For Investment Bankers at the Associate Level and Beyond: I need your advice regarding my post-MBA opportunities
Hello everybody,
Firstly, thank you for taking the time to respond. So I am currently immersed in the MBA application process, and I have already secured interviews with 3 schools ranked in the 11-15 range, 1 school in the top 10, and 1 school in the top 5. Basically I think I will get into at least 1 school that will endow me with the ability to transition into banking. Here are my issues:
Issue 1 - I did my undergrad internship at a tier 2 BB (Barclays, CS, etc). I secured an offer, but I had to decline to be closer to my family (immediate family member was dealing with a major health issue).
Issue 2- After undergrad I transitioned to public sector consulting with a tier 2 firm (Deloitte, Accenture, Booz Allen, etc) doing some really cool and unique global work in health and security. After 2 years, I decided to spend the final year before my MBA volunteering full-time on an issue that I care deeply about.
My question is this: How will potential banks look at my decision not to continue with banking after undergrad, and my decision to volunteer for a year? I think my reasoning for the first one is solid, but on the second one, I just knew that I wouldn't have anytime post-MBA to work on this issue. It has taught me a lot, particularly how to manage teams and stakeholders, but would somebody looking at my resume for a summer internship completely discount that?
Thanks for your advice.
It should be pretty easy for you to land a banking gig. B-school is a fresh start. Nobody will care about this stuff, only your preparation and motivation
I appreciate the encouragement. Especially coming from you Mr. Paulson.
Your summer internship won't even be on your resume (which by no means should be more than a page long) so no one will even know that you gave it a try and decided not to do it. It may raise questions from the admissions committee but even then it should be pretty easy to spin as you got a taste of it, wish you could have pursued it and now are going back to school to course correct. The analyst job is so much different than the associate roll anyway.
As far as volunteering, banks like volunteers, they like passion....tell the story why you took time off to pursue that route (and better yet spin it for leadership). There are tons of MBA banking candidates that did Teach for America, Peace Corps, City Year, etc...
If you're worried about profile and the internship on your resume, I wouldn't be. I included my internship from college years on my resume (went into a different industry FT), only received maybe 1-2 questions about it over 40+ networking meetings/informational interviews with bankers. If you are still worried about it, just leave it off your resume.
One of the misnomers about MBA is that it's a fresh start but in my view it comes with a ton of caveats, particularly for banking recruiting (it is different for other industries for a variety of reasons).
In general you go to b school to rubber stamp your cv, get the network, and get a fresh start in terms of career direction. Unfortunately a b school decision may also exacerbate the prestige and perception issues associated with education in general. At best it doesn't help and at worst it takes away from your other accomplishments.
I say this because It depends on the school - going to a top 5 b school will be viewed with the same light as a top undergrad program. the opposite is also true. Going to a sub 10 or even 15 school - why bother. Banks and most other institutions want the credibility of an HBS or Wharton and they target that for b school hires. Lower schools fall out of targets and the hurdle goes up considerably as you go below the rankings list.
I have seen some instances of a guy going to top 10 undergrad then a not so great b school and it is viewed negatively. It raises questions of motivations, drive, etc
Unfortunately and fortunately this is just finance. In other areas mba is still a sign of maturity, advanced professional and academic skills and network and for some a meaningful change in course in careers.
However I would decide on which MBA program with a very discerning eye and frankly if your goal is just IBD, then pick a top mba program. We are no likely to pick a tier 2 MBa program as we are a tier 2 undergraduate institution.
The only benefit at them back level is that your the benefit of your cv and the fact that there are fewer Mia programs so more of them are "ranked"
This is not meant to encourage or discourage you but want to give you a pretty realistic view of how much of a reset mba actually is if you want to be a banker
You are categorically wrong if you think you need to go to a top 5 b-school to get into IBD. First of all, not that many people from HBS or Stanford even go into banking.
MIT and Kellogg also don't place a ton of people in IB if you want to discuss the top 7.
Yes you need to go to a top 15 b school to get offers (or be very selective outside it), but to say if you don't get into a top 5 school why bother is terrible advice. Top 15 fine...top 5...nope.
Thank you Dat Guy. I was thinking about seeking a pre-MBA banking intership to add to the resume. Am I overthinking it? Should I just enjoy my summer?
I wouldn't be too worried. I went to a top 15 MBA program that isn't known for finance and every domestic student got an IBD internship if they kept their head down and did all that was recommended by the MBA 2s/Finance Club
Thank you for the response, ab216
Thanks everyone for the responses. Also for those in the know, I've been accepted to Yale SOM (no money) and Cornell Johnson (with 80% tuition scholarship). I am leaning towards Johnson as they seem to be very strong on the Street, but Yale seems to be on the upswing. What are your perspectives?
Go to Johnson. Yale is a great school, but Yale's reputation is as more of a feeder into think tanks and non-profits whereas Johnson is a finance feeder.
Yale has a very strong trajectory. At this point, I'd take Yale since you are going into banking. If you were interested in doing something that weren't as strong from a remuneration standpoint, my perspective on the matter may differ. The Yale name goes far, and it places significantly better than Cornell at top 3 banks except for GS, which doesn't recruit at either school as per conversations that I've had with students.
For some perspective, I just recently went through this process and I ultimately selected a higher ranked school over a slightly lower ranked one that offered a full ride. I talked to many people at Yale and only one at Cornell so please do take this with a grain of salt, but I was impressed with Yale's recent finance placements. I think the best thing for you to do is to have an in-depth discussion with the head of the finance club at each program and get into the nuts and bolts of where people are being placed, which banks came to campus, etc.
Best of luck! Please do update at some point with your final decision!
Yale just came back with 30k for each year. I just had a much more positive experience from my visit to Johnson (though I dont want to make an MBA decision based on a one day visit) and I sort of gave a verbal commitment to a member of Johnson's adcom that I would accept (I think I just got too happy over the phone....but now I feel as if I have to stick to my word).
This is a very confusing situation..but I am grateful that I have such a problem on my hands. What is your perspective on the verbal agreement? Would I be completely out of line to renege?
I'll shoot you a PM
Just this one time, I think it's okay to renege.
You should NOT think that reneging is something that you are allowed to do - in fact, I'd say you should never do it in any situation. But, here in b-school admissions and having gone through the process, I'll make a one-time exception given your situation and say that it's absolutely fine and it'll not come back to bite you. Seriously, it won't matter at all...just don't do it again (and especially not to any employers!).
Regarding choices, I think you should do some homework on Yale as I'm not sure how well they place into IBD at the MBA level vs. Cornell, but my hunch/feeling is that you'll be better off at Yale.
One factor to consider is that you'll want to be in NY for about 6-10 weeks in your first semester networking and doing informational interviews. When you have tests + homework + social commitments, the last thing you want to do is add a strenuous drive, and Cornell's 5 hour trip is no joke vs. Yale's train ride.
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