This site has become so pessimistic

I have frequented this site for years and come to realize that many of the members are very pessimistic on the future of Wall Street. Obviously most members are obsessed with IB and PE and I agree that those are probably the most stable places to be long term, but what about other areas of finance? People are constantly saying S&T is dying, ER is dead and HF business is dying.

Is this because we’re getting advice from mentors that started in the business in its hay day or is this really not a good place to be? I believe that we will always need people in these roles but there will be much fewer seats. There is also a need for people to sell services such as prime brokerage or electronic trade execution. I also understand that the money will never be what it once was, but can you not still make $400k-$1M in any of these areas? This might not be what it used to be but is a lot relative to the rest of the world.

I’d love to hear what others think about this. Am I being to optimistic?

 

You're right in that those jobs will always exist but there will be fewer jobs and those jobs will be much less lucrative than they used to be. The issue here isn't that there's some temporary downswing but S&T, ER, and HFs (maybe less so) are structurally disadvantaged. There is simply no way for S&T desks at banks or ER departments to be massively profitable with Dodd Frank, MiFID II, etc. It's really tough to advise someone to go into an industry that is actively shrinking and which already has a surfeit of talent.

I'd argue IBD and PE, while increasingly commoditized and competitive, will be much more stable over the long term. Companies will always need to raise capital and buy / sell things, and institutions are practically throwing money at PE funds despite lower returns.

 

Most of the forum is IB kids gunning for exit opps though.

 

We're competing against time in a dying industry as quants and swe are better off in the long term with their knowledge of coding and maths. It really doesn't have much upside as it used to and won't in the future unless deregulation.

 

Absolutely stupid comment. PE isn't going away it's just getting more efficient. It's much harder for your typical small (200-500m) fund to compete against the others. That's why you see larger funds building out internal functions like strategy teams, talent teams, etc. and switching from generalist to sector specialists. To say the industry as a whole is facing an existential crisis and "this will be the end of the industry as you know it" removes all credibility from you as a poster. The good firms are still 2-3x+ oversubscribed and are raising $1b+ funds in less than six months.

 

The Carlyle Group recorded a $1.2bn investment loss and said it was withdrawing all earlier financial guidance, citing the fallout from the coronavirus pandemic.

The losses were severe enough to completely wipe out the accrued “carry” on three funds, meaning that Carlyle and its executives would receive minimal performance fees or other sweeteners if the investments were realised at current valuations.

 

lol get the fuck out of here you shill. I bet those strategy teams and industry specialists are huge differentiators when everyone with over a $1Bn in AUM has the exact same thing.

PE isn't going away but the days of consistent 25% IRRs are long gone. Funds are oversubscribed because there's a ton of LP capital that needs to find a home, not because there's anything special about the funds themselves.

To your point about "the good funds" look at Berkshire Partners--they're clearly a top tier fund and they haven't done a platform deal since 2017. That should tell you something about how absurd valuations and competition are at this point in the cycle.

 
Most Helpful

Not the most informed opinion on the matter at hand, but I have noticed a lot of people on this forum focus purely on top end earnings (which is a bit ridiculous in my opinion). Suddenly that $400k base and $400k bonus is abysmal because if you are a mega fund PE Partner, you’d earn multiples of that. Everyone on this site acts like if you’re an IB Analyst you’re destined to be the next Henry Kravis. Not to shit on anyone’s dreams, because Henry Kravis does exist and somebody is bound to be just as successful. But picking an entire career as if it’s destiny to be at the highest top end isn’t logical.

It’s like becoming a SWE and saying you’re going to be bigger than Zuckerberg or Bezos. Sure, it could happen. But don’t be a SWE based on that bet.

TLDR: People need to realize being worth billions isn’t the only measure of success. Earning $200k a year before kids is doing damn well.

Edit: to connect this back to what OP was talking about, my point was that people see $500k a year + equity in investments + large bonus and say it’s horrific and dying.

“The three most harmful addictions are heroin, carbohydrates, and a monthly salary.” - Nassim Taleb
 

Voluptatem amet impedit ea aut minima nulla sit. Ratione minima neque ut asperiores veritatis blanditiis. Et sit eos et alias maxime facilis fugit. Aliquam nobis error voluptate et dolor. Consequatur minus expedita odio et sed est. Eum ex libero numquam hic qui quas. Placeat ipsam dolorum ut consequatur porro vitae est.

Voluptatem exercitationem deleniti molestiae quasi nihil quod aliquid. Atque beatae eum ex possimus. Recusandae sit aspernatur ut excepturi et occaecati nisi. Illum sed vel enim aut repellendus nobis eos.

Qui quia provident voluptatem assumenda reprehenderit. Delectus sed qui nulla quia iste sint. Expedita nobis placeat accusantium laudantium eligendi qui quia. Voluptas molestias magnam tempore voluptates. Pariatur vitae nihil fugit et accusantium quo.

Corporis aut necessitatibus dolorem rerum minus ullam. Voluptatem quae expedita error ducimus. Culpa ipsam voluptatem perferendis eum. Minima laboriosam omnis nisi id autem.

Career Advancement Opportunities

April 2024 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company 02 99.4%
  • Goldman Sachs 19 98.8%
  • Harris Williams & Co. New 98.3%
  • Lazard Freres 02 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 03 97.1%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

April 2024 Investment Banking

  • Harris Williams & Co. 18 99.4%
  • JPMorgan Chase 10 98.8%
  • Lazard Freres 05 98.3%
  • Morgan Stanley 07 97.7%
  • William Blair 03 97.1%

Professional Growth Opportunities

April 2024 Investment Banking

  • Lazard Freres 01 99.4%
  • Jefferies & Company 02 98.8%
  • Goldman Sachs 17 98.3%
  • Moelis & Company 07 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 05 97.1%

Total Avg Compensation

April 2024 Investment Banking

  • Director/MD (5) $648
  • Vice President (19) $385
  • Associates (87) $260
  • 3rd+ Year Analyst (14) $181
  • Intern/Summer Associate (33) $170
  • 2nd Year Analyst (66) $168
  • 1st Year Analyst (205) $159
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (146) $101
notes
16 IB Interviews Notes

“... there’s no excuse to not take advantage of the resources out there available to you. Best value for your $ are the...”

Leaderboard

1
redever's picture
redever
99.2
2
BankonBanking's picture
BankonBanking
99.0
3
Secyh62's picture
Secyh62
99.0
4
Betsy Massar's picture
Betsy Massar
99.0
5
CompBanker's picture
CompBanker
98.9
6
GameTheory's picture
GameTheory
98.9
7
dosk17's picture
dosk17
98.9
8
kanon's picture
kanon
98.9
9
Linda Abraham's picture
Linda Abraham
98.8
10
DrApeman's picture
DrApeman
98.8
success
From 10 rejections to 1 dream investment banking internship

“... I believe it was the single biggest reason why I ended up with an offer...”