MSF/MFin besides MIT & Princeton

Hi,
I am looking for classification of colleges (besides MIT & Princeton) that offer MFin courses. Is it true that any other college except the two (i.e. MIT & P'ton) comes a very distant third? Would really appreciate if a ranking can be provided.
About me : 23years old, male, from India, MBA Finance from a target college in India (but unknown globally), FRM, 1.5 years experience in Risk Management, going to join HSBC in a month, by the time I join any course I will have ~ 40 months experience. Looking to work in the M&A function of an investment bank.

Regards
Harsh

Comments (38)

Feb 9, 2011

Many European schools such as LSE and HEC Paris offer Masters in Finance degrees as well. FT offers a great list of schools found here:
http://rankings.ft.com/businessschoolrankings/mast...

Feb 9, 2011
goldari:

Many European schools such as LSE and HEC Paris offer Masters in Finance degrees as well. FT offers a great list of schools found here:
http://rankings.ft.com/businessschoolrankings/mast...

Thanks goldari,
I am looking at US schools in particular (assumption that second to best schools of US are way better than second to best schools of UK/Europe). I know this list but am looking for rankings especially for someone with my kind of profile.

Feb 9, 2011

I would contact ANT at msfhq.com
He is sort of the resident expert on MSF's

Feb 9, 2011
derivstrading:

I would contact ANT at msfhq.com
He is sort of the resident expert on MSF's

Thanks mate.

Feb 9, 2011

Outside of those two schools you have regional strength. Where do you want to work and live?

Feb 9, 2011
ANT:

Outside of those two schools you have regional strength. Where do you want to work and live?

Thanks Ant,
Though the regional aspect of the programmes is a fact, I am not really concerned about my location post course. Though nothing beats NY.

Regards
Harsh

Feb 9, 2011

I know many here are against rankings but I think it would be nice to put together a ranking of MFin programs. The only one available now is QuantNet which excludes non-MFE programs for the most part. It might be helpful to prospective candidates. Ant, do you agree? It would make a nice addition to your site - 1st MFin rankings on the web! I am sure there is demand for this sort of thing...

Oct 10, 2015

...

Feb 9, 2011
bcbunker1:

How would you rank these? It sounds a bit too subjective and regional of a degree other than Pton and MIT.

To a large extent, you could say the same thing about MBA programs ranked 5-25, but they still get ranked. I do agree it would be subjective, so maybe a tiered system? Tier 1 - Princeton. Tier 1.5 - MIT. Tier 2 - Ant figures out (5 schools, all equal). And so forth. Just a thought

Feb 9, 2011

I have no interest in ranking these programs because unlike the MBA the MSF is highly regional and focused for placement. Claremont McKenna has amazing stats, better than Vandy, but if you want to work in NYC, CMC is going to do less for you than "lower" ranked, east coast schools.

Ive looked at and roughed up various rankings and they all end up being misinforming and incorrect. The MBA can be ranked much more easily than the MSF.

Feb 9, 2011

MSF programs are regional and thus hard to rank but I'll take a stab at it from my point of view.

If you take away where you want to work and live, in other words you are okay with relocating anywhere as long as you get a job, and consider school brand, program structure, student profiles, resources provided to MSF students (OCR, dedicated career services staff, trips, etc)....these would be my rankings for programs in the US (non MFE):

Tier 1:

Princeton
MIT

Tier 2:

Vandy
Virginia Ms Commerce/Duke MMS (if you want to include these)
CMC
Villanova
Florida

Tier 3:

UIUC
OSU
Rochester
Tulane MFin
BC

Tier 4:

Rest

I'm sure I left out a few programs, but this is just my opinion. Remember that when you look for a program, a lot goes into the decision. Perhaps it is weather, small/large school, college atmosphere, big city/rural area, family/friends/wife/kids/gf/bf.....whatever it is you're looking for, some schools make more sense than others.

Feb 9, 2011
kimbo:

MSF programs are regional and thus hard to rank but I'll take a stab at it from my point of view.

If you take away where you want to work and live, in other words you are okay with relocating anywhere as long as you get a job, and consider school brand, program structure, student profiles, resources provided to MSF students (OCR, dedicated career services staff, trips, etc)....these would be my rankings for programs in the US (non MFE):

Tier 1:

Princeton
MIT

Tier 2:

Vandy
Virginia Ms Commerce/Duke MMS (if you want to include these)
CMC
Villanova
Florida

Tier 3:

UIUC
OSU
Rochester
Tulane MFin
BC

Tier 4:

Rest

I'm sure I left out a few programs, but this is just my opinion. Remember that when you look for a program, a lot goes into the decision. Perhaps it is weather, small/large school, college atmosphere, big city/rural area, family/friends/wife/kids/gf/bf.....whatever it is you're looking for, some schools make more sense than others.

If you want to play rankings, you are forgetting GW in tier 2.

Feb 9, 2011

I'm going to go ahead and clarify that even though Princeton and MIT might be classified into the same tier, Princeton's MFin is far superior to MIT's. How sure are you that M&A is what you want? Because if there's a chance you want to go into S&T or quant works, an MFE will serve you much better than an MSF.

Feb 9, 2011

bc third tier? Tulane M.Energy prolly should be put 2nd tier -- tulane has amazing energy trading placement, not so good if u wanna do something else

Feb 9, 2011
shorttheworld:

bc third tier? Tulane M.Energy prolly should be put 2nd tier -- tulane has amazing energy trading placement, not so good if u wanna do something else

Agree with you on that one. Tulane MEnergy would be 2nd tier and tops for those interested in energy. I was referencing Tulane MFin for third tier, but in reality after Princeton/MIT you can probably combine tiers 2 & 3.

Feb 9, 2011

as a former mfin student at one of these supposed "tier 2" colleges, i would recommend you go for a degree in europe if possible. lse has a masters in finance and accounting that should be feasible with your background and that will give you the lse branding and ability to get interviews. while i was able to interview at every firm i applied to, i found the mfin program i was part of rather counterproductive in terms of recruiting (my resume was unprofessionally spammed) and the branding, network, and especially finance education considerably inferior to my undergrad.

don't really see the point in getting an mfin at a second rate college. if i had the chance to choose again, i wouldn't go the mfin route.

Feb 9, 2011

Princeton is a solid #1. BC is a great program, but I think it is more of a working professionals program. I live em, just not a lot of info out there.

As for going overseas for an MSF, it isn't so easy. A handful of programs will be known bak here and even tier 2 schools will have a strong alumni background.

Feb 9, 2011

Does anyone have any idea about the Hult MSF program? Anthony....

Feb 9, 2011

Also where would you place the Canadian programs? The MSC in Management at Ivey Business is similar to Duke's MMS and Queens have a great reputation but not so sure how it comes across in the States!

Feb 9, 2011
FinancialNoviceII:

Also where would you place the Canadian programs? The MSC in Management at Ivey Business is similar to Duke's MMS and Queens have a great reputation but not so sure how it comes across in the States!

UofT's MFin is quite good. Rotman is one of the finest finance faculties in the world (academically speaking). They also have the MFE (master of financial economics).

Feb 9, 2011

GW is kind of its own thing, IMO since it's much more geared towards people that have more experience/are still working much like Princeton though without the horsepower behind the name,

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

Feb 9, 2011

LBS MFin, LSE, Berkeley.

Valor is of no service, chance rules all, and the bravest often fall by the hands of cowards. - Tacitus

Dr. Nick Riviera: Hey, don't worry. You don't have to make up stories here. Save that for court!

Feb 9, 2011

Yeah , GW is kind of an outlier. You basically rank schools based on their UG ranking, their alumni base and proximity to a major metro/financial capital.

Feb 9, 2011

given your background, there is no real reason to go to a 2nd tier school. Especially since you will be an international student, you will fit it very difficult to get the job you want from the second tier schools you have listed.

like guts said, the programs in europe will offer you a much better future

Feb 9, 2011
jbond12:

given your background, there is no real reason to go to a 2nd tier school. Especially since you will be an international student, you will fit it very difficult to get the job you want from the second tier schools you have listed.

like guts said, the programs in europe will offer you a much better future

Thanks jbond12,
European programmes are great. They are more rigorous, have been in existence longer, and have a strong footing in the financial markets. But my area of concern is the protectionism stance that UK has taken. Being an international student, it is of prime importance that job market is accessible to me.(Besides UK, very few countries qualify since I don't speak any other language). Also, EU has a tax structure which is inherently higher than their US or Northern American counterparts. (Belgium, Netherlands, UK).

Regards
Harsh

Feb 11, 2011
agrawalharsh87:
jbond12:

given your background, there is no real reason to go to a 2nd tier school. Especially since you will be an international student, you will fit it very difficult to get the job you want from the second tier schools you have listed.

like guts said, the programs in europe will offer you a much better future

Thanks jbond12,
European programmes are great. They are more rigorous, have been in existence longer, and have a strong footing in the financial markets. But my area of concern is the protectionism stance that UK has taken. Being an international student, it is of prime importance that job market is accessible to me.(Besides UK, very few countries qualify since I don't speak any other language). Also, EU has a tax structure which is inherently higher than their US or Northern American counterparts. (Belgium, Netherlands, UK).

Regards
Harsh

take it with a grain of salt, i went to one of the masters programs that ANT has been touting. most of the international students found it near impossible (for several reasons), and either decided to return to their home country or continue their education in the hope of finding a job in the US. as an international, it's best not to settle for a "second tier" program. huge gap down, considering your educational background.

Feb 9, 2011

We've exchanged emails or something, right?

I think an other poster touched on a good point. You have your FRM, MBA and experience. With the way H1 visa's are today, you might still have trouble getting a job. Your best bet is probably a top MBA.

Feb 10, 2011
ANT:

We've exchanged emails or something, right?

I think an other poster touched on a good point. You have your FRM, MBA and experience. With the way H1 visa's are today, you might still have trouble getting a job. Your best bet is probably a top MBA.

We haven't exchanged mails though I have been a follower of your blog since the beginning and can't tell you how much it has helped me. 2012 is my deadline and i want a one year MBA. I will not have enough work experience to be a strong candidate in one year MBA (which is filled with people with more than 7yrs exp). And a top MBA is very costly, which, simply put, I cant afford even if I sell my soul to the devil.

Feb 10, 2011

Do you have any family or close friends here? You can get OPT status and try and land something. As the US economy gets going again I think we will relax this H1 bullshit. Right now it is a crap shoot. Claremont McKenna is a great program. I like the coop for UIUC.

Feb 10, 2011

If you are able to get admission into Top 10 MBA, then you do not have to worry about costs or loans or anything. The entire $180 K loan is arranged and guaranteed by the university. No collateral is required and no co-signor is required. The job is also more or less guaranteed because the Top 10 Business schools have got incredibly powerful alumni networks which can arrange jobs for the graduating MBA students. If you live frugally, you can pay off the $180 K MBA loan within 4-5 years or working. Then you are free from the burden. The default rate is around 0.4 % which tells you that 4 out of 1,000 MBA students from the Top 10 schools has difficulty in paying back the loan. If you are not able to get admission into a Top Business school, then the H1-B visa and the collateral and cosignor for the loan becomes an issue and that is the risk that you have to decide whether you are willing to take. But, so long as you get admission into a top school, there is almost no risk from your side.

Feb 11, 2011

Someone mentioned this above but I'll repeat it again.

If you're an international student, there is no point going to a non-target school because it will be very difficult if not impossible to get hired by companies that sponsor visas (BBs, some top boutiques, some top prop trading firms). Firms in HK are even more of a prestige-whores so that is out of the question as well. Just my two cents.

Feb 11, 2011
numm:

Someone mentioned this above but I'll repeat it again.

If you're an international student, there is no point going to a non-target school because it will be very difficult if not impossible to get hired by companies that sponsor visas (BBs, some top boutiques, some top prop trading firms). Firms in HK are even more of a prestige-whores so that is out of the question as well. Just my two cents.

Of the above mentioned schools, which one would you class non-target?

  • eyelikecheese
  •  Feb 11, 2011

Anthony, doesn't the Tulane Energy program almost guarantee front-office positions withe all of the corporate sponsors for the program?

Feb 12, 2011

Thank you for the posts guys. Those were of great help. After going through posts, I realise that my assumption that a second to best college in US(Vandy, Nova, Olin) is better than a second to best college in UK/EU(Cass, Warwick, Imperial) might be false. Any comments on that?

Regards
Harsh

Apr 1, 2011
agrawalharsh87:

Thank you for the posts guys. Those were of great help. After going through posts, I realise that my assumption that a second to best college in US(Vandy, Nova, Olin) is better than a second to best college in UK/EU(Cass, Warwick, Imperial) might be false. Any comments on that?

Regards
Harsh

Cass,Imperial etc are very good for working in London.But I would prefer a US program since I would like to work in the States.Since you are from India,I dont think it will be harder for you to get a Visa for US than to get a job permit from Europe...Dont forget that in the UK you have to compete with many European citizens who do not need a specific work permit,so it may be tougher than you think.

Feb 12, 2011

Dude cass is solid. Know tons of people who got solid offers coming from there.

Feb 12, 2011
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Feb 22, 2011