4/4/15

A) Totally disappointed with the overpriced and undervalue 3 month Mentoring Program (USD7001)

I am totally disappointed with Anton Kreil's Institute of Trading and portfolio management's 3 month Mentoring Program. This is because the mentoring program is overpriced and undervalue. I have regretted signing it up and asked for a refund on the 7 unused sessions. Anton Kreil refuses to give me a full refund on the 7 unused mentoring sessions. He only partially refunded me USD2500 only after numerous follow up e-mails and Skype's converstions; and he mentioned that it is non-negotiable. The outstanding money Anton Kreil owes to me is USD1583.

B) Go or no go to put on a trade simply based on simple technical indicators.

The total cost of the 3 month mentoring program is USD 7001 which consist of only 12 mentoring sessions. The session is usually around 30min or less if I have no question. Go or no go to put on a trade simply based on simple technical indicators. No addition insight/value given on the trades. I have lost an additional of about USD3000 by following the mentor recommendation on the trades.

C) Don't be a victim like me.

How would you feel if you paid fully for the mentoring program that is not being delivered and it is not fully refundable? I feel that this is not fair to me. I feel ripped off. I feel scammed. I am only asking for refund on the unused sessions even though the used sessions are overpriced and undervalue.

The mentoring program is overpriced and undervalue. I just want to share my extremely bad experience to anyone who is thinking of signing up the mentoring program to think twice. And don't be a victim like me. They will take your money and couldn't care less about what happens to you. Thanks.

Comments (12)

7/1/15

Sounds like a tough experience. I've seen that program in the past through their presentations. Did you signed up to their professional trading master class video series prior to signing up for the one on one mentoring program? Perhaps you can elaborate a bit more about what you actually learned and did not learned

Financial Modeling

7/5/15

I didn't sign up for the person mentoring program, but I met him in person in NYC, made some new friends who also attended the seminar that work on the street, some of them being CFA's, and enrolled for the life time PTM course membership which was around $3k or so... Note, you ARE allowed to share the same login with a buddy so if a couple of you are interested in the lifetime course I'm happy to split my account. If you're in NYC we can meet in person and go over the proof/logistics.

Was it useful? I wouldn't advise it for anyone who is already a CFA. I have a software engineering background and been trading for 4-5 years now (about $40-50k of equity, trades around $80-90k on margin). I still haven't gone through the entire set of videos but the take away I got was you need to be hands on while watching them, open up Excel on the other window and follow the steps in person. I'd recommend it for people who are willing to spot their personal capital on personal trading accounts. Overall I don't regret spending the $3k (with the hopes of hedging it by finding a partner down the road who I can split the cost with - which is why I bought the life time membership, so feel free to PM me if you wish to get cheaper access). I took this before I changed full time jobs into a brand name Asset Management / equity research firm.

I would definitely not spend $7k on personal coaching. It's much easier to just make contacts with people with similar backgrounds in NYC and steal 30 mins. of their time and I haven't had trouble networking with traders or Wall St. veterans over the past 3-4 years just keep an eye out for opportunities to meet such folks that have made it big.

  • Anonymous Monkey
  •  9/19/15

It's pretty obvious to me that he's legit. The mentoring looks like more of a holiday than a training seminar but $7,000 is about what you'd pay for such a vacation anyway. With flights from Canada anyway. So it's a few bucks more than what a vacation would cost. A $2,500 refund seems fair to me. You can't expect him to make everyone happy. Especially when you consider that not everyone is cut out for day trading and that some people expect more than others do for their money.

  • Anonymous Monkey
  •  10/21/15

sounds like other offers on line......so was there anything useful you took away with any of the material presented?

11/4/15

I actually took the course myself and I'm very pleased with what I have learned. But to be honest, I didn't know that much before I took the course. Anton teaches a lot about macroeconomic indicators, using this to predict economic growth and risk management, wich is obviously very important for managing a portfolio. If you are just beginning to trade then this course would be a good way to start building up knowledge.

Also I think the mentoring program would only be a good purchase for people with some money to spare and who have a lot of questions about the course.

I was hoping that one of the guys who actually took the course could send me in the right direction on something. Anton talks a lot about mapping out the value chains of the sectors in the video "Drilling from the top down". Does anyone know how to actually do this? I would appreciate it if someone could give me some advice on how to do this. I have asked the Institute this, but they told me that this question was more suited towards the mentoring program.

6/22/16

Im putting together a group of guys who have studied or has studied the courses. Doesn't have to be antons course, but have a trading style using macro economics and a similar method. Not looking for a large group base, just up to 5 guys. Only self starters and naturally smart, no dumb assess, no day traders or chartaholics. email me on kasfx at outlook com or message me on here, i have all data sets from trading economics which i pay around 300 per month for. You will be able to get other data sets which are not available like other country pmi's from me.

Best Response
7/5/16

I signed up for his course many years ago when I was already a professional trader. Within 4 days of signing up, I found enormous amount of erroneous contents on his class. Besides, the class was extremely low level. I ended up getting a full refund.

In my personal opinion, he is just a dinosaur who used to be okay in flow trading when technology wasnt this prevalent in the industry. Now he knows that he's outdated, so he's just trying to rip off some naive retail customers.

His course may seem appealing to those inexperienced or those who never had a basic quantitative education because of the way it is presented. He is probably a way better salesman than a trader. But don't waste your time and money, just walk away. If you're dumb enough to think that his course is good, then it only proves that you're just another donkey in the stock market: in this case, stop all trading and just save your money in a bank.

12/21/16

The 7K mentoring did not including the off site training. It was just only Skype conference.

12/22/16

I have trouble believing you, not because the overpriced material of these sessions/courses is shit, I believe you on that, but why would an EVP prop trader seek advice from a clique of ex traders providing holiday sessions to tourists with big wallets?

12/22/16

If he were truly any good in trading he wouldn't spend his time teaching people about trading. He'd be smashing it at a prop fund or HF

12/29/16

Three things you need to understand about this course and the founder Anton Kriel. I have personally been through the course and spoken with both Anton and another mentor in the program and now building a track record in my account so I can go into an HF.

1). Expectation: I am not sure what type of expectation you had going into the course, but it sounds like it didn't line up with what the course offered. In my opinion, that isn't any reason to throw "monkey shit" at Anton for his course. Maybe you were expecting to be a professional trader in 3 months? Make 20% return on your money in that same time? I don't know but what I do know is more people lose money in the markets than they make.Knowing how not to lose money is worth the $7k. BTW, for someone to be even considered for the mentor program, you have to have passed the actual educational trading videos. So if you didn't get any value out of the videos why in the world would you sign up for a mentor program teaching the same thing? Also, the videos are extremely dense with Excel spreadsheets for you to conduct your analysis while watching the videos. The average person who isn't sold on investing for the long term wouldn't do this.

2). "Worthwhile info": The info is basic but supposed to be on par of what you would learn in an SA program in trading. @caeruleus mentioned that he was a pro trader before purchasing the program and didn't think the info held any value. I don't see any validity in your comment since as pro trader learning basic or entry level info would theoretically be a step back in education advancement. As a pro trader, you probably have made money for some time and went through some program to teach you how to trade.Your comment would be like Lebron James going back to his high school coach looking to "re-learn" the fundamentals of basketball. Doesn't add up. Rather the info is worthwhile or not is probably relative but I can tell you that the program is extremely useful. I've seen posts where you should just trade your money than waste it on a course. Pretty stupid if you ask me. If you trade and lose all your money, how do you know what you did wrong outside of trading the wrong stock at the wrong time? How will you explain that to an interviewer? This course, in my opinion, is exactly like BIWS and WSO modeling guides. You're not going to be a world class investment banker, but you'll at least have a leg up going into interviews and gain some technical skills.

3). **The mentors making money off you and their validity **: When I met Anton and Raj Malhotra(Former MD of options trading at Nomura) they both told me the same thing. They're not doing this to be Mother Teresa. They do have an objective to the mentorship program, and that is they train you on what they know and how to trade. Once you've passed the video series and start trading inside of the program, they'll get to pick and choose which trades their traders put on and put money behind it themselves. Every trader in the program is mentored and monitored from the back end by Anton. Meaning if you put on a stupid trade, use excessive leverage, or put on good trades he'll know. The program also allows students who have a track record over the course of 12-24 months to potentially be placed in a hedge fund. The hedge fund pays Anton a consultant fee, a percentage of the trader's salary upfront because he trained them. A win-win, since a person doesn't need to be trained by the HF and trader gets placed into a fund. A great option instead of going through the traditional IB route and trying to enter out of UG if that is your objective. Continuing on their validity, most of these mentors have retired after a decade trading in a hedge fund or IB and most run their own books or are still trading for investors. Hichem Djouhri, for example, is a leading fund manager in Dubai. I doubt he would risk running with scam artists losing out on millions on his carry/salary to pick up a few $7000 checks here and there. Along with Raj or Anton.

In short, if you're looking at this course you need to realize that trading is a long term game. You're not looking to make six figures a year with the course but build wealth through compounded returns or leverage your knowledge to a full-time offer. Despite everyone's negative thoughts on the program, it is equivalent to most IB modeling programs, where the investment bankers are no longer actively working on deals but spending their time giving back to eager students looking to enter the industry.

1/2/17
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