Monkey to Millions | John (Session 3) - Mock Investment Banking Interview and Structuring Preparation - Nov 18, 2019
About
John's revised resume is working well. He is getting more traction with his networking which includes second-round interviews at 2 well-respected investment banks as well as one boutique in Newport Beach. In this session, I conduct a mock interview with John and give him advice on how to improve his technical interview prep as well as how to come across as more polished on the behavioral portion of the interview.
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WSO Podcast (Episode 3) Transcript:
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:04] Well. Hello and welcome, I'm Patrick Curtis, chief monkey of Wall Street Oasis, and this is monkey to millions. A show where you get a front row seat as I mentor young students and professionals to try and help them break into their dream jobs in the first cohort. You'll meet four students, all preparing for intense job interviews while trying to also balance personal life and schoolwork. The goal of this show is to shine a light on the struggles of trying to break into competitive positions with a non-traditional background and to give you a roadmap for your own success. My hope is that as you get to know these four impressive students, you're inspired to dream big. Remember, these are real people, and this is their true story. Let's get to it. John's revised resume is working well. He's getting more traction with his networking, which includes second-round interviews at two well-respected investment banks, as well as one boutique in Newport Beach. In this session, I conduct a mock interview with John and give him advice on how to improve his technical interview prep, as well as how to come across as more polished on the behavioral portion of the interview. But first, listen to John himself over the previous few
John: [00:01:32] Weeks leading up to this session. Update on my end. Still networking. I couldn't tell you an exact measure, but let's just say like I've been hitting like a target rate of like five to 10 percent of the people, and the response is that I've been getting kicked off to interview processes in the past week, one with the middle market health care bank in San Francisco and then one with a boutique fintech bank in San Francisco. Um, other than that. Still not working. Trying to keep up at school. Week seven, I got two midterms this week, so we'll see where it goes.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:02:20] Just to start off, just to start off, it'd be great if you could just give me your view of what you have coming up because I know it's Monday. Now it's the 18th.
John: [00:02:29] What's going on? So out of first-round with partners last week and you know, that went well and I got an email saying they won't have a second-round interview this week. I haven't heard back from them yet to schedule it, but I know that's coming up. And then after that, if that goes well, there will be a super. I also heard back from Wedbush, their health care group in San Francisco, and turning a sample like a little case study and talk to their operations administrator in the office. And that went well to I think it was just kind of like a cultural fit check. And she said she'd get back to me with the instructions about speaking to an associate or me, and I'm sure that will be more technical. It's a lot more about like the market. And then I also have an interview in person, actually with a boutique in Newport Beach this Friday.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:29] Nice. It's a lot.
John: [00:03:31] Yeah, yeah, yeah, so it's definitely been ramping up. And I'm still applying to, you know, basically all over just shooting my shot anywhere.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:41] Good man. Good. Ok, so how'd you get that one in Newport?
John: [00:03:47] It's just not working. Yeah, I reached out to somebody who was there, it's a really small boutique-like six guys and we connect it. We connected well over the phone. We had similar backgrounds and similar interests. And then I got a call a week later, just out of nowhere from him, as well as the MD. And they're both on the phone asking me if I can come in next week, which is this Friday. And they know
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:16] We've got to get going on your mark, then OK, so let's do a mock interview. Let's pretend when's the Wednesday EFT one?
John: [00:04:24] I assume this week, I'm not sure when I think I'll hear from them either later today or early tomorrow.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:31] And you think that's still going to be another phone one?
John: [00:04:33] And then it's going to be another phone one. And then after that, there will be a Super Day
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:38] One that's coming up. Or they didn't say yet
John: [00:04:41] The super date or the phone, the Super Day? No, they didn't say one. I think they're just kind of taking super days on a rolling basis right now, just flying kids up.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:53] So have you been when you've been practicing, have you been practicing more like just a general vibe kind of thing, that type of stuff?
John: [00:05:01] Um, yeah, I kind of stumbled in the first round, but I kind of got through it. Kind of how I go about that one is, you
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:11] Know, I talk about, I don't have you don't have to talk about, we'll just go do it and then I can get feedback. But let's start. Let's assume it's just a general IAB interview, you know, so that you're kind of we can keep it more high level this time because it's not for a specific firm that you're trying to prep for, but just know that like I would ask you, like why EFT or why would bush and you want to have specific answers and ideally you can link it back to somebody you spoke with there?
John: [00:05:40] Okay. Yeah, I definitely when I was talking to the guy about it, I actually went to one of the cocktail open houses in the summer
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:49] And I talked to, you have some other stuff open on your computer. It's a little choppy. I don't know if it's my connection or a different place you're at.
John: [00:05:56] That's probably the different place on that. I'm sorry, I got kicked out of a couple of study rooms.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:02] No, no, I'm trying to.
John: [00:06:03] I'm trying to snag one. And then here I am outside.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:08] Yeah, it's working good enough so we can keep it going. But OK, so let's just jump straight into a mock and then, you know, 15, 20 minutes, see how it goes. And then I'll just take some notes and give you feedback. After that, I'll so all right, just to start off. John, thanks so much for coming to meet with us today. I really appreciate you taking the time.
John: [00:06:30] Likewise, thanks. Thanks for having me. I'm happy to be here.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:34] So real quick. Let's just if you could just quickly walk me through your resume. Give me a little spiel about like, who you are, where you came from. That'd be great.
John: [00:06:42] Yeah, definitely. So I'm originally from Riverside, California. I'm a current senior at UCI, studying quantitative economics and minoring in accounting. My first tad bit of experience with finance was at Disney. That role was more so FPGA and reporting, and I didn't have an interest in investment banking until shortly after that. At Disney, my experience became kind of stagnant, even though it has more work and something a little more transactional. So as I was looking for roles my junior year, I kind of missed out on some real estate opportunities because I didn't find about find out about investing, making till the middle, of my junior year. And but I was fortunate enough to snag a spot at Harvey and Company, which is a buy-side advisory firm, which enabled me to get my feet wet in M&A and learn the process of the buy-side process specifically, but also about how private equity groups think and know after. After that experience, I short I realized I needed more experience on the sell-side. So that's when I started looking for more internship experiences and I was able to land the role at B. Riley. Now at B. Riley, I'm doing a lot of modeling work as well as working on Sims and a lot of ad hoc processes that the analyst needs me on a day-to-day basis.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:01] All right, why don't you walk me through one of the deals you've been working on?
John: [00:08:03] B. Riley Okay, so we actually just closed the deal this past Wednesday, which was super exciting as my the first time I've seen a deal close. It was a contract battery manufacturing here in Southern California. The revenues were 10 million and their EBITDA was about two million. And one of the private equity groups that approached us was looking for a really small platform in the space. It was their first fund. So that's why they're looking for something a little bit smaller, and it was going for 10 times, so we were able to get an EV of 20 million.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:43] And so you were running the sell side process for this battery manufacturer? Yes. And tell me like what specific roles you played on that? So like, what were you responsible for in that transaction?
John: [00:08:58] Mm hmm. So my specific role in part of the transaction was, you know, assisting the analyst and the associates with preparing the SIM, as well as helping them prepare parts of the disclosure schedule and as well as part of the model as well. A lot of my work on the modeling had to do with spreading the financial statements. And then when we put together disclosure statement, it was cleaning up a lot of data dumps from the aging schedules that the client gave us.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:25] So the financial statements, what specifically were you doing in there?
John: [00:09:29] I was taking past balance sheets and income statements, spreading it across the monthly time periods that they gave us and then rolled it up into a yearly timeframe.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:39] So you're just like entering in, you're just getting it all into excel because it's all what PDF or something?
John: [00:09:44] Yeah, it was. I mean, they gave us into Excel format, so I took all the past income and balance sheets, cleaned it up, put it into one master sheet and then rolled it up using an index match formula.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:56] Ok. And do you feel like where do you feel like you still need more reps on the financial modeling side? Or do you feel like you're ready to go to hit the ground running or because of your internship over the summer? Do you feel like you've been? You're ready for that type of work, like doing actual financial modeling and sell-side modeling?
John: [00:10:16] You know, I feel like I can always improve on my modeling skills, and I feel like I have improved significantly with my internship at B. Riley. I'm also taking the Wall Street prep course right now to gear up when I do start the full-time analyst role.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:31] Got it! Ok, and then tell me a little bit about why investment banking interests you.
John: [00:10:36] Yeah, so it kind of went back to my experience at Disney. Like I said, the role became a little bit stagnant and, you know, kind of slow at times and coming from a competitive background and always on the move. I was looking for something more fast-paced and competitive, and after my time at Harvey, I realized that this is the work I wanted to do and kind of pulled the plug into that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:02] Ok, and then you said you like the fast pace. What are the most hours you've ever worked in a week?
John: [00:11:09] Possibly 90. I'd be Riley before school started. I was working full time at B. Riley and yeah, I was about 90 hours for the week, so that was a good experience.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:21] How did you feel about that? It was
John: [00:11:22] Good. What do you do? You enjoyed it. I enjoyed it. Just because, you know, worked as many hours as I did, I definitely learned a lot. And being around the people I was with, I really enjoyed the time there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:34] So why do you think you didn't find out about investment banking until so late?
John: [00:11:39] I think partly because of the school system, I'm in UCI, specifically the business and economics programs, they don't push finance as hard as other data science rules or accounting rules. So I have to do a little bit of digging myself to find out about investment banking. Mm hmm.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:00] Ok, fair enough. Fair enough. And do you feel like? You know, we're getting hundreds of applicants for this position. Of what do you think really makes you stand out the most?
John: [00:12:13] I think it has to be my work ethic. I know a lot of your applicants are probably coming from top-tier schools and you guys have a lot of on-campus recruiting and coming from, you know, a non-target school, as you probably are aware of. I have to do a lot of networking and grinding out myself to get into this interview process as well as others.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:36] Ok. Anything specific, though, like any examples you have.
John: [00:12:42] Could you kind of explain that
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:44] A little bit more besides getting into this interview process, like are there any examples of your work ethic?
John: [00:12:51] I guess one good example would be this past winter and spring quarter. In twenty nineteen, I was working to two internships. Mojave and Company Internship actually started my spring quarter, and I also have a hobby of mine, which is music, and I interned at Power 106, which was in L.A. So on top of the sixteen units, which is a full course load at UCI, I was also working two internships. So I would go from internship in the morning at Harvey from eight to one class, from two to five, and then I would bust. I'd bust my way to L.A., which would be a two-hour commute to one of six where I would work six, 30 or seven to one a.m. and then the same thing the next day.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:34] Okay, great. Thank you for that. So let's just do a little quick, little technical. How would a $10 increase in depreciation expense affect each of the three financial statements?
John: [00:13:47] Yeah. So this is the one I always have kind of trouble with. This is the one that gets me so well. You can just
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:00] Try.
John: [00:14:01] Yeah, yeah. So the ten dollar increase in depreciation is an expense, so therefore the net income will drop $10. But this is what I want to ask you, is I was actually looking through your guide and I'm reading it right now in front of me. It says reduce the income by 10 times one minus the tax rate, and I totally didn't understand that part. So this is
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:33] Kind of lowering your taxes. It's lowering your taxable income. Ok, so it's well, so what's happening is like the ten-dollar tax taxes. It means you're not ten dollars higher increase in expense means you're your operating profit by ten dollars, so you're actually paying. So there's less to tax. So it's not like you're losing the full ten dollars down to net income. Mm hmm. So yeah, it's not as if you're saying I'm lowering your taxes by ten dollars and so your net income goes up by ten dollars, it's saying you're lowering, you're lowering your operating profit by ten dollars, so you're by default, you have less profits, you're paying less taxes. So there are taxes before your operating profit. Taxes are in between there and the net income.
John: [00:15:17] So it goes so goes like operating profit. You're decreasing that by 10.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:21] So then you're only paying six. It's really only lowering your fees team a 40 percent tax rate. It means it lowers your net income by six dollars.
John: [00:15:34] Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:34] And then keep going from there.
John: [00:15:37] Okay. So then that rolls up into net income, which will be reduced by six dollars. But then we also have to add back depreciation by ten dollars because of the increase, which would result in then ending cash by increasing about four dollars. And then that cash would flow into the balance sheet, which would increase by $4. No cash increases about $4 and decreases by 10 dollars because of depreciation. Right, and then retained earnings decrease by six dollars.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:19] Right, you got it. Ok. So yeah, I mean, I think just practice that a little bit more, but like, let's keep them. Now what we can do here. How would you value a company with no revenue?
John: [00:16:35] How would I tell you?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:39] Um, like a start-up or whatever.
John: [00:16:43] Yeah. I look at their. I said. Uh, and retained earnings, I did.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:56] It's fine, it's fine, so like we'll go over that one, but basically you can talk about constructing a discounted cash flow model for future cash flows and then discounting them back, so it's
John: [00:17:06] Easier for that one.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:07] Yeah, you can use a DCF so you can look at or you could use other operating metrics to value the company based on like, let's say, it's a website with X number fifty thousand subscribers. But no. You could look at other similar websites that have a value per subscriber and apply that multiple
John: [00:17:26] To what you're buying. I would assume, yeah, my first assumption when you said like no revenue. I figured they'd have no EBITDA at that point, either. So how would you go about, you know, I guess you'd have to make a lot of assumptions to pull a future where forecast the forecast of free cash flows? Ok. And then, yeah, just looking at comparable makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:47] Yeah. Comparable either operating metrics or I mean, you can't look at comparable based on trading. Yeah, no earnings, right? But you could look at comparable looking you could look at comparable, especially if it's a start-up. It's tough, but you basically like operating metrics like website, subscriber, or something like that. Question. Tell me where. Mezze sits in the capital structure, mezzanine debt, but between what typically?
John: [00:18:18] Um. Thinking goes, I forgot what the first one is, because then senior. Yeah, didn't.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:28] It's OK. It goes, it goes senior, which what makes somewhat makes a lone senior secured? What? Ok, it's fine. So typically it's like number one, they get paid first in order to sort of liquidations like any sort of bankruptcy. Number two typically has collateral backed by it. So like the machinery, the assets of the company, they can, they can stay claim to that. So it's the most secured piece of debt. That's why it's senior, it's up at the top. And that that is specifically like it typically pays the lowest yield, so lowest interest rate because it's the safest then before the opposite end is like on the debt is what's typically called a subordinated debt, which is not always but typically unsecured, meaning it doesn't have any assets or collateral backing it, like high yield paper or whatever. So you get a higher yield. A higher interest rate for that because it's riskier does so mezzanine. You can think of it as like in between, you can think of it either after subordinated or like a little bit more senior to subordinate. It depends on the structure. Oftentimes, mayors can have, like some co-investment equity features where like there are warrants attached to it. It's less common nowadays. But. Yet again, it has lower rights and like in the case of a bankruptcy or something like that, so much. And then what's higher on the capital structure, preferred stock or common stock?
John: [00:20:03] You the question, sorry, I didn't hear what's
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:04] What's higher on the capital structure, the preferred stock or common stock?
John: [00:20:09] Um. Wouldn't it be preferred stock, right?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:14] Why? Uh, it just is, it just is.
John: [00:20:18] Yeah, it is.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:19] Yeah, so like, you know, preferred stock, that's they typically get a liquidation preference. So let's say there's like a hundred company that goes bankrupt and it's OK. It's or like whatever. There's a hundred million dollars left to distribute and there's $50 million of like debt and there's like forty million dollars of like equity value left. What would get if there was like 50 million of preferred all that 40 million that was or that whatever's left over to the preferred before the common even gets a penny. Typically, sometimes patient preference like a multiple liquidation preference. So like they have to get to X, their return before the common sees a penny. So something to pay attention to on that, you know, a little bit more about like the how it flows. It's got structure like debt, you senior, then mess then subordinated and then the equity. Yeah, okay. It's fine. It's fine. Tell me a little bit about so. Come a little bit about specifically what you. You know, what you feel like is, you know, you said why I'm estimating you like the fast pace, all that stuff? Tell me. Have you spoken with any investment bankers?
John: [00:21:41] Yeah, I have actually over this past summer, I've connected with well over 500 investment bankers and learning a little bit more about what they do and how many people. Have any of us talking with. I would say, 50 to seventy-five.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:01] Right? Wow, OK, that's good. Do you feel like? It's going to be too much for you, the hours sometimes.
John: [00:22:10] No, I don't I don't believe so. As I kind of mentioned in a previous story where I worked at Harvey and then I had school on top of it and then I missed the long hours. And I think having experiences of B. Riley and Harvey and company and kind of knowing what's to come and actually enjoying the work I've done, I think it's very doable.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:38] How much do you know about LBOs buyouts? Can you describe to me like what it is?
John: [00:22:44] So to my understanding, an elbow is when a private equity groups leverages more debt than they do equity to buy a company, and then they use the company's free cash flows to pay off the debt over time. And, you know, within a five year, usually four standard five years when the private equity group wants to exit, they take the equity value for what it is and then get a nice little penny.
Patrick (CEO of WSO):: [00:23:15] So tell me, why would they use why even use leverage purchasing a company? Why do they do that?
John: [00:23:25] Hmm. Is it is it because that gave us less equity and that's why they use leverage?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:35] Yeah, but specifically what? Yes, but tell me a little bit more like why would so if I want to buy a company to worth one hundred million dollars, why would I go out and raise 80 million dollars and write a check of 20? Why would that be attracted to me? What's the point of the private equity firm? What am I trying to do as a private equity firm? Like what? What is my mandate?
John: [00:24:00] Like what? So in most cases, to turn around the distressed company into a more profitable one.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:14] Yeah, I mean, my mandate is to my limited partners, to my LPs, which basically they gave me money to try and get a return. So I want to make sure that I'm putting their money to work in companies that are going to generate a return anywhere between, you know, depending on the fund, you know, 15 to 30 percent, let's say. So when I'm looking at opportunities and let's say it's a traditional private equity firm, which, by the way, it's not always distressed, it's actually often not distressed. It's just companies that typically have stable cash flows where you can put on a decent amount of leverage on pretty safely. So they're non-cyclical in non-cyclical industries, stuff like that. So where you're able to write a smaller equity check allows you to juice your returns because of the efficiencies with taxes and all that stuff. So and being able to use the cash flows from the firm to pay down or pay a dividend to the investors or back to the private equity fund makes it a much more efficient structure in terms of generating higher returns. So that's why they use debt. It basically allows them to take something if they were at a full hundred million dollar equity check and just grew the companies EBITDA and sold it. They could make X, let's say, 10 percent, but with leverage. Instead of writing that hundred dollars, they can write a 20 million dollar check, a much smaller check and the leverage they get from that and the scale which their returns get used is very significant. So that in that example, something that would only be like a 10 percent IRR could be like a twenty-five percent IRR with leverage.
John: [00:25:52] Gotcha.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:53] Or much higher? I don't know the exact math, but so yeah, I would learn a little bit more about elbows. But where do you see yourself in five years? You know, is it banking your banker for life or what's the plan?
John: [00:26:10] So my outlook in five years is definitely, I would say, kind of uncertain, but I would love to stay within finance. I do see myself coming out the gate pretty strong and investing in making, and that's where my interest and passion lies at the moment. But in five years, it's still uncertain, but I'd love to stay within business and finance.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:37] Ok, great. Tell me a little bit about it. I'm still not letting you off on the technicals a little bit, I just want to just see I know I gave you some medium difficulty ones I want to see kind of where you follow it up. So what's? What's the link of the balance sheet in the statement of the cash flows?
John: [00:27:02] So. Specifically. In that working capital, we take the changes from the previous balance sheet and then the current balance sheet, and we adjust the cash flow of operations with the changes in working capital. And then we also use any investments or PPE into the. Sorry, you broke up for a second there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:29] Into what happens. You broke up for a little bit. You said the depreciation on BP and what happens?
John: [00:27:37] Oh, oh, I didn't say the percentages that and any like investments or any change of that falls into cash flow from investing and then long term debt or common stock, which is reflected in the balance sheet, falls into cash flow from financing and then the bottom line or change in cash flows into our new balance sheet.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:02] Got it. Ok, great. What do you think in terms of? Let me sit here. This is a good one. What's the difference between enterprise value and equity value?
John: [00:28:25] Equity value is kind of more looked into as market cap can be calculated by sending shares times a share price and then enterprise value is the market cap plus debt minus cash minus preferred equity interest and minus minority interest plus-minus.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:51] Yeah, it's basically it's the cash or it's the value left over after they pay their outstanding obligations. So like the net debt, like you said, plus the debt minus cash, so you're their net debt plus the preferred stock plus minority interests. So it's like the enterprise value is the full value of the entire enterprise, whereas the equity value is kind of like the value of the common shares, which is why you call it a market cap, because what the share the common shares are typically trading at?
John: [00:29:15] Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:17] Yeah, that was right. Ok, so let's just go over what you did. I think that overall pretty you're a few things. Number one, just the ums to try to eliminate the arms. Instead of feeling just be comfortable and silent. Be comfortable with silence as you're gathering your thoughts. So practice doing some video answers of like, walk me through your resume, that should have no arms, you should literally practice that 20 times on your video like tonight because that should be like. It should be super polished. Like, there should be no hesitation. You should know exactly where you're going, what you're going to do. And I like the story. I just think I especially liked how you talked about, you know, you learned about a little bit late, but then you've got the internships. You worked on these few deals. I really like that how you're improving, like they didn't oversell it, how you're still improving your doing courses, that type of stuff. Example, you need to be pulling in examples proactively, not waiting for me to ask you, for example, so like the work ethic thing, oh, I'm just hard-working. I'm from a non-target. Like, that's not enough. Tell me good example of specifically what like I had to pull it out from you. That thing where you work 100 hours, you're going in it whatever time and then work till 1:00 a.m. Give that to me. Give me that like the juice. Give me the actual details of specifically why you're a hard worker. Not just anyone can say it. Oh, you know, I'm from Daughtry. I got in this interview. Don't let that be specific about schedule your crazy schedule. Like what? When it was the most and crazy about you and say how like you felt like it was, you know, it was fine for you and you feel like, you know, now it's the time to work hard and learn as much as you can. I think I think talking about being around really bright people who are were going to teach you a lot, I think is a good thing to mention in terms of why I will be in terms of where you see yourself. I think that was fine. You didn't force it. You didn't say like, oh, I know I'm going to be doing banking or whatever. You didn't like bullshit, which is good. I think you can be a little bit more specific. It is a banking interview. You could say something like I do, but I do like the transactional nature of investment banking. I do think it's interesting getting to look at different industries, different companies, and then kind of being trusted to consummate those transactions. I think an exciting place to be, so I could very much see myself staying in banking for good for a good amount of time. But I know a lot more in four or five years. I think that's fine. Let me see what else I wrote here. Yes, so examples are a really big man. Like, that's a big thing. Not just removing names like I'm saying right now, but really weaving in your stories on all these behavioral. So did you have do you have stories that you've kind of outlined or prepped?
John: [00:32:09] I mean, the stories I just gave you are basically everything I've outlined. Working at Harvey and one and six at the same time, and then my experience growing from Disney to B. Riley.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:23] But what if you asked, what if they ask you something of like, tell me a time when you disagreed with the manager? What did you do? Tell me about a time when you were working in a team and you disagreed or you did it? Do you have things you can pull from quickly? Big stories. Group projects work stuff at work.
John: [00:32:43] Yeah, usually for those that kind of pull from group projects or my time at wing technologies or my time on exec within my fraternity. So just be ready for those conflict ones.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:33:01] Okay, such that you. You can point to things that are that have where there was conflict, but you kind of addressed it in a mature manner and just communicated such that you work well in teams. They give an example. Are you working well in teams? Give an example where you disagree with somebody. Give me an example where you disagreed with the direction the leader was taking you. What did you do? Hmm. Like, it shouldn't be broad platitudes, it should be specifically what you did, like the situation, the star, you know, the star framework situation. What was your task? What was the action? What was the result star? You should have stories should have like a bullet on each of those and I would actually write them out. Okay, I'll have like seven or eight prepped and just review all of them. And then when the question starts, like the behavior, if a behavioral question comes, you'll quickly be able to like in your mind, scan across the seven or eight stories and be like, I'm going to grab that one and pull it out, and I'll be ready to go. And you'll be like, Boom, boom, boom, boom. And it'll actually help you because you'll be like, OK, I want to make sure I say these numbers. I say this situation. I say this action. This result.
John: [00:34:11] Ok, yeah, that makes sense. Exactly. Go ahead and do this.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:16] I would do that even before all the technical prep that I think you're going to need. I think you need more a little bit more specifics than like make sure you can walk through DCF, make sure you're a little bit more know a little bit more about LBO, you know what I mean?
John: [00:34:33] Yeah, no, I got to because I think
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:35] Definitely the behaviors are tough. I think the second round is going to be pretty technical, especially at F.
John: [00:34:40] Yeah, I kind of looked into your database as well as Glassdoor. And yeah, they get a little more technical. And that's what I kind of wanted to ask. How do you know what? Obviously, you asked me about like debts and elbows. But when the first interview, when you ask me questions is more so about valuation, he asked me a couple of numbers like kind of brainteasers, like what would be the margin
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:09] I need for the valuation questions? So I went somewhere else.
John: [00:35:13] Yeah, yeah. Like I yeah, that's right. It was mostly like valuation questions like what's happened when they don't levered or. Yeah. And kind of basic, like one basic accounting question. It was super basic. I don't know how or why you asked me that one. But yeah, like, I definitely need this kind of study up on elbows and debts and definitely more accounting.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:38] Yeah. Just to have it's not like you need to know it inside or out or if you get one wrong, it's not the best. Try not to B.S. if you don't. If you're John sure you honestly, I'm not sure.
Speaker2: [00:35:47] And you just said,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:48] Yeah, you can just say and say, Honestly, I'm not sure this is what I know and just say what you know, just state what you know and don't try to sell it or BS because it'll. The most important thing is that you just come across as likable number one.
John: [00:36:03] So because I never knew how to approach those situations because I think I read somewhere, it's like, you know, try your best answer. The question will cost,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:12] Yeah, you should try your best and just start stating what you know so that that way it's one of those things where it's like, you're showing what you do know. Well, I know that leveraged buyouts when the private equity fund, blah, you know, you know, raises debt in order to lower their equity check and think that's how they juice returns, blah. But you know. Probably, I think I think it'll serve you, it'll serve you well if you don't oversell, and I don't think you did. I think I thought that was one of the better things is you didn't like bullshit too much. You didn't know something. What else could I tell you?
John: [00:36:51] Good question. Oh, something like I read online, this is just like one of those questions on door or I think one of your MWI. So somebody said, Oh, I got a question, how do you value a SAS company from equity partners, which I think is pretty reasonable question to be asked, is that kind of a reframe of the question you asked me? How do you value a company with no revenue for you? Kind of just look at the SaaS companies. Um, what's the term you used that kind of look at their metrics, operational metrics, operating metrics?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:26] Well, I mean, with SAS software as a service, they have no revenue. Yeah, you just project out the cash flows and discount them back to present value. But if you a SAS company, the ones they're going to be probably clients for, like NFD partners, it's one of those things where they I'm sure they have revenue, a lot of revenue. So projecting other costs will be a lot, probably just a lot more about. What their turn is, since it's a subscription software as a subscription. Really, it's a question of how much it costs to acquire customers, the cost of customer acquisition and specifically what their churn is, meaning how what's their attrition or like, how sticky is their product. So if they have like, let me give you an example, let's say it's a product that where they charge, I don't know, $1000 a month, but it costs them only like $500 to acquire a customer. And they're attrition or their churn is like only one percent a month or something like that or like or one percent a year. Like, it's amazing like
John: [00:38:31] The questions are really good.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:32] That's a really. Those are really good numbers, right? But let's say it's a $100 a month product. It costs $300 to acquire customer and returns turns at 30, you know, 20 percent a month. It's a much tougher business, right? So like those are critical metrics for any subscription service business, not just software. Okay.
John: [00:38:51] Okay. Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:53] So I think those are those would be key metrics and that's going to I bet you when you're building up the projecting revenue, that the projections on the revenue side, the operating metrics or those churn numbers and that revenue growth and the customer cost customer acquisition is really what's going to drive your income statement, which flows down to your cash flow.
John: [00:39:13] Gotcha. That makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:15] So, okay, so that's going to be really how you would value it. You would project out those, those really critical key metrics. And ideally, you have some history there. If it's I think FTEs does some smaller, more for some smaller companies, but they also they're working for some large SaaS companies as well, where yes, probably some are pretty industry and some insight in terms of how much you're going to close in the coming 12 to 18 months. Okay. Does that help?
John: [00:39:41] Yeah, that definitely helps things cool.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:44] And you could you probably value like the installed base? That's something the installed base of clients and then the future. I mean, I don't know. I never worked in SAS or fintech type. So I'm not 100 percent sure, but that's how I would answer the question.
John: [00:40:01] Got it. Got it. Ok. And then I think I don't know when we got to this, but I definitely I ask this and I kind of cut you off. But in terms like round two, since you asked me a lot of valuation questions, do you think he's going to the next guy is going to turn the page and kind of focus on accounting and elbows and maybe financing questions or M&A modeling? Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:28] Yeah. I think it's going to be technical, especially at FTX. It's going to be really technical, especially if it's an associate interviewing or an analyst. They may be tasked with specifically like asking you technical questions and just seeing that. Whereas if it's like an MD, it typically is more like, Hey, oh, tell me about this, or Oh, you went to see how I did, you know I had a friend? Yeah. It tends to be more chill. It's more like, Can you hang out? Yeah, I mean, is there a cultural fit? So it's funny because some people assume the analysts will be like that or the associates because they're more like your age, but it's actually not, not the case. Do they tend to be tasked with doing the more? Make sure you could pass the technical stuff.
John: [00:41:10] Makes sense. Makes sense. Ok.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:12] So yeah, I would. I would hit the technical course hard. I wouldn't necessarily go all the way to advance. Start with the basics because like, those are the most common, the basic and the intermediate, and make sure you have those down cold, like, like really, really cold. Because if you flame out or you say, I don't know and a super-advanced accounting and question or super advanced, I can guarantee you that's going to be less much less harmful than if you flame out or burn out on like walk me through a decaf or like, tell me about what's comparable to what a president transaction is. Got it! Okay. You can't do that. Those initial ones, those basic ones, you're just going get thrown out. Yeah, yeah. Whereas flame out on a really tricky accounting question or a weird brainteaser, they may just let it slide if they really like you.
John: [00:41:55] Yeah, OK. Makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO):: [00:41:57] So really drill hard on that, really? I would really I'd really encourage you to like when we get off this call literally right. Like, name your seven stories. Will like literally name your seven stories just in your head, be like the B the Y B can be like the that's one little thing and walk me through. Walk me through and walk me through and why I be walking through your resume. Why be bullets on each of those? Those are separate. But then tell me about your experiences. So bravely can be one. But specifically, what hard work at B. Riley work ethic and B Riley specific deals. Financial modeling at B. Riley What? What was the situation? What did it tell me a story? Tell me an actual story. Don't just tell me you did these things. I was responsible for this. Tell me about like, Oh, there was a deal. And I, you know, the analyst was really busy, another deal. And so I had to step up and do this model-like, you want to craft a story around your experiences such that you can bring people in to show, not tell them that you have the skills.
John: [00:42:59] Okay. Makes sense. Also, when you asked me about a specific deal, I'd B. Riley that I worked on, did I do well on that portion? Is there anything I can add to it? Because he asked me
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:11] That I might start asking you stuff about like industry there, but tell me about the battery industry I might tell. Ask you about comps. What are they trading at? You said ten times I might, I could have been starting. I could have been a jerk and started drilling down on that like, well, how much you know about the battery industry, what are other comps, you know? Do you know what I mean? Okay, that makes sense. Got to be a little careful. Whichever deal you choose, you should know a little bit about the industry and the landscape since you worked on the deal and you're theoretically doing that for the seller or was it a buyer? There's a sell-side, right?
John: [00:43:40] Sell side,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:41] Yeah. So you should know a little bit about like. You know who the buyers were? Why did you guys identify those specific buyers? What's the universe you went out to and why that type of thing? Was it all strategic? Or was it just were there any? It sounds like, you know, you were doing private equity and Private Equity Fund ended up buying it. Yes. Did you go to any strategic? Why not? Yeah. That type of thing,
John: [00:44:11] If I wasn't around for that portion like that like I kind of joined. Onto that project after, you know, they're kind of like already in talks with like two private equity groups. So I kind of missed out on the whole, you know, identifying the buyer universe and
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:31] I would learn it and I would be like, you know, I actually ended up joining midway through when they had already. They were already in talks with two private equity funds. But I do know looking at the documents of the deal that they had gone out to the strategic this. I mean, that'll take you like 20 minutes to look it up.
John: [00:44:46] Yeah, not bad.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:47] But that's important. Then it shows like that actually is a really good little window of opportunity to show that you were curious and you looked back. Okay, do you know what I'm saying? Or choose a different deal or choose a different deal? But if that's the one you actually did some modeling on and you did some of the work, like spreading the financials, all that stuff, then I would stick back because I think that's good.
John: [00:45:07] Okay, sounds good.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:09] But kill your arms, actually. Record yourself like you're doing now. Record yourself and doing the walk me through your resume. Record yourself. And if you want to send those to me independently, I'll just look at them and give you feedback. Record yourself doing the why I b, and then I literally want at least six other stories. I want group dynamic stories where like you had to step up as a leader, I want conflict stories. I want you to tell me when you struggle with the team I want like conflict story of when you struggle with a with somebody that was leading you, you disagreed and you can send me you can send all these answers in bullet form to me, like in an email. Okay, so that's going to be like, here's the situation. One bullet here is the task I was given or what my position within that organization or that story is. Here's the action. Here's what I did to kind of either fix it, go on. You add value, whatever it was. And then here was the result all we should have, like four bullets. And that's like really the best way to, I think, approach the behavioral, because I think if you have these stories, you're going to when you're telling it, it's not going that you're not going to be using. I work hard or I'm a hard worker. You're going to make a statement like that, but then you're quickly going to you're going to quickly just jump right into a story. Well, I think, you know, it's probably helpful if I tell you a little bit about my time over at this. When I was working on here, I were like, What's the longest you worked? You say 90 hours at B. Riley, you can say, instead of saying, oh, just 90 hours of bureau, you can say, Well, I'd be Riley one week. I remember we were working on this specific deal in the battery manufacturing space, and the analyst was tasked to do this. And we got a flood of PDFs coming over and somebody had to spread the comps and I was there all night spreading or I was there all night spreading the financials because we had to get from annual to monthly. And that's a really good detail that you don't want to leave out. You don't want to forget to give me that. That perspective, because then I'm picturing you in the office like working hard and just getting through it.
John: [00:47:14] Okay? Can you beat those four bullets above scenario and then action and result? I know I'm missing one star.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:47:20] So task so like scenario task action results task is like what you were. And this is all in the behavioral course. So at the beginning, I think in the first few here I can go. There I'm in the behavioral. I mean, the technical let me go back. Behavioral right here. General preparation here, you. Yet the star story is so right here. There are examples in the course as well. Something some people might do if they want to try to catch you off and they'll be like, Tell me where the market's at. Do you know what I mean? So you've got to be ready for that to.
John: [00:48:12] Gotcha.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:48:14] Yeah, general tips, I don't think that's. Meteor. Here we go. Describe the situation, describe the task. Describe the action, describe the results. Okay. Got it. Anyone can say he or she is a hard worker willing to do mindless tasks. Blah, what you have to do to show your interview that you can do this by using detailed examples from your past. Okay. Maybe you were the editor of your school newspaper, a news story broke two days before printing you led your team through coordinated crash effort to get the whole story into paper with no mistakes. So like, that's one example. Mm hmm. But you become it becomes much more believable when you use this framework because you'll just naturally start pulling in stories from your past as examples.
John: [00:48:58] Yeah. I mean, yeah. Yeah, I know A&M when I was interviewing with them all, their behavioral interviews were start questions. A lot of. It's like, no, no question they asked me was to walk me through resume or, yeah, technical, it was all like situational.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:19] Yeah. And so that's why I'm saying you should have seven stores that you can pull from. Like when somebody asks you, what are your greatest strengths or tell me why we should pick you instead of all these people? It's the same question. Yeah, it's the same question. So like you saying, my strengths are our hardware, our work ethic, adaptability, and blah. Ok, I'm like a sleepover here listening to you, right? Show me. Don't tell me. Show me.
John: [00:49:46] Gotcha. Gotcha. Ok.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:51] It'll really make a dramatic difference in terms of how, how well it's received. Make sure that you can back it up if they start asking details about the story and they dig in. The same holds true, not overselling yourself and making sure that you're ready for follow-up questions. So like knowing the stuff there, but I think the really good stuff, your other internship, you should be able to have at least one good story or two there. And I don't know any other like really competitive things you've done or stuff you've done from your past or time you look in as a team, I think is a great example, a great way to kind of demonstrate that
John: [00:50:39] It is okay. Yeah, that makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:43] Um, I know you're like, Oh, shoot, I'm going into these second-round interviews, so I got to prepare tech, but like, you shouldn't underestimate this stuff because. If you get the basic and the intermediate techs like you're feeling better, you should really invest here in terms of getting just at least six six doors. I mean, by the time I had done like 30 interviews out, that's just naturally what happened in like looking back, I'm like, Man, I should have just outlined all these stories and knew exactly what I was going to say on every single one by the end before they even finished the question. Like, in my head, I'm going like, Do I want to use this one? I should probably say that one for later, just in case something like this is my last like weaknesses story, weakness story that I can pull from. But you want a story where you can talk about like something you're working on or a weakness, like whether that's public speaking or financial modeling or whatever. So you don't want to go there like certain stories you kind of know you need for certain common questions and other stories. You know, you have like some redundancy so you can pull from this one and then from that one. Mm hmm. That makes sense. Yeah. You get that. You'll get that feel as you practice more so. Yeah, I hear you. It's a skill like anything else, man. Yeah, it's like a movie. You play basketball, right? So it's like you get the ball. Like, let's say you get the ball in the low post, right? And you're like, OK, all you have is this like this one move? Or you're like a fade away or whatever a jump hook or whatever, like having all the other answers or a prepped is like you literally going through the drills over and over again and trying, trying different moves. It's all it is.
John: [00:52:16] Yeah, it gives you an arsenal. It gives you a lot of answers.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:52:19] Yeah. You don't even have to think about. That's the key. There shouldn't be any. No. Let me think of a time that that happened. Like, No, dude, like, you should have done that a long time ago.
John: [00:52:30] Yeah, I remember. I remember. I think one of my earlier phone calls you mentioned that by the 15th interview or one of your final interviews, it was less about the actual answer, but more about delivery. And I guess that's the point I'm trying to get to.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:52:45] Yeah. And I don't think you did poorly. I think you're a little rattle on some of the technical stuff, but I liked how genuine you were. I still think you're a super likable guy, so I think you have that going for you, but you do need to tighten up the technicals if you're going to have a chance. I'll let you run. I know you got to go soon. You do need to tighten up the technicals, for sure. And I think you do just have something you can go to faster on those stories, like jumping stories. And I think it's going to be much better. We can do another one in like a couple of weeks or whatever. Yeah, definitely. It sounds like you're going to keep getting interviews, so that's good. The rest is working.
John: [00:53:23] Yeah. Yes, thank you. Definitely helping, yeah. Like the lady, the lady from when Bush was like, we really like, do you like, emphasize like my resume, like my experiences? And she's like, Wow, we really liked it. And then also the case study that I worked on definitely helped, too. Yeah. So I'm super excited about that one as well. Just all them in general. So. I know. I know.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:53:47] Yeah, they're we're now two, four. Like. Uh, Andrew, just got an internship offer. Really? Yes. Your next did your next.
John: [00:53:58] Oh man, I got to speed it up.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:03] No pressure. No pressure.
John: [00:54:05] You could be in New York.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:07] He's going to be in Toronto.
John: [00:54:09] Ok, that's where he's from, though, right? He's on the air.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:12] Yeah, yeah. Yeah, he's up there. The tiny little non-target up there.
John: [00:54:16] Gotcha. Gotcha. Ok, that makes sense. That's awesome. I'm sorry. I'm too bad for him.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:21] Yeah, no. I think you're going to do well, man. I think you just got to tighten it up a little bit. Don't slow down on your prep, like this week's is critical. Like, you don't want to let all these go by because you just like didn't know how to do something basic. You do know how to do the value. You know how to answer valuation questions in basic accounting things.
John: [00:54:42] Mm hmm. Do you have a specific method for me, like when I study like anything, I'd kind of like read and then write it down? One of the interns at B. Riley had no cards, flashcards.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:53] There's flashcards in the, of course, download. Those actually do it.
John: [00:54:58] Okay. Gotcha, gotcha. Ok, I wanted to ask if you had any like
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:01] Everywhere, just be like boom, boom, flip, boom, flip, boom,
John: [00:55:05] Flip. Okay. Yeah, I'll definitely do that right now then. Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:08] There's not that many, but like, that's the best way. Just drilling man. Just for the technicals, especially just drills, so that you're not caught off guard by 90 percent of the technicals. You'll just quickly be like, Oh yeah, that's the success in this. Just make sure when you're answering the technicals, if you don't understand, like conceptually what something means because the flashcards are good for, like quick drilling. But if you might have to go back and actually look at the course to understand specifically like, OK, what's the context of this like? I can say this word or this abbreviation. I have no idea what it means, and you can kind of get screwed. They're like, Well, what does that mean? And why would we ever do that? What is it? I would be ever on Lepre. Yeah, why would we ever, ever unlevered beta and end it in the course? We do have the question, the sample answer, and then a follow-up question and sample answer. So we try to anticipate the follow-ups, too. But just make sure you look
John: [00:55:51] At those yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:52] Well, and understand conceptually like what the bank is doing, what the what's the point of the task? So you understand that so you can communicate like, you know, you get it like you understand what a bank does.
John: [00:56:05] Yeah, makes sense. Ok, so
Patrick (CEO of WSO):: [00:56:08] Did your kids do not worry you're in good shape, I think just keep pushing this week, and
John: [00:56:16] I think that's going to be crucial.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:18] This week is crucial, man. Am I going to lie? I'm not going to lie.
John: [00:56:21] Yeah, you sure.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:22] Don't make sure you get to sleep, but you should be staying up, you know, to a decent hour.
John: [00:56:27] Drilling Yeah, I definitely will be. I don't have any midterms going on this week, so this is going to be straight technicals and behavioral as well.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:35] So tell me, OK, so you don't know when what Wedbush is or you do.
John: [00:56:40] So yeah, I don't know what Wedbush is. I don't even know where he is. I have an in-person with the boutique Newport Beach Friday. And then A&M A&M got back to me last week since I think patched me this week. Honestly, I don't want that. One is just like, I'm not too concerned about investing. Making is still like that had
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:01] Part about A&M. Delaying is now you have some things cooking. Yeah, yeah, and so imagine if aid had given you the offer two weeks ago and you're in that really tough spot where you didn't have much cooking.
John: [00:57:13] Yeah, that's true. Now I kind of get more leverage. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:20] It's more about like, yeah, get if you get the A&M offer, dude. I can almost guarantee you get one of the offers from the places. Yeah. You hope that offer comes through like next week would be beautiful because then you've already done a couple like the second rounds and you can let them know like, I got an offer, but I still would like. I prefer to be in banking and your firm and at your firm specifically. So. The other thing you need to. Point out, like if they ask you specifically like, well, it's our firm and number one choice, sometimes these boutique firms can be a little bit not like the boutique, but sometimes they can like a Wedbush or an FFT, it can be a little bit. I don't know a little bit petty about like, well, are you going to renege or stuff like that? Yeah. I think one of the good things you could say is like, this is absolutely like my first choice I'd absolutely signed today if given the offer. Just be like straight up, like you're ready to go, and I think you should be doing that now and your senior year, like without like you shouldn't be messing around. Yeah. Don't mess around and play cute because it could piss them off. And if you're borderline, if you're like the borderline between them, thinking you and this other guy who happens to go a little bit more name, brand, whatever it happens to be like, you want to give them confidence, like, Hey, if we got this guy, he's locked and loaded like I. If you give me the offer today, I'd sign. Absolutely. I have another offer from this other firm. I need to let them know by this Friday. Obviously, I knew I want a job. I want to make sure I have a job when I graduate, but you can be sure that I would. I would come here. I think that's a perfectly fine way to answer it, and I think it's going give them confidence. It will help you get the offer.
John: [00:59:02] Make sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:03] Okay, that cool, man.
John: [00:59:06] Yeah, it sounds great.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:08] I'm excited for you. Oh, you better give me some good news in a couple of weeks.
John: [00:59:12] I hope so. I sure hope so.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:15] Just buckle down, man. Just buckle down. Try to work late these next few nights, you know, midnight, 1:00 a.m. Whatever it has to be to just get comfortable.
John: [00:59:22] Yeah, we'll do. Also, I don't know how I'm feeling about your hat.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:27] No. Yeah, go see.
John: [00:59:29] Kicking ass. No, they're doing great. They're doing great, though.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:34] Who are you? A Lakers fan? Of course, you are. You're L.A. Yeah, my wife's from the area, but I've forced her to become a Boston fan on everything. I even got like, Oh, really? Yeah, I got her tuchus jersey. She was a Brunson. Now I'm like, fully indoctrinating her.
John: [00:59:52] Yeah. Oh man, the Lakers could be.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:55] You never know. It could be the Lakers. Celtics final. You never know.
John: [00:59:59] Yeah. And I know that's what I told my friends. I mean, they were both leading the charts in a couple of games ago. I mean, you can definitely see happen. Anything can happen in the playoffs.
Patrick (CEO of WSO):: [01:00:06] So these are deeper men. These are much deeper.
John: [01:00:10] Yeah. Ok, we'll see. I'm excited. I mean, hopefully, hopefully we do play each other. It will be awesome.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:17] It would be awesome. Ok, well, listen. Good luck with everything. Definitely. Yeah. Just be ready this week. Be ready on Friday with that boutique. Take it really seriously, and I think you'll be in good shape. The other good thing is if you get the offer from the boutique, you're in good shape for the others. You can just let them know immediately.
John: [01:00:37] Ok, sounds good. Let them know immediately, I'll take the offer.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:40] No, no, no, no. For the boutique, I would tell them, great. Oh, so thank you. Thank you, blah. I'm saying for what bush are for the other ones. Unless this boutique maybe just message me after I'll take a look at it. But unless a boutique does really well, sometimes these small little boutiques are do really well.
John: [01:00:59] And so just a month or two, sometimes I do a lot of financing for health care and tech companies. They're super, super small, and I think there's only one partner to associates like one analyst or two analysts. I'm like one other principle that's in and out, I heard.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:01:17] Ok, so yeah, you probably would prefer an T or a Wedbush over that. Yeah. So if they give you an offer you. I am super grateful. Let me just give it some thought over the week, you know? Can I get back to you within a week or so? And then just let the other guys know. We'll do because if they start turning off strong-arm you and push you to accept, I think just I think that's a totally fair request.
John: [01:01:43] Makes sense. Got it. Thanks so much, Patrick. Good luck. Thanks, man. I'll let you know I'll get back to oh, excuse me, get back to you with these like seven stories, if not tomorrow.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:01:56] Awesome, dude. Yeah. Good luck with everything. Ok? Keep me updated.
John: [01:01:59] Thank you so much.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:02:01] And thanks to you, my listeners at Wall Street, Oasis, if you have any suggestions whatsoever, please don't hesitate to send them my way. Patrick at Wall Street Oasis. And till next time.
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