Hi guys,
I know I posted a topic about lateraling before, but I was just wondering if any WSO member has successfully lateraled from one firm to another as an analyst. It would be preferable if it was right after the first year. I am specifically looking for someone who lateraled from an MM IB to an elite IB (whether it be a BB like GS, Barclays, etc., or a top-notch boutique like Lazard, Evercore, Greenhill, etc.). I also understand that it is likely you would lose a year, so you would go back to a first-year at your new place of employment.
If there is anyone out there who has lateraled and wouldn't mind answering a few questions, or if there is anyone who knows someone who has done something similar, please post some advice, PM me, whatever. Thanks a lot - I appreciate it.
Resurrect and bump!
will let you know in a week as i am waiting to hear back. maybe shoot me a pm around then.
Thanks.
I know of the following cases:
Someone from a BMO/Baird (Regional) to a William Blair/Jefferies level bank (HQ) Someone from a European BB in NY to a top boutique in NY Someone from a regional BB to a top boutique in NY
I also know of an associate that went from a MM shop to GS/MS
It's always possible, especially when groups needs to hire. I think they really care about your experience and your ability to come in without any need for training.
I would also add that I've seen analysts 6 months in at a MM interview for an open spot at a BB. They just didn't land the offer.
Damn, those are not encouraging so far:
BMO/Baird –> Blair is similar, Jefferies is a step up, but is not BB (yet!) or top boutique
European BB –> NYC boutique does not seem like a big stretch
WTF is a regional BB?
I know of:
BMO Toronto to Citi M&A UK BOAML Toronto to GS lev fin NYC
Similar to Foxhound's: not much of a stretch, that is, not a MM (RBC, BMO USA) to a BB.
Sorry, meant regional office of a bb
Oh, cool, so what would you recommend?
Say you are at a full service MM/mid cap full service bank (BMO, RBC – traditionally stronger than BMO – traditionally Jefferies – though they are quickly moving upstream) and you want to make the switch to BB a LAZ/EVR/GHL:
When is the best time to do this? After you first year? Second? Third?
What do you need to do?
How should you position yourself?
Will you be prejudged – probably yes – but more importantly, to what extent? That is if you have two candidates with equal experience, will the BB get it over the MM guy if they like the MM guy more, what about if they are equally liked?
Also, how do you manage the lateral process where you are working, without your group finding out?
Thanks – realize I just drilled you with questions
The best time is when those places have a need for analysts and are hiring - this happens seemingly at random
Once you find an open position, your best bet is probably to network - having an alum or friend in that bank, or just someone who you can ask a favor from is enough. Send them your resume, they'll get it into the right hands.
You position yourself as someone who knows what they are doing, can model, knows how to execute on a deal, and are willing to bust your chops to do a good job. The biggest thing is letting them know they can trust you right from the get go and that you won't require any hand holding.
I don't think you will necessarily be pre-judged - I would imagine your actual experience is crucial. I knew an analyst at a top group at GS who got moved to another division after 3 months when GS was trying to figure out what to do with their IBD kids. This person had no deal experience and barely worked on any models, therefore had a VERY difficult time getting back into banking anywhere. In fact, they ended up moving to Asset Management.
Managing the lateral process is the toughest thing - sometimes people lie and say they are sick, other people figure out how to do it on a weekend, while some others just say they have a buy-side interview in the regular cycle. Lying, of course, can get you in trouble and if your caught, you probably won't be in the best standing with your current employer.
I jumped from a no-name NYC boutique -> BB. Someone recently asked me about my experiences lateraling, so I'll copy/paste my answer here:
I'd recommend you reach out to school alumni and any other people you've encountered through networking, recruiting/interview processes, etc. Can also speak to friends you may have at other banks. Try to get a sense for what groups may be understaffed and are looking to add additional heads. I realize you're willing to give up a year, but as long as you've had decent experience thus far, they should allow you to maintain your status.
When interviewing, I think it's important to be open and honest about your experiences to-date. Don't claim to know more than you actually do, or they'll tear you apart. When asked why you have an interest in that industry, don't say "this is exactly what i've been wanting to do my whole life, bla bla bla." They'll see right through that (unless of course that's actually the case and you have talking points to back it up). What's important is that you detail your experieces over the past year, what you've learned, what you didn't learn, what you feel like you're missing...and tie that into how this new position will fill the void. Sure, it helps to have SOME interest in the industry, but no need to make up any BS.
Also make sure you know any deal that's listed on your resume inside and out. This is really where you can shine. It should be pretty easy to memorize (or better yet, fully understand) a bunch of stats, investment highlights, risks, etc..(taken directly from a lenders presentation, CIM, RAP, memo, OM, whatever..). Have a story for the transaction, what the company does, how/why the deal was initiated, your specific responsibilities and outcome. Cover these bases, and there won't be much room for them to grill you.
As for the technicals, I'm assuming you had to go through this process either as a junior (recruiting for a SA gig) or a senior (for FT) in college, so you should know the basics and some of the more advanced questions they may ask. if not, vault guides should help. if you think you need help with some of the more advanced technicals, the vault guide to PE interviews is actually really good (in my opinion).
In my opinion, it's most important to discuss your current transaction experience. Since you graduated college only a year ago, you're not expected to be an expert. If you can convey that you've "mastered" much of your current experience and that you're a fast learner, it shouldn't matter whether you have knowledge specifically relating to the industry and other aspects of the coverage area. I can only speak from experience, and this is exactly what I did.
Analyst Lateral (Originally Posted: 07/12/2010)
I recently started working at a boutique IB and after about 2 months here, I'm coming to realize that things aren't as rosy as it was pictured during interviewing, it turns out that a large portion of the team is on the way out, chances are everything will be fine, however, I want to have some other options open when I find out how the firm will look after these people leave... anyways, I wanted to know more about the lateral process
what time of year should I begin to send out my resume? when do banks actually hire lateral analysts (I have heard the summer is not a particularly good time of year for lateral hires) would less than 1 year of work experience be considered detrimental?
M&A activity seems to be picking up (or at least trying to) so if banks were in need of more analysts, would they fulfill that quota with college seniors? or is there a particular time (such as the winter) when they may decide to hire some what experienced analysts to fulfill immediate slots?
Any help, along with lateral stories, would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks.
bump
You should send out your resume as you see opportunities come online. If you are sending your resume to contacts, you can start sending them out either soon or wait until after labor day.
Right now, many banks will be focused on training their new analysts and getting everyone accustomed to the new team members, group flow, and so forth. In other words, with the new analysts just starting, there probably won't be a ton of opportunity out there, but there will definitely be some. As analysts quit, things continue to pick up and groups get new allocations, slots will open and you will see more postings and will want to be in touch with your contacts when that happens. This will start to happen as early as September, and then more so after the new year.
Check out this article on switching groups as well for a little more help on the process.
http://www.bankonbanking.com/2009/07/27/making-the-group-switch/
and
http://www.bankonbanking.com/2010/07/01/i-got-placed-in-my-bottom-choic…
Feel free to PM me if you have any other questions.
Lateraling as an Analyst? (Originally Posted: 02/07/2009)
Hi guys,
I was wondering if you could give me some advice. I am a senior at a small liberal arts college in New England. It's a bit below the Amherst-Williams grouping, but it's still a Tier I LA. Anyway, I was able to secure a FT IB Analyst position at a boutique in New York City. It is a decent boutique, but it's not an Evercore or Lazard-type shop. My school is basically a non-target (it gets the occasional FT recruit from alums), so all the interviews/offers I got were through my own networking. I was able to make a few good contacts at some of the top banks (GS, Barclays), but unfortunately, the interview they were able to get me was more of a "favor;" those banks did about zero hiring outside of their SA class.
It is my goal to get into a big-time bank. It has a bit to do with everything - prestige, deal size, dealflow, culture, etc. At my boutique, I will be a generalist, so I will get experience in M&A, DCM, and ECM - my main interest is M&A, though I cannot complain about the experience.
I was wondering if it is possible for an analyst to lateral? I'm guessing it is pretty rare, as most banks do the two-year commitment. However, I would have a solid resume (a year of banking experience, solid internships, varsity athlete in college, good ECs, and a 750 GMAT) and would even be willing to start at the big bank as a "1st year." I honestly would not mind starting over, as it is only a year and it would give me the opportunity to stand out over the other 1st years.
What do you guys think? Is this a possibility? And if it is, how would I go about getting the opportunity? Would I just reach out to my contacts and explain my situation and hope that one of them could do something for me?
Interesting situation. Your willingness to start over as a 1st year is very important as very few banks want to hire analysts for only a single year, even if they have prior experience.
What I would recommend is to start networking with the banks that interest you after you start. It is unlikely that they will put you through the standard recruiting cycle which takes place in the fall. I would advise that you use your network to try to secure a spot that opens up near the end of your 1st year or at the start of your 2nd year. Banks typically experience very mild attrition each summer as 1st year analysts drop out of the program or lateral to other banks. If the economy starts to pick up and banks feel they underhired, you could be a great filler for them.
Note: This is just one potential way to go about it, you could be successful taking many different approaches.
~~~~~~~~~~~ CompBanker
Thanks CB. That's exactly what I was thinking - if things pick up even a bit, banks will likely find they are very thin at the analyst level in this year's class and potentially next year's class, if recruiting stays at such a low level. My main question was how and when to go about speaking with people, and at the end of the summer sounds about right.
Out of curiosity, what about banks where I have no contacts? Is there a way I could go about contacting them?
Any other thoughts?
Lateraling as an analyst (Originally Posted: 02/23/2013)
Hey Guys,
If one was to join an industry focused boutique that's relatively well known in the industry how easy would it be to lateral to a top BB in that industry group? (I.E. MS tech, etc)
Thanks.
NOTE: This is FT not summer.
If you're at a well-known boutique, why would you want to lateral as an analyst? This usually entails falling back a year at your new bank and can be exceptionally tough.
I think he means well-known to the industry they cover, so not an elite boutique. Otherwise he probably wouldn't be asking.
I missed that initially, but my comment still stands: if you're at a well-known boutique in the industry, you should have no problems moving to a buy-side job. Although it's possible to move during your analyst stint, it's very uncommon and the job market is pretty spotty. Typically you're better off switching for your 3rd year so you can go direct promote at your new shop.
But is moving from a well known (but not elite) industry specific boutique to a top PE firm likely? I know anythings possible but would being at the boutique put one at a disadvantage?
Also how common is that third year lateral to a BB if someone wanted to stay a banker long term?
Depends on what you mean by "top PE firm". You sound like you're really restricting your options here: you either want to move to a "top BB" or a "top PE firm" when you're already at a respectable shop in the space in which you want to work. It's hard for me to discern how you really benefit from spending tons of time and effort trying to find an analyst lateral position that may or may not exist at a BB firm. Playing ping-pong with your career isn't going to move you forward.
You might not be landing at KKR out of your boutique shop, but what's so bad about moving to a MM PE shop and going from there? Most people would consider that a much better option than trying to become an analyst (again) at a BB bank. You want career advancement, not be spending your time and energy trying to change the brand at the top of your resume.
Bump
NorthSider thank you for the answers.
Looking for more perspectives
But it's the brand on the résumé that advances your career, right?
Not necessarily. It's your experience, poise and performance in interviews. Brand helps, but it's not worth derailing your career trajectory, unless you're making a huge move (i.e. unknown boutique shop to BB). If we're talking, say, energy boutiques, I wouldn't advise an analyst to jump ship from a well-known energy boutique like TPH or Scotia or Simmons to move to Barclays or Credit Suisse. Doesn't advance your chances at a great PE job meaningfully and opens up the potential for people to ask why you only stayed at your first shop for one year - are you only going to stay here until you find the "next big job"?
That makes sense but what about someone trying to jump from a RBC, WF, or JEF to a MS/GS/JPM for better general PE exit opps or even HF exit opps?
Still, I think trying to lateral as an analyst is taking a step in the wrong direction. Guys from JEF go to top PE shops all the time, and RBC and WF place into buyside jobs with consistency. I find it hard to believe that you'd be better off trying to transfer laterally as a first year analyst than spending your time advancing your career onto the buyside.
Thank you guys so much for the info. One last question: what if it's a regional office at JEF?
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