Barclays IBD or Citi IBD (both in NY)

I have offers from both to join as an Analyst. I understand that Barclays is a stronger shop but that Citi also has extremely strong groups. Given the media situation about Barclays at the moment and speculation that its investment banking arm might be spun off, and also that Citi has incurred many one-time charges and is (supposedly) on the rise, I wanted to know people's thoughts.

 

personally, I'd take Citi. Know a bunch of guys there and they're all great.

But my understanding is that Barclays does its M&A within its coverage groups (like GS), so if you are looking to get solid M&A exposure (and the Citi offer isn't M&A), that's something to keep in mind.

“Success means having the courage, the determination, and the will to become the person you believe you were meant to be”
 
nontargetPSD92:
personally, I'd take Citi. Know a bunch of guys there and they're all great.

But my understanding is that Barclays does its M&A within its coverage groups (like GS), so if you are looking to get solid M&A exposure (and the Citi offer isn't M&A), that's something to keep in mind.

Talked to someone from Citi and my understanding was that much of the M&A work was done in-house, under supervision of a more senior M&A banker. That seems to be the new standard nowadays, or am I mistaken? Haven't started my SA yet, but going on what I've been told from others on the Street.

 
DiggsRTC:
nontargetPSD92:
personally, I'd take Citi. Know a bunch of guys there and they're all great.

But my understanding is that Barclays does its M&A within its coverage groups (like GS), so if you are looking to get solid M&A exposure (and the Citi offer isn't M&A), that's something to keep in mind.

Talked to someone from Citi and my understanding was that much of the M&A work was done in-house, under supervision of a more senior M&A banker. That seems to be the new standard nowadays, or am I mistaken? Haven't started my SA yet, but going on what I've been told from others on the Street.

I've spoken with a couple of Citi coverage groups and was relayed this same information. The coverage groups generally only bring in a senior M&A or LevFin person to assist on deals. But, the majority of the deal is run out of the coverage group.

 

Doesn't sound that good even if it should not affect US too much.
Anyway, I'd choose considering the groups.

Feb. 12 (Bloomberg) -- Barclays Plc, the first U.K. lender to report results for 2012, will eliminate 3,700 jobs to reduce annual costs by 1.7 billion pounds ($2.6 billion) after posting its first full-year loss in more than two decades.

The net loss of 1.04 billion pounds compares with a profit of 3 billion pounds in 2011, the London-based bank said in a statement today. Analysts had estimated a loss of 307 million pounds, according to the median estimate of nine surveyed by Bloomberg. The bank set aside an additional 1 billion pounds in the fourth quarter to compensate clients wrongly sold insurance on loan repayments and interest-rate swaps.

Antony Jenkins, who took over as chief executive officer in August, is seeking a return to profit and avoid repeating the regulatory missteps that led to the resignation of his predecessor, Robert Diamond. Jenkins stopped short of setting a profitability target, saying only he will target a return on equity that exceeds the lender’s 11.5 percent cost of equity.

“Our plan is built on a rigorous review of 75 distinct business units to determine not only their ability to generate an appropriate and sustainable return on equity, but also their strategic attractiveness, including their impact on Barclays reputation,” Jenkins, 51, said in today’s statement. “We expect to make good progress towards our financial commitments by 2014 and deliver them fully during 2015.”

Cost Reductions

Barclays plans to reduce costs to 16.5 billion pounds by 2015 to reduce them as a proportion of income to about 55 percent compared with 64 percent in 2012.

The lender will eliminate 3,700 jobs this year, with 1,800 coming from its investment bank and 1,900 in European consumer and business banking. About 1,600 have already been cut at the investment bank, Finance Director Chris Lucas told reporters on a conference call today. The firm employs about 24,000 people at its investment-banking unit, and about 140,000 worldwide.

The bank said it will focus on the U.K., U.S. and Africa and will direct its European consumer bank, which lost 239 million pounds last year, on what it called so-called mass- affluent market. The firm will shut its structured capital markets unit at its investment bank. It will take a 500 million- pound restructuring charge in the first quarter.

I'm grateful that I have two middle fingers, I only wish I had more.
 
bankbanker101:
As an analyst, this shouldn't be a concern. Agree with above poster - I believe industry groups are split into coverage and M&A, and you can choose to specialize in either at the analyst level. Certainly helps with placement afterwards. Also have strong sponsors and excl. sales (sell-side M&A) teams.

It does not affect you in terms of job security but can't it affect the execution experience you may have? I mean, if Barclays is going to lose something on the financing side, can't it affect its ability to originate new business and be involved in capital intensive transactions? What about cross-border M&A activity (esp. with Asia and South Europe)?

I'm grateful that I have two middle fingers, I only wish I had more.
 
cruel3a:
bankbanker101:
As an analyst, this shouldn't be a concern. Agree with above poster - I believe industry groups are split into coverage and M&A, and you can choose to specialize in either at the analyst level. Certainly helps with placement afterwards. Also have strong sponsors and excl. sales (sell-side M&A) teams.

It does not affect you in terms of job security but can't it affect the execution experience you may have? I mean, if Barclays is going to lose something on the financing side, can't it affect its ability to originate new business and be involved in capital intensive transactions? What about cross-border M&A activity (esp. with Asia and South Europe)?

This is a very astute point, but there are two arguments against this: 1. financing M&A didn't stop even after the LIBOR scandal (Dell is a clear example): Jenkins is aware that the IBD arm of Barc (at least the NY arm) is quite strong so he's not going to screw around with this. Proof is if you look at their deal volume for US vs. Worldwide, the US is a very large chunk of their total M&A volume.

  1. Think I indirectly answered cross M&A using the above point. Cross-border (only international) was never really Barc's strong-suit. If it's cross-border involving a US target, then it may just be handled by US/UK offices.

Hope that helps.

 

Pick the group where you like the people the best. You can get to where you want to be from either bank. Other arguments simply service preconceived biases.

[quote=Dirk Dirkenson]Shut up already. Your mindless, reflexive responses to any critical thought on this are tedious. You're also probably a woman, given the name and "xoxo" signoff, so maybe the lack of judgment is to be expected.[/quote]
 

Six of one, half-dozen of another. BarCap is by all accounts a very strong shop as is Citi and both would have comparable exit ops. Pick the one that you think best suits your personality and that will be more tolerable during your analyst stint. It would be a crying shame if you picked a firm based on slight differences in rep, hated your firm, performed poorly and didn't get the right exit.

“I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are.” - Hicks
 

Im going to disagree with the norm opinion here (ie: it doesnt matter), and say that Barclays generalist is a better overall choice purely for PE exits. This is because Citi has an M&A group, whereas Barclays follows the GS model of doing all M&A within industry groups (they have a global M&A team, but they sit within industry and the work is the same). Thus you're more likely to get relevant exposure.

 

Barclays is not GS, and doesn't pull off the GS business model quite as well. Meanwhile, I know first-hand that the best groups at C place well into top 20 PE shops - yes, including KKR for you prestige junkies. But there's the rub - group is far more important than bank. And at the end of the day, it's how you perform in that group that determines your exit opportunities, not the BB name on your resume.

 
cmonkey711:
Barclays is not GS, and doesn't pull off the GS business model quite as well. Meanwhile, I know first-hand that the best groups at C place well into top 20 PE shops - yes, including KKR for you prestige junkies. But there's the rub - group is far more important than bank. And at the end of the day, it's how you perform in that group that determines your exit opportunities, not the BB name on your resume.

What are the best groups at C? Never really heard much about their groups.

 
youngblood:
no homo:
Citi M&A > BarCap overall > Citi overall

Both are in the UBS/BAML/DB tier, in that they're not quite in the GS/MS/JPM/CS/LAZ tier but still offer great exit opportunities compared to non-IBD so long as you work hard and make the most of it.

You're in college dude, know your role.

Yeah, but I'll take having signed a FT offer at a BB over whatever your role is at PJC/Harris Williams. How's that role treating you?
 
Best Response
no homo:
youngblood:
no homo:
Citi M&A > BarCap overall > Citi overall

Both are in the UBS/BAML/DB tier, in that they're not quite in the GS/MS/JPM/CS/LAZ tier but still offer great exit opportunities compared to non-IBD so long as you work hard and make the most of it.

You're in college dude, know your role.

Yeah, but I'll take having signed a FT offer at a BB over whatever your role is at PJC/Harris Williams. How's that role treating you?

I'm at a bulge bracket, son. And please, signed offer or not, you aren't in banking, you are in college. Leave the retarded 'rankings' to the professionals.

 
no homo:
Citi M&A > BarCap overall > Citi overall

Both are in the UBS/BAML/DB tier, in that they're not quite in the GS/MS/JPM/CS/LAZ tier but still offer great exit opportunities compared to non-IBD so long as you work hard and make the most of it.

Sooo ... you work for CS right?
 
no homo:
Citi M&A > BarCap overall > Citi overall

Both are in the UBS/BAML/DB tier, in that they're not quite in the GS/MS/JPM/CS/LAZ tier but still offer great exit opportunities compared to non-IBD so long as you work hard and make the most of it.

I'm assuming you work at CS.....

 

And for the record, GS/MS definitely have the advantage, but outside of that, all of the bulge brackets are more or less in the same league. Someone from any one of the BBs could make themselves feel better by adding their firm's name to end of that retarded 'top tier' list...hence a two-firm list grows to become 5 firms deep lol.

 

I think a lot depends on group. I know Barclays has been going through some tough stuff lately, but long-term for an entry level position it shouldn't play too huge of a role in the decision process, in my opinion. Not sure how accurate it is, but have heard from come people at Citi that deal teams can get huge (15-20+) and therefore your role is pretty minimal.

Top groups are probably Nat Res and Power at Barclays and what the above person said at Citi.

"Money is a scoreboard where you can rank how you're doing against other people." -Mark Cuban
 

At one of these firms or at a comparable BB (to avoid be called out) and agree with the above poster. Deal teams can get quite large at Citi, and as far as reputation is concerned, both are at the same level.

Regarding Barc's restructuring: it's not expected to be very significant (confirmed by inside sources). In fact the layoffs that occurred last week hit very few associates (and by very few, I mean very very few), and mainly VPs/EDs, which'll happen at any bank come bonus season. Just because it's marketed, doesn't mean things are going to hell all of a sudden - this happens everywhere. Areas that they're expecting to be hit are Equity S&T (wasn't their bread and butter business), and tax advisory (for image reasons). If you're going in as an analyst, go where you like the people and the teams. Don't need to remind you that Citi has a new CEO as well because Pandit also resigned.

 
BTbanker:
3 hours ago- http://www.latimes.com/business/money/la-fi-mo-barclays-to-cut-3700-job…

Like I said... Barclays is dogshit. I'm sorry if anyone works there.

Dude did they reject you for an internship or what? This is just a delayed form of what most other banks went through last year (layoffs, etc)

I would say Barclays and Citi are about even and it's very group dependent. Both in mid-tier of BBs but either can be a great experience / place to start your career. At the end of the day you'll be happiest at whichever group has fewer D-bags that you have to deal with

 
BTbanker:
3 hours ago- http://www.latimes.com/business/money/la-fi-mo-barclays-to-cut-3700-job…

Like I said... Barclays is dogshit. I'm sorry if anyone works there.

I'm sure you've come to that conclusion from a really in depth analysis and talking to a ton of people at the firm. Financial Services companies, since the crisis, are reporters favorite type of thing to overhype and blow out of proportion.

I second to whoever said theres probably a reason why you are shitting on them (aka didn't get an offer). I'd definitely say its atleast on par with Citi, and that deciding on the two is a wash depending on what group you end up in.

"Money is a scoreboard where you can rank how you're doing against other people." -Mark Cuban
 

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