How much can connections help you
Hi monkeys!
My question is pretty straight foward: lets say I have a family connection who's a MD at a BB (head of a group) , how much can he help me if I'm looking for an internship? What about a VP?
Hi monkeys!
My question is pretty straight foward: lets say I have a family connection who's a MD at a BB (head of a group) , how much can he help me if I'm looking for an internship? What about a VP?
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Do they like you and are they respected in their group? If yes, you pretty much can't lose.
It really depends on how much they like you and are willing to help you. They can help you all they want but it's really up to them...
Bump
How useful are BB connections from non IBD divisions (Originally Posted: 03/28/2007)
How useful are connections that are high up in the BB banks at Vice President and Director/MD levels but in non Investment Banking Divisions.
I'm assuming that they obviously don't have the same pull as those who are high up in IBD, but is it possible for them to easily get you into the firm provided you have a very solid gpa and can prove you know what IBD does with the hours, valuations, pitchbooks and have a good general knowledge of current market events etc...
You will not get IBD, I am sorry but you won't. Enjoy PWM.
Sleepguy can you answer the question.
Those people may bring your CV directly to those in charge of recruiting for particular groups. Thus, you get a decent chance for an interview. Definitely you won't have any advantage over another candidates who made it through CV screening process for lateral hires
if they know someone who is involved in IBD, it could be helpful. but this is a relationship-based business, and nobody will put any credibility on a non IBD VP or even MD. they can say you would do a good job, but how would they know?
Not making traction year out of undergrad, wondering how to leverage highly experienced connections (Originally Posted: 06/15/2017)
Graduated from semi-target (not great GPA) in 2016 and have been failing at trying to find an opportunity in finance. I've had a handful of interview processes (BB BO, Boutiques), and while I usually make it to the final rounds, nothing has come together yet. My one strongest asset is a close family member who is highly respected and connected in finance, but in the academia/public-sector side of things. He knows a wealth of guys at top firms in many areas of finance, but when I'm put in contact with someone, they're a partner/VP/MD who has no idea what's going on in the junior hiring process and I don't really ever get off the ground.
Anyone been in this sort of situation where all of their connections are too removed from any hiring decisions? How should I proceed? My family member is definitely willing to link me to his network, I just feel like I'm meeting the wrong people at the right firms.
Giving this a bump. All help appreciated!
I was in a very similar situation to this in CRE. I ended up finding a job at a really small shop, haven't really enjoyed it but have worked hard and have made enough connections to where I'm beginning to get offers to jump over to mid sized places.
Thanks, mind if i pm you?
How best to use connections at Superday? (Originally Posted: 10/30/2011)
Hi guys, I just wanted to ask this question, as I've gotten a lot of help from this board in the past year, and I'm very grateful.
So in the recruiting phase, I'm at the point where I've been invited to superday at a bank. Over the past half year, through networking my butt off, I've made some pretty strong connections at this bank. I'm sure they helped me land the superday, and I've been in touch with all of the people whom I've networked with.
My question is, as the superday approaches, what's the best course of action to take to really get the best chance of my network playing a role in the decision process. The superday is on a friday.
My plan is to email them thanking them for all of their help, and letting them know when the superday is. Hopefully this might have them put in a good word for me before the day.
Then I was planning to email them on the friday afternoon after my superday finishes (day of), letting them know who I interviewed with.
Is this the best course of action? What's the best way to leverage connections at the superday level? I know that decisions are probably made that day, so I fear the people I've networked with can't help me out after the interviews.
Any advice is very much appreciated.
I think it's a sound approach! You just need to be fairly confident that your connections actually like you.
Also, make sure not to seem too obvious because no one what's to be used in an obvious way!!!
Definitely shoot them an email to thank them for the help they've given you and to let them know you're attending the superday.
Why Is This Guy Helping Me? How Your Tangential Connections Will Help You Land An Offer (Originally Posted: 08/26/2013)
I took a very circuitous route to my current position in real estate finance. I started off at a target majoring in political science (I’m from DC, it seemed like a good idea at the time), meandered to a non-target for an MBA (but mainly so I could continue my baseball career), and ended up playing professionally for two season in various small towns in Ohio and Northern California.
Pro Ball Didn't Work Out
When my baseball career ended last August I knew that I wanted to work in finance but I had no idea how I was going to achieve that goal. Most of my friends from school got their jobs through on-campus recruiting. However I was two years out of school and I lived 3,000 miles from campus. Plus being the creepy post-grad wandering around campus didn’t hold much appeal for me so I realistically had to obtain gainful employment through other means.
As I embarked on my job search I was fortunate enough to have a solid network from which to start making calls and emails. These were very close family friends and I had high hopes that one of them would be able to help me land interviews or point me in the direction of firms that were hiring. I probably spoke to 15 or 20 people over the course of 6 weeks. I did not make a meaningful connection out of all the meetings, emails, and lunches I took. I began panicking: if these were the best connections I had and they could not facilitate any interviews, how was I going to get a job?
Get Hooked Up From This Guy?
I ended up getting help from an unlikely connection. I had coached 9th grade basketball during the offseason. The school’s varsity coach had heard that my baseball career was over and he introduced me via email to my current boss and helped me set up an interview. The entire time I kept thinking “why on earth is this guy helping me?” We were friendly but weren’t particularly close. In all honesty he was more of an acquaintance than a friend. However he put his reputation on the line to help get me an interview, and eventually a job.
It was the same for most of my other leads as well. One of my oldest family friends barely returned my emails whereas I got an interview with a hedge fund through I guy I met for an hour at a college football game. While people I barely knew were working very hard to help me my best connections were vaguely promising to “send an email” or “make a call” and invariably were no help.
I'm Not a Special Snowflake
I thought that my situation was unique until I began hearing from several of my friends that they had similar experiences. They all said that when they hit the job trail they were shocked by how little help those closest to them were and how their big breaks all came from people they could not believe were willing to go to bat for them.
When you are looking for the next opportunity, you cannot just rely on those closest to you. For whatever reason they might not be able to help you. As we saw in the recent Hedge Fund Bro email, your rich father’s connections might not be enough to land a job. You have to constantly meet new people and expand your network as you can get an offer or an interview through someone that you feel that you barely know.
I too have almost no success so far getting tangible results from networking with family friends and those that are close to me. I think asking them for help creates a sense of burden for them, whereas asking someone new creates a sense of exciting challenge for them to set you up with something tangible.
Yeah same here.
Yeah, these sorts of loose connections can be incredibly helpful. This is why it's so important to let everyone you meet (not in an annoying way or anything) if you're looking for a new job. You never know who they know, or who they might have heard of that's looking for someone with your background.
Good stuff, 'shorts. I completely agree that the most random connections can sometimes be the most fruitful.
This is actually one of the topics covered in "Never Eat Alone" by Keith Ferrazzi. I read the recommendation to read that book from an AMA here, by a consulting recruiter, and it was an outstanding book recommendation. Turns out that distant connections are typically more helpful in helping to find jobs. I just ran into this phenomenon today, when someone I met just once on a trip offered to help put me in touch with some people at a company that I want to work at...surprising since I barely know the guy, yet he was willing to go out of his way.
Oh, and as a very obvious example of distant connections, people on WSO are incredibly helpful
The part about close contacts not really helping that much and mere aquaintances going to bat for you has been my experience as well. This is why you go hunting: you're taking that long shot in a strange place, and that's where the meat is. Had I realized this earlier, I'd probably be an MD. This is why I do not "keep up with the Jones' next door"...they don't matter, they won't help you when you really need it, and you're better off having a small inner circle and regarding everyone else as a 'connection'.
Congrats and good luck on your job dude!
Great post! I received my job based on a peripheral connection as well. Although I still do not understand why those connections can be more fruitful then the more intimate ones I have. Alas it is still a very real phenomena.
Malcolm Gladwell touched on this in Tipping Point. In his research,over 80% of the people who received jobs from a connection were helped by people they had minimal contact with.
http://www.businessinsider.com/malcolm-gladwell-tipping-point-connector…
I had a really similar experience. I was actually on a plane back from a super-day, sat next to a HF dude, and we chatted and he offered to put me in touch with a buddy of his if I was looking to do something different. The guy sent the email literally the next morning. I wonder why too, but I think it has to do with two things: (i) they don't carry the baggage of the entire relationship, i.e. negative things they may have built up, or secretly hoping you never do better than them, and get just the first fresh view and (ii) Lower risk for the helper - i.e., hey, I just met this guy, and seems good on first glance, and I know you may be looking, but btw it's not my head if he sucks because I am not his best friend. When it is a long-time friend/relative all the baggage gets in the way of the natural inclination for people to help each other.
How to Utilize a Potential Connection? (Originally Posted: 07/19/2017)
In my current internship, I worked with a colleague twice (briefly) and she asked where I wanted to work after graduating. I mentioned Capital One and she mentions her husband is a Senior Director there. She tells me to reach out to her if I ever apply because she says having a reference can really help.
Two of her kids also went to the school I am going to and my stats are decent. However, I didn't even get an interview on campus when Capital One visited my university last recruiting season.
Anyways, how can I go about approaching her about using her husband's name? Should I just tell her I want to be a Business Analyst at CapOne and if her husband can refer me that would be awesome?
Thanks
good lord you have a great in with her husband as a Sr. Director. Take her out to lunch preferably, coffee at the least and ask her about her career path blah blah, tell her you admire Capital One and it's mission blah blah it's you dream to work there (make up a personal story how they gave your grandma credit to buy a frig when no one would etc).
Summary take her out to lunch, tell her about the skills you learned interning and how they apply to Capital One. (you have to have a clean story and resume ready to go). Ask if she would be comfortable putting in a good word for you or putting you in touch with her husband to navigate HR.
don't lead with the ask, catch up, find out if she remembers you, what's going on in her life, etc.
assuming nothing major has changed, mention you remembered she said something about Capital One, and that you're still curious about working there. then say something like "doesn't your husband work there? what division is he in?"
assuming his division is something relevant, I'd ask "do you think it'd be alright if I reached out?" if she says yes, ask if he'd mind if you called (believe me, it's a lot easier for her to just give you his phone number than it is for her to tell him to call you and have him actually do it).
good luck
Advice to Use Connections (Originally Posted: 06/20/2006)
I have a question. I go to Princeton, and I see there is lots of room for networking. I can pull the grades, but can anyone give me advice on selling myself? I have a relative who works at Lehman Brothers in NY. Any suggestions on approaching him (I haven't met him, but I know pretty much his whole family). If anyone has gone to Princeton or any Ivy League school, do you have any advice on making connections? I come from a small town in the South, so I'm not so in tune with how to interact in a quick-paced atmosphere.
Also, any general tips on getting into iBanking? I'm working out so that I can eventually join some club teams (I've always liked sports, just been to skinny to do anything but track), and I am reading NYTimes from page to page...any other reading advice? Any other activities that you think will build my willpower, body, and will empower me socially?
Thanks!
Also, sorry, one more question...how do I go about landing internships right now? I wanted to go to the Goldman Sachs camp for freshmen, but I'm not a minority (I'm from South India)...right now, I'm interning with a state senator and researching.
Leveraging HR contacts (Originally Posted: 01/05/2011)
I've made several contacts within HR across banks while in pursuit of a SA position. I wanted to ask my HR contacts if they could put me in contact with someone in the specific groups I'm interested in so that I may ask them a few questions about their roles at the company (aka get my name familiar with the people in each group). Would you guys say this is a good idea or is it too forward? Should I just stick with keeping in contact with HR? Thanks in advance for the suggestions.
You sure about that, Einstein?
Thanks for the helpful response gsduke, that really pointed me in the right direction.
Let's not use the word "leveraging". That makes it sound like you are going to blackmail them or rough them up. If you have legitimate contacts in HR, feel free to connect with them as you see fit. By legitimate contacts, I mean someone who will remember your name when they see it in their inbox and not go "Who the hell is this?"
Ok great thanks for the response! Yea these are HR contacts that have returned my emails expressing interest and have encouraged me keep in touch. Thank you for the input.
That's kind of HR's job, Sherlock.
HR can point you to recruiting events through which you can gain more contacts in whatever division ur interested in. Unless they really like you, I don't know if they would be willing to put you directly in touch with anyone who is busier than a first year analyst
I have a great contact but don't know how to use him?? (Originally Posted: 02/12/2012)
Through another contact, I got connected to this guy who has had tons of experience in banking and in finance. We had coffee about 3 weeks ago, and he literally told me he would find me an internship this summer (i'm a sophomore so looking at boutiques). He called a few people while I was with him, so I know he's serious about it. I emailed him my resume and he said he'd keep me posted. I followed up about a week ago and he said he was meeting with a great contact the next day and would get back to me. ...Now it's a week later and he still hasn't emailed. The problem is, I know he's serious about it but he's still really really busy and it took me forever to even schedule a coffee meeting with him. I literally had to email him over 6 times. Normally I wouldn't be too persistent but it seems like my last chance for this summer, and he really seemed eager to help. I think he just forgets/is busy. How should I follow up with him? It's been about a week since he last told me he was meeting with someone and would 'keep me posted'. I have no idea how to get him to actually act on his word. Help!
I think you should start emailing him EVERY HOUR EVERY DAY.
But forreals forreals, I wouldn't have followed up after only 1 week. It's only Feb, April/May is ultra panic mode
but if i don't follow up he completely forgets. like i said, it took me 6 back-to-back emails to set up a coffee meeting. i'm already in panic mode. should i wait another week or so to follow up? and what should i say? he apparently met with his contact last weekend... would it not be appropriate to ask him how that went this week?
Call him. Quit with the emails.
^^ agreed. when people get emails constantly all day, they might just read your email, get distracted for 10 minutes and when they come back to their computer they have 10 more emails to read and you just get pushed aside.
Call
call him and saw what? hey just wanted to see if you talked to your contact..?
I don't know man get a conversation going and then ask ' You heard anything from your contact?'
The guy sounds a little wishy washy though - more like he is trying to impress you when he can't really - I mean who the hell calls some of their contacts while you are sitting in the roomm..... that sounds a little austentacious
Books: eh, I had some hedge fund guy making 5mm a year do that for me. He was pretty full of himself, but hey you take what you can get.
Tree: If you can't start a conversation and then segue into your real question, don't bother going into finance.
I met Rosenbaum at a Networking Event: Best Way to Leverage this Connection? (Originally Posted: 04/08/2016)
Hi fellow monkeys,
Rosenbaum (the author of the famous IB book) was at a recent networking event for RBC, and I talked to him personally for a while. As a rising junior recruiting for a SA IB position, besides using this connection to network with other RBC individuals, is there any other way that I can leverage this awesome connection, considering that he is so famous in IB?
Thanks!
Yes, you could get him to sign the book.
Was this at Baruch or Rutgers?
Yes you can be the coauthor of his next book--Investment banking: networking and ass-kissing
How helpful are contacts in getting you interviews, etc.? (Originally Posted: 10/06/2006)
Hi,
I am junior at the University of Michigan, double majoring in economics and philosophy and am looking to hopefully get a summer internship at a ibank. I am applying to competitive firms such as goldmann sachs, UBS, and Lehman. I actually know a few influential people in these firms, who could possibly offer some help. How exactly would contacts help you? Along with my econ major, I have courses and internship experience in finance and accounting. However, to be frank my grades are not exceptional, as I have a cumulative GPA of 3.3. I appreciate any help on this.
Thanks, Anvar
Probably the most important considering your GPA--having someone bat for you is like bypassing the 1st round.
Ridiculously important. Get on it.
Too important to neglect
cold calling is where boners go to die
a 3.3 from UMich will probably DQ you right off the bat if you don't use your contacts
I summered at a top 5 group this summer (think UBS Los Angeles, MS M&A, GS TMT etc) from a core west coast school. We had two 'contact' hires who both had about 3.3-3.5 GPAs from non targets. These guys were able to force an interview then impressed to get an offer.
I also had numerous friends with subpar GPAs from UC schools (not berkeley or UCLA) network their way in to first rounds.
If you have family contacts those are all the more powerful.
edit
Use this Contact for A Job Listing? (Originally Posted: 04/26/2011)
Hey
I was given the contact information for an MD during my job search from a family friend. He forwarded my email to another MD. That MD responded to me with an email of "if we come across something, we will let you know and keep your resume on file" (but in a nicer way). A job just opened up on Doostang, but is not listed on the corporate website. Even though I applied to this job on Doostang, no one has looked at my resume and contacted me (Doostang tells you when an employer looks at your app).
I figured I should send this MD an email and tell him I heard there was XYZ job out there and was wondering if he had any more information.
Would this be appropriate? I do not want to be bothersome to an MD, especially since I do not know the MD and have not talked to him before except our small email correspondence.
If I should, what should I say?
Thanks
100% appropriate
Yea what you are suggesting is appropriate, use the contact. Just be polite, respect the MDs time, and come across like a professional and he will treat you as such. Depending on what group the MD works in send him an email at an appropriate time.... for example don't send a trader an email at 9am. Good luck
How much time elapsed between the initial correspondence and your application?
I would just shoot him an email and say just wanted to let you know that i came across (the job posting) and applied. blah blah.. I realize that you and your team are very busy, but I would welcome the opportunity to spend 15 minutes discussing the position with you or one of your associates. THX BRAH.
I emailed him last in late Feb / early March. I still have our initial email, so I would send this email as a reply to the others.
reach out to him....appropriate..displays you are on the ball and want the job
This is exactly why you network, so you can take advantages of opportunities like this. Congratulations, sir, you are a Networking Ninja.
Can I Use This Connection - Neighbor? (Originally Posted: 07/16/2011)
I want to at least do an informational interview with a guy from MM (think Piper, William Blair, etc.) and I just found I know an MD (high up it seems). He lives in my neighborhood and basically is shouting distance from here. Problem is I have never really talked to him or his son (who is my age business major). Would it be weird to email? If not, how should I phrase it? He would recognize my name for sure, but I really only have a connection with him because he is my neighbor who is always travelling.
Delete this post.
Email him and follow up with a phone call.
why don't you befriend his son, and work from there?
id go the son route too. thats prob the easiest way to ensure you will get a shot, considereding the dad may just turn you down.
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