Top 10 US MBA entry

From Australia,

I want to ask my chances of getting into a Top 10 MBA program in the US.

GMAT 780
GPA 6.4 [3.4 in the US]
WAM IB in Australia (think GS, MS).

I studied finance & economics at a Go8, honestly i slacked off the entire time and by chance stumbled into my role as an investment banker at a top BB. I have always been able to receive high grades when I work hard, but some units just didn't interest me so my marks are quite broad either very high or low 60s/70s. Those units were mainly marketing, management, broadening units, law (just fluffy BS in AUS curriculum). I am a decently intelligent guy who slacked off a lot when I felt it didnt matter, I honestly think I could have got a perfect GPA if I had set that goal at university. I left high school with perfect university entrance scores and ranked amongst the top students with scholarships with to AU uni of my choice. However, I'm sure that's largely irrelevant to the harvard admissions department given it was years ago.

My marks aren't bad, nor are they exceptional. I want to know people's thoughts on getting into schools like Harvard (main goal), Stanford, Booth, Kellogg etc. I'm sitting GMAT again as I'm still young and wouldn't mind making a bit more money for a bit longer. Only thing I have going for me is likely to be my job at a prestigious firm + GMAT which I think i can resit and get 790. Those days of forgetting about my GPA and messing around are catching up to me.......

Thanks!

 

A score of 780 on the GMAT puts you in the 99th percentile of all applicants. By planning to resit the GMAT, it shows you're clearly focusing on the wrong things or you're just pedantic [international undergraduate from Zimbabwe here, I sort of understand].

Not an expert but anyone would tell you that your GPA is in the past so stop worrying about it - it won't change. Instead, focus on having stellar essays and a strong application that makes you stand out. Seriously though, with a 780, you should have decent odds just about anywhere. All the best!

 

You'll nearly a sure shot everywhere except for H/S imo, and you could get into either with the right execution/goal-stating. Don't resit for the GMAT - bad idea. No reason at all to retake a 780. Do you realize schools below H/S rarely even get a single 790? The range typically tops out at 780. Don't believe me? Google school profiles. Think about the strategic process. If they show or don't show the full range, there is a good reason for that.

Don't retake the GMAT. Enjoy doing things that you are passionate about and talk about those in your application instead. You can't change your GPA and you've maxed out GMAT effectively speaking. Academics are a closed book.

 

Why in the world are you retaking a 780? Reeks of Asperger's.

Go volunteer somewhere. Play with puppies at the animal shelter on Saturday afternoons, serve food to the homeless - anything other than trying to masturbate your way from the 99th percentile on standardized test to the 99.9th percentile.

Commercial Real Estate Developer
 

Thanks for the comments guys, unfortunately I have already paid for the GMAT but I definitely understood the minuscule benefit of sitting GMAT again. Honestly, I planned to do it again because I see no way of actually improving my application as GPA is essentially set in stone. The only other point I would make if I got to an interview (which is what I made to investment banks) is that I don't believe marks accurate reflect an individual's ability. I was employed by the university to teach a variety of units, which I demonstrates this despite by non-exceptional GPA. But yes, I'm grasping at straws to improve my application.

 

I still think you're missing the point a bit.. You're a really strong candidate as it is. Give yourself a little credit. Just be sure to make the rest of the application as outstanding as your GMAT, that's all we're reminding you to do.

 

Taking the GMAT again has almost no chance of improving your application. It may actually hurt it because it comes across as anti-social.

Your gpa is set, your GMAT is off the charts. If you want to improve your application get involved in a club or organization that demonstrates that you are more than a banker with a high GMAT

 

That video is absolutely hilarious , funny cause I'm an ABC (Australian Born Chinese). Thanks for the tips guys, definitely reconsidering retaking that GMAT. On an additional note, what are your opinions of why people go and do MBAs. In my honest opinion I feel that my three year undergraduate degree wasn't enough and hence want an additional qualification and nothing looks better than say Harvard. However, I realise many people do MBAs to get jobs at BBiBs or MBB and I'm not sure what I want to do. Hence, the considerations of business school, however if I knew that I certainly wanted to have a career shift to McKinsey I would probably just apply straight out and they would end up paying for an MBA after. I just got out of a long term relationship, and no longer have a clear vision for the future, an MBA seems to enable me to stall and really figure out myself in the meantime..... I guess though the connections would be invaluable, but so are the ones you make at BBs and MBB. I definitely appreciate the responses so far, and hence posing this question out there also. Thanks guys.

 

While not knowing what you want to do is understandable, I wouldn't say anything even remotely close to this in your essays or to admissions personnel. Not insinuating that you were planning to, but it seems important to demonstrate a clear reason as to why an MBA, from a professional standpoint, to the people reading your application.

I would also thoroughly advise against retaking the GMAT. Spend 2 of the 4 hours you would have spent in a room trying to meaninglessly improve your gmat score on volunteering for/participating in something that interests you or is otherwise meaningful. Make this a regular thing. Ideally this would be something that you would do even if it wasn't strictly to improve your profile. This will paint a more three-dimensional picture of yourself that will make you more than just another banker.

Spend the other two hours doing some introspection and trying to figure out just what you want to do after you graduate. Have to come up with a compelling story that sounds like it makes from an admissions perspective. Without a well put together application and executing on the stuff that I have been told that too many people overlook (essays, short answers and recommendations in particular) you are doing yourself a disservice. I have no basis for this, but I suspect that a top schools would almost be eager to deny someone with a top GMAT who doesn't nail the rest of his application so that they can further illustrate how "holistic" the process is.

 

Lots of red flags here:

-You want to retake a 780
-You don't seem to have a reason for pursuing the MBA -You prioritize prestige to a fault -You included your breakup as an impetus for considering B-school

If I were you, I would instead focus on an outcome I'd ultimately like to see, and then reverse engineer a path to it that includes the MBA during the application process. In the meantime work on making yourself more interesting to these ad-coms. Your GMAT and work experience already clear a couple of hurdles but you need to have some hobbies, pursuits, or service activities that help you to stand out from the legions of bulge bracket guys w/ high test scores, and demonstrate you'll be a classmate with whom people actually want to network and befriend.

 

First off, the biggest thing you seem to have going for you is that based on your responses here, you seem to have a sense of humor about yourself. That's much more valuable than you realize. Tons of young men (especially guys I'm sure you've encountered, especially in finance) take themselves so seriously - and that can be a huge problem because it's hard to truly change and grow without some perspective.

With that said, I think the biggest thing is that you are a race car without a destination, map or driver. You've been a passenger to your talent (you seem like a smart guy, but haven't really put it to full use in a way that is meaningful to yourself or more importantly to others).

Not everyone going to b-school are fully formed or have all things figured out, but what they may not have in terms of raw smarts compared to you, is more of a sense of themselves - some may call that 'maturity' but I think it's simply a bit more self-knowledge (not a lot more, but a bit more).

And with that, I think what will prevent you from getting into b-school isn't your test scores or profile, but a sense of "something missing" that adcoms may subtly pick up on in your essays and interviews. They may not even be able to fully verbalize it consciously, but that something doesn't quite add up (and that is what I think I mentioned above). You seem a bit more adrift of lost than other applicants (not just "career goals" although that's just one of many byproducts, but something deeper than that) which will likely show up in a subtle or inadvertent way in how you convey who you are.

Practically speaking, by all means on the surface, apply to b-school. But don't be surprised if you don't get in, even if on the surface everything seems to check the marks. B-school admissions is far from being some spiritual quest or anything, but as it can be a very subjective process, the people reading these applications respond emotionally to what they're reading (or respond with no emotion at all).

Beyond b-school admissions, I strongly encourage you to do something else with your life. Not quit your job today. But knowing that you can't just put this stuff off forever - if you're adrift today inside, you will be adrift in b-school, and on and on, until you deal with it. Or else you'll simply be a passenger, coasting through and any empty feeling will only get worse.

B-school is probably not the answer to these questions. You can't just defer this kind of stuff until later on - i.e. "I'll figure it out later." Figure it out now, or you will never figure it out. Because it only becomes easier and easier to kick the can down the road. And if your job in IB doesn't allow you time to do other things, don't blame the job. Find a way. Even if it means looking for another job in parallel to applying to b-school.

Your biggest issue isn't talent. It's that your talent and raw potential will atrophy faster than you think if you don't do the work to discover your real interests. To stop being so laid back about your motivations, while letting external things (school, work, prestige, etc) fill that void.

This doesn't mean you have to have everything figured out - but that you need to work even harder on the process of figuring that out in the first place. To make that very discovery process a priority. Because if you don't, not only adcoms, but others including recruiters, partners, investors, etc will pick up on it. And not to get too personal, but perhaps your friends and romantic partners as well.

So that's my long-winded answer as I fall asleep to my own typing...

Alex Chu www.mbaapply.com
 

Thanks for the responses guys, much appreciated. Just so you know, I did realise how absurd it was to consider do GMAT again being on the borderline of sociopathic as some of you may have put it. That just didnt matter as I couldn't think of a way to improve. I also agree my notions of prestige and reasons for an MBA are flawed, but I guess that's what the anonymity in this forum is for :) Trust me though, I know how ridiculous this can be, but hey all steps to figuring out what to do next. Certainly keeping everything in mind.

 

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