Realism of HSW With a Generic PE Background
Hey everyone. I’m a first year associate at a MM PE (~$1b fund) shop. I’m interested in pursuing business school in the future and have an M7 deferred admit from undergrad. I’m actually a big fan of the school for a number of reasons but after speaking with people in the industry, the consensus seems to be that if I have a good seat and a path to promotion, the ROI simply doesn’t make sense if I intend to stay on the buyside unless I go to H, S, or to a lesser extent W and materially trade up in fund AUM post MBA recruiting.
Stats:
ORM
3.6 STEM major from a top public
GMAT: 740, have tested as high as 780 on the GMAT official practice exams and think I could consistently perform this well on a retake given enough studying
If it helps, I can secure LORs from direct managers from each of these schools. I am pretty confident these will be very strong and I know they think highly of me.
EC front is light. Ran a fairly sizable community service club in college and I’m working on some alumni association work but nothing super notable post college give the time demands of the job.
My firm itself has a pretty direct ESG angle that I’m personally passionate about and have some related experience in but nothing that would jump out on an application as of yet.
Given the above, I’m thinking of biting the cost bullet and getting a top admissions consultant vs my strategy applying deferred which was trying to figure it all out myself.
Appreciate any advice in advance.
Is your current firm unwilling to promote you if you don’t go to HSW?
I don’t really think you need this forum to “chance” you and I don’t think most people would be able to do a good job of that based on what I’ve seen happen this year in admissions to highly qualified peers of mine.
If you have decided that you want to apply to HSW, you should just go for it. Frankly don’t know enough about you at all to decide if it is realistic at all and at the end of the day it’s a personal decision that folks make to apply. On stats alone you don’t look great (which I think you know) but that doesn’t mean you can’t get in. Applying to b school is obviously very competitive now and you should try to get a consultant to help you. I can tell you for sure other folks will get a consultant and probably be able to package up something better than just just themselves thinking through it.
Honestly only you will know. Look at your app and ask yourself if you’ve got the good stuff
the nice part is it sounds like you’re in a good position now so applying would be all upside
Talk to admissions consultants. IMO, if you execute on story, Wharton should be very achievable with your profile. H/ S is always a bit more of a crapshoot.
Was in a very similar position to you a few years back and applied with a class of three other associates. It’s honestly a crap shoot - one ended up going to Stanford GSB, two of us (myself included) were dinged from HSW but into B/K/C (each with a ~50% merit scholarship), and one was dinged from all of the M7. Each of us had similar stats (3.6-3.9 GPA, 720-760 GMAT, T25-75 UG) so I think it just goes to show the variability of the process.
We all used different consultants and had mixed experiences — mine was a huge waste of time IMO but another coworker swears his was the reason he was admitted. I would only use a consultant you have a personal recommendation / referral to vs. taking the luck of the draw from one of the big sites because it really varies.
On the recruiting front, I ended up attending one of Booth/Columbia/Kellogg. I think those three are more or less interchangeable when it comes to PE recruiting but have distinct cultures. In my class, everyone who wanted a PE job got one and generally ended up at a similar fund to their previous role and the folks who were very intentional about geography, industry, size, etc. were able to make it work. I was actually able to trade up a bit relative to my prior fund in terms of pedigree / fund size which I’d attribute to a lot of networking, great deal reps as an associate, and fun/interesting/offbeat summer internship, and, frankly, luck.
Overall, I thoroughly enjoyed my time in school and ended up with a job I’m happy with and think most/all my peers had a similar experience. My two hang ups are as follows:
i) my network in PE just isn’t as strong as it would have been if I had gone of H/W. Maybe 10-20 people in my class came from legit PE funds vs. several hundred at H/W so sometimes I feel like there are fewer people I can reach out to when the time comes. The flip side of course is I know the 10-20 people very well and I’m much more confident they’d respond to a cold text or email
ii) Two years off is a blessing and a curse. I felt refreshed and ready to go after having a lot of fun in school but did miss out on two years of deal reps and progression. I have friends who played it straight through at the MD/Partner level now and they really took advantage of their SA/junior VP years while I was out partying. I’m sure it’ll all even out in another 5 years or so but I do feel a bit behind where I could have been.
Thanks for sharing the above - found it very helpful. I am also in the same boat as OP. When it comes to CBS/Kellogg, is there a chance of not being able to get back into PE as senior associate post-MBA due to the more limited network (assuming you don’t plan to return to the same fund)? Are there risks outside of the opportunity cost you already outlined?
Agree with most of what was mentioned here, but would just flag these aren't really similar stats in the context of MBA applicants given how selective schools can be for PE applicants (e.g., 720 v. 760 is materially different on GMAT).
OP - unless there is some truly unique angle / story (which perhaps an admissions consultant could help pull out) for you, I would say there is a very low shot at H / S for you unfortunately as they've really gotten less interested in traditional finance applicants and there are enough top PE folks to fill the seats they do have. W would be achievable, but you'll benefit from pushing your GMAT a bit higher if you can since you don't seem to have standout brands on your resume (more run of the mill PE). As a broader comment, the ROI in general for people coming from a pre-MBA PE background isn't there for the MBA - the reason to do it is more if you actually value the MBA experience, which is a personal decision.
If someone did a 3-year analyst stint at a good IB before joining a UMM PE firm would this 3-year stint be looked down upon versus a typical 2-year banking stint for adcoms evaluating an MBA profile?
Good post, I agree with all of this.
The one thing I'd add is to think about what you want your post-MBA career to be. Where H/S/W help with are access to bigger funds that typically have very few post-MBA seats. If your thought process is "well if I'm going to take 2 years off and spend all that money on school, I better end up at a bigger fund and ideally a UMM/MF" then you'd be best served to have a little more of an H/S/W or bust type of mentality.
If you're hoping to not close the door entirely on PE, but are open to mid-size funds, non major city funds, etc, then the rest of the M7 will still present enough opportunities that if you apply yourself and have good prior PE experience, that you'll more than likely end up at a solid fund.
As far as your chances go, as others have said, it's a crapshoot, especially for ORM, non brand name PE folks. My general sense is that you chances would be worst chances at Stanford, a little better at Harvard, and best at Wharton, with best chances being a coinflip at Wharton.
If I were you, I'd keep the MBA in your back pocket, give it another year, and see how the rest of your PE stint plays out. There are plenty of life experiences that may push you one way or another.
Definitely get your GMAT to 780 - that will help you get into W for sure. Regardless of what people tell you, there is a material difference between a 750 and 780 if you are in private equity. Also hire a consultant - my friends and I have worked with a few and they are very helpful. I can give you recs.
In my MF, this year, every ORM who got into H/S who got in had 770-780 and 3.9+ GPAs. Though not all from target schools. You are competing with the people in your same PE group. I think the high gmat will get you into Wharton for sure (they really care about the high gmat), but as I look to the GSB class composition, it will help you but won't guarantee you anything. Ideal candidate has the stats + some sort of x factor story. HBS has been an absolute crapshoot at MFs this year, really strange.
Would love to take you up on talking through the consultant recommendations.
Didn't know it was this competitive tbh, at an MF, and had a 730 / 3.7 GPA (T30 Undergrad). Got into HBS (ding at GSB) didn't think I had much of a unique story
For avoidance of doubt, I am an ORM (Asian American)
what class were you? recent years might be a bit more competitive
Also interested in hearing consultant recommendations. Could you PM?
HBS has been a crapshoot the last few years at MFs, not really new this year. In general H / S both have shied away from traditional PE candidates, especially if not female / URM. I think 780 GMAT is a pretty difficult score to get as even for good test takers there is an element of luck on test day at that level (literally 1-2 questions can put you out of range), but 760+ is where you need to be to feel comfortable on the test scores as an ORM PE applicant
You have thoughts on the Focus scoring? Got a 735 which is roughly a 760-770 on the old one. Wouldn’t retake a 770, but 735 kinda just sounds low and worried that others will retake due to similar thinking.
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