Do people in medicine have it better than those who go to bschool?
Curious if anyone has thought it could be better working in medicine such as being a doctor. Seems like the job gets more respect and you do more impactful work that helps others while still being paid a lot.
Thoughts?
F*ck no mate. I have heard doctors in the US make similar to teachers over the long run if they don't own a private practice
Where'd you pull that from?
Average wage is $350k and specialists earn much more. Teachers don't make that much.
Better hours than IB, ultimate job security, locum for extra pay, can become partner in pp and make $$$
But ofc you have to go through med school and residency first
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This is just so misinformed… How can you possibly think doctors earn the same amount as teachers?
??? Doctors are guaranteed to make 200k+. If they specialize (which I assume most do, especially driven ones), then 500k+ is the norm in a MCOL/HCOL area. For lucrative ones like derm/neuro, clearing 800k+ is relatively normal as well. Obviously varies, but there's a reason why prestige is associated with the field.
With private practice and decent acumen, the sky is the limit for earning potential
Source: Mother and few of my relatives are doctors
Only go into medicine if you couldn't see yourself doing anything else. It's not for everyone. Also as someone whose met over hundred doctors in my lifetime who are at different stages of their career (residents --> recently retired ones), majority of them see it just as a job and nothing more. Most of them can't stand their patients and just appreciate they get paid very nicely and can get great benefits (not unheard of to get 10+ weeks off in some specialties). Heck my PCP even admits regretting going into medicine but I still trust him.
You may find the few ambitious doctors (a surgeon making well over 7 figures and doing a lot of research) but it's not common and usually reserved for doctors who are truly passionate about what they do.
Also keep in mind a mistake in medicine can affect a patient's life forever and in some cases, accidentally kill them. You won't see that in other professions.
The above is correct - also financially, you're over time better off in finance. Doctors have hundreds of thousands of dollars in schooling costs, and then make ~50k for several years - so you're not making any money until your mid-30s, and then you have huge loans to pay off.
The work is impactful, but in many specialties you spend all day with very ill / dying people. You help them to the extent you can, but it's not happy work.
And as said above, if I make a mistake at work, then a random number is wrong and it doesn't impact anyone. If a doctor makes a mistake they are potentially killing someone. Very stressful job with real lives on the line, props to everyone who goes into medicine but I could never do it.
I’m only a student, but the two main things that turned me off from medicine were the timeline and the modern bureaucracy of the healthcare system.
It’s no secret that it takes a long time to be a doctor. 4 years undergrad, 4 years med school, residency, fellowship, specialty can each add a few years to the point that you’re not practicing until your early to mid 30s. By that time in finance, you could be clearing $500k+ and have been making at least $160k since you were 22/23.
The biggest complaint I heard from my friends about their doctor parents’ work was how much paperwork has to be done these days and how little medicine is actually practiced in comparison. Fighting with insurance can be difficult, and the patient’s health outcomes can be restricted by what the insurance is going to pay.
Last thing is that medicine can also be unpredictable in terms of hours. Being on call all the time sucks and surgeries can take a whole day.
It’s probably a lot more rewarding (and imo more respectable) than banking, but that’s not to say it’s clearly a better career.
absolutely. not even close.
my two best friends are doctors. Their residency and med school period was not bad at all. The only reason you hear how "terrible" and "hard" it is is because medicine has the most neurotic whiny group of people in the world. You know that kid in high school that would study 25 hrs in one weekend for an easy math quiz that was 3 questions that even the teacher said would be easy.....those are the average med school students. my buddy said residency was actually pretty fun and he had tons of time off.
now that they are practicing their lifestyle is SOOO much better than finance roles. When they are off work...no emails...no checking their phones...they completely relax. Of course depending on specialty they can get called back in for emergencies...but its a direct phone call and no one is mad at him for being at a party or at some event (as opposed to an MD calling you angry wondering where you are and why you arent responding immediatly). No emails to respond to, no zoom calls to join, no hopping on a client call on a chairlift in aspen etc. We'll be at some dinner event and im sitting there managing my phone as things are blowing up and my dr friend is completely present and doesnt need to worry about his outlook box.
they have set vacation times that are truly vacation. again no fake vacation like in finance where you are expected to be on calls etc.
zero fear of layoffs.
if my friend decides hed like to move to nebraska or some remote town in Idaho - its easy to find a job there...and they actually pay him MORE than if he wants to rat race it up in NYC (nyc area doctors are actually some of the least paid doctors in america).
people genuinely respect doctors
can work until you are 75 if youd like (and people actually respect older doctors). no being set off the reservation to retire and die like a vice chaiman role, if you want to still meaninfully work...you can!
So your basis is based off just two 'best friends' in medicine? Not a large sample size. I know anomalies like this too.
They must be medical specialists. Also when you're taking a call for a patient and you're at a party / drinking, you could loose your license assuming your 'on call' within your private practice group. Calls outside of that, sure I agree - they can blow them off. Sounds like your friends see it as a lifestyle / a job and not much more. Nothing wrong with that, fairly common with the many millennial doctors I've gotten to know over the years.
Not trying to say I disagree with this but this doesn't paint the picture - 1/3 of doctors probably feel like your friends, 1/3 see as a boring job, and 1/3 regret their decision. That's my opinion.
Also your mistakes don't possibly kill someone, your friends' decisions might if they're done poorly (of course not wishing any ill will towards your dr friends careers).
Disagree with this generalization too - "You know that kid in high school that would study 25 hrs in one weekend for an easy math quiz that was 3 questions that even the teacher said would be easy.....those are the average med school students." You do realize how much content is actually on the Step / board exams right? Students can be pretty much tested on 1000+ pages of material and it won't be direct questions and may require connecting the dots between more than one concept. That's not easy .... for even the smart finance students, I can promise you that.
This is true. As an engineer undergrad, the pre-meds in my early hard sciences classes were the biggest pussies. They thought organic was the hardest class ever and calc. They would study non stop for basic material. They are whiney ass people and some very entitled.
Only the general public think they are intelligent bc they never encounter other highly educated people imo.
UK perspective from someone who did the opposite: Definitely not lol.
I moved from med school (undergrad) to IB and the difference in comp and respect is night and day. For example, my first year IB total comp will be higher than 95% of my med school class' career high earnings.
Treatment of doctors in the NHS has to be some of the worst I've read about. Complete opposite of many countries.
Surprisingly common outside a select few countries
If you’re thinking about of becoming a doctor or leaving finance to try something you’re interested in, go for it!!!
I’m leaving PE for a neuroengineering PhD. People on this site will talk shit because god forbid something could be “better” or “more prestigious/appealing” than doing 1st grade math and moving logos.
You have the rest of your life to work. A few buddies of mine are also leaving high finance for medical school/PhD’s.
Give it a shot and don’t look back!
You have a background in med/sciences? Doesn't feel like a jump to a hard sciences PhD like that is open to just about anyone. Congrats on the move btw, fascinating field, even for a layman like myself.
would love to hear more about this with regards to what undergrad background you and your buddies have. I respect it
Have you been cutting and pasting this often? Feel like I keep seeing it lol.
I am a doctor and did a few yrs at MBB. Still consult w a boutique while practicing.
To me:
- Medical work more inherently fulfilling in an existential sense. You’re clearly doing something good, people appreciate you for it. I’m not typically one to get all emotional about helping people but it feels nice sometimes. Never go home feeling like “what was the societal utility of anything anyone did today” which I felt not uncommonly at MBB lol
- From an intellectual stimulation POV, I found consulting and investing (much CDDs) problem solving more stimulating from a “first principles” perspective. No right answers in the problems, what should one do. Can’t speak to IB directly, Likewise, practical modelling skills etc are fun, making ambiguous decisions. In medicine there is usually a right answer/range of right answers and you have to know it.
- From an expertise/knowledge base perspective I think you feel like more of an “expert” in medicine due to the hard intellectual/practical skill. Having said that I think people generally underrate the importance and time it takes to develop especially the soft skills of consulting (and from my experience not in IB, finance).
- There’s a repetitiveness to medicine that I didn’t find in MBB.
- The people you find in medicine generally (not always) have what I’d call “smaller” professional lives. They see patients. No expansive network of rich people/company execs/flights/dinners etc — a less extravagant thing as you’re not working on massive projects/deals.
- “Team” aspects to the job vary greatly with specialty. Some comparable to a high finance/consulting environment, some less so.
- Financial rewards come later in medicine, with a lower ceiling, generally less risk.
- Lifestyle is specialty related and self driven. Know people who work 70 hrs and people who work 20. In some gigs can be very flexible.
Very different jobs. Puts and takes like anything!
Feel free to reply and/or PM me if any questions!
Why did you ultimately return to medicine/doctor? Also, what drew you towards MBB and not IB
Not answering for him but I assume MBB leaves to more exits. I've seen some stellar digital health exits from MBB doctors on LinkedIn. Occasionally the MD (medical doctor) in banking may break into life science VC / healthcare PE but usually not so much.
IB docs often did not do residency, MBB tends to have residents (some if not all Harvard residency programs for doctors offer the chance for their residents to get free of charge Harvard MBAs).
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