain relationships with all the banks. Thats one of main ways we source deals, so not sure that's Moelis's competitive advantage over LZ/GHL/EVR/BX/MS/GS/JPM

Anyway, unlikely that I will want to contribute anymore to this thread, unless someone manages to annoy me this much, but thats my two cents.

Good luck to you.

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Nov 15, 2014
Comment
Nov 15, 2014
Nov 18, 2014