Sheesh, Sergey Aleynikov can't catch a break. Most of you will remember him as the ex-Goldman programmer who swiped the firm's Doomsday Machine code before jumping ship to another firm. Or I guess we have to say allegedly swiped the code (again), since his federal criminal conviction was overturned by a higher court.
Neither distinction mattered to Manhattan DA Cyrus Vance and US Attorney Preet Bharara when they charged him in state court on Thursday. Aleynikov faces up to four years in prison on the new charges of unlawful use of secret scientific material and duplication of computer-related material.
“This code is so highly confidential that it is known in the industry as the firm’s ‘secret sauce,’ ” Mr. Vance said Thursday in a statement. “Employees who exploit their access to sensitive information should expect to face criminal prosecution in New York State.”
If you guys remember back to when he first diddled Goldman's mainframe, the FBI showed up on his driveway like 10 minutes later. Seriously. They didn't make Osama bin Laden the same priority they made this poor schmuck whose biggest mistake in life was thinking you could steal from the almighty Goldman Sachs and get away with it.
Now that he somehow wriggled out of the federal noose, the state boys are coming after him. Double jeopardy be damned. You don't fucking steal from Goldman Sachs.
For the record, I think Vance and Bharara are good guys who will be remembered for doing a good job on balance. But for crying out loud, can we go after somebody who actually hurt someone financially and benefited themselves to the tune of a couple hundred million?
Seriously, guys. Enough with the low-hanging fruit. We get that the Wall Street paymasters want to send a message to the working class finance pogues that their lives will be over if they fuck with the firm. Message received.
Now how about going after Fuld and Callan for Repo 105, hmmm? That's just one idea. Honestly, call me. I can help you guys retire on the perjury cases alone from all the bogus bank CEO testimony before Congress over the past four years.
But I guess that would look too much like justice.
Apparently everyone has just forgotten about Jon Corzine? This is just a classic misapplication of priorities.
Eddie, you are my favorite journalist.
Did Fuld actually know about repo 105?
Ever heard of SarbOx?
Yes, lol. You're referring to corp resp but I just merely wanted to ascertain the level of his scumbagness.
Considering that he blatantly perjured himself before Congress regarding his own compensation (downplaying it by 8 figures), I'd say he sets the bar pretty high. I'm also quite sure he was well aware of repo 105 transactions and happily approved them.
Think about it: could you really move that sizable a chunk of assets off the company's balance sheet at the end of every quarter without the CEO noticing?
Eva Rausing is my favorite case, get caught with that amount of drugs and be a poor black guy and you're in for some jail time. Law enforcement is for the poor except when there is huge public outrage and the person is guilty without any doubt at all, and even then, and so is everywhere. Sometimes you just need to remember the plebes to stay down, and make an example whenever you have the chance. It just sucks, but its not going to change (for better).
Seriously, who's in?
Remember how it works - you're okay as long as you steal from the poor (mutual funds, etc). The moment you steal from the rich, you're going to get canned. Seriously. Ask Madoff.
Gotta love it, so what if the Chinese are hacking government and Fortune 500 business intels, go after the guy who stole from Goldman. Goldman secrets >> US gov secrets.
love the USMC jargon, haha
Is Vance planning on running for office soon? Just curious...
Don't do the crime if you cain't do the time. Hope they lock his russian butt for +10 years.
Goldman paid him good money and this is how he repay them? By stealing their stuff? I'd make an example out of him.
You're missing the point Abdel (as usual)
Goldman is right to make an example out of them. In the same vein, Goldman should be drawn and quartered for their part in the financial crisis.
Well, if you know what caused the financial crisis (did you saw it coming?), you should know that Goldman was only a symptom of the problem and not the problem itself.
In the case of Aleynikov, he is the source of the problem. Not the same thing.
Abdel: 1 Anomanderis: 0
I didn't go anywhere. I'm starting Graduate school in 2 weeks.
Only did the PE thing as a psychological reinforcement lol.
This is painful. In the US, fraud is illegal. When you represent to someone that gold-plated shit is solid gold and they pay you for it, that is fraud.
From Wikipedia: In criminal law, a fraud is an intentional deception made for personal gain or to damage another individual; the related adjective is fraudulent. The specific legal definition varies by legal jurisdiction. Fraud is a crime, and also a civil law violation. Defrauding people or entities of money or valuables is a common purpose of fraud, but there have also been fraudulent "discoveries", e.g., in science, to gain prestige rather than immediate monetary gain.
Well Goldman can say that one division recommended some product and some other division saw a flawed in that product and decided to short it.
Bad communication. It can happen.
If you murder someone and the authorities can't gather enough evidence to convict you, you are still a murderer.
Your logic before was that they didn't break a contract and basically, it's ok for a bank to be fraudulent because they put disclaimers on their offering. Now you are saying, well, if they were fraudulent, they can escape guilty charges through perjury (as long as everyone tells a consistent story).
I'm not changing my position at all. I only used the 'bad communication' example to show a way they can respond to you guys accusations (eventhough they don't have to since no contract was breached).
When it comes to your murder example, it is not adequat. Here we have two parties who voluntarily decided to enter into an agreement to do something that is LEGAL. The clients KNEW the risks and knew that they could lose all of their money. And they SIGNED.
At the end of the day, that is the only thing that matters.
Abdel,
I'm going to give you the benefit of doubt and assume you are trolling. I find it hard to believe you don't know the definition of fraud. Especially since I posted it here.
I'm not trolling. All I'm saying is that, technically speaking, there was no breach of contract.
Breach of contract is different from fraud. Just because there is a contract doesn't mean fraud can't be committed.
In the contract, Goldman specifies that it will do the work to the best of its abilities. That it is a risky business and that you might lose all of your money.
Well, they did the work to the best of their abilities. Clearly it was not good enough and clients lost money because of that. But it was in the contract.
Abdel, bang your head against the wall a few times and tell us how many times it echoes.
Well, I made the point that technically, I'm correct. Now, you're attacking my person, and not my arguments, which shows that I'm right.
Abdel: 1 SirTradesaLot: 0
I will score you a point for getting me into a discussion with someone who is incapable of debating things and is clearly trolling.
Fraud is illegal. If Goldman committed fraud, it is irrelevant if they have a contract or not. It's not difficult to understand for 99%+ of people. You can't disclaim away fraud. You are not technically or otherwise correct, you are absurdly wrong.
Do you admit fraud is illegal in the US or not? If not, then read the laws. If so, stfu.
I allowed myself not to quote your personal attacks.
Now, to your question. Sure, fraud is illegal. But if two adults sign voluntarily a contract where one can fuck the other over, then it is not fraud.
For example, say I sign up to a gym to do boxing. I will get punched and beat up. Following your logic, I should sue for aggravated assault on my person?
Anyhow, I'm done with this thread.
Final score:
Abdel: 2 SirTradesaLot: 0
What the contract said is irrelevant. If GS knowingly sold securities to investors that consisted of bad underlying assets, then bet against the same contract, that's fraud. A disclaimer doesn't make it less illegal.
Great. Can you just be done with this site in general as well?
Another personal attack instead of arguments. I guess I'll be the adult here and keep it moving.
Thank you for your time sir and may you have a good day :)
-Abdel
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