Target Schools for Chicago Banks?

I think your list covers it pretty well. If you're ranking them in order, I would put Michigan above Notre Dame.

Obviously, you can still place into Chicago from any of the top MBA programs. However, if you have the numbers for a top program, then you'll at least get into Michigan or Notre Dame (that is, if you're determined to stay in the Midwest for B-School).

Also, ask quantumm, I'm sure he'll be all-too-eager to help you out with any and all Chicago-related inquiries.

Thanks. I actually go to Notre Dame now and am surprised that it isn't on most lists for target schools in the second or third tier since it is a top 20 school and it has the number 1 undergrad business program(even though those rankings are skewed since so many ivies don't have undergrad business.)

The rankings are also reputedly skewed because they place emphasis on trivial things such as "student satisfaction", which really has no impact on a school being target or not.

I share in your misery though. My school (Villanova) is "Top 20" too, but nobody really views us as being target either.

target school is really just a editing technique from human resources and people in wall street justifying freezing the 4 best years of their life off from 18-22. Talk to anyone at a bank from a non target and theyll tell you its all bs and politics and if you work hard enough, make enough contacts, and know your stuff -- you will be bound to get a job

Were you referring to business schools or undergrads?

For undergrad recuirting, sometimes the Chicago offices pull from schools like Vanderbilt and Wake Forest. It all depends on where the senior bankers at the midwest offices went. I would put Michigan above ND as well.

Add Wash U in St. Louis too. Probably behind UChicago and NU though (I view it as UChicago > NU/WUSTL but proximity to Chicago will really help NU in this case). Michigan is great too but I don't know much about Ross and where it ranks in your list.

i take it your talking about mba. for mba in chicago market, i would rank as:

1. UChicago
2. Northwestern
3. Michigan
4. Notre Dame
5. WashU
6. Indiana
7. Purdue
8. UIUC
9. Wisconsin

obviously, there are lots of other top programs out there, but if you want to stay in the midwest for mba, i would attend one of those. however, i would avoid 6-9 on the list for an mba, not that they are bad schools, but you should aim for the best if you want "better" career prospects

For those of you putting Michigan over ND, are you taking into account alumni network? Perhaps it's a misconception of mine, but especially for IB, I get the feeling that an absurdly dedicated alumni network really makes a difference. I'm not sure how Michigan's is, but everything I've heard regarding ND's is that they're the kind of people that are extremely dedicated to the school and are extremely willing help fellow grads.

Take this with a grain of salt, as I'm just going on what I've heard, and I'm not from the midwest or anything. Just throwing it out there as something to think about.

How many people from ND are in IB to begin with? I really don't know. I have a lot of HS friends that just graduated from ND with finance and accounting degrees and they are heading towards various consulting and accounting jobs (PwC, KPMG, Deloitte, Accenture, etc.). Haven't heard any of them mention it for that matter, but I know a fair number of people from Michigan's Ross that are heading into IBD. That could be just my perception, but that is what I have seen. Ross seems to be the exception of state schools that place well into IBD (prob just barely under UChicago and maybe NW in terms of numbers off the top of my head for the midwest--prob much lower for trading/MBB/etc.) if you want to be somewhere in the midwest that isn't as expensive.

In regards to Meph's comment, yes ND probably has a solid alumni network, but Michigan seems to have more of a presence in terms of numbers. Obviously its bank specific but from working in Chicago thats what I've observed.

In regards to undergrads 1. UChicago/Northwestern (UChicago has a higher ranking and more quant heavy students, but they tend to send more to east coast than Northwestern, which reduces their presence in the midwest, and can be soft on the people skills relative to NU counterparts) 2. Michigan 3. Notre Dame 4. Indiana/UIUC 5.Vanderbilt 6.Purdue/Wisconsin

I don't know of any presence of WashU.

Purely based off of my observations

^Regarding WashU undergrad I know the deal is that around 15-20% of each business school class will head into IB each year. That's about 30-40 kids a year split almost evenly between Chicago and NYC. Not a huge number but still a good portion of each graduating class (small class sizes of only ~200 students). Chicago prop shops also seem to like their students. I'm not sure where that would put the school on the list above but I would think that has to be better than Vandy for Chicago at least. I always thought Vandy was strong in the South and a little in NYC but not so much anywhere else.

I have lived and worked in the MW all my life, I think this is a pretty accurate depiction of Chicago IB:

1. UChicago/Northwestern
2. Michigan
3. Notre Dame/Indiana/UIUC
4. Wisconsin
5. Wash U
6. Purdue

ND is a small school, so you don't run across as many Domers as you'd think. They have a presence at all of the big guys though (BB Chi Offices/Baird/Blair/Lincoln, etc.), and have a large small boutique presence as well.

IU and Illini send a shit ton of kids to Chicago, too, simply due to their size + fin/acc programs. Like ND, all firm sizes are represented.

Wisconsin: I feel like their kids are more split up between Chicago, Milwaukee, and Minneapolis.

Wash U: there's barely a presence in Chicago IB. It's probably due to student interest in the space, though, because it's a great school. You'll only come across a few if you look around. Perhaps they go to more quant-heavily roles, rather than Corp. Fin. Advisory.

Purdue: non-existent. Their engineering students go to consulting if they don't go into engineering, and their business school simply doesn't hold their own against Mendoza, Ross, Kelley, etc.

By presence, you mean 2-3 people (there are prob 4-5 schools where I work that have 5+ people--UChicago/Harvard/MIT/Princeton/UI, which is why I ask what you mean by presence)? I know people at both of those shops, have met up with groups of their friends from work, have run into 0 WashU folks. I'm actually surprised there aren't more WashU folks involved in finance in some form since it is such a good school and relatively close to Chicago

I'm not really sure the exact numbers, I just know there is at least 1 person currently at each of those firms. In no way am I saying it's comparable to HPM+UChicago and UI in number of people placed at these firms. My point was more that OP could get a job trading in Chicago coming from WashU. I'll do a more detailed search and get back to you

Ok, here is a little more information. There is at least 1 person at each of the following firms: IMC, Chicago Trading, Chopper Trading, Great Point Capital, International Trading Group, Allston Trading, Traditum Group, Nico Trading, Spot Trading and Wolverine Trading. There was also one person listing himself as a C++ Software Developer at Jump Trading. Overall, IMC and Chicago Trading have the largest numbers. I believe Chicago Trading has 6 or 7 people and IMC has around 4 or 5 people. Got this information from some quick LinkedIn searching. I don't have access to the Alumni Database but that might show some more. I don't think these numbers compare to the schools Jerome mentioned but I still think this is pretty good/respectable.

I mean dude, there are probably the same number of guys or more from IIT/Wisconsin/IU-Bloomington/etc. in trading as there are WashU folks if that's your argument. I've even met guys from REALLY random schools that are trading at top firms--it just isn't typical or standard and there isn't OCR at those schools, so you have to try to network in or be the bitch clerk for 3-4 years.

You are probably right but I was just saying it is possible. I think it is a school OP should consider if he wants to work in Chicago and can't get in at the schools you mentioned. To be honest I have no interest in trading so I don't know much about the field. Just saying it's not like you are at some school in east bumblefuck. It's a well respected school and you can break in with a little effort. WashU is definitely better for consulting and F500 type jobs than IB and trading though but it can be done.

Schools that place well in Chicago IB and Trading, all based upon my experience working and interviewing

based upon quantity of people:

U Chicago, Michigan, Northwestern Notre Dame, Wisconsin, Illinois Wash U, Indiana

notes:

Wash U has fewer people b/c its further away and is a smaller school, I wouldn't recommend Indiana to anyone unless they are confident that they can get admitted into the IU Investment Banking Workshop.

Wisconsin and Illinois are pretty much neck and neck, for both trading (Chicago Trading Company has many Illinis and Badgers, many more Illinis since the firm was founded by an Illini) and IB---grads from these schools are more common in middle market banks (think Houlihan Lokey and BMO) though the best and brightest grads from these schools can also be found at places like GS and CS Chicago. Wisconsin does have a significant edge in Real Estate Finance- many grads in CMBS groups at banks like JPMorgan when times were good, asset mgmt/investment firms like Jones Lang LaSalle and Tishman Speyer, and several smaller real estate private equity shops.

Michigan places well everywhere- I'd recommend this school to anyone interested in working in finance, in addition to the solid placement, it has all of the fun you would expect from a Big 10 school (unlike Northwestern where the girls are miserable dogs)

NU, Chicago, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, UIUC, IU, Perdue and to some extent UIC are excellent schools to the extent that you're in a top-20 ranked program by US News or Businessweek.

Wash U also has an excellent reputation.

I think there's a four way tie between Michigan, Chicago, Northwestern, and Notre Dame. People tend to underrate Michigan because it's a state school, but bottom line is that the rankings for Michigan are stronger than those for Northwestern in finance, and Chicago doesn't have a finance program. Northwestern and Chicago definitely have stronger reputations once you're east of Pittsburgh or west of Omaha, but in the Midwest (including Chicago), a business degree from Michigan carries a lot of weight. So does Notre Dame. Notre Dame has a nasty reputation for getting two or three alumns into a firm and having them quickly multiply.

If you want to go in-state, UIUC has the best Accy program in the country and it would get you into most interviews for Chicago investment banking positions. Illinois is also strong in Math and Engineering; I am biased, but I think a UIUC engineering degree is a good option if you want to go into trading. It got me (eventually) to the trading floor in New York, and firms from Citadel to GETCO to Jump to Chicago Trading Company recruit traders at UIUC's engineering career fairs.

I would try to steer clear of most schools in downtown Chicago outside of U of C and UIC. Roosevelt and DePaul are perfectly good schools in my book, but a number of hiring managers see them as halfway between the quality of state schools and community colleges.

What type of job are you looking for? Kellogg and Booth dominate the Chicago PE scene and are quite prominent in a lot of high finance roles.

My impression is that its all about effort. MBA brands outside H/S will carry the most weight in their region. More familiarity and alumni, etc. That said, if you put in the effort, getting a job in Chicago post top 15 mba should certainly be doable. It might just not come as easily