Comments (86)

Jan 13, 2013

Could you please help me with this? : http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/top-domestic...

Thank you!

Jan 13, 2013

How did you get your next (you mentioned summer) job ? My guess it's that same old story again, you drop your pants and show Harvard/Yale/Wharton and everyone starts jaw-dropping and gasping for dear air.

Jan 13, 2013

PE or HF? May help direction of questions.

Jan 13, 2013

How are analysts picked to interview undergrads? If you have never interviewed an undergrad before, what are the chances you will interview one this year? Will they let you know beforehand or is there any list of people who are "qualified" to interview? How is this in Asset Management if you know?

Jan 13, 2013

@anavoisp - I dont know enough about those places to give an informed answer.

@financier - Getting the interviews was that easy, but the interviews themselves were not easy. Credentials can only get you so far. Funds will grill you no matter who you are. If you dont know your shit, you wont get passed the first or second round (for hedge funds, generally the first round is with HR).

@GED - HF, but I dabbled in the MM PE process too

@Prangs - generally, analysts dont interview at my firm. Its associate or above. Analysts do the resume screening and coffee chats type stuff.

Keep em coming...

Jan 13, 2013

What do you view as the most important aspects of preparation for obtaining and performing in SA and 1st year FT interviews? (i.e. technicals, developing/polishing your story, GPA, prior WE, etc.) Thanks a lot. This is really helpful.

Jan 13, 2013

HF megafund, or small? and what kind of strategy does your future firm use?

Jan 14, 2013

@TGI - All things you mentioned play a part in getting the offer. For example, when looking through 300+ resumes when I have other things to do or plans that night, each resume will get 10-30 seconds at most. Luckily, there are enough 3.8+ with top internship resumes that it's not hard. After that, there could be coffee chats - if your story sucks or you don't seem to know anything about finance/banking you won't get to the actual interviews. At the interviews, if you can't answer the technicals you prob won't make it to the super day. Essentially, with so many kids from top schools applying, the top banks can have their cake and eat it too.

It's $3bn+ with an emphasis on value.

    • 1
Jan 17, 2013

[quote=bigbadanalyst]

Jan 14, 2013

I'm in my final year of school at a miserable little institution with no name recognition at all. I've networked as much as I can and believe I've exhausted all reliable/helpful sources. I have decent GPA and experience (3.5 and three internships, one at a boutique IB) and have applied to around 200 different jobs. Haven't had any real opportunities and haven't even had an interview yet.

Long story short, extremely discouraged and very annoyed because I feel like while I may not be getting offers left and right, I expected to at least have some interview invites. What would be my best option going into the spring of my final semester? I've been trying to look into smaller boutiques and specialty advisory firms, however just feel like I've applied for all possible positions available at the moment.

Any advice would be great, thanks.

Jan 15, 2013
streetwannabe:

I'm in my final year of school at a miserable little institution with no name recognition at all. I've networked as much as I can and believe I've exhausted all reliable/helpful sources. I have decent GPA and experience (3.5 and three internships, one at a boutique IB) and have applied to around 200 different jobs. Haven't had any real opportunities and haven't even had an interview yet.

Long story short, extremely discouraged and very annoyed because I feel like while I may not be getting offers left and right, I expected to at least have some interview invites. What would be my best option going into the spring of my final semester? I've been trying to look into smaller boutiques and specialty advisory firms, however just feel like I've applied for all possible positions available at the moment.

Any advice would be great, thanks.

I know its not my thread, but don't stick to only known sources like alumni. Reach out to random people who share a common thing with you (prep school background, sports, location grown up, rival school). I had great success reaching out to RANDOM people on Linkedin who were only second level connections.

Jan 15, 2013

Yes, I agree. Casting a wide net in every way possible is key. It doesn't matter how you get the job - just get the fucking job. This should be all you do and think about till you get one. Not an ideal senior year, I know, but then again, you probably wouldn't be a fit for banking if you are not driven.

Also, don't think I am just spouting some inspirational bullshit. I thoroughly earned my seat at my firm. I cannot tell you how many times I've been rejected (was even rejected by the firm I am at now). It's fucking hard. Many analysts have daddies in the business or who are clients, so if you don't, expect to work your ass off and sacrifice a lot to break in.

yeahright:
streetwannabe:

I'm in my final year of school at a miserable little institution with no name recognition at all. I've networked as much as I can and believe I've exhausted all reliable/helpful sources. I have decent GPA and experience (3.5 and three internships, one at a boutique IB) and have applied to around 200 different jobs. Haven't had any real opportunities and haven't even had an interview yet.

Long story short, extremely discouraged and very annoyed because I feel like while I may not be getting offers left and right, I expected to at least have some interview invites. What would be my best option going into the spring of my final semester? I've been trying to look into smaller boutiques and specialty advisory firms, however just feel like I've applied for all possible positions available at the moment.

Any advice would be great, thanks.

I know its not my thread, but don't stick to only known sources like alumni. Reach out to random people who share a common thing with you (prep school background, sports, location grown up, rival school). I had great success reaching out to RANDOM people on Linkedin who were only second level connections.

Best Response
Jan 14, 2013

@street - I know the spot you are in is a frustrating one. Your best bet would be to cast a wider net. I know it may be ibanking or bust, but you really don't want to be in the position of not having anything come May. You have to understand that there are SO many qualified applicants that getting the interview is an accomplishment in itself. Also, you mentioned having worked at a boutique - why not go back there or at the very least leverage your contacts at the firm - it's a small world and they probably have buddies at other firms. Best of luck!

    • 2
Jan 15, 2013

How did you decide between HF and PE? Which group are you in at your bank and how did you pick it? How different are the exit opps between various groups within your bank?

Thank you.

Jan 15, 2013

Like many people on this site, I had dreams of 2 years GS/MS, 2 years KKR/BX....honestly, banking is boring and mind numbing. I spoke to many people at PE firms and although they said it was in some ways better than banking (better hours when not on deals, much better pay and perks, somewhat less bullshit) it is inherently the same shit as banking. I didn't want to spend two more years of my life wishing it away. I found the HF path to be more exciting. I love following the markets and investing and can honestly say will enjoy my next job, sure it will inherently be more stressful (losing money vs fucking up the font or something stupid in a pitch book), but for me, it will be much more satisfying.

As for my group, it is a top group at GS/MS, I won't say which as I would like to remain anonymous. I chose it because I liked the analysts I met and the placement was really "sick". From what I have seen, just about every group has placed well. If I had to do it all over again, I would've gone for an elite boutique.

D1 finance:

How did you decide between HF and PE? Which group are you in at your bank and how did you pick it? How different are the exit opps between various groups within your bank?

Thank you.

Jan 17, 2013
bigbadanalyst:

If I had to do it all over again, I would've gone for an elite boutique.

Can you elaborate on why you would've chosen an elite boutique over GS/MS?

Jan 15, 2013

What tips do you have for an incoming first year analyst in NYC in terms of spending/saving money? How much money did you save the first year and how much do you think is a good target to save? Is "spend your salary save your bonus" a good rule? What's worth splurging on and what's best to go cheap on as an analyst (i.e. worth it to splurge on clothes, appt, nights out, etc)?

Jan 15, 2013

Well, I don't know you, so I can't say what's best for you. All in I am expecting to come away with $50-70k saved up. I probably could have saved more but blew a lot on nights out and vacations.

I don't think spending everything from your salary is a good rule. You can get fucked on your bonus and have less than you expected.

As for what to spend money on that's up to you. As an analyst, you will barely use your apartment. The best thing to do is split it with a bunch of friends - you save money and you have people to chill with if you ever get home at a normal hour. I think spending money on clothes as an analyst is a waste - you will get the wrong kind of attention, plus you'll be in the clothes for ungodly hours which will cause wear and tear, so why fuck up your expensive suit when the only people that will see you in it are your banking coworkers who cares about impressing those fucks.

I do say spending on going out / vacations as youll have very little free time to enjoy life might as well make the best of it. For now, enjoy college and dollar beers

Raptor.45:

What tips do you have for an incoming first year analyst in NYC in terms of spending/saving money? How much money did you save the first year and how much do you think is a good target to save? Is "spend your salary save your bonus" a good rule? What's worth splurging on and what's best to go cheap on as an analyst (i.e. worth it to splurge on clothes, appt, nights out, etc)?

Jan 16, 2013

I'm currently a first year in S&T (trading) at a top BB, and I've been here since basically 2012 summer when the analyst program started. I had an idealized/naive view of S&T going in, and now i realize that i absolutely hate my desk/nature of the work, and have strongly been considering moving to IBD. Most S&T desks that do somewhat interesting work are going to be shut down/downsized in my bank due to Basel etc, and I am almost 99% sure IBD will be a better fit for me.

I was just wondering whether lateraling into IBD after my first year (I am more than willing to restart as a first year analyst) is realistic, and whether you have seen people enter the IBD analyst program by lateraling from somewhere else, especially from non-IBD, front office roles like research, trading etc

Whom do I talk to within the firm to try transferring out after my first year? I'm afraid to ask anyone in HR because they might not like me ditching my group after only 1 year in, and all the other senior people i know are within S&T, not IBD. Any pointers you may have for me would be great. Thanks, and sorry for the rant above!

Jan 16, 2013

Well the first thing to do is come up with a good reason as to why not trading and why banking instead. That will be pretty critical and asked in every chat/interview you have.

Haven't seen many laterals to be honest. Lots of kids leaving early for different reasons, but no one replacing them. If the deal environment gets hot, that could change things.

Your best bet is to speak to HR. if you have a compelling argument and have had good performance, I cannot fathom why HR wouldn't want to move you internally if the bankers like you as well. The argument has to be that you love the firm but you want to do banking for so and so reasons and want to stay at the firm.

Another good thing would be to reach out to junior people you met in training on the banking side and seeing if they can help.

It's funny though. I often wished I did trading instead of banking. Grass is always greener my friend.

quag_mire:

I'm currently a first year in S&T (trading) at a top BB, and I've been here since basically 2012 summer when the analyst program started. I had an idealized/naive view of S&T going in, and now i realize that i absolutely hate my desk/nature of the work, and have strongly been considering moving to IBD. Most S&T desks that do somewhat interesting work are going to be shut down/downsized in my bank due to Basel etc, and I am almost 99% sure IBD will be a better fit for me.

I was just wondering whether lateraling into IBD after my first year (I am more than willing to restart as a first year analyst) is realistic, and whether you have seen people enter the IBD analyst program by lateraling from somewhere else, especially from non-IBD, front office roles like research, trading etc

Whom do I talk to within the firm to try transferring out after my first year? I'm afraid to ask anyone in HR because they might not like me ditching my group after only 1 year in, and all the other senior people i know are within S&T, not IBD. Any pointers you may have for me would be great. Thanks, and sorry for the rant above!

Jan 16, 2013

Thanks for the great replies so far. I was curious, since you mentioned you are working at a top BB group, about how often people were able to lateral into your group or similarly strong groups. If there are a good number of laterals, are they typically from within the bank, or from other well known banks?

Do laterals face a different or tougher recruiting schedule for hedge funds and PE shops? Thanks.

Jan 16, 2013

I honestly have only come across one lateral analyst at my bank. It could just be my bank, so can't really speak about others. I would imagine it's more to do with the hiring and deal environment today. This could be a different story in a year or two if things change.

doriolisdog:

Thanks for the great replies so far. I was curious, since you mentioned you are working at a top BB group, about how often people were able to lateral into your group or similarly strong groups. If there are a good number of laterals, are they typically from within the bank, or from other well known banks?

Do laterals face a different or tougher recruiting schedule for hedge funds and PE shops? Thanks.

Jan 16, 2013

I had a phone call today with a 3rd yr analyst at a BB that I thought was going to be just networking/an informational interview where I could ask questions. 5 minutes in I am being asked about my background, then job experience, and then a number of technicals. It was by no means planned to be an interview, but my responses were not as polished as I'd hoped because I was basically shell-shocked. There was no lead in saying that he'd ask me some sample questions for experience or anything.

I guess I just don't know what to think about it. Could this have been an interview for an interview? Is this a common thing to do?

"Money is a scoreboard where you can rank how you're doing against other people."
-Mark Cuban

Jan 16, 2013

Everything is an interview. No one is really wasting their time getting to know you for fun. This isn't match.com. Any communication like emails, networking sessions, phone calls, and coffee are interviews. Don't make that mistake again. You don't get many chances like that.

ltdsting26:

I had a phone call today with a 3rd yr analyst at a BB that I thought was going to be just networking/an informational interview where I could ask questions. 5 minutes in I am being asked about my background, then job experience, and then a number of technicals. It was by no means planned to be an interview, but my responses were not as polished as I'd hoped because I was basically shell-shocked. There was no lead in saying that he'd ask me some sample questions for experience or anything.

I guess I just don't know what to think about it. Could this have been an interview for an interview? Is this a common thing to do?

    • 1
Jan 16, 2013

How does a non-target student turn a first round phone interview into a second round or superday?

Jan 17, 2013

It's an uphill battle for sure. Phone interviews make it harder to connect to the interviewer than in person. You want to sound friendly and confident. Above all else, you want to have perfect answers. Like the poster above expect technicals (which you should nail 100%)

Prangs:

How does a non-target student turn a first round phone interview into a second round or superday?

Jan 17, 2013

How would you make your interviewers like you during an interview? I was told it is more important than nailing some technical questions.

Jan 19, 2013

Yes, with anything in life likeability is very important. It is a hard question to answer as every interviewer is a different person who likes different things.

At the minimum, first impressions are key. Neatly dressed and groomed, confident posture, smile, eye contact and firm (hopefully not sweaty) handshake. Beyond that it's all about speaking confidently and with enthusiasm.

Ultimately, your interviewer is asking himself do I see myself spending 100 hours a week with this monkey. Of course having similar interests or backgrounds would help, but if you sound like a cool guy who is excited about banking, that should be enough in that department.

henryxub:

How would you make your interviewers like you during an interview? I was told it is more important than nailing some technical questions.

    • 1
Jan 21, 2013

Which elite boutiques, specifically, would you rather have worked for? Are analysts at these firms recruited as hard as GS/MS analysts?

Jan 21, 2013

These thoughts are based on talking to my friends at these boutiques.

By far, Blackstone M&A and Restructuring (restructuring is the stronger group, but dont choose based on that - choose based on your interest). They placed better than any bank on the street this year and do so consistently every year. This year, they had kids get funds like Baupost, SAC and Och Ziff - havent heard of any other banks that placed that well. My friends there generally have better hours. The pay is also at the high end of the street (second years get 6 figure bonuses).

Have heard great things about Centerview as well. Great culture and people and pay is way above street, but for those looking to leave - this wouldnt be the best place to go.

Evercore / Greenhill have great cultures and place pretty well but their classes are bigger and there is a larger variance in people's experiences and exits.

D1 finance:

Which elite boutiques, specifically, would you rather have worked for? Are analysts at these firms recruited as hard as GS/MS analysts?

Jan 21, 2013

What are your thoughts on Lazard (Coverage Group) or Houlihan Restructuring?

bigbadanalyst:

These thoughts are based on talking to my friends at these boutiques.

By far, Blackstone M&A and Restructuring (restructuring is the stronger group, but dont choose based on that - choose based on your interest). They placed better than any bank on the street this year and do so consistently every year. This year, they had kids get funds like Baupost, SAC and Och Ziff - havent heard of any other banks that placed that well. My friends there generally have better hours. The pay is also at the high end of the street (second years get 6 figure bonuses).

Have heard great things about Centerview as well. Great culture and people and pay is way above street, but for those looking to leave - this wouldnt be the best place to go.

Evercore / Greenhill have great cultures and place pretty well but their classes are bigger and there is a larger variance in people's experiences and exits.

D1 finance:

Which elite boutiques, specifically, would you rather have worked for? Are analysts at these firms recruited as hard as GS/MS analysts?

Jan 21, 2013

Is there a good way to ask for referrals from people you barely know? So you cold emailed an analyst and talked with him on the phone, then you met up with him for lunch a few months later. Is there a way you could ever meet a VP or MD of his group?

Jan 21, 2013

If it was me, I would just be straight up. Tell him you enjoyed lunch and would love to be able to meet with others in his group. If he liked you, he wouldnt mind passing your resume to others.

orangebull:

Is there a good way to ask for referrals from people you barely know? So you cold emailed an analyst and talked with him on the phone, then you met up with him for lunch a few months later. Is there a way you could ever meet a VP or MD of his group?

Jan 21, 2013

Couple of recruiting questions from an incoming 1st year at GS/MS:

Do you have to decide PE/HF out of the gate, or can you recruit for both (definitely leaning towards HF, but don't want to rule out PE before day 1)?

What's the timeline for when HF's and headhunters reach out and start recruiting?

Any skills I should pick up, book to read, or any other recommendations to best prepare for the HF recruiting scene?

Thanks a lot.

Jan 21, 2013

I was able to do both processes, but I wasnt really serious about PE. You definitely want to figure it out as soon as you can. On the hedge fund side most of the headhunters want people that have the "hedge fund or bust" mentality.

I was getting calls from random headhunters 1 week into the job - no joke. The more legit hedge fund headhunters and other legit headhunters reached out in October/November - so you have some time.

Realize that the interviews for PE and HF will be very different, so preparation will be different. On the hedge fund side you want to be following the markets and have a few stock pitches down to a tea (you will be grilled on them). Beyond that, the hedge fund process is really different between funds and interviewers - you can get brainteasers, econ questions, valuation questions, fit questions and so on. Some will have a modeling exam - will generally be an operating model / dcf type model.

Tons of book threads on this site - read as much as you can. Your learning in banking will plateau at some point.

westsider:

Couple of recruiting questions from an incoming 1st year at GS/MS:

Do you have to decide PE/HF out of the gate, or can you recruit for both (definitely leaning towards HF, but don't want to rule out PE before day 1)?

What's the timeline for when HF's and headhunters reach out and start recruiting?

Any skills I should pick up, book to read, or any other recommendations to best prepare for the HF recruiting scene?

Thanks a lot.

Jan 21, 2013

How has work changed from your 1st year as an analyst to now?

Jan 21, 2013

It has generally been better. You know your way around shit and can do things much more efficiently. You get the chance to work on more live situations if you want but that also equates to more hours. Ultimately, as a second year, I am not afraid to push back on deadlines that are retarded and have been able to enjoy much more time out of the office. I suspect the next 6 months will keep getting better and better as I become more and more checked out.

tangent style:

How has work changed from your 1st year as an analyst to now?

Jan 21, 2013

[Maybe has been asked before, so ignore if you want to]

What's the work split between modelling and valuing companies versus drafting documents like CIMs and editing PowerPoints?

Jan 22, 2013

It's really hard to say I have had periods where all I was doing was modeling and periods were all I was doing was PowerPoint shit. Either way the modeling plays just a part in the job you have many other responsibilities.

tangent style:

[Maybe has been asked before, so ignore if you want to]

What's the work split between modelling and valuing companies versus drafting documents like CIMs and editing PowerPoints?

Jan 22, 2013

just wanted to say, as an incoming first year, this info you're sharing is super valuable and helpful. thanks a lot. i'd give another SB but im out!

Jan 22, 2013

Will M&A advisory internship in summer after sophomore year at companies like Deloitte be transferable to BB IBD opportunities for summer after junior year, or should I consider regional PE or IB opportunities? I am only in my freshman year now, and am doing PWM at Morgan Stanley, and am working on a second internship in regional PE or IB for the summer.

Achiever in college from freshman year: Rainmaker.
Hustler in college from junior year: More than you initially hoped for.
Dreamer in college from senior year: Top closer for 4 man boutique in Idaho in toilet lid M&A
Everyone else: Dunkin Donuts.

Jan 22, 2013

Kids today are funny. You're already planning every internship? Why not shoot for doing front office work at a BB? You are doing PWM at MS. Why not leverage that to getting into other parts of the firm??

firestormllp:

Will M&A advisory internship in summer after sophomore year at companies like Deloitte be transferable to BB IBD opportunities for summer after junior year, or should I consider regional PE or IB opportunities? I am only in my freshman year now, and am doing PWM at Morgan Stanley, and am working on a second internship in regional PE or IB for the summer.

Jan 23, 2013
bigbadanalyst:

Kids today are funny. You're already planning every internship? Why not shoot for doing front office work at a BB? You are doing PWM at MS. Why not leverage that to getting into other parts of the firm??

firestormllp:

Will M&A advisory internship in summer after sophomore year at companies like Deloitte be transferable to BB IBD opportunities for summer after junior year, or should I consider regional PE or IB opportunities? I am only in my freshman year now, and am doing PWM at Morgan Stanley, and am working on a second internship in regional PE or IB for the summer.

Guess what I found out I'm not in PWM but just regular WM. I assumed that every office for MS is PWM if not something more. So yeah, definitely looking at regional PE/IB options. Very easy to crack since I'm from a place where deal flow takes place, old money, and few people interested in this field. Midwest life. So what thoughts on my original q? Thanks a lot dude.

Achiever in college from freshman year: Rainmaker.
Hustler in college from junior year: More than you initially hoped for.
Dreamer in college from senior year: Top closer for 4 man boutique in Idaho in toilet lid M&A
Everyone else: Dunkin Donuts.

Jan 22, 2013

What do you think is the longest time one can stall after getting an offer? Don't want to burn bridges at this bank but would like to have as long as possible to leverage the offer.

Thanks.

Jan 22, 2013

There should be a date on the offer letter or your OCR policy (which isn't always followed). If not, ask when they need to know by. If it's a tight deadline, try to accelerate your other processes and only do the ones that are meaningfully better. If that doesn't work, accept the offer and keep interviewing - just be careful. You will burn a bridge, but if your off to a better firm is that a bridge you ever want to cross again? Once you live in the penthouse, it's hard to go back to your pre-war shit walk up in the east village....

crawl_b4-bawl:

What do you think is the longest time one can stall after getting an offer? Don't want to burn bridges at this bank but would like to have as long as possible to leverage the offer.

Thanks.

Jan 22, 2013
bigbadanalyst:

There should be a date on the offer letter or your OCR policy (which isn't always followed). If not, ask when they need to know by. If it's a tight deadline, try to accelerate your other processes and only do the ones that are meaningfully better. If that doesn't work, accept the offer and keep interviewing - just be careful. You will burn a bridge, but if your off to a better firm is that a bridge you ever want to cross again? Once you live in the penthouse, it's hard to go back to your pre-war shit walk up in the east village....

crawl_b4-bawl:

What do you think is the longest time one can stall after getting an offer? Don't want to burn bridges at this bank but would like to have as long as possible to leverage the offer.

Thanks.

Thanks for the advice. Offer is for a good BB (MS/GS). I am speaking to a number of boutiques (LAZ/BX/Evercore/GH). Is it worth the risk to decline offer?

Jan 22, 2013
bigbadanalyst:

There should be a date on the offer letter or your OCR policy (which isn't always followed). If not, ask when they need to know by. If it's a tight deadline, try to accelerate your other processes and only do the ones that are meaningfully better. If that doesn't work, accept the offer and keep interviewing - just be careful. You will burn a bridge, but if your off to a better firm is that a bridge you ever want to cross again? Once you live in the penthouse, it's hard to go back to your pre-war shit walk up in the east village....

crawl_b4-bawl:

What do you think is the longest time one can stall after getting an offer? Don't want to burn bridges at this bank but would like to have as long as possible to leverage the offer.

Thanks.

Thanks for the advice. Offer is for a good BB (MS/GS). I am speaking to a number of boutiques (LAZ/BX/Evercore/GH). Is it worth the risk to decline the offer?

    • 1
Jan 22, 2013

Any big regrets from your analyst stint?
(Projects/work you wish you had been staffed on, skills you wish you had developed, opportunities you wish you had pursued)

Jan 22, 2013

My biggest regret is not leaving early. Some HFs will recruit for an immediate start. Although I am sure there are some benefits to going through the IB program in its entirety, I have found it to be a waste of time Sure, I still learn new things here and there, but none of it excites me or will be that applicable to the next job, so I feel that the past 6 months and the next 6 months will is a waste of time.

tangent style:

Any big regrets from your analyst stint?
(Projects/work you wish you had been staffed on, skills you wish you had developed, opportunities you wish you had pursued)

Jan 22, 2013

Why do a lot of people say that going HF early is becoming too specialized early on?

what are the options after HF, or lateral? lets say worst case scenario, one gets fired from HF, and then fired from say a 2nd HF or has a bad track record somehow. Where do you go from there?

Jan 22, 2013

Well there's just less optionality than the PE track. There's a thread going on now that describes that in further length.

And haha I don't know man. Haven't really thought beyond HF. I hope to spend the rest of my career in the HF world. I suppose there other less prestigious funds or going back to business school? How about focus on kicking ass than the idea of getting fired from two firms??

zeroblued:

Why do a lot of people say that going HF early is becoming too specialized early on?

what are the options after HF, or lateral? lets say worst case scenario, one gets fired from HF, and then fired from say a 2nd HF or has a bad track record somehow. Where do you go from there?

Jan 22, 2013

Have you worked for any associates who were straight from MBA programs and not IB analysts first? If yes how were they and any suggestions for somebody who will potentially be in that position in the future?

Jan 22, 2013

Yes, I have worked with both. Generally, the associates that were promoted as analysts are far better to work with. They not only have the technical ability, but they "get it". Dont be the douchebag that hits the floor and starts bossing around analysts so you can impress your superiors, especially by making them do mindless shit that wont add any real value. The analysts will get fed up pretty quickly, talk shit behind your back and push back on you when you need them most.

Try to cut out the bullshit with them, lend a hand with the work and be understanding. Generally, first year associates will be paired with second year analysts in the beginning. Realize the analyst has been doing the job far longer than you have, knows a lot more than you and is probably worn down and hates life. Working with an associate that is "nice" and understands how much the job sucks is generally pretty refreshing - at the end of the day, you and him just want to get out at a reasonable hour. Obviously, it is hard to balance having the analyst like you and impressing your superiors - I just gave you the analyst's perspective, cant give you more than that unfortunately.

mappleby:

Have you worked for any associates who were straight from MBA programs and not IB analysts first? If yes how were they and any suggestions for somebody who will potentially be in that position in the future?

Jan 22, 2013
bigbadanalyst:

Obviously, it is hard to balance having the analyst like you and impressing your superiors - I just gave you the analyst's perspective, cant give you more than that unfortunately.

Could you elaborate on this? Are senior bankers really impressed by an associate who is a dick to his analysts? Surely having analysts respect/like you and willing to work hard for you because of that would reflect well on both your management, leadership, and relationship skills.

Jan 22, 2013

hahaha alright. I was cautioned by several MD's actually from going into HF early, that's why I asked such a question. They said to stick it out, become an expert on an industry, and then specialize later on in career by going into some fund.

Jan 23, 2013

Hi - thanks for this!

Quick question - was wondering if you could talk about the MM PE interview process and what IB analysts should do in terms of preparing and what the interview actually is like at MM PE shops?

Jan 25, 2013

The process varies by fund. I would say be prepared to talk about yourself, your deals, your interest in PE, your interest in that specific fund, be able to speak about LBO, some funds asked paper LBO questions, general finance technical questions and investment ideas (I would keep your investment idea to a company that fits general LBO criteria). Some funds will have modeling tests, be comfortable building them from scratch - would practice doing a few with different assumptions and what not.

coldfire:

Hi - thanks for this!

Quick question - was wondering if you could talk about the MM PE interview process and what IB analysts should do in terms of preparing and what the interview actually is like at MM PE shops?

Jan 26, 2013

[quote=bigbadanalyst]The process varies by fund. I would say be prepared to talk about yourself, your deals, your interest in PE, your interest in that specific fund, be able to speak about LBO, some funds asked paper LBO questions, general finance technical questions and investment ideas (I would keep your investment idea to a company that fits general LBO criteria). Some funds will have modeling tests, be comfortable building them from scratch - would practice doing a few with different assumptions and what not.

Thanks for this! is there any guide you used or recommend for studying from, for PE interviews?

Jan 26, 2013

[quote=bigbadanalyst]The process varies by fund. I would say be prepared to talk about yourself, your deals, your interest in PE, your interest in that specific fund, be able to speak about LBO, some funds asked paper LBO questions, general finance technical questions and investment ideas (I would keep your investment idea to a company that fits general LBO criteria). Some funds will have modeling tests, be comfortable building them from scratch - would practice doing a few with different assumptions and what not.

Thanks for this! is there any guide you used or recommend for studying from, for PE interviews?

Jan 24, 2013

thanks for doing this. Congrats on the offer!

Can you tell us a funny story you can recall during your analyst stint? Funny or memorable (in a bad or good way). As an incoming analyst who spent a summer in IB, I realized that at the end of the day, the only thing you will remember are the hilarious moments!

Jan 24, 2013

I am currently an ER associate at an industry focused shop in the south. If I wanted to make the transition from ER to banking, how would you suggest that I concentrate my efforts? Have you seen many laterals from ER to IB at the analyst level? I would be looking to come in as a 2nd year analyst (I have 2 years of ER experience). I think the ER skillset is very similar to IB - and I dont understand why there would be a significant barrier to such a move. From what I have gathered it seems first year analyst experiences are always different, but some analysts dont touch models or meet with management/clients at all. I have formatted, edited presentations, etc until I was blue in the face, just like youre average banker, but I have also been involved in modeling and client/management meetings. And you may say that I don't have any transaction experience - but there have been 2 separate mergers within my coverage group and I have had to build proforma models post transaction announcement. I know this is all cover letter material for these said banking jobs, but I am just looking for a little guidance on how to sell my experience and get into banking at top/mid MM firm (im assuming due to the more structured nature of BB I wont stand much of a chance)

Jan 24, 2013

Very informative thanks - best of luck @ the new shop.

Jan 26, 2013

When trying to show you have a personality... what if you don't do whatever every other banker does i.e. marathon running, swimming, investing, reading or travelling. What if your a gym goer or enjoy creating online media or something different. Auto-dinge? (most people I see who get through have 'standard' hobbies which is why I'm asking).

Why do bankers look for someone who can play a musical instrument, is team captain of a sports team etc - what if your just a normal guy whose cool to be around but not 'top class' in everything he puts his hand on? He doesn't deserve to be in IBD?

Jan 26, 2013
Charles-perry:

When trying to show you have a personality... what if you don't do whatever every other banker does i.e. marathon running, swimming, investing, reading or travelling. What if your a gym goer or enjoy creating online media or something different. Auto-dinge? (most people I see who get through have 'standard' hobbies which is why I'm asking).

Why do bankers look for someone who can play a musical instrument, is team captain of a sports team etc - what if your just a normal guy whose cool to be around but not 'top class' in everything he puts his hand on? He doesn't deserve to be in IBD?

In interviews shared interests are always a plus but especially these days not all bankers are cookie cutter clones of each other. They have diverse interests too. What your interests are is not as important as showing you have a passion for them and can express that passion. They just want to make sure you're well rounded and not someone who is going to burn out in a few months. And for associate interviews being well rounded means you have a better chance of interacting well with clients and being able to move up.

Mar 5, 2013

Monkeys I am back and ready to answer more questions. I am sure all the first years are starting to panic as the headhunter meetings are in full swing. Bigbadanalyst is here to help....

Mar 5, 2013

not about PE/HF recruiting but had a quick question -

how often did someone from another part of the bank move into IBD during your stint? I'm talking guys from PWM, AM, S&T, etc. If it did not happen in your particular group, have you heard of this happening, and how accommodating was HR/senior management in getting an individual to move into the IB side?

Mar 5, 2013

Hey bigbadanalyst,

Thanks for doing this thread. Any tips on how incoming SAs can shine and win a return offer? Is there anything that you would recommend incoming SAs do over the next few months to prepare to kick ass over the summer?

Mar 5, 2013

Q: Which portfolio management systems are you currently using ?

Mar 7, 2013

Dont know what you mean by that?

Financier4Hire:

Q: Which portfolio management systems are you currently using ?

Mar 7, 2013

Hi bigbadanalyst,

Thanks again for continuing what was already a great thread.

How receptive were buyside alumni of your university to networking as an undergrad? Did that change once you had become an analyst and had some experience?

Thanks!

Mar 7, 2013

Been looking at profiles of associates at MFs, and everyone seems to come from MS/GS, not even top groups at other BBs. Any truth to this? IE, did your buddies in, hypothetically, BAML FSG struggle to get placed? Do we overrate groups and underrate the bank?

Oct 21, 2014

great info! thanks

Oct 21, 2014

Hey guys - I am back on the site. Have been out of banking and at my fund for over a year now. Lovi life! Happy to answer any questions....

Oct 21, 2014

You mentioned that you were in a value oriented fund. Doesn't it frustrate you that it generally takes a long time before you can see whether an investment is a good one? Furthermore, do you think that you are actually able to 'beat the market' consistently and create consistent value? I interned in a value oriented fund and it just seemed that most of the results were quite random and resulted from random events that couldn't have been accounted for.

Oct 21, 2014

how hard is interviewing for HFs? Does it take several rounds or is the process like banking interviews? Do you have to do modelling exercises as well?

How do you know which headhunters are the good ones for HF recruiting?

Oct 22, 2014

@Radiohedge - No not at all. I have already seen one of my investment thesis come to fruition - quicker than I expected, but it still happened. And I mean if I didn't believe that then I would be out of a job right? My fund has beat our benchmark consistently, so it does seem that it is more than just randomness at play.

@iamamonkeybanker - I mean generally HFs recruit people after they have gained some experience and are not looking to train someone with the basics (they are just too lean and don't have the time). The interviews will be harder and the process can be drawn out for many rounds over a couple months (but each fund is different). Some funds do have a modelling component - usually a 3 statement model / dcf.

Oct 22, 2014
Comment
Oct 22, 2014
Oct 22, 2014