Why did you do your MBA or why are you considering an MBA?

I was just wondering for the people who're currently enrolled in an MBA program or completed MBAs or are considering getting an MBA, why did you decide to pursue an MBA or why are you considering an MBA? For career switchers it's a pretty easy answer : they are from a non-business background and need to break into the financial world which an MBA allows them to do that. But for the folks that already have business/ management degrees or are already working in the financial services/ consulting industries, why put yourself through all the MBA application processes, give up 2 years of salary + accumulate debt to get an MBA ? What were your motivations/ reasons? Was it any family pressure or was it because your co-workers/ friends are getting an MBA and that's why you decided to get one as well?

For the folks how already finished your MBA: was it worth all the stress/ debt/ effort? If so how? If not, why not?

 

I'll bite. I graduated in May and have recently started my new job (and it's not in banking or consulting). I didn't have a business undergrad (I was a History major) but I worked in consulting prior to getting my MBA. For me the biggest reason I did it was to open up options. I wanted to leave consulting and I did interview for a few jobs before applying to bschool, but coming from consulting I was fairly limited to corp. strategy-type roles. By getting my MBA, I gave myself a lot more options in terms of industry, geography and function. I also was quite lucky in that I didn't take on any debt for my degree (between savings, scholarship and my parents kicking in some money I didn't need any loans), so finances weren't quite as much of a consideration. It was definitely worth it, as I love my new job and now have a huge network in my new industry (and at my new company).

 

I never heard someone regretting the fact that they did an MBA. Even some people who didn't really enjoyed their experience, they still believe it was the best choice.

On the other hand, I know people who regret that they didn't.

 

1) Moving to the US. I'm a permanent resident, but with a non-US undergrad and work experience I feel that I need some US credentials and network to fully settle in.

2) Exploring options to switch careers. Not sure if I want to do that yet (I'm in consulting) and what kinds of opportunities will be open to me, but it's nice to have this option.

3a) Interesting life experience. I'm going to be working for the next few decades, and does it really matter if I make Director at say 35 or 37? But when I'm 60+ I sure do want to have memories of going to the HBS.

3b) Also, when else will I have an opportunity to spend 2 years doing my own stuff (e.g. I like writing) and broadening my horizons without derailing my career?

4) Education. I do believe that the case method provides valuable educational experience, not so much in hard skills (and I don't need those anyway), but soft skills - definitely, i.e. arguing the case, "making" decisions under uncertainty and building a convincing rationale for them et cetera. Also I can go to classes in other departments in my 2nd year to pick up interesting stuff. Clubs and classmates can provide a lot of industry knowledge as well.

5) Last but not the least, black swans. High-caliber business schools are the type of environment where you're exposed to an increased probability of interesting shit happening. This can range from becoming friends with a future president of some country or a start-up billionaire to getting some unique job opportunities that you didn't know existed to whatever.

 

i'm guessing it depends largely on your political skills, as BB's shouldn't be short on good bankers. so being good should complement your networking (ie ass-licking) and self-marketing skills. but this is from a strictly academic (theoretical) point of view.

"... then, lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in My sight, shall snuff it."
 
Best Response

One thing I learned after I was admitted was 90% of people going to top MBA's really aren't sure what they want to do. They might be 50-80% sure sure but few are 90-100% sure. Yet all of these folks crafted compelling enough "Why MBA" essays or answered the question well enough in an interview to get into an MBA business schools">M7.

I treated it this way - find ONE interesting thing that you MIGHT want to do after school, which may be obtainable for you with an MBA but not really without. Let that goal make sense with your background. Let it be 'honest enough' that you could seriously see yourself in that role. Then research what the requirements are, how the school will help you get to that goal, etc. This way you can craft a compelling "why mba" that clearly shows how an MBA will help you transition 'up' or 'out' to that goal. If you 'change' your mind later (which you never really made up in the first place) who cares.

My take is that the main reason a school wants to ensure you have a compelling 'why mba' goal is to ensure you are going to be a viable job candidate coming out so it doesn't hurt their metrics. I bet the University really just wants to make sure you wont waffle around in a job interview by feeling out your goals and dedication in their interview process. Confidently approaching the process with a single, obtainable goal is the easiest way to overcome this. It doesn't need to be the main point of your candidacy.

 

You should checkout a picture from LBS showing the roadmaps for their Master programs. https://www.london.edu/-/media/files/programme%20files/master%20courses…

Check the second to last page.

you may see yourself towards mid-career, which is open to both MBA and EMBA programs. typically MBA reset your career in a higher leadership level or a different industry---without your need to change jobs drastically, MBA may only help with a promotion. Thus it may have been hard for you to pursue a MBA.

Your lack of career progression and direction may be also hurting your chances. I know accountants who work the same jobs for over 10 years. Hard to justify their needs for a MBA if they're stuck there all along.

 
buysiderules:
Training is what matters. I honestly do care at all if I could make 500k next year at some trading job.

I would trade it for a 2 year training program at the top BB, IM or consulting companies.

Its what you are making 7-10 years out of school that matters, not 1-2.

I'm not sure. Who knows what's going to happen in 7-10 years. If someone offered me 500k (heck even 200k), I think I'd take it. Then, if it doesn't turn out so well, I'd go back and get an MBA and switch careers.

 

Yes that hedge fund story might be true, but like you said its only for top people at top Univirsities.

Do you really think someone with a 600K/yr job at hedge fund will go for that?

MBA is a way for those who aren't in that bracket, to open the doors to get $. The people who go get an MBA do so for the following reasons:

1-Boost their careers (More opportunities, and jobs they qualify for.) 2-Money(starting salary for undergrad is 40-45K, MBA starting is 100K on average) 3-Get a better school on their resume(if they went to crappy undergrad)

Overall its an option to reinvent yourself.


Disclaimer: The post above has been made by someone who is not currently employed in IBD, and has not had an interview yet...

 
aspiringmonkey:
Yes that hedge fund story MBA is a way for those who aren't in that bracket, to open the doors to get $. The people who go get an MBA do so for the following reasons:

1-Boost their careers (More opportunities, and jobs they qualify for.) 2-Money(starting salary for undergrad is 40-45K, MBA starting is 100K on average) 3-Get a better school on their resume(if they went to crappy undergrad)

Overall its an option to reinvent yourself.

aspiringmonkey, i think you've got it wrong. I know high fliers (ivy league, summa cum laude, BB M&A and top PE shops) who went back to B-school. Yes it also does all of the three above but that is not all. I guess some people are just suckers for a higher degree. That said, almost no one I know in Trading/HF went back to B-School.

 

I was more talking from persepctive of non-targets, of course there are a ton of ivy guys who go get their MBAs(they fall under 1. and 2.)

As far as the reason why traders stick around, its probably because an MBA does nothing for them. Doesn't open up a ton of opportunities like other fields


Disclaimer: The post above has been made by someone who is not currently employed in IBD, and has not had an interview yet...

 

First thing: Assuming that you're fluent with english (the vocabulary suggests it is), I'd suggest keeping in mind that you need to adjust your language for the audience. On my end I actually don't know what my IQ is(throw monkey shit if you want, it's true) because the last time I took an IQ test was in high school and I got every single question right. I had to learn the hard way that just because you're smart doesn't count for jack shit. You might be able to brilliantly dissect any issue but that's got no significance unless you are able to clearly, concisely, and persuasively state your conclusions. You would do well to learn how to use more direct language and choose stronger words for key points.

Second I don't think those societies are huge advantages. That said it's always good to join any kind of society given that your entry barrier is low: the biggest reason is that you can easily use LinkedIN to find other members who work in the field that you want to and that common talking point is a good way to get the conversation started.

For putting it on the resume I'd do it, but it would be a single word under a bullet of "professional memberships" of some such.

 

Also, quite frankly IQ doesn't help that much with these kinds of decisions. You have to follow it intuitively on some level. If you're mostly interested in law to the point where you end up reading about it in your spare time it's probably the way to go.....but there isn't as much overlap between law and finance as you'd think. Here in the US there's a program called a JD/MBA where students come out with both certifications from the same school. General consensus is that it's a waste of time since there's so little overlap between what finance analysts and lawyers do. While there's a few viable specializations out there the only one I've ever talked to people about is M&A advisers.

 

No, I'm 29 and get whatever kind of sex I want daily if I ask for it.

I'm half tempted to give you my real phone # so I can find out who you are, and get you arrested for stalking. I'm still curious why you've come to the conclusion that I'm "Chris". Literally everything I've ever posted points to me being under 30.

 

Lots of reasons:

>Burned out need a vacation

>Didn't want/get direct associate promote

>PE firm made you go back to school

>To get into IM/HF/PE/VC/Consulting/Marketing/Retail/F500

>To get a broad perspective on different business functions/industries, and occasionally learn something new

>"Networking" aka making friends who will also provide some inside color on industries you're interested in.

>Get two resume building years to mess around/do entrepreneurial stuff

>Just got married/want to get married and need time

>Also, for international couples, MBA= Making Babies in America (citizenship FTW)

>work on leadership, public speaking, golf and other skills that need polishing

Basically, you buy back two years of your 20s, while enhancing your resume. It's true that if you just want to do banking at a senior level, MBA might not be helpful (I hear that in HK most bankers don't do it), but a lot of ex-bankers at MBA don't want to do banking at a senior level. I don't know a single BB IBD analyst in my class who is recruiting to become a BB IBD associate (the extreme few who recruited banking, did so for more specialized boutiques). On the flip side, my friends who loved banking (they're basically machines) got a direct to associate promote.

Also, most people aspire to do 1~2yrs IBD > 2yrs PE > 2yrs MBA > PE

 

For those of you that did go to business school after an analyst stint, would you say that the most common situation for paying for an MBA is through loans (as opposed to the alternative of company sponsorship, since it's my understanding that sponsorship is rare amongst banks)? I'm pretty ignorant to the MBA scenario currently, so I'd appreciate some opinions.

I just have trouble justifying business school in my mind, especially only 2-3 years after leaving school...even a corp development job that pays less than PE seems more enticing than just ripping into your nest egg you've started building during your analyst years just for networking and "rebranding" purposes.

 

AalH,

the reason you're confused is because your assumptions are false. Revise your premises. That is not the traditional career path.

The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin', Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd.
 

To be fair, it may be a "traditional" career trajectory for someone in banking for the long haul. But they are few and far between.

"There are three ways to make a living in this business: be first, be smarter, or cheat."
 
AalH:
So it seems like the career path of your average IBanker is:

1st Year Analyst 2nd Year Analyst (3rd Year Analyst) MBA MBA 1st Year Associate 2nd Year Associate 3rd Year Associate

what's the point of the MBA if you could just save the tuition money and jump straight from analyst to associate?

The analyst to associate jump is probably the hardest to make in investment banking, harder if not on par with the Director to MD jump. On average, only about 5% of analysts are offered the direct promote route to become associates. From a conceptual level, it does make sense since banks like their associates to be a little older and have a more diverse array of experiences... Genghis Khan had a good post awhile back talking about how direct promote assocites tend to struggle in the long-run since their experiences are a bit narrow and their perspectives a bit too one-dimensional.
 
Vancouver Canucks 2011:
AalH:
So it seems like the career path of your average IBanker is:

1st Year Analyst 2nd Year Analyst (3rd Year Analyst) MBA MBA 1st Year Associate 2nd Year Associate 3rd Year Associate

what's the point of the MBA if you could just save the tuition money and jump straight from analyst to associate?

The analyst to associate jump is probably the hardest to make in investment banking, harder if not on par with the Director to MD jump. On average, only about 5% of analysts are offered the direct promote route to become associates. From a conceptual level, it does make sense since banks like their associates to be a little older and have a more diverse array of experiences... Genghis Khan had a good post awhile back talking about how direct promote assocites tend to struggle in the long-run since their experiences are a bit narrow and their perspectives a bit too one-dimensional.

I thought it was due to self-selection, since many analysts don't think about direct promote but bail out to PE or corp development after analyst stint... but I could be totally wrong.

given that an analyst is gunning for direct promote, would you say that it is still really hard?

 

You are right about self-selection bias since approximately 50% of analysts gun for buyside exits after their analyst stinits. Nonetheless, the direct promote route is pretty hard to attain since the MBA-to-associate-to-senior banker route is an ingrained institution and a lot of the characteristics that make a great analyst great simply does not become applicable at a mid-VP level. Think the best investment bankers or even MDs you know - how many are direct analyst promotes? It is below 5% based on my personal experience.

 

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"There are three ways to make a living in this business: be first, be smarter, or cheat."
 

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