Not sure what to do at this point
I've been trying to get into the industry for over 6 months now with no leads or interviews. Finally got a lead back in October for a Credit Analyst position at a large bank in their lending department. Had my final interview earlier this week and haven't heard back. Just saw exact job was reposted yesterday for location and my app status says candidate no longer in consideration. I've taken modeling courses and Argus, been reaching out to people everyday, numerous phone chats, coffee chats. Not sure what to do now. Currently in corp RE for year now with an F15 company and shit is just horrible. Not gaining any valuable experience and I am just miserable.
I'm starting to think to reach out to people regarding internships. Still living at home so can take the massive pay cut in income. Any advice?
Keep grinding man! Things will work out
What have you been doing to get leads or interviews?
I take job postings with a grain of salt but I still apply anyways and will reach out to someone at the firm. I've gotten good responses with cold emails and have had coffee chats as well. Met with an MD at a large brokerage at his office and he told me to keep tabs on their firms about postings for Analyst and to reach out when one comes available.
Only thing I have going is possibility of maybe switching internally to our Transactions team and eventually for my masters. Really not what I want to do but at least that would be better than what I am doing. Unfortunately I think the team runs pretty lean with just managers.
Not knowing anything, besides remembering seeing your handle on some threads you should try for a sales role. If you can bank role yourself for 1-2 years as an associate somewhere like marcus and millichap you will have much better success.
All I read is people bashing MM saying they throw you in the fire and just have you cold call all day. Definitely not what I want. I'm not sure I can stomach the loss of income for however long in a traditional broker position. I think an Analyst role in one of the CBRE/CW type shops would be best for me. I think I am going to start reaching out to more brokers. Also going to reach out to guys at banks in lending groups.
This has been frustrating and I have thought about just giving up and maybe try and switch internally to some marketing position or something, but RE is what I want (at least for now who knows in future). I won't give up and will continue to be on the grind. On to the next one.
I've worked with a lot of people who got their start at MM and now they make millions per year. Feel free to PM me - I spent a long time trying to break in as an analyst and after 3-4 years of interviewing I finally caught a break.
You say things are horrible at your current job. Is that bleeding into your networking/interviewing? I ask because I can empathize with working a tough job and interviewing at the same time.
What cities are you looking at? What is your goal? What is your background? Have you tried headhunters?
Yes it is definitely impacting my networking and ability to meet up with guys. I work in the suburbs and want to be in the city which is an hour out of my job. I will usually take half days and drive into city if it is a coffee meetup I arrange. I try to stack them on each other. Also stepping outside constantly when doing phone chats. I am only specifically looking for one which is a major market. It's where I want to be and I have family reasons why right now is just not an optimal time to go to a different city.
I have reached out to recruiters. Most have told me they only deal with people with experience already. I'll reach out again maybe I missed some. Some guys I have met with have told me right now is the worst time to be job searching as it's the end of the year and many don't want to leave bonuses. Hopefully come end of Jan I'll see some openings. I just want the experience with a good reputable firm where I am not getting hoodwinked. I will gladly take a massive pay cut to do so for such opportunity.
PMing you
You need to adjust your expectations, and with that, your attitude.
Just because hundreds have turned you down, doesn't mean they all will. You only need one offer, one opportunity. Keep grinding and at the same time realize that a lot of this is about timing. Once the holidays are over, a lot of companies will re-examine hiring. I wouldn't expect much to happen in December. Keep your head up.
Also, like I said, attitude adjustment. So many people go into the job hunt with this "oh I'd be so lucky to work there" attitude. Fuck that. They'd be lucky to have you. Every time they don't respond, every time they don't offer - that's them making a poor business decision and who would want to work for someone that makes poor business decisions in the first place?
Is it bullshit? Yeah probably, but so is the "I have no idea what else to do" mentality. Might as well keep it positive.
Thank you.
I appreciate it. I guess my mentality and attitude is like this more so because I am just completely miserable at my current position. Trying to keep positive here and not let it impact my entire life. I'm going to keep grinding and not give up. It's like chasing girls I guess, if you're 1/1000 I guess you're still successful? lol
Well it's like chasing girls in that once you finally get an offer, you'll probably get 3 more the next month but all of a sudden you're taken. Life's weird.
I definitely understand hating your current job. I hated my first job in the industry. I quit and spent 6 months out of the industry, only to land another job that turned out to suck though, so my advice is to stick with it. One day you'll look back and have 1-2 years of F15 experience on your resume and think "hey, that looks pretty good" instead of me, who has a year at a major brokerage, then 6 months off, then a year at a bullshit company, before I got my shit together again.
yankss101 keep grinding man! I was doing the same exact thing you were doing for about 14 months until something finally came down the pipeline. As we've talked before, things will happen when you least expect them too. Keep hustling!
Keep at it and use your previous experiences to improve your networking technique. Having a structured system (i.e. excel sheet with all relevant info and timelines) can help you a lot.
I had a similar situation a few years ago. Just keep at it every day, something will come along. One tip I will mention is that your attitude will definitely spill over into interviews. I met with a recruiter one time and I was in a very low-energy depressed mood. He called me out on it, so I definitely made sure to put my game face on each and every time I met with anybody. There is a lot to be said about body language and confidence. This sounds a little crazy, but I have used some of the stuff I heard in this lecture about body language. Check it out if you'd like.
Can't encourage enough to continue trying. I know what it's like to have a job that you dread going to everyday, but you have done the right things so far. First, just remember that hiring cycles can be longer that 6 months and that coming into the new year, groups are trying to forecast staffing needs which often result in additional postings. Second, continue to reach out and email people as it only takes one person/firm willing to give you a shot. Third, make sure you have your story down, and are confident in your technical ability. The benefit of having time is that it allows you to be as prepared as possible and present a polished overall version of yourself. Fourth, and most important is to keep a long-term perspective. Relative to the expected length of your career, 6 months is nothing. You see people who switch careers well into their 30's and still end up being successful. It is easy to get sucked into a negative mindset when things are difficult, but if you can remain positive and keep a long-term perspective, you will find that the small setbacks aren't nearly as debilitating.
Took me almost 3 years to break in. Just remind yourself everyday that losers quit.
The problem the industry (any really) has is that people assume that getting to the field of green grass is an easy-walk-in-the-park to get to...when really the road is paved with blood, sweat, and tears. People always assume, "he/she got it easy," without fully understand the inner struggles that person had to endure to get there.
Keeping a poor mental state will never, NEVER end well for anyone, including yourself. I never thought I'd work for a blue-chip company because of my economic and educational background, but here I am.
I am aiming to become a better person myself, and I hated always getting no's until I landed a few interviews (still-ongoing) onto to want to hustle more for better opportunities in the future.
Good luck to you man, keep hunting your prey.
Keep going man. In my recruiting struggles there were several stretches where I got zero bites and I started to doubt that things would work out. Sounds like you are doing the right things so something will work out with enough time and persistence. Good luck!
Thank you guys!
Two questions to follow up:
1) How do I stay in touch with contacts after meeting for coffee and such?
2) Would you guys recommend to just go after any position that would give me experience? Everyone says start out in brokerage. I don't think I can do the stretch of no income for a bit which is an Analyst in brokerage is appealing.
1) If it's a strong lead (i.e. they mentioned the potential need to bring you on board), keep in touch at least once a week, use your best judgement on when and who to connect with. If it's more of a "we dont have anything right now, but stay in touch and good luck", I would stay in touch and make contact every 3-4 weeks. "Staying in touch" could be a simple email or phone call. Just say 'hope all is well, I wanted to follow up on our meeting....'. The calls may be awkward and may only last 30 seconds or so, but the point is to stay in front of them for when an opportunity opens up.
To add to "staying in touch", look for excuses to reach out. Example: you just completed a project/deal that is ok to discuss externally. Something along the lines of "since we last spoke I completed X, which really gave me experience in value-add retail plays that are relevant to your business. Another excuse to reach out is to keep surfing Google News and see if their firm pops up. Even though I am relatively new to my new position, I still reach out and congratulate brokers when big deals are announced, just a good way to stay in touch and you never know what could happen.
2) Depends what kind of experience you are referring to. Certainly don't just take any position because there is a small real estate piece to it, or because it is at a large real estate firm (e.g. database administrator at CBRE). If something appeals to your long term goals, does not hurt to reach out.
The only other advice I would give you when reaching out to your contacts is to be intentional. Make sure you have a plan for what you would like to discuss on the call. As awkward as it may seen, the person on the other end know why you are calling and it part of normal career progression. Regarding your second question, ultimately only you can decide what is fiscally responsible for yourself and how long you can afford to live with reduced income. When looking at taking a position, I would encourage you to strongly consider how beneficial it will be. Often times you see unhappy employees end up taking terrible jobs just because they are eager to have a different job. I would caution you against this, and encourage you to be diligent when looking at opportunities. You can also vet any of the opportunities you come across with the contacts you have made. They will be able to tell you quickly whether or not the position you are considering will offer any valuable experience or not.
Good points guys.
I am pretty much looking for anything that would give me experience but like you said obviously not some database guy with a CBRE. IS Analyst, positions in lending and of course the acquisitions or AM which are the top targets.
Your last point about getting feedback from guys I spoke with.. def what I would do. Every guy I spoke said feel free to ask ignore I come across an offer with a firm to see their thoughts on said company.
I don't work in CRE and, quite frankly, don't know anything about it either, but I saw this on the front page and have been in a similar position, so I wanted to reply. Just for some context, I started my career off at a tiny investment bank and absolutely hated it. My associate (not sure about CRE, but in IB that is the guy right above you) was incompetent, my firm's clients were very financially unsophisticated, the pay was well below market, the work was mundane, etc. I dreaded coming into work every day. I graduated from a non-target, had an average GPA, and was terrible at interviewing, so to be frank, I was lucky to have that role.
From having been in your shoes, I can tell that judging by your posts that your number one issue is your attitude. I mean this in the most professional way possible, and I say that because tone is impossible to communicate online. But, your attitude is most likely turning off would-be employers and your networking. Quite frankly, judging by your replies, you are not getting job interviews because you are coming across as a whiner. Yes, your current job sucks, but big whoop, no one cares. Don't let your misery at your current job affect your networking or interviewing. Don't show up and sulk like a whiner. Don't badmouth your current firm. When asked why you want to leave, feed them some line like "I want to expand my horizons" (obviously tailor this to your space...again, I know nothing about CRE). Again, the reason you're not getting interviews if most likely because while you are probably capable of performing the job, would-be employers are thinking, "Wow, this guy is such a drag. I'd shoot myself if I had him report to me."
If you do get any interviews, my biggest piece of advice is to really work on how you answer some of these questions. What made a big difference for me was changing my answer to "Why do you want to work for us?". Instead of using the traditional lines where you rattle off the firm's accomplishments, weave in some of your own. Great, so the firm can offer you better experience, access to better learning opportunities, etc., but so what? Why should they give you that? This is where you finish your answer with something along the lines of that your experience can let you hit the ground running, your experience at a past role is with similar clients that this current firm deals with, etc. For me, making this one change was a real game changer. Good luck.
I appreciate the feedback. Maybe my posts do sounds like that lol but I can assure you in all my chats or interviews I never say anything bad about employer. I pretty much always talk about how it has been a great start to my professional career but passion lies more into the RE investment industry. I will though look back and try to see if I did come across as what you said.
Thank you!
What exactly do you now?
I can tell you it isn't impossible as long as your roles keep evolving in the right direction.
I started out collecting rents and pm'ing shitty multifamily units in Brooklyn, a couple of yrs ago with a shit GPA at a non target. Same story as you, miserable and depressed going to work everyday. But kept chugging on looking for new roles (even internships) to get investment exp and networking, with a little luck and help in between, I am now at a multibillion fund on the acquisition side.
It is possible, just don't giveup and I'd recommend interning if you can to get real life modeling/argus skills. Refine your interview skills and know everything cold. Do you have an alum database to tap into too?
Can you go into more detail how you landed your current role?
And I have reached out to alumni.. spoke to decent amount who seem to be great contacts.
Shoot me a pm with specific questions you may have and i'll answer as best as i can
Seriously.. thanks to you all! reading your responses has honestly helped me tremendously to keep my head up and keep doing what I am doing. Something will come up eventually just gotta keep grinding.
send me your resume/lets set up a faux phone interview.
it's year end. wait til bonuses are paid out 1Q17 then stuff will likely start opening up
That's what I have been told actually by many. Hoping for that.
I started in retail making $13.50/hr bro. You're in a good position right now in the sense that you at least have a professional job relevant to RE, at worst you can finish a yr or two there then move on to an MSRE and you'd be very competitive for RE positions given your previous experience. You probably don't even need to do that though, just keep applying and stay positive and I am sure something will pop up. Godspeed.
Good point.
If I can't find something still by beginning of year but have an opportunity to switch internally to our Transactions team, it could be a good move and set me up for a future AM role. A lot of what they do is basically Asset Management except on the corporate level. Some acquisitions, mostly dispositions, leases and such.
6 mos isn't long. It took me 9 mos of full-time networking to land my first job as a broker and 5 years of relationship building to land my current job as a developer. You just have to keep grinding.
You need to find a balance of professional and personal in your interviews. People want to work with people who are competent but also who they don't get sick of seeing every day. It's totally OK to be driven and ambitious, but I presume you're coming off as a Gordy Go Hard (been there too.) Chill out, read the person across the table, and have a real conversation with them. You're young and people don't expect you to know all the answers so be overtly humble (you're looking for a new opportunity so you can continue learn and grow as a person). If you're talking more than 10% of the conversation you're doing it wrong.
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