Leaving finance to do something else?
How much money is enough? At what level (income or assets) are you guys going to leave finance and do something else? What is that something else going to be?
$10 million is enough.
i think after 500k i would begin to do what i really enjoy...which would be running my own business
Are you talking per year, or nest egg?
500K per year annuity is OK too. (10MM * 5%)
just nest egg...with 500k to play with, i would love to own a franchise
You need to be able to live just off of reasonable interest. Otherwise you are just gonna do drudgery until the money you already have is that size anyway.
Leaving Finance (Originally Posted: 06/11/2013)
Fellow Monkeys, after a long, sometime rewarding and oftentime exhausting four years in finance (2 years consumer M&A, mezz debt), I am considering leaving. I was curious how many of you feel done with all of this and what are some of the avenues you have taken? My family owned and operated 35 restaurants before selling to a PE firm and currently owns and operates two concepts that are doing amazingly well and will probably be looking to scale, I would enter the business at the very bottom level (food runner/waiter) with the understanding that within a year I would be a manager and then help move into a COO/CFO role when the company expanded. I am trying to weigh the risks and options here here as well as get your thoughts on the opportunity and other avenues that would be worth considering, I'm done with finance. Feel free to PM me.
Wow, 4 years in M&A + mezz and your family would make you start out as a food runner / waiter?
Starting as the food runner and then experiencing all jobs from bottom to top will give the OP a very good idea of his business, which will later help him when he is running the company.
Yep. Do it OP. You have a golden opportunity.
OP, I would suggest that you clearly communicate with everyone that you are planning on working your way from bottom to top, just in case you know?!
Yes, expand the family biz. Many kids your age would do the same if they had the opportunity. My goal is to never become a MD or stay in banking forever. I am saving up plenty of money to invest in the right businesses.
Looks like a great opportunity to pursue. I would also start at the bottom. That way you will get to know in and outs of the business. What type of restaurant is it? Fancy one or lower scale/bar?
One is high end, the other is slightly more casual, but still both are sit down 40+ unit restaurants, >$2.5mm in rev at the smaller of the two >$6mm at the larger
It's apparent that your family wants you to succeed in running the business based on the rate of promotion. Like someone else said this is golden.
Do it. The only path left to true wealth is entrepreneurship. Plus people always need to eat.
In finance, you're more than likely working for someone else.
This family restaurant gig sounds awesome. I'd do it, too.
Do it man. You'll learn a lot. I worked as a waiter, then bartender, then manager of a restaurant while in college.
Sounds like a plan to me. Do it.
I'd take that in a hearbeat.
Just to play the devil's advocate though....a year as food runner/waiter is really not intellectually challenging AT ALL...just make sure you keep your finance fresh and that your goal there is to understand the business. Is your family's business at a city you want to live in long term? Hospitality management is very different from finance, but if you grew up in that, you should have a good innate sense of the environment. I would just find out more about the lifestyle you would be living before committing totally. Best of luck!!
Grow that empire
I'll have my steak medium rare
But in all seriousness successful entrepreneurship is a personal dream of mine. If you are financially sound and can afford the risk/income change then take this opportunity, as others have said it's golden. Meeting people from different walks of life, growing a business, and a comfortable lifestyle is practically impossible to find in high finance. You are doing the right thing and I believe deep down inside you know so. Finance is a means to an end for most of us
I would go for it, even if you have to spend some time as a waiter. I think it would probably benefit you in the long-run as you would learn how everything works from the ground up, which will allow you to make better decisions once you actually move up and get to the executive level.
Leaving Banking (Originally Posted: 04/15/2012)
I've spent many years working in banking, seen friends lose their jobs, find new ones to lose them again, and recently found myself in a similar situation (laid off for the first time in a very long time).
When is it time to leave banking / PE / HF altogether and what to do instead?
Now.
Not my blog (and doesn't seem to be updated anymore), but I saw this a few months ago. Reasons 1-5 are pretty compelling: http://anonybanker.wordpress.com/
[quote=Feinstein]Now.
Not my blog (and doesn't seem to be updated anymore), but I saw this a few months ago. Reasons 1-5 are pretty compelling: http://anonybanker.wordpress.com/[/quote]
Wow I never saw this before.
Hey man welcome to life! You will enjoy it! I know I do! Good luck!
[quote=Feinstein]Now.
Not my blog (and doesn't seem to be updated anymore), but I saw this a few months ago. Reasons 1-5 are pretty compelling: http://anonybanker.wordpress.com/[/quote]
yeah good blog..
Yeah great blog. "A $6 billion deal, with say, a 4% fee spread around 5 banks, works out to $48 billion in fees per bank."
Part 3
What you want to do next would probably depends on what is important to you personally.
Moving on from finance (Originally Posted: 07/07/2014)
I've been working for a couple months in banking and am realizing that maybe finance is not the career path for me. While it's been an okay learning experience, I just can't see myself continuing to work in banking or even moving to the buyside. While the money is good, it's getting harder to justify going to work and doing something I'm just not that interested in.
I've always been interested in tech and am thinking of learning some programming languages, but not sure where that would take me. I'm sure tons of other people have gone through this so just wanted to see if anyone had advice/stories.
Considering today is only July 7, how can it be possible that you have been working in banking for a few months? You are talking about investment banking, right? Can you provide more details of your story?
I came in off-cycle and am working at a boutique bank - and yes it's IBD. I've been here for ~4 months now. Graduated from a top-tier non ivy and spent months after graduation trying to break in. I just didn't know what I wanted to do straight out of college so I decided on IBD mostly for the exit ops. I thought I would want to stay in the finance industry - either move to the buyside or even corp dev/strategy later on. After working in the industry though I just want to get out of finance alltogether. Only problem is, I don't really have a plan and more importantly, not sure if I would like my new job (whatever it is) anymore than my current job.
For now, I've decided to just suck it up and get around a year under my belt before I jump ship, but am trying to plan out..or at the very least start thinking about what I would want to do after IBD.
Try to stick it out for at least a year, ideally two, because you can't easily put any job you've worked in for less on your resume (you can, it'll just look weird and you'll have to explain it away). You're probably also at the point where the newness of the job has worn out and you're feeling that this isn't what you thought it would be because almost every entry level job is pretty boring and you're doing what seems like stupid crap, which you probably are to a large degree. If you can get over this hump you can just cruise until you have two years under your belt and have better exit opps.
I think I'd stick it out for two years (or later to a larger bank after one) if I was plannin on staying in finance but since I'm not, doesn't it not matter? If i moved to a completely new industry, ie tech or something else, I feel like it wouldn't matter if I had stayed in IBD for 1 year or 2.
Time to throw in the towel on career in finance. What should i do? (Originally Posted: 10/16/2014)
I graduate from a non- target school with a degree in business. I couldn't get a really good internship so I got an internship at a boutique firm. When my internship was over I tried to get my Series 7 license but the firm got shut down by the SEC. Ever since then I have been bouncing around from temp job to temp job at various IB but I can't get hired because I have no real experience. The best run I have had was when I worked as a temp at Citigroup for a year. But there was a massive hiring freeze and I couldn't get hired permanently. It's been 7 years since graduating and I am seriously considering giving up working in finance. What do you think?
7 years after graduating will be tough to get an analyst job, possibly go back to school and get your mba?
Why you haven't tried for valuation, credit analysis, Corp banking, risk, private banking, treasury, etc by now is beyond me. You need to put the banking dream on hold and get some actual finance experience. Then you can attack banking.
There are tons of finance opportunities outside of IB. Look at FP&A roles at F500 cos. or credit analyst roles at commercial banks. These types of roles will likely have less discrimination based on age. Throwing in the towel on IB does not necessarily mean throwing in the towel on a career in finance. Commercial lending roles (two promotions past entry level credit analyst) at my MM bank have great work/life balance and do pretty well on a $/hour basis.
I mean, I admire the tenacity, I guess. At some point you need to know when to hold em and know when to fold em. There are thousands of opportunities in finance, so I find it difficult to believe you can't find anything in the financial field. What kinds of jobs have you been looking for and why do you keep accepting temp jobs?
I'm up for doing anything in finance other than being a broker. I can't co back to working in a boutique firm. The idea of calling people for 12hr/day for 8/hr is not really going to work. I have a wife and rent to pay and i don't think it would work for a person my age. This is a list of all the places I have worked temp, S&P, JP Morgan & Chase, Citi, Goldman Sachs, but I can only come as a person doing clerical work. I can't make the transition from filing and scanning documents to doing something finance related. I have can't afford grad school and I'm afraid that without work experience I could end up with an expensive grad school degree but no work experience to make it pay off.
My advice, an MBA from a top school or try to become an officer in the military.
I'm going to guess that by "finance" you mean "investment banking" ? There are other fields of finance and business that your degree could've gone too, and I'm going to guess you didn't even try for those. If that's the case then you need to recognize your expectations have basically been holding you back for 7 years. Why would a clerical position get you closer to an investment banking role?
There was a recent "success story" post about a guy who networked his way in and he put up the stats of a few other guys that had a similar "success story", if you can even call it that. Basically, they sent out hundreds of cold emails, hundreds of phone calls, informational interviews, application drops, networking events and self-financed personal networking trips. Ultimately it was someone's wife or cousin who was an MD who gave them a shot. As in, pure luck. Sure, they "made" their luck by being so adamant but the reality is there were probably thousands that have tried the same and gotten nowhere.
The flip side is a post from "OpsDude" (?). Who put up the stats of people interviewing for investment banking at his target school, basically all of them got it. This "non-target success story" has so far cost you 7 years. As I see it, leaves you with 2 options:
1) Attempt a target school MBA to re-brand yourself and have a shot at recruiting, which may or may not be financially prudent.
Or
2) Move on.
I wish you well in this decision. If it's any consolation, I too have dealt with setbacks.
Really you have a couple options:
Leaving Banking For Something Completely Different (Originally Posted: 01/09/2011)
So I'm a first year analyst right now in IBD and I honestly hate it so much. It's at a point where it's even affecting me outside of work. Not only am I really unhealthy right now (gained a lot of weight), but it has affected my personality as well (kind of bitter). I'm sure some of you are going to call me a pussy or w.e, but you have to understand this isn't for everyone.
I want out of banking and I don't particularly like finance or have any interest in doing anything in finance. The reason I ended up here is because I honestly wasn't sure what I wanted in college and kind of followed the herd and listened to my older siblings (both former bankers...so here I am. I am trying to suck it up to finish the year out and then leave.
As I try to figure out where I want to go with my life, do you guys know of people who left for something totally different? I am particularly interested to hear if anyone knows of someone who left for something in a more fun/creative industry (Arts, Hospitality/Tourism, etc.) I am not meant to be in the finance industry, and would love to hear if there were people like me and where they ended up. Thanks.
Stick it out and then go be an analyst at MTV or something like that.
How about this, I'm stuck in back office and will gladly take your place. Is this possible? This is a serious offer
Why are your siblings FORMER bankers and how did they manage to convince you to go in if they themselves got out?
They both did their analyst stints and moved on to the Hedge Fund world....so they were big advocates of doing Ibanking
I appreciate all the advice....I think I will at least finish out my year and hopefully figure stuff out by then...I'll let you guys know what I end up doing
Plenty of guys leave and do completely different things. You're 24 years old man, you have your entire life ahead of you. I have a friend who joined the peace corps, another who went into PR. Worst case go back and get an MBA to reset.
my best friend was in a top group at GS/MS and left about 1 year because he hated it... he now works at a top talent agency in L.A. as the assistant to an agent (eventually he'll be made a junior agent... but it'll take another year or two and he's already been there a year). He loves the change and is doing great there. One day he'll also probably end up making a lot of money --- although right now he makes under 40k / year... so I'd say that option only worked out so well because he comes from a "good family" (very solid subsidies from mom and dad).
it is what you make of it --- and banking is not for everyone. Doing it because your brothers did is not a good call... clearly.
It might be an idea to see and employment consultant and identify what you really want to do before you make a switch. If you can pinpoint some goals for yourself first, it could make the change easier for you. Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
I was in your shoes, and left for a well known startup (think Groupon/Zynga/etc.)...no regrets at all. Seriously the best move of my life for professional and career purposes.
If you know banking isn't for you, hustle and figure out what it is you're looking for. Goo luck.
Actually, going towards the start-up route is something I am really interested in...I really like the idea that you kind of have to be a jack of all trades and I honestly think I would thrive in that kind of entrepreneurial environment, which is one of the reasons I am having so much trouble in banking (spend hours and weekends on work that never gets used, lots of mindless formatting, etc.) Could you compare your experience at the start-up vs. your time in banking? Really appreciate it.
BUMP BUMP BUMP EXPERIENCE AT STARTUP after leaving banking?????
I don't have any experience in banking but I've been involved with alot of start ups. If I can help you in anyway, send me a PM.
[quote=Actually, going towards the start-up route is something I am really interested in...I really like the idea that you kind of have to be a jack of all trades and I honestly think I would thrive in that kind of entrepreneurial environment, which is one of the reasons I am having so much trouble in banking (spend hours and weekends on work that never gets used, lots of mindless formatting, etc.) Could you compare your experience at the start-up vs. your time in banking? Really appreciate it.[/quote]
weeds49-------is there any way I can reach you? Your PM functionality is disabled! I have a question to ask you that I'm hoping/suspecting you'll be able to answer. thanks!
what's your exit strategy? (Originally Posted: 07/08/2008)
For those of you who don't intend to make banking a career, what's your exit strategy? How long do you plan on working in banking?
Exit strategy? Exit strategies are un-American.
The most common one would be business school. I almost have to do banking for two years to make enough to pay off student loans. Not sure if I would like to go back to business school that soon and incur even more debt. Preferably some genius idea will come to me so I can turn it into a start-up firm.
Preferably an IPO. If not that, a trade sale or secondary offering of shares.
do you ever post anything other than BS, for f*ck sake
What about an equity recap? I swear - some people are so narrow minded.
That's the kind of comment you get from prospective monkeys who want to sound like they know what the F they're talking about.
I thought that the comment on an IPO or a trade sale was kind of amusing.
Lighten up.
To the OP, standard exit opps are PE/HF, Corp Dev, B-School and wandering the jungle for a few months.
The most common is to either go to b-school (like I did), or to transition into another finance-oriented job -- but a different function (sales/trading, research, or even back office like HR for those looking to start a family, etc.), or into asset mgmt, private equity, hedge funds, and sometimes VC, or in transaction/project-oriented industry jobs, most notably corporate development at large companies. And even then, most of these people aren't necessarily working their way up brick by brick to become partners or Masters of the Universe or anything. After a few years, many will then move onto some other completely unrelated job or career path.
There's also quite a number of ex-analysts who leave finance altogether to join a nonprofit, teach in Africa, open a restaurant, get married and become full-time parents, start a business, become a carpenter (that's a true story), go to med school, etc. Or some of the analysts from wealthy families go back to managing the family biz.
Most people's careers don't follow a linear progression at all. Which is a great thing, because who'd want to have a career that was so predictable and formulaic?
Alex Chu
Quit Banking and Then What... (Originally Posted: 12/19/2011)
Hey guys,
So I'm about 7 months into my IBD analyst gig at the current time at a top tier BB (think GS/MS/JP). I'm coming to the quick realization that the spreadsheet wizard lifestyle is not for me. I have sincerely given finance a shot having doing a summer in an S&T program lthe prior summer and one in PWM my sophomore year. Further, as glorified as PE and the buyside may be, I figure the office job will always be there so I should take the chance to do something I am more interested in experiencing at a younger age while I am still relatively obligations-free.
I am the kind of the person who is very entrepreneurial and have been working on some projects on the side but with 100hr weeks owning my life I can't do much else apart from sleep/work. I was wondering, for someone who wanted to do something entrepreneurial after college, as sort of a learning process, what options exist out there in terms of jobs/programs. I figure that I can try something a little more risky and if it all goes south, I could try doing b-school and jumping back in the finance game. And when I say something more risky, I don't mean quit to start running a lemonade stand or even my own projects. I want to be a part of some kind of experience where you continue to learn about becoming an entrepreneur and building a business from the ground up, while freeing up a little time to focus on my own stuff. One example would be this interesting new program I came across called Venture For America (think TFA but instead sending kids to go run small startups). Anyone heard of anything else of the sort. Maybe VC's have something out there for aspiring recent grads?
Even if nothing like this exists, I still want to vary up my work experience pre b-school, what other experiences do you think would shape you well for being a young business professional? Maybe strategy at Google? Global Corp Dev in one of Walmart's international offices seeing how they spearhead the world's largest retailer in India/China? Something interesting and different.
Please only reply if you have something constructive to say.
Do you mean something like startup incubators or accelerator programs. For these programs you need to have a business plan/idea and pitch it to them competing with thousands of other entreprenaur for a spot in the program. Here are two well known startup programs of the kind I am referring to.
http://www.techstars.com/program/
http://ycombinator.com/
There are many of these programs out there do a search for startup incubator,program and you'll get many relevant results. Good luck.
Split and go where, back to wearin' knock offs?
lolol
Have you tried escapethecity.org? I browse it occasionally and have come across some pretty neat stuff
If you're looking for something with a shorter time commitment, I would check out the Lean Startup Machine. It's essentially a weekend competition and series of workshops on entrepreneurship, with a focus on validating your ideas and customer development. In 2012 they'll have around 40 events nationally, so there definitely will be one near you.
Travel for a bit and find out what you really want to do dude.
I am thinking of opening a beet farm and getting into the agrotourism business. Maybe something out near Gettysburg.
I'd say you just begin applying for different start up companies. Look at like the Top 100 NA Red Herring companies or something and find a few that interest you. I'm sure they'd at least be willing to sacrifice 10 minutes to talk on the phone with you and hear you out.
Lean Street Machine sounds interesting. Looking into an upcoming event.
But essentially, I wasn't saying I was looking to get seed funding for my idea. I don't want to necessarily quit from jobs altogether. I just want a business related job which is a little more entrepreneurial or to join a company which has a 1-2 year program of training recent grads in a variety of new areas of business rather than be pigeon-holed into a team for two years where you just crush MS Office programs all day long. I heard the GE FMP program is interesting, is there anything a little more entrepreneurial than that?
The Venture for America program started recently sounds very interesting but working with startups in Nola and Detroit would probably not be as interesting as i may be in NYC or silicon valley, hotbeds of activity and creative flow.
Wait, you work in investment banking now and want to lateral out to GE's FMP program?!
Is i-banking analyst gig really that bad? (I am curious)
Also, regarding GE FMP program, this thread may be useful:
//www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/the-truth-about-ges-fmp-its-accounting-f…
One big negative about working for GE FMP is that you will likely to get placed in the middle of nowhere.
If you hate being an office monkey you'll probably hate GE FMP, just saying. Less pay, less prestige, potentially more mundane. Better hours though.
Facilis est sed quia ut tempore vero. Soluta veniam corrupti cumque et. Ut quis sit harum quasi eaque in repellendus.
Repellendus voluptas sit repellendus sunt dolores distinctio. Delectus totam aliquam sint et eveniet. Amet nobis nostrum possimus. Eos assumenda non laborum maxime.
Dolore voluptate optio quia aut. Velit ea qui ex nihil repellat est. Fuga officiis reprehenderit fuga molestias. Porro ipsum ut quis alias cumque ratione.
Quia aut iste labore autem. Odio itaque et voluptate est ab est quia est. Quas ratione sint inventore rem. Architecto animi dolores aliquid suscipit voluptatem rerum suscipit.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Odit recusandae odit mollitia ex nostrum odio. Repellendus aut voluptas laborum voluptatem. Possimus ab a facilis vel. Incidunt laboriosam et aperiam autem beatae. Minima debitis sed eius eligendi eum sequi quis. Totam cupiditate sapiente unde sed veniam vitae fugit. Dolorem illo aut distinctio dolor corrupti veritatis.
Rerum dolore voluptates odio veritatis. Atque laboriosam et corrupti porro eius ex ut dolorum. Id nobis aperiam consectetur occaecati. Rerum tempore est quo. Laboriosam officiis ad excepturi reiciendis officia cupiditate. Sint assumenda eligendi porro blanditiis et et. Atque voluptatem voluptas voluptas omnis.
Dolorem vero eum aut. Reiciendis est animi vitae ut dolorum et.
Repellendus tenetur blanditiis natus sed minima. Odit laudantium est possimus debitis sunt sapiente qui ut. Est accusamus ut voluptates maiores alias laboriosam. Illo laudantium ut at eaque. Ipsam non fuga nulla vitae. Debitis aut enim aperiam suscipit impedit blanditiis alias.
Ut ab quasi magni ab sapiente eligendi. Non nemo minus et quasi quam. Et doloremque aut sit enim ullam sed.
Mollitia dolor magni nesciunt omnis. Incidunt saepe quia sapiente quia. Harum voluptatibus quasi illum. Eos adipisci nam quibusdam voluptatem.
Consequatur velit non voluptates. Dolor nostrum molestias quo est dolorem aut. Minima et et voluptatem qui soluta aliquid blanditiis. Molestiae dicta quasi doloremque omnis delectus. Deserunt non saepe animi qui.
Cumque in quia quis assumenda et ex quod. Et eius natus animi. Eaque quo dolore est at enim non. Sapiente ipsam vel quaerat tempore corrupti. Explicabo enim nihil voluptates sunt sint eaque. Quia reprehenderit minima veritatis ipsam recusandae ipsa sint.
Voluptas qui quaerat ullam cupiditate adipisci. Inventore et est excepturi ullam quibusdam voluptatem cumque. Dolorum sapiente omnis qui est.
Libero laudantium animi quis non quidem nemo deleniti. Et est modi earum eligendi aperiam neque iusto. Optio magni optio unde temporibus nisi eius nemo. Sapiente et cum molestiae rem qui. Ullam accusantium rem atque enim hic ut quia. Temporibus inventore sed consectetur corporis accusamus et et. Vero sit temporibus et nihil.
Qui laboriosam voluptatibus in at. Ut numquam voluptatem velit sit. Est sequi consequuntur est dolor tempora et quas. Enim sit et ab natus itaque. Et maiores blanditiis facere molestias nostrum dicta voluptas.