30k To Be Made Redundant
(Senior Baboon, 196
Points)
on 3/29/12 at 5:55pm
This ones an interesting one for debate.
while SocGen is clearly a market leader in equity derivatives, its market share in commodities is approximately 1%.
SocGen is offering a minimum of €30k in redundancy payments to its French investment bankers in an effort to encourage them to leave of their own accord.
Questions:
1. Is SocGen a leader in Equity Derivatives? How is this measured?
2. Would you take the money and leave? If yes, why? If no, why?






It's very difficult to fire
It's very difficult to fire an employee under French law. If you've got a good offer in hand, then it would make sense to take it. If not, suck that tit until its dry.
French labor laws are worse
French labor laws are worse than anywhere I've ever seen in the world. You positively cannot fire someone. Even if you fire them for cause (like stealing, to use one example I know of personally), they will sue you for wrongful termination and the labor courts will rule in their favor.
Which is why you'll never go to labor court. Your insurer won't allow it. Your insurance company will reach a settlement with the fired employee before it ever gets to court and you will have no choice but to accept it. The settlement will be a multiple of the fired employees annual salary. You will pay your deductible, the insurance company will pay the balance of the settlement, and then they will promptly drop your coverage and send you scrambling for a new insurer.
I'm pretty much amazed every day I wake up and find that this country hasn't ground to a halt because it's so absolutely backward from any business perspective.
So, yeah, paying employees €30,000 to leave without suing is a bargain.
they are clear leader in
they are clear leader in derivs
Everything Eddie said. And
Everything Eddie said. And SocGen pretty much wrote the book on Equity derivs. Getting a job in the field there is horrendously difficult. Virtually everyone on that desk came out of this master's program: http://www.masterfinance.proba.jussieu.fr/index2.php
Financial Modeling Training
Guide to Finance Interviews
Eddie, if France was business
Eddie, if France was business oriented in the way the US is, it would cease to be France!
relinquis... Killing the GMAT this December; Over/Under set at: 725 GMATs.
Relinquis wrote: Eddie, if
Eddie, if France was business oriented in the way the US is, it would cease to be France!
Look, I love France. Otherwise I wouldn't live here. But it is just miserable doing business here.
For example, I went in to BNP on Friday the 9th to wire €50,000 into an American account. In the US, an international wire transfer takes no more than 24 hours, and can even be done the same day if you get to the bank early enough. When the money hadn't even left my account by the following Tuesday, I called BNP. They had no explanation for me but said someone would get back to me.
Never happened.
So I called back on Wednesday when I saw that the money still hadn't been taken out of my French account. It has now been 3 full business days since I authorized the wire in writing. I get the international wire manager on the phone and she informs me that she hasn't approved the wire.
I'm sorry, what the fuck did you just say to me? Who the fuck are you to approve a wire I authorized?
Wanna know her answer? In typical French banker fashion, she said the wire hadn't gone out yet because they didn't know why I wanted to wire the money.
How 'bout because I fucking told you to?
And this is typical, everyday commerce in France. A French businessman will readily give you a dozen different reasons why something that takes place as a matter of course every day in every other part of the world cannot be done here.
I love France. I love the food, I love the lifestyle, I even love the people. But I fucking hate doing business here.
Edmundo Braverman
French labor laws are worse than anywhere I've ever seen in the world. You positively cannot fire someone. Even if you fire them for cause (like stealing, to use one example I know of personally), they will sue you for wrongful termination and the labor courts will rule in their favor.
Which is why you'll never go to labor court. Your insurer won't allow it. Your insurance company will reach a settlement with the fired employee before it ever gets to court and you will have no choice but to accept it. The settlement will be a multiple of the fired employees annual salary. You will pay your deductible, the insurance company will pay the balance of the settlement, and then they will promptly drop your coverage and send you scrambling for a new insurer.
I'm pretty much amazed every day I wake up and find that this country hasn't ground to a halt because it's so absolutely backward from any business perspective.
So, yeah, paying employees €30,000 to leave without suing is a bargain.
This is so true. The firm I work for invests globally with very few rules attached, but one of those rules is NO FRANCE. Doesn't matter how cheap the stock is, if it's French, we're not buying it. That goes for non-French companies that have substantial French exposure as well.
My favorite investing experience with France of all time was when I was researching a US company that was shutting its high cost footprint in France because they could no longer compete with non-France based manufacturing. I called the CFO to try to get a sense of how much cost savings this might provide and what that might translate to for the stock. He starts telling me how difficult it was to exit plant and lay off the labor -- apparently when the workers got notice, they went home, grabbed a bunch of weapons, and came back to the plant to hold management hostage in the back office at knife and gun point resulting in a 24 hour stand off with the authorities.
Seriously France, you are one crazy bitch. And not in the good way.
Then how on earth is France
Then how on earth is France one of the richest countries on the planet? Something must be right I assume.
IRSPB wrote: Then how on
Then how on earth is France one of the richest countries on the planet? Something must be right I assume.
That's pretty much exactly what a Frenchman would say.
Edmundo Braverman
Then how on earth is France one of the richest countries on the planet? Something must be right I assume.
That's pretty much exactly what a Frenchman would say.
So true!
We've had a good run investing in France... 2x net to our LPs on a hotel portfolio we exited in 2006.
relinquis... Killing the GMAT this December; Over/Under set at: 725 GMATs.
.
.
Edmundo Braverman
Then how on earth is France one of the richest countries on the planet? Something must be right I assume.
That's pretty much exactly what a Frenchman would say.
What about France made a loot of money colonizing countries in Africa and Middle East. France money isn't organic.
Edmundo Braverman
Eddie, if France was business oriented in the way the US is, it would cease to be France!
Look, I love France. Otherwise I wouldn't live here. But it is just miserable doing business here.
For example, I went in to BNP on Friday the 9th to wire €50,000 into an American account. In the US, an international wire transfer takes no more than 24 hours, and can even be done the same day if you get to the bank early enough. When the money hadn't even left my account by the following Tuesday, I called BNP. They had no explanation for me but said someone would get back to me.
Never happened.
So I called back on Wednesday when I saw that the money still hadn't been taken out of my French account. It has now been 3 full business days since I authorized the wire in writing. I get the international wire manager on the phone and she informs me that she hasn't approved the wire.
I'm sorry, what the fuck did you just say to me? Who the fuck are you to approve a wire I authorized?
Wanna know her answer? In typical French banker fashion, she said the wire hadn't gone out yet because they didn't know why I wanted to wire the money.
How 'bout because I fucking told you to?
And this is typical, everyday commerce in France. A French businessman will readily give you a dozen different reasons why something that takes place as a matter of course every day in every other part of the world cannot be done here.
I love France. I love the food, I love the lifestyle, I even love the people. But I fucking hate doing business here.
Made me actually laugh
johnnie.welker wrote: What
What about France made a loot of money colonizing countries in Africa and Middle East. France money isn't organic.
Your English shows you clearly didn't grow up in a former British colony (or Great Britain for that matter). France has been one of the world's major powers for a long time and for primarily economic reasons. It is the largest country in Western Europe and was one of the first countries to industrialize after the UK. Claiming that France' current money stock comes from its former colonies is preposterous. More money has come into France and the UK since decolonization than in the centuries preceding.
Financial Modeling Training
Guide to Finance Interviews
Actually, if you take a look
Actually, if you take a look at all the top French companies.. much of their revenues come from other countries.. not from within France.. that's what they are doing right.. using their perception of "luxury" and "chic" to capture business elsewhere. Doing business in France still sucks
The main danger France is in
Financial Modeling Training
Guide to Finance Interviews
Not much to add, no way I
France ammended a law that
Check out my Blog
Edmundo Braverman
Edmundo Braverman
-MBP
Downside is that you also
-MBP
Edmundo Braverman
i love the rhetoric in this
relinquis... Killing the GMAT this December; Over/Under set at: 725 GMATs.
Double post.
I've been screwed over before
Financial Modeling Training
Guide to Finance Interviews
GoodBread, so what? why not
relinquis... Killing the GMAT this December; Over/Under set at: 725 GMATs.
Singe wrote: Plus, you will
IRSPB wrote: Edmundo
Edmundo Braverman wrote: This
Hi, Eric Stratton, rush chairman, damn glad to meet you.
Edmundo Braverman
Relinquis
Financial Modeling Training
Guide to Finance Interviews
Hegel wrote: Edmundo
"Life all comes down to a few moments. This is one of them." - Bud Fox
Doing business in France is a
In an ironic twist today, I