Pride

WolfofWSO's picture
Rank: King Kong | banana points 1,728

What are you proud of? Your sexuality? Great, Fine, I am too. But why do you need a parade to flaunt it?

Furthermore, why do gay men have to flaunt their shirtless bodies on the pride parade like they are in a Sex Shop or working for Chippendale's. If you want people to accept you for who you are, you need to accept other's people's acceptance of what is decent. I do not want society thinking that gay men are all about leather, lisping, being shirtless, HIV, and exposing their bodies in tight thongs. Yet they do it, and think that is normal and acceptable. Sorry. Not to me. I want society to accept the gay and lesbian population as regular people who want to accepted into society not due to their sexual preference, but rather to the love that they have for one another. But the whole Pride Festival disproves that. And if you think about it. It is sad.

They go on and on that they want equality and to be taken seriously, but when you have events such as pride looking like a retarded circus orgy, it's kinda hard to exercise empathy for their cause.

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Comments (46)

Jun 8, 2018
Jun 7, 2018

What's more, if you dare to question their behavior or even hint that you don't agree with the way they are trying to communicate their message, that immediately makes you a bigot/homophobe/sexist/racist(yes really) or whatever.

It is insane and rather frightening to be honest that this is where we are now.

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Jun 7, 2018

Welcome to 2018 (#It'sTheCurrentYear!) bigot. If you don't think we should sexualize brainwashed 11yo boys, well then you're just a homophobe.

https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2015/06/15/watch-little...
200

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Jun 7, 2018

.........

GunningForPortfolioManager

Jun 7, 2018

excel is my canvas, and data is my paint - new york - brunch conesseiour - atheist - centrist - ENFP - TCU alum

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Jun 7, 2018

I hate faggy shit, but I was really hoping this thread would be more philosophical.

heister:

Look at all these wannabe richies hating on an expensive salad.

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Jun 6, 2018

The whole point of this discussion is that overt sexualism in Gay Pride is controversial. Some people are ok with it, but others are not. My definition of societal acceptance is non-distinction between different groups of people. Clearly, this is difficult to achieve if certain groups embrace controversial behavior. Imagine if Coca Cola's slogan was "Coca Cola: We support abortion". Some people will think this is great, but about 50% of people will not buy Coca Cola. Being neutral is good in the long run.

Now, Gay Pride might be useful in the short term, when being gay is still not accepted by many people. However, eventually, we need to taper down this stuff. In the long run, we want gay people to be neutral and ordinary members of society, not people who are associated with various perversions.

Sexual theme is not necessary for us to remember that gays were/are persecuted. Jewish people don't need to wear black leather thongs for me to understand the Holocaust, for instance.

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Jun 7, 2018

Well said, OP. It seems like the far left is obsessed with cramming gay "rights" down peoples throats without any regard for what is generally accepted behavior (e.g. twerking down main street in a thong isn't going to win over too many people, no matter what your cause is).

Also, some of the brainwashing of kids with drag/transsexuality/gender identity mentioned above is seriously messed up but that's getting off topic.

Jun 7, 2018

With your logic, you probably think all Irish people are drunkards, all christian people are consumerists that only care about receiving gifts, all americans only care about fireworks and yelling 'Merica (okay this one may be true #Godbless the Land of The Free)

anyways my overarching point is: let people enjoy things. As long as no drunk revellers key your car or make you late for work, let them celebrate their identity in whatever way they wish.

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Jun 6, 2018

You must not work in a major city where these parades increase traffic and detours tenfold.

Jun 7, 2018

who is driving a car to work in a major city? also when do you work/drive to work? 1pm on a Saturday?

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Jun 7, 2018

I think he meant work/live.

You don't take cabs to meetings/when you're going around town?

Have you ever tried to get across town, even walking, when a parade has shut down one of the avenues?

Jun 7, 2018
m8:

You don't take cabs to meetings?

Have you ever tried to get across town, even walking, when a parade has shut down one of the avenues?

No, because I'm not a moron. If there is a parade happening (and it's extremely easy to figure out), I plan around not having to go through the damn parade.

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Funniest
Jun 7, 2018

Oh sorry, I don't check daily the parade schedule in NYC. Maybe I should start doing that... Thanks for the tip.

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Jun 7, 2018
m8:

Oh sorry, I don't check daily the parade schedule in NYC. Maybe I should start doing that... Thanks for the tip.

I mean, if you have a meeting to make a certain time, and you're not checking traffic conditions, then yeah, you're an idiot. Why should anyone sympathize with an under-prepared cretin? And all of that is leaving aside that your putting your personal convenience ahead of the fact that there is a statistically significant percentage of the country who belong to a community that literally had to fear for their lives if they revealed who they were, and who were denied basic Constitutional rights as recently as 2015. I'm sure the gay couple who weren't legally allowed to marry for the last three decades agree that you having to wait an extra 20 minutes in traffic is vastly more inconvenient than being denied their 14th Amendment rights for years.

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Jun 7, 2018
Ozymandia:
m8:

Oh sorry, I don't check daily the parade schedule in NYC. Maybe I should start doing that... Thanks for the tip.

I mean, if you have a meeting to make a certain time, and you're not checking traffic conditions, then yeah, you're an idiot. Why should anyone sympathize with an under-prepared cretin? And all of that is leaving aside that your putting your personal convenience ahead of the fact that there is a statistically significant percentage of the country who belong to a community that literally had to fear for their lives if they revealed who they were, and who were denied basic Constitutional rights as recently as 2015. I'm sure the gay couple who weren't legally allowed to marry for the last three decades agree that you having to wait an extra 20 minutes in traffic is vastly more inconvenient than being denied their 14th Amendment rights for years.

Lol at using a gay marriage argument; what a sham. Gay men are absurdly promiscuous, have very high STD rates, and monogamy is basically unheard of, but sure #GayMarriage. I'm not even anti-gay (though I'm sure you'd say I'm a bigot or something), but rather I'm against the insidious lies that the gay community continues to spread in order to cover up the debauchery of an average gay person.

Like c'mon dude, gay men literally had to have a drug like Truvada invented for them because of their notoriously dangerous sexual practices. Amazingly that still wasn't a wakeup call, and it just gave them more of an excuse to let a bunch of anonymous dicks up their butts. Hell, there are even now reports of Truvada not working because HIV strains have mutated slightly due to increased unprotected sexual activity. It's ridiculous.

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Jun 7, 2018
Pmc2ghy:

Lol at using a gay marriage argument; what a sham. Gay men are absurdly promiscuous, have very high STD rates, and monogamy is basically unheard of, but sure #GayMarriage. I'm not even anti-gay (though I'm sure you'd say I'm a bigot or something), but rather I'm against the insidious lies that the gay community continues to spread in order to cover up the debauchery of an average gay person.

Like c'mon dude, gay men literally had to have a drug like Truvada invented for them because of their notoriously dangerous sexual practices. Amazingly that still wasn't a wakeup call, and it just gave them more of an excuse to let a bunch of anonymous dicks up their butts. Hell, there are even now reports of Truvada not working because HIV strains have mutated slightly due to increased unprotected sexual activity. It's ridiculous.

So your argument is that gays shouldn't be offered the Constitutional rights theoretically extended to all citizens of this country, because you think they're overly promiscuous?

And you have no clue what the "debauchery of an average gay man" is. How can anyone take you seriously when you have the gall to type something like that? Please, point me to the clinical study that says that gay men are more debauched than straight men. How many straight guys in banking are coming into the office on Monday morning bragging about the hot girl they slept with? Read this whole damn site; half the reason anyone here wants to be in banking is because it's a status thing. Read the thread on marriage that was going around; most of the comments are to the point of "don't get married, just keep fucking as many hot chicks as you can, why risk a divorce and your wealth just to be tied down to a woman who will lose her looks?"

If you knew a straight guy that was going around banging a different professional cheerleader or underwear model every other night, you'd be insanely jealous. And if you specifically wouldn't be, I dare you to sit there with a straight face and tell me you believe the majority of people on this site wouldn't be. And yet, somehow, wanting and achieving that level of reckless promiscuity is an ideal to be sought after, but if its two gay men it isn't? Every action you are condoning is considered socially acceptable, even desirable, when done by a straight man.

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Jun 7, 2018

You're reaching so hard, it's sad. The promiscuity of the gay community is well documented, stop acting like a clueless moron and have an honest debate. Like if you want to debate that promiscuity isn't bad then okay, we can do that, but don't blatantly lie about the facts. And no, using WSO as the barometer of male sexuality is a strawman. The average number of lifetime partners for a heterosexual male is around 6; that's a rowdy Tuesday night for a lot of gays.

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Jun 7, 2018
Pmc2ghy:

You're reaching so hard, it's sad. The promiscuity of the gay community is well documented, stop acting like a clueless moron and have an honest debate. Like if you want to debate that promiscuity isn't bad then okay, we can do that, but don't blatantly lie about the facts. And no, using WSO as the barometer of male sexuality is a strawman. The average number of lifetime partners for a heterosexual male is around 6; that's a rowdy Tuesday night for a lot of gays.

Only because women say 'no', not because a straight dude wouldn't fuck two different chicks every day if they could. Women are the filter. Lesbians are like two filters and probably rarely get laid (I have not checked the stats).

If you don't know who the sucker is at the table, it's you.

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Jun 7, 2018

We used to have parades for going to the moon, now we have parades for guys who like fuck and suck each other. -Norm MacDonald.

youtube the clip, hilarious.

Jun 7, 2018
WolfofWSO:

What are you proud of? Your sexuality? Great, Fine, I am too. But why do you need a parade to flaunt it?

Furthermore, why do gay men have to flaunt their shirtless bodies on the pride parade like they are in a Sex Shop or working for Chippendale's. If you want people to accept you for who you are, you need to accept other's people's acceptance of what is decent. I do not want society thinking that gay men are all about leather, lisping, being shirtless, HIV, and exposing their bodies in tight thongs. Yet they do it, and think that is normal and acceptable. Sorry. Not to me. I want society to accept the gay and lesbian population as regular people who want to accepted into society not due to their sexual preference, but rather to the love that they have for one another. But the whole Pride Festival disproves that. And if you think about it. It is sad.

They go on and on that they want equality and to be taken seriously, but when you have events such as pride looking like a retarded circus orgy, it's kinda hard to exercise empathy for their cause.

Whoa. Either you're one of the least self-reflective people in the world, or a particularly stupid and ineloquent bigot.

They aren't looking for your sympathy or your approval, they're expressing themselves in their own way. You don't have to approve or disapprove, any more than you have to approve or disapprove of a woman wearing a bikini or a man a sleeveless shirt for those things to be okay.

As others have said, is it equally ridiculous that traffic on the West Side Highway gets shut down for July 4th? That the Irish get a parade on St Patricks Day? Why the hell do those damn veterans have to keep shoving their service in my face, anyway? Don't they know I have meetings crosstown?

And by the way, have you ever stopped to consider (hah, of course you haven't) that perhaps the reason gay men are so eager to flaunt themselves in public on that ONE day a year is because folks like you are so eager to condemn them for their sexual identity on the other 364 days of the year? Gay culture is the way it is in large part because for decades they were forced to do it in secret, and now they can revel in the fact that we're (mostly) behind the days where young men were tied to fence posts, whipped and tortured, and left to die for the crime of being gay.

Have you ever been to the Puerto Rican Day Parade, or Dominican Day Parade? Those are also giant parties, people get drunk and make out and wear minimal clothing. Why not outrage there? Have you ever been in Hudson River Park for the Fourth of July? Tons of women are wearing next to nothing, plenty of people acting like it's a "circus orgy". The only difference is that it's heterosexual couples.

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Jun 7, 2018

Hahahahaha. Your entire post can be summed up with "well ACKSHULLLLY, drinking beer on St. Paddys day and waving an American flag on Veterans Day is THE EXACT SAME as guys in g-strings shaking their cocks in front of kids and fellating each other off to the side but still in public! So empowering!"

How delusional can one person be. I suppose if I went around all day everyday with 99.9% of my identity based on where I get to stick my dick (or where a dick gets to be put into me), I'd be going off the deep end too.

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Jun 7, 2018
Pmc2ghy:

Hahahahaha. Your entire post can be summed up with "well ACKSHULLLLY, drinking beer on St. Paddys day and waving an American flag on Veterans Day is THE EXACT SAME as guys in g-strings shaking their cocks in front of kids and fellating each other off to the side but still in public! So empowering!"

How delusional can one person be. I suppose if I went around all day everyday with 99.9% of my identity based on where I get to stick my dick (or where a dick gets to be put into me), I'd be going off the deep end too.

No, my point is that gay men have a few hours, of one day a year, in which they get to act how they want in public, after decades of forced silence. It's a giant party, yeah. People wear g strings and shake their ass. Women wear g strings and shake their ass on the beach every day of summer. Go to the Jersey Shore, or Main Beach in the Hamptons, and tell me it isn't happening. Every day. Why is that better? What, exactly, is the difference, except that one group is gay and the other is not explicitly gay?

And honestly, how dare you assume that gay people wrap their entire identity up in their sexuality. Spoken like someone who doesn't actually know any gay people, just the ones Fox News shows in a 10 second clip. Yes, gays are more likely to identify as gay over anything else - maybe that has something to do with the fact that up until the extremely recent past (and the present, in many places), being gay meant being exiled from any other community. Kind of hard to be a Christian man who happens to be gay, when your church won't have you for a member because of your sexuality. Kind of tough to be a Texan who happens to be gay, if your state won't let you get married to someone you love.

You seem to have no problem with straight people fellating each other in public, or shaking their shit for each other in public. At least,you haven't condemned them. So why is it such an issue when gays do it?

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Jun 7, 2018

You keep trying so hard. It's been a gigantic fallacy that gay men are "just like you and me." Like stop lying bc I don't care about your cherry picking of women at the beach (stupid argument to boot); the average heterosexual man or woman is nowhere near the sexual promiscuity of the average gay man. Gay relationships are rarely ever monogamous. What about the absurdly high STD rates in the gay community? Sorry if the truth hurts.

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Jun 8, 2018
Ozymandia:
Pmc2ghy:

Hahahahaha. Your entire post can be summed up with "well ACKSHULLLLY, drinking beer on St. Paddys day and waving an American flag on Veterans Day is THE EXACT SAME as guys in g-strings shaking their cocks in front of kids and fellating each other off to the side but still in public! So empowering!"

How delusional can one person be. I suppose if I went around all day everyday with 99.9% of my identity based on where I get to stick my dick (or where a dick gets to be put into me), I'd be going off the deep end too.

No, my point is that gay men have a few hours, of one day a year, in which they get to act how they want in public, after decades of forced silence. It's a giant party, yeah. People wear g strings and shake their ass. Women wear g strings and shake their ass on the beach every day of summer. Go to the Jersey Shore, or Main Beach in the Hamptons, and tell me it isn't happening. Every day. Why is that better? What, exactly, is the difference, except that one group is gay and the other is not explicitly gay?

And honestly, how dare you assume that gay people wrap their entire identity up in their sexuality. Spoken like someone who doesn't actually know any gay people, just the ones Fox News shows in a 10 second clip. Yes, gays are more likely to identify as gay over anything else - maybe that has something to do with the fact that up until the extremely recent past (and the present, in many places), being gay meant being exiled from any other community. Kind of hard to be a Christian man who happens to be gay, when your church won't have you for a member because of your sexuality. Kind of tough to be a Texan who happens to be gay, if your state won't let you get married to someone you love.

You seem to have no problem with straight people fellating each other in public, or shaking their shit for each other in public. At least,you haven't condemned them. So why is it such an issue when gays do it?

Men throwing their cocks around and pissing on each other in public is the same as people dressing in scantily-clad beachwear on a BEACH?

K

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Jun 7, 2018

Pretty sure everyone hates the PR and Dom day parades too.

Jun 7, 2018
C.R.E. Shervin:

Pretty sure everyone hates the PR and Dom day parades too.

The PR day parade is absolutely miserable. My office has a pool about the number of rapes reported at the parade. DR parade I haven't had much experience with, but I find the West African parade interesting, as people seem to get VERY stabby at it.

Also, for the guy complaining about traffic: It's a Saturday. (in NYC at least) If you're working on Saturdays (other than from home) you have bigger problems than the parade. When it comes to disruption, St. Pat's is the worst because it's on a weekday through midtown.

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Jun 7, 2018

In my view, we as people have an ego to please. Having an identity is important to us and in this social media obsessed world, it can seem like you're an insignificant underachieving spec in a crowded universe. In short, it's hard to feel like YOU are special in any way and the reality is you probably aren't.

This is why I think people have turned to sexuality as a means to express identity. It's edgy. It's new. It's controversial. People who strongly identify with a fringe sexuality feel like they're instilled with a purpose to fight a good fight and change the world. It makes them feel like they belong to something bigger than themselves and making a difference by representing a group of people that want to be equal

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Jun 7, 2018

I think you're looking at this without applying any historical context. You're looking at Pride only as it relates to the current environment for homosexuals, instead of the environment in which it began.

Pride parades started when gays had to fear for their lives because of what they did behind closed doors. They finally had enough, and declared proudly that their sexuality is nothing to be ashamed of much less be ostracized, beaten, or murdered for. They put their sexuality out in the open - at great risk to themselves - to challenge the notion that they should be ashamed of who they are. Maybe you think that should have been done with reverence to what's traditionally decent, but the goal of the whole movement was to change the conversation in America about what is and isn't shameful. They were making a point: this isn't shameful behind closed doors, and we believe that so thoroughly that we won't be ashamed in public either.

You write: "I do not want society thinking that gay men are all about leather, lisping, being shirtless, HIV, and exposing their bodies in tight thongs." And while I'm sure the gay community appreciates your concern for their brand, most thoughtful people don't paint an entire group of people with such a wide brush. Most gay people aren't about that at all, but they still appreciate the people who came before them with courage to protect their private lives.

Jun 6, 2018

I mean, it's one thing to celebrate your body, but the way pride parades are set up worldwide are more about the overly sexual and S&M advertisement then really looking for acceptance and human rights.

I am also finding that a lot of gay people, though do not like the presentation of gay pride, participate because they are gay and feel obligated to do so out of fear of looking like an uncle tom.

The whole concept of gay pride is very confusing to me.

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Jun 7, 2018

Again, historical context helps here. The gay community and the kink community were similarly ostracized back when the pride movement began. There was a kinship between the two groups (and certainly some overlap) because they each had to hide their sexually "deviant" behavior or risk their safety. Pride served as a way to advance the rights of both groups with a statement that sexuality, in all its forms, is not shameful.

And yes, most gay people I know would never dream of participating in the edgier displays of pride. But I don't think they "feel obligated to {participate} out of fear of looking like an uncle tom." Instead, I think they value the statement that different sexual orientations should not carry a stigma, and they value the freedoms and safety they enjoy because people have the courage to make that statement on their behalf.

Jun 7, 2018

The left, and yes most people who take part in Pride activities are on the left, swings the pendulum further and further until what they want is now the norm. See you don't enjoy having all of those overly-sexualized people out and walking down the street, whereas being gay, by itself 20 years ago, wasn't acceptable. The left yells for the mile because it looks more reasonable to only get a tenth of a mile in return. The right falls into this every time. They give incremental ground until they give up the very things they are against or not for.

tl;dr its easier to swing for the fences and to get a single than to specifically try to hit a single.

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Most Helpful
Jun 7, 2018

OP I'm not here to judge your personal beliefs, if you are or aren't ok with homosexuality I can assure you that's none of my business. What I will say is if your thoughts are based around the idea that how people act in these parades is indicative of how they wish they could behave in real life, you're probably letting some personal biases creep into your logic. I believe the idea of these events has a lot more to do with a homosexual person's feelings of having to hide who they are from the general populace (as the result of either real or perceived threats to their personal well-being). These parades serve as a form of expression or release from the normal daily slog. By their very design they are meant to be flamboyant, extravagant, and histrionic to serve in juxtaposition to the "closeted" status of everyday life.
Do I agree that some of it can be hard to watch as a heterosexual male, sure. Is America as a whole placing an emphasis on all forms of (not just Homosexual) hyper-sexuality, absolutely. But in the grand scheme of things, if they have a permit, and they're not hurting anyone let 'em live for a day. Taking it to the other side of the spectrum, I feel the same way about the rally at Charlottesville last summer (prior to the fuckwad who hit that civilian with his douche-mobile). Obviously I hated the message, and if they all had gotten napalmed I wouldn't feel any type of way about it, but if you got the paperwork, your right to assemble is as good as anyone else's. It's one of the many things that make this Country awesome.

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Jun 7, 2018

Some of you all need to be careful what you say though in regard to LGBT issues. Remember, freedom of speech has been abolished when it comes to this issue.

CrossFit Exec fired and told to "Shut the fuck up" for disagreeing with Gay Pride Parade

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Jun 7, 2018
Click OK to Continue:

Some of you all need to be careful what you say though in regard to LGBT issues. Remember, freedom of speech has been abolished when it comes to this issue.

CrossFit Exec fired and told to "Shut the fuck up" for disagreeing with Gay Pride Parade

I think you are somewhat confused with the prohibition of the government prohibiting freedom of speech: "OMG, Hitler was right, buy Mein Kampf now!!!11!1!1!!1!!!" and your company firing you for being a dickwad.

In the US, you can't be jailed or penalized by the government for that statement. In Germany, you serve hard time for it. In either country HR is likely to give you a comfortable escort out to reception for it.

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Jun 7, 2018

I'm well aware of the difference between a law and a company policy. One gets you in trouble with the government; one gets you in trouble with your employer. THANK YOU for that lesson as a response to my not-at-all-hyperbolic/sarcastic comment.

The point i was trying to make though is that our society as a whole has effectively prohibited people from engaging in legitimate/sincere discussions surrounding this issue, despite this being a very polarizing issue. You actually somewhat proved my point. Insinuating that believing that a marriage is a sacred bond between a man & woman (as has been the case throughout human history) is tantamount to being a Nazi is exactly how the far left silences opponents in regard to literally every social issue.

I believe in protecting gay rights. I also believe in protecting SINCERE freedom of speech, expression, and religion (thinking that Jews should be killed isn't legitimate). The fact that you're totally fine with someone being told to "shut the fuck up" as he/she is being fired (you even implied he's a "dickwad") simply for tweeting out a sincere religious opinion regarding marriage, then i think that says a lot about you.

I'm not sure why Germany was brought up. You serve "hard time" for disagreeing with gay marriage there? OK??? In Saudi Arabia you get whipped for criticizing Islam....

Jun 7, 2018
Click OK to Continue:

Insinuating that believing that a marriage is a sacred bond between a man & woman (as has been the case throughout human history) is tantamount to being a Nazi is exactly how the far left silences opponents in regard to literally every social issue.

Marriage has been a "sacred bond" for about as long as Jews have been considered the people who killed Jesus. In fact, its amusing that you bring up the Nazi thing, given that context. Which is intelligent people react negatively to the "marriage a sacred bond between man and woman" argument. It just is not true. Marriage as the legitimizing factor in procreation is mostly true, but to act like history is one long stretch of the sanctity of heterosexuality is absurd. That emphasis comes in with the spread of Christianity, a small portion of recorded human history. Again, you say "kill all the Jews" is not a reasonable argument. I'm sure you'd agree that "make the Jews into a special group of second class citizens with fewer rights and privileges" is equally abhorrent, and worthy of social condemnation the second its brought up. So why is it okay, or less absurd, to say it in regards to gays?

Jun 8, 2018

Freedom of speech means you can't be arrested for speaking an opinion. Not that you can say whatever you want whenever you want without consequence.

Jun 7, 2018

Wonder how many more pride diversity recruitment events will be added to the calendar for SA 2019 across BB's due to this post

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Jun 7, 2018

I'm proud of the fact I can admit to people I'm an absolute idiot, and have absolutely no shame doing so.

It takes a strong individual to admit failure, defeat, and weaknesses.
Then again, most of you are dependent on someone else for an income source, so it's understandable.

I also enjoy being hated. If I'm not hated by a new person every month, I have to look in the mirror and ask myself "what are you doing wrong?"

Jun 8, 2018

"My sexuality doesn't define who I am"

Dedicates several parades and festivities regarding said sexuality and how it is a source of pride for the individual

"Work ethic, work ethic" - Vince Vaughn
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Jun 8, 2018
Yankee Doodle:

"My sexuality doesn't define who I am"

Dedicates several parades and festivities regarding said sexuality and how it is a source of pride for the individual

"Don't define me by my sexual preferences!"

BB investment banks institute preferential hiring programs specifically for, and only on the basis of, guys who like to suck cock and women who like to eat twat

So pwuhgwessive!!! What a world.

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Jun 16, 2018

Interesting and smart takes in this thread. Here's mine. My issue with the gay pride parades is the over sexualization of the event. Society has placed a stigma on overtly sexual behavior and dress in public spaces. This from understanding is for the protection of children. Would you like your 10 year old daughter to see some guy in a g-string? Not exposing children to excessive sexual behavior is a good thing.

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Jun 16, 2018
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Jun 16, 2018
Jun 17, 2018