Help. Feeling Lost
Long story short had a mental breakdown today. Currently an associate in MF PE and have been working non stop the past three months running on 4-6 hrs of sleep consistently even on weekends. Screwed up on a deliverable primarily from being stretched too thin and got berated at by VP
Coming up on a year and already know I will be pushed out given it’s a 2-year and out associate program.
does anyone have any advice as to potential other PE/Finance roles? Really not a fan of portco work and spending all night doing model work that won’t be anywhere near the actual company’s performance. Should I look at direct lending? FoF? Biz dev? Startup? Honestly looking for any advice or experiences from others who were in my position.
I think you're on the right track - credit, secondaries, FoF etc are all good ideas if you like the work but don't want to work MF buyout hours anymore. Luckily with your pedigree you'll have a menu of options, even in this market, so you can start talking to HHs to get an idea of what's out there if you want to. Or more "lifestyle" jobs like corp dev or asset management are always an option.
I personally wouldn't go startup in this environment - timing is everything in that world and this is a rough environment - but I'm risk averse
Go to business school. You have the money and the 2 years vacation is exactly for people like you who have snapped. You can take the time to figure out what you want rather than jump to something now out of a panic realization that you can’t take it anymore. Just my .02.
First, I would advise you to take some sick days. Just call in sick, honestly seems like you need the rest.
Second, figure out whether you really like PE investing or not. If you really do like it, then just lateral to another firm. I'm guessing you worked in IB before for two years, and now you're at a MF. That's three years of long hours, and seems like you're at a real grind house there. As other commenters said, you won't have troubles getting looked at by other firms. But this time around, instead of focusing on getting ANY firm, focus on getting THE firm. I.e. do your research (WSO, H1B, LinkedIn, own network, etc.), figure out what specific firms or type of firms (MF, UMM, MM, FO, etc.) suits the lifestyle you want, and be very specific with recruiters. I can assure you that not all PE firms have you on 4-6 hours of sleep for 3 months straight including weekends...
If you don't want PE anymore, then you should start considering what you really want. And doing an MBA as a time to reflect isn't bad either. You already have killer experience, so I would suggest you really take some time to think about what you want right now and go after it. Keep your head up and crack on.
Agree with other posts here, you have options so try to take a step back to appreciate that and allow yourself to feel confident about your position/trajectory. The implications for each path are very different given the broad aperture defined by this discussion, so I would emphasize the point made in one of the posts above and suggest that you take your time, research, and operate intentionally. Easier said than done given the constraints you articulated, obviously you were driven to post for a reason, but you'll get through this. Worse comes to worst, if your situation persists for much longer then try to get comfortable settling for middle-of-the-road effort/work product in the aspects of the job that are marginal enough to not put entire workstreams at risk yet impactful enough to contribute to the preservation of your sanity and mental health (small things add up here, i.e. if distributing notes from a call or MP then cut out the incremental 15-30 minutes of meticulous editing).
Also, and only you will know how applicable this is, but given the fact that the interaction with your VP seems to have been the trigger for your breakdown (understood that it was just the breaking point and not the only thing on your mind), I would suggest subtly shifting your mindset. Early in my career, I had the displeasure of working for individuals that were objectively infuriating in how they managed processes and allowed their stress to manifest in very unhelpful and emotionally charged ways. This is easier if you otherwise think your VP/manager has good intentions and simply struggles to regulate their emotions, but at one point I just realized that I shouldn't take unnecessary blowups or seemingly targeted and angry criticism personally, regardless of whether mitigating factors like positive intent exist. While there might be genuinely helpful feedback somewhere in there (often the case), the folks who act like that consistently are the ones with the problem. You learn to either take it in stride (if there's positive intent), or just tune out the annoying/hurtful stuff and not take it seriously. It's very rare that folks in that mold will be well-respected, as the negative personality quirks underlying your interactions will manifest elsewhere; your focus should be on those who both are competent and demonstrate a consistent dedication to professionalism/cordiality.
Outside of the above, I wanted to add my support. I also did my pre-MBA associate years at a MF, and it was taxing. I know it's extremely difficult to maintain perspective in the midst of overwhelmingly strenuous stretches. It's also very, very challenging to reconcile certain mental/emotional aspects of your situation; you likely derive an immense amount of pride/reassurance in the personal qualities you attribute to your success thus far, but in the really tough times you begin to interpret each setback as evidence that contradicts the narrative you've established about yourself. That cognitive dissonance compounds in a very toxic way, which at best is discouraging.
I've been where you are mentally, so allow me to share with you the words that gave me license to open my eyes and begin to turn things around: while you may be questioning a lot of things, in particular the story you've been telling yourself about the path to your current situation, you should know that the emerging narrative underlying your self-doubt is the actual lie here homie. Two things can be true at the same time: your success isn't a coincidence - options were open to you for a reason - yet the specific situation you find yourself in might not be right for you and/or has likely been influenced by factors outside of your control.
OP here. Really appreciate the words and completely agree that I have serious imposter syndrome atm. Did 2 years of banking ay BB and was top quartile (not top bucket but definitely well regarded) and have never had a breakdown like I did even at my previous group which WSO seems it as a sweatshop.
My take is that I need to be proactive here in the next month or so and start reaching out to HH’s. I try to convince myself that I enjoy the industry because as you mentioned a lot of my identity (and many peoples identity) is so tied to my job/career. I do enjoy investing but there are components of the job I can’t stand / recognize I’m naturally not good at (I.e technical acumen). Any perspectives on potential roles within PE/Growth/VC you’d recommend?
Same person who posted the comment you responded to.
Tough to give advice without knowing more about what you're trying to optimize for. You've mentioned what you don't like and areas that you might not be as naturally strong in, but haven't been super specific about what you enjoy and/or would look for in a next role.
I would do a simple exercise where you divide a piece of paper into two columns, one for the aspects of the job you enjoy and would like to see in your next role. This should be your focus and might be more difficult than filling out the other column (where you'll list the negatives).
Once you've completed that, feel free to post the results here for folks (including myself) to respond to.
No advice but sending positives vibes man 🖤, don’t forget to talk to people, treat yourself, and all that other stuff. You got this 😤😤😤
Know people who moved to FOF co-investment and seem to enjoy it. You do minimal portfolio work and just keep underwriting deals. Downside is probably you are not in the driver seat anymore if you care about that.
I'm sorry you are in the position you are in. The VP who posted had some phenomenal advice. A couple of things I'll add as you navigate this season of your career. First, I hope you realize by now you realize you aren't alone in your experience, nor your feelings. This is important to remember as it's easy for someone with imposter syndrome to internally paint a narrative that somehow they bamboozled all their peers and somehow are in a unique situation where they are being "discovered" as a "fraud". Also, I want you to realize how abrupt the changes are for juniors in finance so you can hopefully better manage future situations. In finance, you take incredibly brilliant individuals who are very used to the academic system of constant positive feedback (grades, winning internship, praise from peers for securing FT offer) along with the immense benefit of exploring new subjects frequently. You take those very individuals and remove nearly all autonomy in determining how to best spend their time AND make them work on very specific tasks that are more often than not ereally intellectually stimulating. It's a very drastic shift and it can be very demoralizing if left unchecked. It's imperative for you to decouple your worth, abilities, and intellectual sophistication from your job. I say all this because whether you switch to another role or company, you'll have this underlying ticking-time bomb if you don't decouple your self-worth from your job. Said in another way, this is one part of having "thick-skin" and learning how to pragmatically assess when someone is berating you if it's truly warranted or if the person is just being unhinged and has their own issues to figure out.
In terms of next roles, you should take time to rest (get some sleep and exercise) and evaluate what you may want to do long-term before scrambling for the next job. You probably aren't in the right state of mind, given the lack of rest, to make a great judgement of what your long-term goals are. Do you actually enjoy PE and maybe LMM or MM is where you'll be more happy? Maybe you love investing but maybe the public markets are more suited for your desires? Or you could actually care less about investing and just like the comp, which is totally fine as well. You say you aren't interested in portco-work, why is that? Your MF experience is such a small sliver of the entirety of the US PE market. The forum can definitely throw a crap ton of ideas and see what sticks, but only you and those close to you can truly provide meaningful guidance on what you may want to pursue long-term.
Get some rest, take care of yourself, and rest assured you have options.
One other avenue you could consider if you still enjoy PE investing is MM PE. It’ll be easier to move downstream given MF pedigree and generally have better hours and culture. Comp will be lower but still very significant in the long run (multiples of corp dev in long run). Just be sure to do your diligence on culture prior to hopping. Push out start date once you get it, get your head right with some travel and relaxation and start back up on the right track! You got this man.
Others have already nailed the best pieces of advice here. I’d build on the VPs idea of a list of parts of your job you enjoy and would want in the next one vs. those you don’t. After being burnt out in PE I did an MBA and created a similar list. I created a list like this for every job I’ve ever had. I supplemented it with thinking about my ideal life - today and in the future. What is most important to me outside of work - what do I believe I need to protect to help me be a fulfilled person. I talked to MBA alumni in every career path possible and evaluated each role against my map of pros/cons for a job and whether it would force me to sacrifice the outside work elements that were most important to me. This was incredibly helpful, and I’m more confident now than ever that I’m pursuing a career that’s right for me.
Take your time with this, be honest with yourself, and try to go through the process with a clear state of mind. You want to go in unbiased, truth seeking, no forced answers. It’s investing but for something far more important than any deal - it’s your life.
As others said, if you have a list I’m happy to share what careers I think would be great options for you to explore.
Good luck. Better times are ahead.
I've been in a similar place. Promise you, you'll be fine. In the moment it probably feels like there's some massive opportunity cost from diverging from "the path" (though if you lateral or get into Harvard or Stanford, you'd be right back on it) but you'll come to realize there's enough money out there without remaining in PE your whole career to not feel like you've missed out.
Finding your third job should be much more targetted - you need to decide for max two categories as they require super different approach and loads of networking... I also have many friends who left the IBD / PE world and are living much more meaningful life so do not get scared but rather enjoy the process
Best options outside of MF PE that are closely related and will allow your skills to transfer:
Compared to MF PE, all of these options will have lower comp (but still good comp), but should allow you to have more of a life and avoid spending 100+ hours a week in an extremely high pressure environment.
What city are you in?
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