Sales Vs. Investment Banking

Hey guys, this is my first ever thread, so sorry if it could be in a more relevant forum or something.

I'm an A level student in the UK, so if you're American and reading this, I'm still at high school. I'm hoping to study Politics at the LSE, or perhaps Warwick. For a couple of months now, I've been torn between what I want to do in life.

I first started out wanting to be a sales broker at an investment bank because I liked what I read about it. It's all about selling and talking to clients, it's based around markets which interest me but also, it means I could have a good work-life balance. The pay isn't too shabby (but I still don't know how much they do earn, I was just under the impression they earned around about the same as investment bankers). The client entertainment aspect of it also attracted me. It meant I could have a great time, going out to the best clubs and what not.

However, I really like the idea of being an investment banker also. The skills you get from sales are probably not too great and transferable like the skills you get in IB. Some of the work in IB also interests me, I like the idea of working with big businesses working on deals. I know I'm thinking wayyyy too ahead here, but I know I'd want to move over to the buyside after a while ad perhaps being in IB could make this possible. I'm somewhat sceptical about the hours I'd have to put in and the pay is not justifiable for being a zombie in my opinion.

What can you say about these two roles and your general opinions on them both? Your truthful opinions would be greatly appreciated :)

 

A minute ago you had graduated LSE and were working at CS in M&A, what's up with that?

"After you work on Wall Street it’s a choice, would you rather work at McDonalds or on the sell-side? I would choose McDonalds over the sell-side.” - David Tepper
 
Alimbo:
Haha I was just living the dream for a bit ;)

Yea, you're a douche.

Use the search bar.

"After you work on Wall Street it’s a choice, would you rather work at McDonalds or on the sell-side? I would choose McDonalds over the sell-side.” - David Tepper
 
Best Response

It's never too early to start thinking about this! Firstly if you are pretty sure you want to go into sales or IB i think about doing a degree more orientated towards that path. Economics, finance etc are much much attractive degrees in these jobs. I'd also look into applying to a bank that offers schemes for A level students. I know JPMorgan does this in London ( I am British). This will put you well ahead of the game and simultaneously the exposure will help you make your decision as to whether you prefer sales or IB.

As regards your specific question. Sales you are correct allows a much better lifestyle. - weekends off, market hours. It is very client based and requires solid knowledge of markets. Pay is good and is relative to how many clients you have. With sales your exit opportunities are much more limited, you may be pigeonholed into as sales guy/broker for your career. It would be very hard to break into other prestigious finance jobs.

IB has much longer hours, especially as a graduate (could be 18 hour average working day) and you will typically get 2 days off per month. Additionally in IB there will be a lot of excel work. You will not see the glitz or working with clients for a while. It however, more prestigious and has much better exit opportunities for the future - Private equity, hedge funds, as you learn many transferable skills and it is I bankers are generally seen as some of the smartest guys in the industry. Pay of course if very good.

Check out these two books, I've linked you to free downloads:

http://www.ebook3000.com/Vault-Career-Guide-to-Sales---Trading_21831.ht…

http://ebookbrowse.com/vault-career-guide-to-investment-banking-2007-pd…

NB - I'm 2nd year uni student with offer to working in Sales & Trading who has done of research

 

Cheers for the reply mate, I appreciate it a lot :)

See, I would probably have tried to study something more relevant at uni, but with my lack of Maths A level, it's pretty hard getting onto anything worth it. I've got quite a bit of work experience lined up for this summer actually: the JPMorgan one that you mentioned, Morgan Stanley do one too, McKinsey & Co's leadership course, a week with my dad's insurance company and a week in an MP's office. So, when I start applying for internships, hopefully they could overlook my degree subject and see that I have been interested in working in finance for a while.

Yeah, hopefully after all the experience I'd be in a better position to make a decision. If you don't mind answering, what made you want to do S&T over IB, or anything else for that matter?

Thanks for the links, I've given you a silver banana :)

 

Wow, thats a great start! The reason I'm leaning towards the S&T route is mostly lifestyle and that I'm a markets man. IB is brutal, the hours are treacherous .

As rearguards the course there a few finance and accounting course that don't require maths A level. You should look into it. As long as you are comfortable with maths. If not just go for a top, prestigious school that will still get your foot in the door especially with all your finance experience you will have.

 
IMFUTURE:
Wow, thats a great start! The reason I'm leaning towards the S&T route is mostly lifestyle and that I'm a markets man. IB is brutal, the hours are treacherous .

As rearguards the course there a few finance and accounting course that don't require maths A level. You should look into it. As long as you are comfortable with maths. If not just go for a top, prestigious school that will still get your foot in the door especially with all your finance experience you will have.

Fair enough, I don't know how I'd be dealing with like 18 hours days to be honest :')

Oh, I might have to look into that. It's just I understand how the banks all find the institution the most important thing rather than the degree, so I thought going for an A&F degree with no maths a level would probably limit me to only a few, lower ranking unis.

 

Your post is very unclear. When you say sales, are you referring to S&T and are you referring to IBD when you say 'Investment Banking'. Your big worry is your subject. A Politics degree from anywhere other then LSE or Warwick at a stretch, and a FO office position in London is unlikely considering that you don't have A-Level Maths. So it's pretty much LSE or bust. The general consenus is the lower down the league table, you go, the more relevant your degree must be in order to stand a fighting chance. Why not Law? Politics seems like a rather wishy-washy degree.Despite Law, not being quantitative, it still has links with many aspects of IB, and my BB class intake had its fair share of Law grads, albeit from the Top UK schools. Without a quantitative degree or A-Level Maths, I wouldn't bank on setting foot on the trading floor anytime soon, especially if you don't make it into LSE or Warwick. Why not apply for Cambridge's PPS course, you'd be able to specialise in Politics if desired from the first year onwards. The issue is that with a Politics degree you will struggle to convince recruiters that you're in banking for the right reasons, unless you're actively involved in finance societies at university..

You seem to have a very naive outlook towards banking. Most bankers accept that the job becomes your life, so your idea of having a good work -life balance is strange, simply because you will not have a social life in comparison to your peers. Some of my friends are clocking off at 5pm, while I'm not even contemplating that at that time. Bankers work hard and play hard. If the hours worry you, quit the chase now. One thing bankers don't worry about is the hours, staying ahead of the competition is the biggest worry. As an analyst you're in for two years of doing 'grunt' work, so the idea of working of with 'big businessess' is utopian. You'd be about 5 years away from living the lifestyle you want upon entry as an analyst. As an Analyst you see very little of the action.

Focus on getting into a target university, nailing the numerical and verbal reasoning tests, getting a few spring weeks and doing your best to convert that into a summer internship offer.

 
SpawnofDescartes:
Your post is very unclear. When you say sales, are you referring to S&T and are you referring to IBD when you say 'Investment Banking'. Your big worry is your subject. A Politics degree from anywhere other then LSE or Warwick at a stretch, and a FO office position in London is unlikely considering that you don't have A-Level Maths. So it's pretty much LSE or bust. The general consenus is the lower down the league table, you go, the more relevant your degree must be in order to stand a fighting chance. Why not Law? Politics seems like a rather wishy-washy degree.Despite Law, not being quantitative, it still has links with many aspects of IB, and my BB class intake had its fair share of Law grads, albeit from the Top UK schools. Without a quantitative degree or A-Level Maths, I wouldn't bank on setting foot on the trading floor anytime soon, especially if you don't make it into LSE or Warwick. Why not apply for Cambridge's PPS course, you'd be able to specialise in Politics if desired from the first year onwards. The issue is that with a Politics degree you will struggle to convince recruiters that you're in banking for the right reasons, unless you're actively involved in finance societies at university..

You seem to have a very naive outlook towards banking. Most bankers accept that the job becomes your life, so your idea of having a good work -life balance is strange, simply because you will not have a social life in comparison to your peers. Some of my friends are clocking off at 5pm, while I'm not even contemplating that at that time. Bankers work hard and play hard. If the hours worry you, quit the chase now. One thing bankers don't worry about is the hours, staying ahead of the competition is the biggest worry. As an analyst you're in for two years of doing 'grunt' work, so the idea of working of with 'big businessess' is utopian. You'd be about 5 years away from living the lifestyle you want upon entry as an analyst. As an Analyst you see very little of the action.

Focus on getting into a target university, nailing the numerical and verbal reasoning tests, getting a few spring weeks and doing your best to convert that into a summer internship offer.

Thanks for your reply :) Yup, I'm referring to Sales in S&T against Investment banking as in IBD. Well, since last night, I've been doing some research about any possible degrees to do with Finance that I could get in and if they are at well regarded unis, and I found a couple I could possibly do. I found Business Finance at Durham and Finance, Accounting and Management at Nottingham. What do you think about these unis? They don't necessarily want Maths A level so I could get in to these courses.

No I am aware that it does become your life. I know a girl who's brothers work as IBers at Deutsche and BAML, and she always tells me to never go into IB, mainly because she never gets to see them as they're always at work, and even when she does see them, they're glued to their Blackerrys checking emails and what not. I want to perhaps work at an IB until it's time to do an MBA then after move in to a PE firm or something like that.

 

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