Top Groups at these BBs?

BANK3R's picture
Rank: Monkey | 63

What are the top product/industry groups at these banks?

Bank of America Merrill Lynch?

Morgan Stanley?

Wells Fargo?

Top investment banking groups: BAML, MS, WF

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Comments (39)

Jan 5, 2011

This is a question that you could have done a simple search on, but I'm gonna answer it anyway because I have nothing better to do.

Bofa - lev fin, M&A

MS - M&A

Wells Fargo - don't know, could be lev fin

Jan 5, 2011

SEARCH

B of A - not sure, prob levfin

MS - M&A

WF - lev fin, FIG and Industrials

Jan 5, 2011

MS M&A is great from what I've heard on wallstreetoasis.com

Jan 5, 2011

BoA - lev fin is the best group, but i don't think you can go wrong with the m&a / sponsor group at any BB (Do BoA have M&A still? forgot)

MS -
1)M&A
2)Tech
3)Sponsor
4)Telecom and Media

WF - not sure. But I assume the busy group would be your best bet - lev fin, industrial

Jan 5, 2011

Aside from what Ricqles pointed out, MS has a strong FIG practice as well; although the culture isn't for everyone.

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Jan 5, 2011

BofA has a corporate finance group that is strong too. tech is pretty strong as well, palo alto office is the biggest ML office outside of NY.

Jan 6, 2011

BofA - RE / Gaming & Lodging is pretty good as well...

Jan 6, 2011

BAML - Lev Fin
Morgan Stanley - M&A
Wells Fargo - FIG (but this is not a product group, it is coverage)
JPM - Lev Fin and M&A (why was this not on your list?)
Credit Suisse - Lev Fin and M&A (why was this not on your list?)

Jan 5, 2011

B-School Bound.

you totally just reminded me of my VP with the comments regarding CS and JPM

Jan 6, 2011

goldman sachs, why is this not on ur list

Jan 6, 2011
boutiquebank4life:

goldman sachs, why is this not on ur list

Maybe because he has offers at those places and not GS? Just a guess (not trying to be a dick)

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

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Jan 6, 2011

I was parodying bschoolbound.

Jan 6, 2011

I've heard it's difficult to make it out alive from MS M&A group. Anybody with experience in the group or that knows about the group care to comment?

Jan 6, 2011

CS for sponsors

Jan 5, 2011

Yes and no. M&A isn't an 'easy' group, but it's definitely not the toughest group to work in at MS.

Jan 7, 2011

What exactly is the corporate finance group at Baml. What do they do? thanks

Jan 8, 2011

not sure what corp fin at BAML does. here's the real deal on these banks...

BAML- M&A is not that great and the best exit opps actually come from the strongest analysts in the better industry groups. Would go with lev fin since it's top on the street and you would almost be guaranteed to be involved in whatever big LBO happens to occur in the near future (of course if any), media and telecom (solid group, very good exit opps), industrials (lots of deal flow, strong in group M&A), healthcare (lots of M&A in the group).

MS- M&A obviously (very good group, exposure to proxy battles and unique analytical situations you won't get elsewhere), media and telecom (very strong, great exit opps in general and TPG usually likes analysts from this group, does all M&A in house), real estate (experience in both RE private equity and investment banking makes this a good place to be if you are interested at all in doing RE PE, and even if not you get PE experience a lot of the time so its a good segway into any buyside job).

Wells Fargo- honestly this bank is garbage. it is not a BB. to set the record straight, the BB's are as follows and ranked in this order... GS, MS, JPM, CS/BAML (tied in my opinion), Citi, Barc, UBS, DB. if you have some skill and can get into any of the other ones you mentioned i would go to any group there, including pure ECM or DCM, over anything at WFC. you are not getting to a sick hedge fund or PE shop from this place.

JPM- M&A (very good group, similar to MS M&A but a small step below), SLF (syndicated leveraged finance, strong group almost identical to BAML's), Sponsors (complements the strong lev fin group, kids have gone to apax and KKR in recent history), TMT

CS- TMT (lots of people leaving early for hedge funds, nice history with quattrone having been the group head in the past), M&A (although many people in this group are dousche bags, you will get some pretty good modeling exposure), Sponsors (senior bankers have good relationships with clients and thus advise on big deals, so the analysts have good resumes. good LBO modeling experience).

tried to be honest with this and hope it helps.

Jan 5, 2011
jackdup:

not sure what corp fin at BAML does. here's the real deal on these banks...

BAML- M&A is not that great and the best exit opps actually come from the strongest analysts in the better industry groups. Would go with lev fin since it's top on the street and you would almost be guaranteed to be involved in whatever big LBO happens to occur in the near future (of course if any), media and telecom (solid group, very good exit opps), industrials (lots of deal flow, strong in group M&A), healthcare (lots of M&A in the group).

MS- M&A obviously (very good group, exposure to proxy battles and unique analytical situations you won't get elsewhere), media and telecom (very strong, great exit opps in general and TPG usually likes analysts from this group, does all M&A in house), real estate (experience in both RE private equity and investment banking makes this a good place to be if you are interested at all in doing RE PE, and even if not you get PE experience a lot of the time so its a good segway into any buyside job).

Wells Fargo- honestly this bank is garbage. it is not a BB. to set the record straight, the BB's are as follows and ranked in this order... GS, MS, JPM, CS/BAML (tied in my opinion), Citi, Barc, UBS, DB. if you have some skill and can get into any of the other ones you mentioned i would go to any group there, including pure ECM or DCM, over anything at WFC. you are not getting to a sick hedge fund or PE shop from this place.

JPM- M&A (very good group, similar to MS M&A but a small step below), SLF (syndicated leveraged finance, strong group almost identical to BAML's), Sponsors (complements the strong lev fin group, kids have gone to apax and KKR in recent history), TMT

CS- TMT (lots of people leaving early for hedge funds, nice history with quattrone having been the group head in the past), M&A (although many people in this group are dousche bags, you will get some pretty good modeling exposure), Sponsors (senior bankers have good relationships with clients and thus advise on big deals, so the analysts have good resumes. good LBO modeling experience).

tried to be honest with this and hope it helps.

Is WF really that bad? It seems like they get pretty good deal flow, at least in some groups. Obviously analysts aren't going to KKR, but would analysts get into good MM PE shops from Wells?

Jan 8, 2011
SHORTmyCDO:
jackdup:

not sure what corp fin at BAML does. here's the real deal on these banks...

BAML- M&A is not that great and the best exit opps actually come from the strongest analysts in the better industry groups. Would go with lev fin since it's top on the street and you would almost be guaranteed to be involved in whatever big LBO happens to occur in the near future (of course if any), media and telecom (solid group, very good exit opps), industrials (lots of deal flow, strong in group M&A), healthcare (lots of M&A in the group).

MS- M&A obviously (very good group, exposure to proxy battles and unique analytical situations you won't get elsewhere), media and telecom (very strong, great exit opps in general and TPG usually likes analysts from this group, does all M&A in house), real estate (experience in both RE private equity and investment banking makes this a good place to be if you are interested at all in doing RE PE, and even if not you get PE experience a lot of the time so its a good segway into any buyside job).

Wells Fargo- honestly this bank is garbage. it is not a BB. to set the record straight, the BB's are as follows and ranked in this order... GS, MS, JPM, CS/BAML (tied in my opinion), Citi, Barc, UBS, DB. if you have some skill and can get into any of the other ones you mentioned i would go to any group there, including pure ECM or DCM, over anything at WFC. you are not getting to a sick hedge fund or PE shop from this place.

JPM- M&A (very good group, similar to MS M&A but a small step below), SLF (syndicated leveraged finance, strong group almost identical to BAML's), Sponsors (complements the strong lev fin group, kids have gone to apax and KKR in recent history), TMT

CS- TMT (lots of people leaving early for hedge funds, nice history with quattrone having been the group head in the past), M&A (although many people in this group are dousche bags, you will get some pretty good modeling exposure), Sponsors (senior bankers have good relationships with clients and thus advise on big deals, so the analysts have good resumes. good LBO modeling experience).

tried to be honest with this and hope it helps.

Is WF really that bad? It seems like they get pretty good deal flow, at least in some groups. Obviously analysts aren't going to KKR, but would analysts get into good MM PE shops from Wells?

I think you have a misconception about MM PE shops. Unlike banking, where MM firms (except evercore, lazard, moelis, bx) are looked at as second tier and are easier to get into, MM PE shops can be just as talented, prestigious, and difficult as mega funds. Many of them have the same type of people with the same level of talent that just want to work on different types of transactions than mega buyouts of mature companies. My friends at the bank I was at (BB) were very good and some of them chose to do MM PE and went to fabulous shops and are making a ton of money there. Point is- as long as were not talking about joe schmoe investing his dad's money down the street, all PE is good, and don't think that you're just going to be able to fall back on going to a MM PE shop without good experience and similar skills that you'd need to get to a mega fund.

Regarding wells, yes it is not really a good bank. When you think of investment banking, you do not think of wells. I knew a kid or two from there and they were not very strong candidates for PE. Very little modeling, no significant M&A experience, and the talent there is subpar. My shop would not look at someone from wells, although we are not MM. I don't mean to be a dick but I want to be real with you because it seems like you care about this and I want to give you the real advice. If you are someone who thinks that they are good enough to be going to a good buyside firm down the line, than use those same skills you would use to get there and be successful in deal making to network your way into a BB. These days, the BB's are very "networkable", and with some effort I'm sure you can land an interview.

Jan 8, 2011
jackdup:

real estate (experience in both RE private equity and investment banking makes this a good place to be if you are interested at all in doing RE PE, and even if not you get PE experience a lot of the time so its a good segway into any buyside job).

I would actually argue that MS RE PE would not be a good place to exit into a general PE shop, because RE is such a specialized industry. When I was interviewing there, the team made clear that they wanted someone who was dedicated in the RE industry.

Jul 2, 2012
jackdup:

not sure what corp fin at BAML does. here's the real deal on these banks...

BAML- M&A is not that great and the best exit opps actually come from the strongest analysts in the better industry groups. Would go with lev fin since it's top on the street and you would almost be guaranteed to be involved in whatever big LBO happens to occur in the near future (of course if any), media and telecom (solid group, very good exit opps), industrials (lots of deal flow, strong in group M&A), healthcare (lots of M&A in the group).

MS- M&A obviously (very good group, exposure to proxy battles and unique analytical situations you won't get elsewhere), media and telecom (very strong, great exit opps in general and TPG usually likes analysts from this group, does all M&A in house), real estate (experience in both RE private equity and investment banking makes this a good place to be if you are interested at all in doing RE PE, and even if not you get PE experience a lot of the time so its a good segway into any buyside job).

Wells Fargo- honestly this bank is garbage. it is not a BB. to set the record straight, the BB's are as follows and ranked in this order... GS, MS, JPM, CS/BAML (tied in my opinion), Citi, Barc, UBS, DB. if you have some skill and can get into any of the other ones you mentioned i would go to any group there, including pure ECM or DCM, over anything at WFC. you are not getting to a sick hedge fund or PE shop from this place.

JPM- M&A (very good group, similar to MS M&A but a small step below), SLF (syndicated leveraged finance, strong group almost identical to BAML's), Sponsors (complements the strong lev fin group, kids have gone to apax and KKR in recent history), TMT

CS- TMT (lots of people leaving early for hedge funds, nice history with quattrone having been the group head in the past), M&A (although many people in this group are dousche bags, you will get some pretty good modeling exposure), Sponsors (senior bankers have good relationships with clients and thus advise on big deals, so the analysts have good resumes. good LBO modeling experience).

tried to be honest with this and hope it helps.

I'm curious where you heard that Baml has good industry groups? And what sort of great exit opps from media and telecom there? I always thought industry groups at BBs with product groups got little to no modeling experience.
-Not attacking, just curious

Jan 6, 2011

jackedup: Ubs over db? wrong friend. Rankings are:

GS
MS
JPM
CS/Citi
BAML/Barcap
DB
UBS

Jan 8, 2011
boutiquebank4life:

jackedup: Ubs over db? wrong friend. Rankings are:

GS
MS
JPM
CS/Citi
BAML/Barcap
DB
UBS

haha knew this would be a widely contested topic. alright i agree with you on DB and UBS if you say so. i dont have any real experience with either, except DB was on a deal that i was on and my whole team thought they sucked. however, BAML is absolutely better than citi... no questions asked. i did not work there but i know quite a lot about both banks and BAML has a lot of talent. there are still some very senior merrill MD's at BAML that make it rain, and the firm gets itself into many high profile deals. from a buyside perspective, the kids at BAML do better than the kids at citi. BAML is not legacy banc of america securities and should not be thought of as such on this forum like many people think. citi M&A is pretty good, but the industry groups at BAML place much better than those at citi. in my opinion, BAML and CS are very similar and on the same level, and citi falls way behind as far as an analyst experience goes.

Jul 2, 2012

Didn't see other thread

Jul 2, 2012

By nature, their mortgage desk is very strong.

Jan 6, 2011

^Outed as BAML employee at industry group

There's not even a "falls way behind" between the likes of a MS vs. a DB in terms of analyst experience. You are clearly biased. The mid tier of Barcap/BAML/Citi/CS are all similar and depends on group. CS sponsors is going to rock and so is BAML Levfin and Citi M&A and Barcap nat/energy.

Jul 2, 2012

equity derivs, credit, mortgages, algo mkt-making are particular strengths

Jul 2, 2012

How are they in EM? And Rates?

Jul 2, 2012

pretty solid EM teams overall, although obviously varies by product. rates isn't its strongest suit.

Jul 2, 2012

How are they across FICC?

Jul 2, 2012

How are they across FICC?

Jan 8, 2011

^Lol jackup ranking his own bank again. Figures.

Jul 2, 2012

According to 10xleverage, Goldman TMT is the clear-cut #1, then comes Goldman FIG, BX Restructuring, and MS M&A. Other than that, the M&A groups at other banks are where you want to be (according to 10xleverage). You should check his thread out.

//www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/former-ms-ma-kkr-he...

Oh, and uh...do a search next time. Kthx.

Jul 2, 2012

If you're talking about PE recruitment targets, I was told by analysts who went through the process this year that Goldman Healthcare/TMT, MS M&A, BX M&A / Rest, Moelis were among the first to get calls

Jul 2, 2012
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Jan 5, 2011