Why is the Yen a safe haven?

The tittle pretty much sums it up.

The media is reporting a 'Rush to haven' assets, such as gold and the yen. I understand why fear in the markets pushes the price of gold up but why is the haven currency the yen rather than the dollar?

 
Best Response

The notion of yen as a safe heaven stems from the usual behavior of Japanese investors. When the world looks shaky, Mrs Watanabe normally tends to repatriate (i.e. sells her foreign assets and converts the proceeds into yen). And, as the previous poster mentioned, Mrs Watanabe (and her various agents) owns a LOT of foreign assets.

 

In the last week? Massive risk off sentiment partly due to gyrations caused by Deutsche Bank and it's COCOs leading to stockmarket selloffs. USD IR projections unrealistic in current environment, and Yellen not adding anything of note the last two days. Asian holidays reducing liquidity. Also a beautiful H&S technical setup on the weekly USDJPY that added to the long JPY being the trade of the week. USD is still the safe haven, but as long USD is currently a crowded trade, when there are issues in the US (namely the FED's IR projections vs Mkt) you will get money flowing into other areas (EUR and JPY).

 

An Asian guy walks into the New York City currency exchange with 2000 yen and walks out with $72. Next week he walks in with 2000 yen and gets $66. He asks the lady why he gets less money this week than last week. The lady says "Fluctuations". The Asian guy storms out, and just before slamming the door, turns around and says: "Fluc you Amelicans too!"

 

There's a shit ton of Japanese bonds set to be redeemed this month, around $190 billion i think and there's the risk that they'll keep it in cash for awhile so I'd be careful.

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis, you can't trust people Jeremy
 

hmmm, I wouldn't... Short term wise, since the domestic saving exhausted in Japan, they need to bring capital from overseas for rebuilding. That may temporarily boost yen. However the insurance companies won't repatriate as much funds as market speculated, cuz the many properties are not insured from what I understand and hence bigger damage to Japanese economy (weak sign). Also, further spending causes even higher level debt to GDP ratio. Japanese just had an annual trade deficit first time in 28 years. That's also weak sign and a very important sign that yen shouldn't be weaker. I have been waiting since last year to short the yen.

 
GekkotheGreat:
hmmm, I wouldn't... Short term wise, since the domestic saving exhausted in Japan, they need to bring capital from overseas for rebuilding. That may temporarily boost yen. However the insurance companies won't repatriate as much funds as market speculated, cuz the many properties are not insured from what I understand and hence bigger damage to Japanese economy (weak sign). Also, further spending causes even higher level debt to GDP ratio. Japanese just had an annual trade deficit first time in 28 years. That's also weak sign and a very important sign that yen shouldn't be weaker. I have been waiting since last year to short the yen.

I think you're right, it could be v-shaped (usdjpy and the economy) this year. Was also thinking about shorting EWJ, its been down 9% since Friday and well if its as bad as I think it is (worse than '95) we have another 20% to go.

Do you think the higher debt-to-GDP will cause investors to abandon the carry trade? Rates are still very low...but is there long-term risk in the JGB now? Looks like the long-end is steepening, but I can't see BoJ letting rates go loose.

Seems insensitive, I know, but I'd like to see this as a learning experience. Sadly, what's worse is that the Japan bears who shorted on a sovereign-debt thesis probably made good money on this terrible tragedy.

 

Theres a reason vol is ridonkulous right now, no one has a clue what's going to happen.

Jack: They’re all former investment bankers who were laid off from that economic crisis that Nancy Pelosi caused. They have zero real world skills, but God they work hard. -30 Rock
 

A lot of Japanese-owned assets invested outside of Japan may end up flowing back into the yen (insurance, banks, pensions, etc) and the govt looks like they'll continue to buy securities, but that's only half of the supply/demand equation.

There have been many great comebacks throughout history. Jesus was dead but then came back as an all-powerful God-Zombie.
 

Around 80 is the ultimate resistance and whether it can punch through that line will gives us an important indication of its underlying strength. No idea how this will play out in the short run, but I'm a huge yen bear in the long run. I also think that getting past 80 will be tough because the BOJ will start intervening and unlike last time other countries can't say shit about it.

 

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