Positions in less than ideal locations?

Is there any value in looking into positions in places like Africa, India, etc.? Obviously China has become fairly well represented but what about other options abroad? How do Bschools look at them, as in, would coming from an office in one of these places set you apart or just make you look like you couldn't get a job in a place with indoor plumbing?

 

Based on the subject, I thought this was gonna be about the Kama Sutra. I am sorely disappointed.

(Seriously though, I'm in your boat, too. Currently looking at i-banks in the Philippines. Booming economy, particularly the debt market. You may take a hit when it comes to the brand, but you can make up for it with unique experience if you do it right. Maybe focus on high-demand emerging markets. And there are well-known multi-nationals that operate in those places, e.g. HSBC Citi, JP, etc. It's better than admin work.)

 

True that and I wish I had thought about the Kama Sutra angle and written the post in a more interesting way. So sorry to disappoint. I was looking at the Barclays thing last night and saw the Cairo office which kinda got me wondering what other opportunities were out there. Hope the thing in the Philippines pans out though.

All that being said, I really don't think living in Africa is ever the answer unless you went to Bates and wear an "I hate the World Bank" pin on your burlap skirt.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford
 
International Pymp:
also - I heard there's a lot of cool stuff opening up in Bahrain in both PE and IB these days. There's a good article a few months back on M&I about working in banking in the middle east by an english dude who's with a BB

I've just got back home from a 4 year stint in IBD in the Middle East. It was fantastic a few years ago, less so now. I'll probably head back once the markets start to clear up, as they've taken an absolute belting in the past year. Having said that you can still make serious coin in the region, its just harder. You don't need language skills at all - I speak no Arabic after 4 years there - and people worship US Ivy League educations. All the majors have a strong presence in the region and many of the commercial banks (HSBC, Standard Chartered etc) have strong IBD presences as well.

Really good exit opps as well. I have friends at Mumtalakat and GFH in Bahrain, Mubadala and ADIA in the UAE, QIA, KIA, etc. Being ex-ADIA opens doors everywhere, believe me. As for the other areas:

Africa: Is dead and will be for some time, don't bother unless you want to get sector experience in mining, and most shops do their coverage from London / Dubai anyway. All business is done in English / French so you'll be fine.

India: No point unless you're of Indian heritage. Much like in China, all the rain makers are local and the market has moved on from foreigners being in top positions. Speaking only English is fine but you'll probably need to learn some hindi to get by.

  • CIS: Developing, and I ended up looking a lot more into the 'stans just before I left. Astana will probably be the next big place to do business but as far as I am aware no one has a permanent presence. Business is mostly done out of Moscow / St. Petersburg based shops. Again, language isn't as huge an issue.
“I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are.” - Hicks
 
Best Response
International Pymp:
What's the models and bottles situation like in the ME?

Models and bottles situation is great. Plenty of good looking girls if you've got the coin to get into the clubs and the parties are ridiculous. For my first year there I went to Dubai every weekend, party started with boozy brunch on the Friday and ended Saturday afternoon.

The reason I stayed for so long was the lifestyle.

  • Awesome cars in a country where you can hit 200km/h + on the highways
  • Massive apartments (I had an apartment in the centre of the city that was bigger than the house I grew up in)
  • No income, capital gains or withholding tax and currencies that are pegged to the dollar
  • comp in excess of Street
  • far shorter hours than any of the major financial centres
  • 5 - 6 weeks annual leave per year, plus everything slows down over summer so you get plenty of down time
  • Cheap labour, so if you feel like it you can have full time drivers, cooks, nannies, maids etc

Downside is the deals are pretty simple so you have to head back to the OECD every few years to keep the skills sharp if you want to be able to go back home. Having said that I know plenty of people that will stay for most of their working lives as you can live a pimp lifestyle.

“I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are.” - Hicks
 

I may have to look at China next stint. There's a lot of opportunities for me in HK and Singapore but the mainland sounds a bit more 'fast and loose'. How is the PE market over there? Getting saturated or are there still opportunities?

“I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are.” - Hicks
 
jackilewis:
the lifestyle in the middle east is shit...you cant compare it to asia.... even dubai is garbage...

work in new york and then go to the emerging markets.. not the other way...you wont learn anything and wont be able to move to the states effectivly

To each their own. I found the lifestyle great, but you do have to get in with the right crowd. You are right about the exits back to New York though. For me its not so much a problem as home base is a second / third tier financial centre, so its not a huge deal that I spent a lot of time in emerging markets. Its fairly common for guys to do 5-6 years in Dubai, Singapore, Mumbai or HK and come back with no repercussions, but the same may not hold true for Americans.

“I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are.” - Hicks
 
Wage Slave Number 9][quote=jackilewis:
the lifestyle in the middle east is shit...you cant compare it to asia.... even dubai is garbage...

work in new york and then go to the emerging markets.. not the other way...you wont learn anything and wont be able to move to the states effectivly

To each their own - I found the lifestyle great. While I was there I had a top car, a co-shares in a boat, massive apartment, plenty of time off (short work days plus weekends off), long holidays to Africa and Europe and good comp. Hard to see how you can't have a good lifestyle under those circumstances. Granted this was post / early GFC but things have only come down in price while wages are flat, so its still a good deal.

You are right about the exits back to New York though. For me its not so much a problem as home base is a second / third tier financial centre, so its not a huge deal that I spent a lot of time in emerging markets. Its fairly common for guys to do 5-6 years in Dubai, Singapore, Mumbai or HK and come back with no repercussions, but the same may not hold true for Americans.

“I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are.” - Hicks
 

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