Why I believe most psychologists are a scam

datakid97's picture
Rank: Senior Baboon | 219

I was first going to make a comment on the ADD/ADHD topic but I think that topic eventually leads to a bigger issue.

I know this is a sensitive subject since some people on this forum probably use a psychologist, and most people definitely know others with mental issues. Therefore I would like to ask you to just try to follow my argumentation without feeling attacked, these are just my opinions and I don't claim to speak the absolute truth.

  1. First of all, psychologists are in no way real doctors. They do not have a medical education. Saying a psychologist is a medic is the same as saying an economist or investor is a scientist. A psychologists will do the same experiment a hundred times with the exact same input and he will have a hundred different results. That does not mean their experiments do not hold value, it just means that you can't really claim their findings to be facts.

For example, saying it's a fact that ADD/ADHD exists would in my opinion not be true.
How do you differentiate someone with ADD/ADHD and someone who's just bad at focussing? Is it entirely impossible that having the ability to focus, is as much a talent as being smart?

  1. My biggest issue with psychology: there doesn't seem to be any progress in the field, contrary to actual scientific fields like the medical field where real diseases do get cured. Both suicide rates and the number of psychologists are rising (yes, I actually looked that up). Are they correlated? I don't know, but it's definitely not something that speaks to their advantage.

FYI; I do not have a medical education. However I don't think that's necessary since the only thing that matters in the end are the results.

Comments (28)

Apr 12, 2018

To answer some points, at least in the UK psychology students do get some basic neuroscience training so there is some science underpinning a bit of what they do. I agree that they don't have the same scientific rigour that traditional doctors so but then again I think that of physiotherapists too (although they do more science). I think for many psychologists are 'professional' listeners who have been trained to try and find a deeper meaning to answers patients provide and perhaps ask or phrase questions in a better way than the average joe would. As for your ADD/ADHD comment, I agree that there is a debate going on about it but an increasing body of evidence is finding neurological processes underpinning these disorders. And these conditions are studied by neurologists as well as psychologists so do have more scientific backing.

Apr 12, 2018

Would like to just point out, (and in no way attacking you), that people conflating a psychologist with a psychiatrist probably cause 99% of the confusion in the, "Psychology is a scam" mentality. Psychologists, as you pointed out, are not medical doctors (they cannot prescribe drugs and don't have an MD or DO behind their name). Psychiatrists are very much medical professionals and can prescribe meds.

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Apr 12, 2018
dr_mantistoboggan_MD:

Would like to just point out, (and in no way attacking you), that people conflating a psychologist with a psychiatrist probably cause 99% of the confusion in the, "Psychology is a scam" mentality. Psychologists, as you pointed out, are not medical doctors (they cannot prescribe drugs and don't have an MD or DO behind their name). Psychiatrists are very much medical professionals and can prescribe meds.

This.

Psychiatrists attend medical school. Psychologists address things like behavioral patterns and such.

Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.

Apr 12, 2018

Indeed. Psychiatrist is like saying dentist, psychologist is like saying toothyologist

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Apr 12, 2018

Yes I know the difference. I agree that psychiatrists are scientists. The ADHD example is perhaps a bad one since aderall prescribed by psychiatrists does achieve results.

However, in the whole depression context, they are also not achieving any results. I believe that as a society, we have to challenge these people more. If there are no results, they should be questioned, which in my opinion isn't happening enough.

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Apr 12, 2018
datakid97:

Yes I know the difference. I agree that psychiatrists are scientists.

Apparently you don't know the difference.

Psychiatrists are physicians. Psychologists are scientists.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

Best Response
Apr 12, 2018

I appreciate you bringing this up and initiating a discussion. That being said, there are a few flaws in your post that stem from lack familiarity with the subject at hand. How could anyone be familiar with this subject unless you or someone you know is in this field? It's not like it's discussed in the media or everyday life.

  1. Psychology is the study of the mind and behaviors. No one is saying they are Doctors but they are people who can help others by listening, understanding and providing helpful solutions to problems.
  2. ADD/ADHD - Is a real disorder and deals with the lack of stimulation in the frontal lobe, this is the part of the brain that deals with your executive functioning skills (think of the Brain's brake system). Hence why people with ADD/ADHD are usually impulsive and disorganized. In diagnostic imaging tests, you can see the lack of stimulation in this area of the brain. THAT BEING SAID- yeah BIG PHARMA/DOCTORS love making money off Adderall and other similar drugs. They are relatively harmless and work for everyone. We all know a few people who went to a doctor because they had trouble concentrating and left with a script.
  3. There has been a lot of progress in the field of neuroscience and psychology. It wasn't too long ago that mental illness was brushed under a rug and never spoken about. Today, people have access to all sorts of different treatments that were never available even just a few years ago.

I have a lot of people in my life that are in these fields so I'm constantly being bombarded with this information. I hope this helps in clarifying some one of points and questions and once again I apprecciate you starting a discussion.

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Apr 12, 2018

good god

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Apr 14, 2018

Without your disclaimer I would have assumed you were a top medical professional, you sure you aren't in the medical community? Some really compelling points . . .

"I'm not fat. I'm cultivating mass."

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Apr 15, 2018

I agree with you that most psychologists are a scam for most people. I also think most psychiatrists are glorified pill-pushers that don't do a whole lot either.

I saw a psychologist when I was in high-school that I thought really helped me out though. I was at a point in life where I didn't need medicine or a psychical doctor, but I did really benefit from a knowledgeable third party helping me take an objective look at my behavioral patterns and peeling back the layers as to why I was acting out. Therapy is a very underrated tool, it's just super hard to find a legit practitioner and even harder to find a patient that's willing to do the work on themselves required to get anything out of it.

Apr 15, 2018

That's why you should see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist

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Apr 15, 2018

Interesting points. Here's some things I think about psychologists:
1)All a shrink does is shrink your wallet.
2)If they become too successful at helping people with their issues, their clients won't keep coming back as they won't need them anymore.
3)They ask BS questions like "How did that make you feel?" or "Why did that make you upset?" etc etc instead of offering legit actionable advice and the cold hard truth(this combines with point #2).

Obviously there are good psychologists out there, but I won't let the exception swallow the whole.

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Apr 16, 2018
TheROI:

2)If they become too successful at helping people with their issues, their clients won't keep coming back as they won't need them anymore.

Lol what. Physical therapy must be a scam too right?

Apr 16, 2018

You can find similarities in logic with just about anything. Nothing was debunked.

Apr 15, 2018

There are two distinct flavors to psychologists:

(1) Research psychologists. They do real science - they collect quantifiable data and prove or disprove hypothesis in an evidence-driven way. Their research is usually very closely interrelated with neuroscience. Any hard-core finance person should read certain basic psychology papers to better understand some of the behavioral biases.

(2) Clinical psychologists. These are the guys that ask you "how does it make you feel?" and so on. While it's not evidence-based (a personal gripe of mine), I am sure it can be helpful, especially for people that don't like engaging in self-analysis on their own. An additional (minor) bonus, a psychologist can probably serve as a bouncing boards in making decisions where you want to keep your deliberations confidential.

Finding a good (2) is probably pretty hard, like finding any specialist in a field where track-record is hard to evaluate. I have a few friends that go to a psychologists and they say it's money well spent, but I have yet to try it myself.

Apr 15, 2018

How the fuck has this post not been deleted?

Psychologists are part of the escalation path before seeing a psychiatrist.

I believe you can google this if you want to learn about the subject.

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Apr 15, 2018
datakid97:
  1. My biggest issue with psychology: there doesn't seem to be any progress in the field, contrary to actual scientific fields like the medical field where real diseases do get cured.

You obviously don't read. When is the last time you looked through recent research articles on psychology/neuroscience on PubMed? Also, psychology/neuroscience covers diseases of the brain. Are diseases of the brain like dementia and Alzheimer's not real enough for you? What exactly are 'real' diseases?

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

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Apr 17, 2018
Isaiah_53_5:
datakid97:
  1. My biggest issue with psychology: there doesn't seem to be any progress in the field, contrary to actual scientific fields like the medical field where real diseases do get cured.

You obviously don't read. When is the last time you looked through recent research articles on psychology/neuroscience on PubMed? Also, psychology/neuroscience covers diseases of the brain. Are diseases of the brain like dementia and Alzheimer's not real enough for you? What exactly are 'real' diseases?

Thanks for doing the takedown. There's just so much error here I didn't know where to begin. One of those posts where I'm surprised the admins didn't take down.

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Apr 15, 2018
datakid97:

Both suicide rates and the number of psychologists are rising (yes, I actually looked that up). Are they correlated? I don't know, but it's definitely not something that speaks to their advantage.

The number of psychologists are rising? Wow, bro. The population is rising too!

Suicide and suicidal ideation is an issue handled by psychiatrists in behavioral and chemical therapy of people with severe depression. Why are you mentioning psychologists here?

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

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Apr 15, 2018
datakid97:

My biggest issue with psychology: there doesn't seem to be any progress in the field...

...it just means that you can't really claim their findings to be facts.

I met a psychologist/neuroscientist by the name of George Paxinos at a psychology/neuroscience conference.

As for progress, and the legitimacy of his findings, he mapped out the brain. He mapped out the brain for humans, birds, and developing mammals.

So, what do you think neurosurgeons used as a guide to perform operations on the brain? Paxinos' brain atlas.

Nearly every person in a medical or scientist profession with a role relating to the brain has heard of Paxinos. His works have undoubtedly advanced science.

"In the field of neuroscience, he is the author of the most cited publication internationally (The Rat Brain in Stereotaxic Coordinates; Paxinos and Watson, 1986.).[2][3] This is the third most cited book in science after Molecular Cloning and the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Paxinos

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

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Apr 16, 2018

my wife used to fart in her sleep...

Apr 16, 2018
ToWhomItMayConcern:

my wife used to fart in her sleep...

Well, it's good that's in the past.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

May 1, 2018

Goodwill hunting quote haha

Apr 17, 2018

.

Apr 17, 2018

ADD and ADHD are overdiagnosed but I lay the blame on parents and kids. Magic addy makes your kid get better grades? Yea he has ADD. Parents need to hold their kids accountable and make them work hard. At my HS 20-30% of kids were diagnosed with ADHD or ADD.

Apr 17, 2018
Comment

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

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