Harder brainteaser than the coin flip

Suppose X ~ Normal(0; 1) and Y = X + epsilon, where epsilon ~ Normal(0; sigma^2) and epsilon is independent of X.
Conditional on observing Y , what is the distribution of X?

SBs for 1st correct answer

Edit - this is in response to //www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/the-hardest-brainteaser-that-you-ever-did-see

Edit - solved below so scrolling down is cheating if you want to solve.

 

Well, by my calculations, the correct answer is -theta --- +epsilon(X-Y^epsilon+1)

"Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's not a threat, that's a fact.
 

Well, by my calculations, the correct answer is -theta --- +epsilon(X-Y^epsilon+1)

"Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's not a threat, that's a fact.
 

Bivariate Normal Distribution FTW

"Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's not a threat, that's a fact.
 

Zy,Zx f(x, y)dxdy = 1 f(x, y) >= 0

Where Z is the integral

"Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's not a threat, that's a fact.
 
ivoteforthatguy:
the distribution of X is the same as the distribution of Y.

Y = X + epsilon, so X = Y - epsilon. Since epsilon is an unbiased normal variate, X and Y are equivalent under permutation. By symmetry, X and Y follow the same distribution.

No such luck, sorry. Very common mistake though.
 
Dr Joe:
ivoteforthatguy:
the distribution of X is the same as the distribution of Y.

Y = X + epsilon, so X = Y - epsilon. Since epsilon is an unbiased normal variate, X and Y are equivalent under permutation. By symmetry, X and Y follow the same distribution.

No such luck, sorry. Very common mistake though.

lol

then i will go with my second choice: X ~ Normal(0; 1).

i hope this isn't a gag question.

 

Hey,

Is the answer:

P(X|Y) ~ N(rho*y/(sigma^2+1),(1-rho)^2)

where rho is the correlation coefficient of X and Y? (i.e. rho = Cov(X,Y)/(Var(X)Var(Y)) = Cov(X,Y)/(sigma^2+1))

I had to use paper and pencil for this [x has been edited to y, since y is observed...]

Just Do It
 
maximumlikelihood:
Hey,

Is the answer:

P(X|Y) ~ N(rho*y/(sigma^2+1),(1-rho)^2)

where rho is the correlation coefficient of X and Y? (i.e. rho = Cov(X,Y)/(Var(X)Var(Y)) = Cov(X,Y)/(sigma^2+1))

I had to use paper and pencil for this [x has been edited to y, since y is observed...]

Nope
 
whocaresdr:
Dr ... this isn't that hard.

(X|Y) ~ N(Y/(1+sig^2), (sig^2)/(1+sig^2))

Also ML, you can compute rho explicitly given independence of X and eps...you know the formula for covariance and you know the variances of X and Y....

We have a winner.

Also, I never said this was that hard. But I think it is a very good question to test overall comfort with conditional probability. Just having the insight to say that E[X|Y] =!= Y, and E[X|Y] is between 0 and Y is sufficient here for most purposes.

 
yhp2009:
whocaresdr:
Dr ... this isn't that hard.

(X|Y) ~ N(Y/(1+sig^2), (sig^2)/(1+sig^2))

Also ML, you can compute rho explicitly given independence of X and eps...you know the formula for covariance and you know the variances of X and Y....

Shouldnt the E(X|Y)=Y/(1+sigma) without the square power?

I checked, and no, the original answer is correct.
 

Also, a note to the above who fell into the trick of thinking the mean was Y (which is a gut instinct), an easy demonstration of the fallacy occurs when we allow

Y = X1 + X2, with X1 and X2 iid. (this is generalizable to Y = Sigma(X_i))

Then, clearly, E(X1|Y) = E(X2|Y) and by linearity E(X1|Y) + E(X2|Y) = Y, so E(X1|Y) = Y/2.

A more general form of this reasoning is used to give the result here.

 

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