Renege Advice
Hey everyone. I made an ID specifically for this question, and even though I read a lot of good threads about it I am hoping to get some input on my specific situation. I am a junior and recently got an offer from a fortune 500 firm for a finance internship. I thought it was pretty good and even though I was set on getting into a BB or MM IBank, I did not have anything else lined up so I verbally accepted over the phone. I did not get specifics on start/end dates pay, or even the specific area I would be working in.Fast forward about a week later I get an offer from a quality MM IBank through my school's OCR, offer expires in a few days.
Basically I am worried about the ramifications of reneging on my verbal acceptance, first from my university. Although I did not get the offer through ocr, the company does get a good amount of interns from our school. I dont really think they can ban me from the career center but definitely has crossed my mind. Secondly, I have read that through the grapevine the MM firm may here I reneged and take away my offer. I know one is a bank and the other a f500 company so, again, I am not sure if I should worry about this.
I really think this is better for my future and I am pretty set on reneging I just wanted to get some heads up from people who have been there before. Thanks.
from a career standpoint, yes. but if you are set on BB / MM, you should never accept the f500 offer in the first place. at the end, i think this decision also speaks a lot about your personal values. i have been in a similar situation before and i took the "less sexier" offer. people though this was probably a stupid decision, but till now i am happy with this call.
u didn't sign anything, so its not exactly reneging. They might get pissed but it is nothing to get worried about. I doubt you will get banned from OCR, if you do you didn't sign shit so you have a good argument.
You accepted verbally, it's not even a binding agreement. Do what's best for you - accept the MM IB offer, kill it this summer, and get a FT offer. You'll probably lose OCR but I think it's worth the risk (maybe unless you're at a target)
Can somebody explain to me how this person can possibly be banned from OCR if the F500 offer wasn't through the career center? (Even if he signed a contract for the offer)
I think the crux of this issue is due to the fact that the OP mentioned that the company has a fair representation of alums. Even though it wasn't through OCR, the company still gets a lot of interns through that school, which means they have a relationship to uphold. Granted, it's not as bad as reneging on an OCR offer, it is still a sensitive issue based on the fact that the school may be seen as some sort of feeder into that company.
There was a thread about a similar situation recently where someone got a job by himself/herself, but OCR had lined up a job for him/her as well. The person was forced to take the OCR offer or be banned from it since it'd essentially sour the relationship between the school and the company.
It really is up to your school's OCR and how they handle these things. Some may not take action, some may.
Just tell the F500 that you appreciate them giving you this opportunity but you have decided to go another route. You should really just be honest as it's quite obvious that you're making some bullshit excuse if you're turning it down.
Did you interview with the IB after you verbally accepted the offer?
FM
I had already interviewed before accepting the offer. Also, although I am not sure, I think I had to renege on a firm that I was connected to through OCR in order to be banned. Has anyone heard anything to the contrary? Also, what do I say when I call the f500 to renege, I imagine it could get awkward.
I guess worse comes to worse, since I have not signed anything, I can always say there was a miscommunication between myself and the company.
exactly no witnesses right? you can always tell there was probably a misunderstanding between u and the person you spoke with over the phone.
You're best off acting in your own best interests and reneging. After all they will treat you as disposable if it is time to bring the ax, be a mercenary.
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Yea, for example, the school that I went to, they had a strict policy that if you reneged, you were no longer allowed to use OCR for a year. I would find out a few things:
If you renege and OCR bans you, it wont mean much if you get FT offer. However, if you renege and dont get FT, your screwed when your a senior looking for a job.
I'm pretty sure it's not considered "reneging" if you didn't sign anything. However it depends on whether they said something like "call us if you want the job" and after considering you did. If it was an off the cusp type affair, pretty sure if you tell them early enough (where they may be able to offer the position to another candidate) that they wouldn't really care.
I plan on being everything short of profusely apologetic when I call and, hopefully, they will understand and just not call my school in the first place. I understand they may be a little ticked off, but it is not even December and this is for the summer, so its not like I ditched last minute and left them without a fair amount of notice.
Also, from what I understand, the MM is doing well and does extend a fair amount of ft offers to interns, so thats a plus.
Also, what do you all think; should I approach OCR and tell them my situation ahead of time or should I renege and hope that they don't make a big deal of it?
I think it's safer if you do give OCR a heads up and you will be covered, or at the very least know what to expect. With that said, if you do go that route, you have to be okay with following their advice, even if it means turning down your IB offer. If they tell you that you have to turn it down and you end up doing the opposite, it'll be worse than if you never told them in the first place.
This. Forget what everyone else is saying. You are young, you don't want to burn bridges this early, it will hurt you going forward. And yes people get banned from OCR, my school and many others are now instituting strict policies to curb this kind of behavior. One of my friends actually had a situation with KPMG, he was trying to work in IBD. He got an offer from KPMG, he accepted because he was desperate, and then a few weeks later, he got an IBD intern offer from a BB. Turns out the BB only took a handful of the interns for FT and he wasn't one of them. When FT recruiting came around senior year, he applied around, KPMG recruiters told PwC, Deloitte, and EY recruiters that this kid bailed. He didn't get passed 1st round.
I have to say I have never heard of anyone being banned from ocr, although I am sure it happens, or having a recruiter blast a candidate to the firm they reneged for (I would recommend not telling the firm where you are planning on going).
Since you have not signed anything I think it is best not to tell your ocr center about your decision; that way you can always tailor your response after the fact, and may even avoid having them know all together.
If OP goes to a large school, I doubt that the OC recruiters will go after him post renege. This happens too frequently not to mention kids quitting in april/may with a boutique offer, quitting during the middle of the internship, etc.
I think you may be right, but he didnt get the interview/job through ocr. Shouldn't that mean they have no authority or business in what he chooses to do? I can understand if ocr was used to make the relationship but that does not seem to be the case here.
no sign. no promise. take the MM offer
These general rules go for all grads regardless of what they are doing or want to be doing.
If a better offer comes along do not hesitate to renege on one that you accepted simply for the sake of taking a job. You are far better off pissing off 1 HR manager and one campus career center employee than wasting an opportunity doing something you want to do over your commitment to a verbal agreement. Chances are said HR or career services worker will not be employed in the same place in 2-3 year time at the latest and at the very least you will not even be remembered three months from when you renege or some other arbitrary time period like that. I wouldn't re-apply if things don't work out, but definitely don't think twice about a verbal agreement. You know what you want to do, and you need to make a slight change to get there. Make the necessary changes and get it over with.
If/when times get tough, anywhere from IBs to F500 companies will renege on you without even batting an eyelash. I really can't emphasize this enough as they are making business decisions and you need to do the same thing. If someone takes it personally, that is their problem, not yours, and you need to treat it with that type of attitude. One of the big, brand name investment banks didn't extend any offers as part of their summer program last year and did it with one single announcement while the interns were still working! As Eric Cartman would say, Holy shit balls man, holy shit balls. You are just a number (your salary) to these people when it comes time to hire someone, and if the marginal benefit really isn't there and business is falling, they won't care how many offers you turned down to get there, regardless of prestige.
That should sum up the two biggest reasons why reneging is not that big of a deal.
Well, after being a nervous wreck thinking about this decision, I decided to go ahead with it. I pretty much did it on the basis of what TedWahlberg and Cash4Gold mentioned. I could not pass up an offer that I know I would regret not taking, just for company that would, if they cared to, renege on my offer without hesitation. I dont know if they will contact my ocr but they have not done so already so that is good news so far. I think the hr guy was a little taken back when I told him I had another offer I needed to accept, but ultimately, I apologized and he wished me luck.
After this experience. all I have to say is that the choice is absolutely individual, and definitely has some risks. However, do what your gut tells you and no matter what, you will feel so much better knowing that you won't have any regrets. Seriously, a great feeling of relief came over me when I hung up the phone.
To the OP - if there is no evidence of you having accepted an offer (at the very least an email trail), there is no issue. They can not prove you have accepted, hence OCR can not ban you without reason.
It's more on the moral side - you've given a promise to a person and now don't stand by your word. Provided that you called the company and apologized, moral damages were partially rectified, as well. Right decision from your end.
We never actually exchanged any emails, and not only did they not list the position on ocr, but I never applied to the company through ocr either. I think I am safe. Has anybody ever been banned from ocr before, if so how long did it take from the renege for your university to contact you?
I wouldn't give your OCR a heads up. It's better to act first and ask permission later kind of situation. Like someone said, there is a possibility you get someone who misinterprets the situation and then tells you that you have to take your initial offer and then you are stuck even worse. You've left the f500 more than enough time to find another intern.
Seriously man this is an easy decision. Verbal acceptance is complete bullshit, no agreement was ever signed and there are no records. Second of all you lined this job up outside of OCR so the school won't even find out in most cases. I highly doubt that someone in HR will even bother calling up your school and letting them know. If for some reason you find the 1% case where you get a vindictive HR rep at a large F500 you can always tell your school that said "I think I am going to accept/I am thinking about accepting" and that there was a misunderstanding. Lastly all of these contracts are "at will" anyways which means the contract can be terminated by either party at any time for any reason so you are not even breaking any contract terms...but bottom line is you NEVER SIGNED ANYTHING.
Bottomline: stop being a pussy, take the MM offer and do not look back.
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