Moving to the buy-side from the sell-side
I have a dilema,
First, i little background:
I have been in equity research for almost 5 years covering consumer discretionary and healthcare services stocks. My goal is to move to the buy-side, more specifically i want to be in a fundamental-value oriented hedge fund (small to mid size based on AUM).
Now, i have some leads on some buy-side firms - mutual funds and hedge funds, non value-oriented firms - but no real opportunities yet. I do have i couple of options to go back to equity research to cover small cap banks and healthcare services.
My dilema is:
I have been out of a job since December.
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Should i go back to equity research to start earning some money again and move to the buy-side later?
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If i go back to equity research - should i start from zero analyzing small cap banks or go back to healthcare services?
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My goal is to eventually move to a hedge fund - would healthcare, financial services (in this case small cap banks) or another industry be more well received or respected in the buy-side?
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Should i just forget the sell-side, and say i'm not going to stop until i get to the buy-side with my current background?
Any thoughts, comments or feedback???
I guess the answer depends primarily on how badly you need the money. Why can't you continue your job search while working?
He took the words right out of my mouth.
Go back to sellside for the dough and interview like a fiend on the side. ON coverage I'd argue small cap banks do not have a catalyst either up or down right? Plus you'd have to learn the space and wouldn't be the go to guy for that space, it'll take some time to build out enough to have ppl call you and care about what you say. I wouldn't.
Healthcare svcs -What names do you like.Why dont u just break out on your own. trade your p.a. like a man. just roll up some family money and just go @ it man. Some ppl on this forum did just that and are balling out of control now up like a gazillion %
Thanks for your input. So far i'm leaning towards going back to the sell-side, so i can make so $$$. However, i'm will continue to work towards moving to a HF. Which remainds me, do you know where i can find a list of newly launched HFs (in NYC, ATL, and Chicago)? I haven't had any luck online - one place was charging $4,000 for a list!! There has to be a free list somewhere....
http://www.hfalert.com/free-trial.php
Try the free trial and look for latest launches.
Easier to get a job when you have a job.
there's a bunch of those lists popping up on the forums. do a little searching.
you should def. go back to your ER job and maybe apply to bschool while you're looking for a buyside job. I think columbia is your best bet for fundamentals buyside unless you can get into h/s/w and even then it still deserves a look.
Does anyone know a couple of emerging market funds in London?
$4,000 for a list is ridiculous. Bloomberg publishes this in the HF monitor every week. Ask a buddy w/ a terminal to kick HFN into a workbook for you.
Any thoughts on working at GS U.S. equity research? And how about thoughts on Carlson Capital in Dallas?
both would be great, but Carlson is better.
considering switching from sell-side to buy side (trading) (Originally Posted: 02/11/2018)
i've been a credit market maker in a tier 2 bank for 3 years now. i actually really like it here (culture-wise and work-life balance) and i have a strong feeling that management also like me. however, the flow that we see have been on the decline for a while and it's been consistently pretty difficult/political to grow trading responsibility since everyone's performance is pretty much the same and i'm the most junior guy on the desk.
for the past 3 years, my total comp has been pretty flat around 130k GBP (+/- 10k). i now have an offer for a buy-side execution trader role with a pretty average asset manager promising a first year package of 180k. i would say that my priorities are 75% money focused and 25% culture/type of work.
i think i enjoy taking risk on the sell side a lot more than simply routing some PM's order on the buy-side, but the pay gap in this instance is too big to ignore. i know that earning potential can be a lot higher where i am now than where i could potentially be but i'm honestly not sure how long it would take before i ever get there. most of the guys here are old and have been trading their names for decades. i can't apply for similar roles on the sell-side due to a non-compete.
what would you do if you were in my shoes? stay at ~ 130k on the sell-side with big earning potential or jump for what i imagine to be a steady 180k to the buy-side?
fyi, i have 3 years exp as a trader and 2 years exp as a quant.
What type of credit products are you in?
What makes you want to be an execution trader and not a quant or junior PM on the buyside?
i just prefer the trading floor a lot more than the nerdy environment of research. also, as a trader, i can't help but notice the fact that the pay to difficulty of work ratio is a lot higher for a trader than a research guy.
Sellside --> Buyside (Originally Posted: 01/19/2018)
Speaking with a few other analysts at my firm, we were talking about the single best tip someone gave us when we moved from the sell side. One of the analysts mentioned channel your inner Ed Chambers (spurring my username change). Fellow buysiders... how do you channel your inner Ed Chambers?
Hi Ed Chambers, any of these threads helpful:
Or maybe the following users have something to say: patocallaghan123 Katie-Hobbs NuckFuts
Hope that helps.
Why do sell-side before buy-side? (Originally Posted: 04/18/2008)
I just curious what is the rational of going sell-side before joining buy-side? Is it because the number of buy-side position is less than sell-side one? Given choice, will you prefer buy-side right after graduation? Is sell-side give one a stronger basis, like modeling skills, or sth. else providing you a boarder exit? What is the advantage and disadvantage of doing each after graduation?
Any thoughts appreciated!
Good question, my friend just got an internship at a PE firm. He was originally going to do M&A, then PE after 2-3 years, but once he found out it was possible to go buyside straight off, he went for that instead.
thanks joefish, so what would a 2nd year M&A analyst compared with a 2nd year buy-side analyst, say in Private Equity Dept at BB or top PE houses..any thoughts?
The only benefit of doing banking before PE is the training and comprehensive/diverse exposure to different types of transactions. I started on the buyside and think that I could have gotten a lot more out of my experience (at least starting out) by going through a formal BB analyst training program. I also think that the sell-side serves as a rite of passage for those who eventually make the jump.
it's pretty damn hard to find really good buyside options out of undergrad. it's not like tpg and KKR are recruiting undergrads on a regular basis. Blackstone is the exception and they already get the cream of the crop.
junkbondswap: what is the benefit of starting at PE? will you consider back to banking after PE work? btw, how is PE group at BB sounds like, compared with top PE houses? i knew the pay is not the same, anything else?
I went straight to PE from undergrad and I agree with junkbondswap. Starting at a BB provides diverse experience and a great training program. Depending on the BB, you also get a "name" on your resume.
What I've often wondered is exactly how polished of a skill set the average analyst has after a 2-year stint. Obviously this is contingent on the group you worked in, but I'm still curious generally speaking.
Starting in PE does have its perks if that's where you'd ultimately like to end up. Already being in the industry makes it easier to lateral from firm to firm. You'll be competing for Associate positions with banking analysts who haven't been doing PE for 2 years. PE also provides exposure to the management consulting mindset (providing you do some work for portfolio company initiatives). Lastly, in my opinion, having PE on your resume definitely helps for B-School.
Clearly all PE firms are not equal in terms of quality. Everyone that goes to PE from ugrad doesn't end up at BX, KKR, TPG, or the like. However - if you want to do PE and have the opportunity to join an active shop upon graduating, I would seriously consider it.
Please rank the below 5 buyside opportunities to go to the buyside directly as an undergrad given current market conditions and future prospects / transferable skills..
Please assume pay , culture, people are all the same, fund size all > $5bn
-Real Estate Private Equity
-Mezzanine fund
-Secondaries Private Equity
-Traditional corporate Private Equity
-Distressed Debt fund
I think an analyst's skillset probably varies wildly bank to bank and team to team and it's all up to the individual. If you really enjoy the work and are genuinely interested, then IBD is clearly a great career option, whether for 3 years or longer and you can pick up many valuable skills other than the abilty to BS. PE at a junior level is probably a bit less structured than a BB analyst program, some people would prefer this, some would not.
I think this article from dosk is a pretty good read and makes some excellent points.
Personally, if I had the chance to start at a small PE firm or an i-bank where I would have many more people in my age group, I'd take i-bank every time. The people make the experience, I'd rather be in a bullpen with 10 assholes and 10 friends than in a PE team with 4 decent guys and 2 dickheads. What can I say, I'm a people person
Also, obviously one can make the switch IBD to PE, but I don't hear of too many doing the opposite, so you should bear this in mind also.
Don't know if you should be factoring in "market conditions", no-one can predict what's going to happen to PE, despite what people may tell you...
In saying that, I've been advised to take a good look at distressed debt private equity by this senior M&A dude I know, so I would tentatively rank that no. 1
I know nothing about real estate PE....but it sounds muthaf*ckin' boring zzzzzzzzzz
Wait a sec, isn't Real Estate PE what estate agents do!!!? :P
By definition, mezz and distressed debt are not private equity.
Oops
Work on Sell Side before Buy Side (Originally Posted: 03/07/2008)
I am currently in HY research at a top 5 BB, long term i want to work at a fundamental distressed HF. theres always talk of "i want to work for a few years on the sell side before going buy side". what is the rationalization here? why not go over to a top fund if you get the opportunity earlier?
The idea is that sell-side banks have an incentive to spend time training their employees--your contributions to returns are minimal and they generally make a commitment to a 'culture' that involves internal promotion. On the buy-side, you are expected to have certain skills and you contribute very directly to alpha; as a result, learning opportunities are "on the job."b
i agree and why i joined a sell side bank out of ugrad. my question is, if i have an opportunity to move over to a top distressed fund 7 months into my two year analyst stint, do i take it? i am inclined to think i would if my opportunity pans out.
why wouldn't you take it?
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