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If you're set on doing PE or IB in New York, Fordham is the best option, but don't expect this to be an easy route. You're going to have to hustle to make it either PE or IB. SMU I'd imagine would only be good if you want to do energy in Texas, though I don't know how it compares to U of Texas, Rice, TCU, etc. in that regard.
Could you entertain me/elaborate further on two things:
the Fordham as the best option/not an easy route. My thoughts on this is that I would be up to the challenge (but I may be way in over my head). NY isn't something I'm dead set on, but there's just a certain allure and it's not something I have actually experienced before. That's why I would like to go. However, from the other two posters, I gather that Fordham just doesn't have as many opportunities as SMU. Do you have any thoughts on this?
You said SMU would only be good if I want to do energy. Is there really nothing else at SMU that I could major in that would be as successful as a degree in energy? Accounting, for example, may be (much) better at U of Texas but I was under the impression that Accounting majors don't really matter where you go as long as you get the internships and such=>big 4. Any other (business) degrees that may be versatile? I just want a back-up plan in case energy may just entirely not be for me and I don't (no one, really) want to be stuck doing something that I hate/dislike.
I think your best option is to go to SMU and do oil & gas banking or energy trading. It's possible to do from Cox, and regardless you'll have a good alum network there. SMU has a very particular culture though and you'll get the feel once you visit the campus. If you don't like the culture of the south, and you want to move for a better time then I'm not sure if SMU is for you.
Fordham is similar to Pace, St Johns, Rutgers, etc. The odds are not at all good to get into finance (non-target school), but a few kids manage to get in.
Could you give me some more information on oil & gas banking/energy trading? I've never actually seen it as an option before so I'd like to get some more information on it/getting into the field. From some of my preliminary findings I'd major in SMU's Finance with a Specialization in Alternative Asset Management and get more familiar with the field/see how I like it from there.
Also, a worry of mine is that the energy sector is becoming quite saturated and wanted to get some thoughts on that as well.
I don't really have that big of an issue with the culture of the south. It's moreso that there's this culture in NY/on Wall Street that I've never actually experienced and the allure is interesting to me. This fantasy/expectation of mine might (probably) shoot myself in the foot so that's why I'm asking about it.
Do you think my assessment of an accounting degree correct? (If I do go down that route) I'd just like the option as a way out in case I dislike banking or something occurs, and I wanted to know if it was as clear cut as that.
SMU is further from NYC, but their Cox BBA has nice networks; their Cox MBA is also reputable ~50-60 in ranks. Fordham will be in NYC, but with all those giant sharks (Columbia, NYU Stern, along with EVERYONE who wants to be in NYC). their MBA is unranked
I'd put SMU just slightly below UTAustin. Rice is a harder school to get in (UG), and UTAustin's alum network is quite powerful too with their MBA
I just want to confirm that your opinion is essentially that SMU is overall a better school than Fordham.
Because of the fact that there are good networking opportunities in SMU. And, despite Fordham's location (which might actually be one of its downfalls), SMU would (probably) set me up better for jobs and such. Also, from the previous two posts above you, it seems that energy is a big thing (in Texas, of course) that SMU can open doors to. Do you have any additional information on the majors that are good at SMU? Or would I be pidgeon-holed into Energy? Would accounting be an option?
Also, a worry of mine is that the energy sector is becoming quite saturated and wanted to get some thoughts on that as well.
I don't think SMU or Fordham is better than each other, they're both afterthoughts to schools around them (NYU, Columbia, UTAustin, Rice, etc) All I'm saying is that Texas has less competitive programs, thus you'd have a higher chance to pickup opportunities.
If you want to do accounting, nobody is saying no. but in this WSO, people see you are either BB or bust. Do all you want, and you don't have to be in BB to succeed.
Don't worry about energy sectors that much--you are not doing petroleum engineering. If you're very good from your BBA, I'm sure you could get very good jobs with enough networking.
As a Fordham grad, my opinion is going to be biased but I do believe that it's a great school for finance. There are obviously fewer OCR opportunities for IB/FO roles compared to the bigger names (i.e. Columbia, NYU, etc.), you'll definitely get the chances to network and get your foot in the door somehow. I've managed to land many FO role interviews and currently work in PE/alt inv. Yes, it'll be harder than other big name schools, but if you put the effort into it, Fordham will be a great place to go.
If your end goal is to be in NY, then I would say Fordham. If you are open to staying in Texas, then there are plenty of opportunities that SMU offers. If you do a LinkedIn search of SMU Finance grads, there are plenty of them at a BB in Houston or Dallas. In most of Texas you're going to have competition from Texas and/or Rice graduates, but you won't be at a disadvantage. If you want to work in the DFW area, then SMU is above the competition, no question. There are so many networking opportunities within Dallas that it's not even funny. The bottom line is that in Texas, SMU can be considered a target school. In Dallas, SMU is THE target school. You'll find competition from McCombs BHP grads or Rice grads, but network and you should be fine.
Source: grew up in Houston, attended undergrad in Dallas
On the other hand, I don't know much about Fordham or the opportunities in NYC you'll have if you attend there. I'm just laying down the options for you in case you find that you don't mind staying in Texas over NYC.
Hey man, thanks for sharing your experience! You definitely shaped/developed my perspective on a degree from SMU.
I was wondering if you could elaborate further on how SMU is THE target school of Dallas? I don't really know the kinds of opportunities that are exactly out there and from some of the above posters, it appears that SMU is good for energy, only. But you seem to hold a different opinion and I'd like to know more about it.
For context, I am going to graduate school at SMU starting next fall. I'll be getting a Master in Finance (MSF), and while I was researching on schools to apply to I took to LinkedIn to see where graduates of different schools' programs worked.
While I was looking at where SMU MSF grads went on to work, of course undergrad BBA Finance graduates popped up plenty of times. There's actually someone graduating this May that's going on to work at UBS in New York (in their IBD) after they graduate. He accepted an offer after his internship last summer, so it's definitely possible to move on to NYC, just very rare.
Just looking more on LinkedIn I see '14 grad in Citi's oil and gas IBD in Houston, and plenty of others with similar roles at BAML (Dallas), Credit Suisse (Houston), etc. Since these are in Texas the chances are higher that you'll get into energy-related roles in IB. SMU is a small school so this isn't due to a high volume of finance graduates.
If you go to Fordham, work hard, get involved with the Finance Society, Student Managed Investment Club, Finance Scholars, Value Investing concentration, etc. you will do fine. Fordham is by no means a target but its location in NYC is a valuable asset. Fordham students have ample opportunity to intern, both during the summer and the school year. Fordham also has an undervalued alumni network with strong presence in the Tri-state area.
Fordham has plenty of mediocre kids grinding, trying to land opportunities in the back office, but they do not struggle to place their top students (top 10 every year to be exact) in BB positions in nyc.
I do not want to mislead you into thinking it will be easy. Honestly assess your own abilities. If you believe you will be a top caliber Fordham candidate, you will be fine. I don't want to sound like a dick, but if you are not a top caliber candidate at Fordham, you will struggle to find front office employment regardless of where you go to school.
Source: Recent Fordham grad who was involved with leadership roles in the above mentioned clubs and now works at a front office role in a BB in NYC.
Can't speak to SMU.
GordanGorilla. Thanks for giving me some insight on Fordham and what I may have to do there, to succeed. You don't sound like a dick at all. I asked for a reality check and I got one. With that being said, I would have be in the top 10. While, at SMU from what I've learned, I would have to be top 25-30. Fordham has a larger UG pop than SMUas well. Honestly, it's an extremely daunting task and I can't say with confidence that I will succeed at Fordham- or be that happy stressing over being #1 in nearly all my classes as well as involving myself in that many leadership roles. This is not to say that I won't work hard at SMU, but I need to not have such heavy weight and expectations on my back so that I can succeed more easily.
With all that being said, you definitely helped me develop a more cohesive idea of what I would have to do at Fordham. Thank you.
No problem. A brief clarification- I wasn't referring to grades when I said top 10- its a holistic process. I was somewhere between the top 10-15% (class of about 500 so I was #50 or 60) mark in grades after the first few years, got a good internship and started working 50 hours a week. I was president of the finance society and i had a great time in college.... the end result was I graduated in the bottom quintile of the class GPA-wise. Fordham ear-marks the top students relatively early, and these kids are invited to all of the special networking events, modeling workshops etc. This process involves GPA to some extent, but also looks at extracurriculars, teacher recommendations, internship experience and an interview.
While they would never admit this, I think the administration wisely realizes that the average Fordham kid is not going to land on wall street so they focus their resources on the top 20 kids to give them a shot. (From this group of 20, about 10 get front office jobs every year- not a bad hit rate).
The clarification helped a lot contextually.
I will consider heavily upon your experience at Fordham in my decision. If I choose to go to SMU, I will attempt to apply what made you a top student at Fordham to my experience at SMU (hopefully finding some similar extracurriculars to those that you held/internships/decently high grades). If I go to Fordham, I will try to do what you have done, and succeed in a similar manner.
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