Barclays generalist vs Jefferies generalist (generalist offers, group placement after joining), I do know people and can network with people at both for their "best groups" (e.g. P&U @ Barc, HC @ Jefferies)-- personally am ok / interested if I end up in FIG, HC, Tech, P&U, CR, Sponsors, NR (basically everything) as long as exits are good
Generally want to go for "best bang for buck" and not just slave 120 hrs/wk for example just for a group thats 5% "better" (whatever that even means lol)
I know P&U is good for Barlcays along with NR but that's 2 specific groups that many will compete for- can anyone advise me on group placement generally and how to think about it? ECM/DCM doesn't do any modelling, so are those an avoid for PE recruiting generally?
additionally, is Barclays worth taking over Jefferies? I'm pretty sure it is, and from what I know about JEF not really interested in the way they operate even though I like the people there. Just want to confirm I'm not making any mistakes really (which I know these things don't really matter in the big scheme it's more about fit and things).
Also have to consider if I get stuck in a group I don't want, where will I generally be better off? I know Healthcare is good at Jefferies. M&A as well?
Thanks in advance
Barclays is objectively a step up. Jefferies is a safer bet for group placement though.
thanks, so what you're saying is that avg. Jef group > Barc? I thought it was the opposite, which is generally why I was thinking Barclays was "safer" because I could get into a group that wasn't the "best" but is still good.
Also, I'm assuming actually that Jefferies isn't ENTIRELY generalist (even though offer is)-- because they gave poor returns this summer from what I heard because they did group placement and most people chose the top groups (meaning the best groups are already filled). Knowing this I am leaning Barclays.
Better groups at Barclays, but generalist offer means you could end up in product groups like ECM/DCM/Risk Solutions etc. At Jefferies, I believe they recruit separately for those groups, so worst case you end up in one of the less desirable coverage groups. All coverage groups at Barclays are very good, but uphill battle and very competitive for those who didn't summer. Especially since you're getting these offers so late in the process. Good options with both banks, well done.
I would go with Jefferies. They have performed very well recently and have a lot of different groups. If you didn't summer with the bank, it will make it a lot harder to get placed into the group of your choice since you will have a much smaller network. The dirty secret to group placement is that it's all about networking and most groups figure out who they want much quicker than any internal placement date. If you are banking on getting into one or two groups at a particular bank, this will almost definitely fail. Not trying to knock you, but you have to understand that you do not know anyone at the firm yet and hundreds of others do. Jefferies, despite what you read online, has a good culture.
Do you really want to gamble where the payoff is working with Power and Utility companies? If you want to make it through the two years, you at least have to enjoy the work that you are doing. P&U might not provide the most variety of flavor compared to something like a Healthcare group at Jefferies. The point being, I would rather spend my time in healthcare with much more exit ops and exiting opportunities than in P&U. Yes, P&U at Barclays will give you a little bit better shot at PE, but PE recruiting is a clusterfuck nonetheless and it only marginally helps you at getting your foot in the door. If PE doesn't work out, you need to prepare yourself for life beyond that. If you go into something thinking XYZ bank has better PE opportunities, you will hate yourself if you don't make it into PE and are instead working in corporate finance at your local power company.
Assuming you made both comments, I think you are giving very poor advice. What you're saying doesn't sound intelligible at all- there's an equal risk of not getting into a good group at both banks (though I agree I'd prefer HC > P&U for obvious reasons of pure interest lol, even if P&U places better). Posted above, but I'm thinking partially that Jefferies isn't ENTIRELY generalist (even though offer is)-- because they gave poor returns this summer from what I heard because they did group placement and most people chose the top groups (meaning the best groups are already filled) and were left with nothing. Assuming they are trying to fill their under hired groups. Knowing this I am leaning Barclays.
Also I do know people at the firm, and very well (that's at both) that I've already networked with or are alumni for example. But it's a nonfactor because like you mentioned the placement can come down to luck (just like recruiting in general). I also outlined that risk of "getting into 1-2 groups" in my post (I cleaned up /edited original post and you may have posted while I edited so my bad if that's the case). I also like Jefferies people a lot, but people at Barc are good too and the bank culture is "supposed to be better"
But overall, no offense you didn't give me anything except common sense dude. Try not to comment obvious shit lol... I'm asking for specifics and it seems you are unfamiliar which groups are good at Barc / Jef other than what I mentioned, which means you have no idea about average group etc. And you gave me obvious advice about the networking. If you are someone who makes these types of comments often, please stop as it adds zero value and potentially negative
All sound like good options. Maybe go with where you will learn/do/help the most. Otherwise it’s like choosing between all good options
yeah I think at this point just talking to people and finding more info from the specific groups is best course of action. really appreciate your comment though thank you
Go with Barclays. Better bank with fantastic mobility (something that people here fail to mention). Average coverage group at Barclays places better than at Jefferies. Barclays has better culture in most groups as well.
Re mobility, I networked with a bunch of people that said they did a product group then easily got into a ft covg group (or m&a exclusive sales). Would 100% take Barclays
thanks for your response that is good to hear. I will try to network a bit before accepting either and figuring out as much as I can, but acceptance timelines are short enough that I will probably just have to accept and figure it out
My non-target friend who grinded like a madman to break into IB quit JEF after 3 months because of how unbearably toxic the culture was. Can't speak for everyone at JEF but take that for what you will.
dang, that's honestly really tough to hear / feel really bad for. Who knows with WFH banking though now, could be really tough everywhere. But I appreciate your comment, thank you
go with barclays, feels like a no brainer.
yeah I think people generally regard Barclays as better but with the whole covid thing this last year and full time as context, think it might change things slightly (especially with placement).
culture is good and I get along with generally everyone at both though so that's a wash. Really just trying to see if there's anything objective I'm missing that I'd otherwise regret if I make a mistake or overlooked something
The objective truth is Barclays is better. Not significantly but meaningfully enough, and your reasons for “risks” or “culture” are not moving the needle. If you want large cap PE or UMM PE, go to Barclays and network into one of their very good middle-tier groups that you vibe with culturally. FIG, Media/telecom, RE, C&R, are all very very good places to start and if you network enough you will get a great fit and it will work out well. (Some people want capital markets and people who are bad fits/lower caliber/don’t network will more likely lead to there). If you can’t get into a great group at Barclays, you wouldn’t get into one at Jeffries.
Simply put, dont over complicate this into somehow convincing yourself Jeffries is better. Go to blue eagle and start networking in the fall
GS/MS/JPM > Barclays/BofA/Citi > CS > Jeff > RBC > UBS/DB > WF
Arguably could switch Jeff and CS at this point.
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