Pirates
Seriously, are they fucking kidding me?!? More captured ships?!?
Seriously, are they fucking kidding me?!? More captured ships?!?
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they've been doing this for years you know, you just started noticing because you watch cnn or some other shitty news outlet and they've developed a boner for piracy and other low-importance but high-interest news
Well, they have been doing it for hundreds of years. You would think with technology today they could avoid, or at least see a bunch of guys in a 15 foot out-board motor boat jumping up and down heading there way. They could out maneuver the pirates. I know it is easier said than done, but come on!!
The Economist had a graph several months ago with some interesting statistics on this.
http://www.economist.com/daily/chartgallery/displaystory.cfm?story_id=1…
Piracy has been around forever. Find a better news source than CNN. It'll rot your mind.
This one shows all the attempted hijackings (yellow) and all the succsessful ones (red) for 2009: http://www.vg.no/nyheter/utenriks/artikkel.php?artid=552537
Sorry for the language.
The pirate attacks have come to attention now simply because they have become more frequent and more audacious- like they hijacked an entire Saudi oil supertanker.. Also anarchy in Somalia and Sudan is simply spiling onto the surrounding seas..
I think that the US, France or any country that captures pirates should torture the hell out of them and have the video "accidentally" leaked on the internet so that they know what awaits them when they get caught. This will make them think twice before their next attack.
Ok, I know that the government won't go for this (nor do I really think that torturing would be OK), but they could fake the tortures and use Hollywood TV magic to make it look real. They play dirty, why can't we?
@Trigger1 - I agree with you that with all this technology can't they at least develop some kind of radar that will tell you that some tiny-ass boat is closing in on you. And then you can just fire a bazooka at them.
jesus christ have u ever heard of politics
Easy dude! All I am saying is that this is the only viable option to defeat these guys, not that I condone it. They have nothing to lose; they don't fear death or getting locked up somewhere in jail, because they live in such treacherous conditions that they wouldn't care less what happens to them. This is their only chance to make money and live a
The only reason that civilized countries have such relatively low crime is because people fear the punishment that awaits if they get caught. These pirates don't fear any possible punishment that will come from our government, and that is where torture could make a change (once again I do not condone it) I am just saying it is the only thing that may work.
YEah like starving somalians hacve broaband internet and high end gaming computers in their house, and also watch youtube all day long...
Srsly , thse guys just have some rpgs, aks and a satellite phone they stole. And now they are trying to make some money, that doesnt mean that their huts will become orange county houses in a couple of weeks.
no we can't play dirty, were the U.S. Geneva conventions have to be followed.
The c/b analysis is always going to give the pirates a positive result as long as we continue paying them. Somalian males have a life expectancy of 47 years, even if they get arrested by a us ship they'll spend the rest of their life in a US jail, which will literally improve their life expectancy and quality of life. If they don't get caught, they walk off with millions of dollars. It's quite literally a no-lose proposition.
as for outmaneuvering pirates? that's like saying to somebody who gets mugged "oh, you should've just ducked." come on man
the us can probably stop piracy by filling the sea with ships, but at this point it probably isn't a big enough problem to justify that expense. of course, media attention trumps practicality, so we'll probably start shipping our tax dollars out to the indian ocean to protect ships that are delivering our food to ungrateful refugees
They shot at a US lawmakers plane yesterday as he was taking off from Somalia... REAAAALLLYYY???
Do they honestly think that's a good idea? Their logic behind this was because we killed three of their guys... who hijacked a vessel of ours to begin with.
Do they honestly think waging war with almost every powerful country in the world is a good idea? It's too bad there are hostages, otherwise we would be bombing like there's no tomorrow.
dude they arn't some organized paramilitary organization.... its just tons of loose bands of people from 15-25 with ak-47s
Bombing the hell out of them won't make their lives worse. We have absolutely no deterrent against these guys. Their lives are shit. Piracy at least gives them a shot at some wealth.
The guys that were holding the U.S. captain were 17,18, and 19 years old, respectively. They were probably given a 5-hour crash course on the operation of an AK-47 and were sent to work.
These people have literally nothing to lose.
For those with an interest in the depth and breadth of the problem globally (not just in Africa), the international Chamber of Commerce has been keeping piracy records since 1992, and publishes a live piracy report here:
http://www.icc-ccs.org/index.php?option=com_fabrik&view=table&tableid=2…
14 incidents over the past 10 days alone.
OoOoO, when i saw the thread title, I thought you were talking about Pirate Capital..
"I'm a fly Malcolm X, buy any jeans necessary."
"I'm a fly Malcolm X, buy any jeans necessary."
That's one way to you know if you've been on WSO too long!
These pirates have lived through poverty, starvation,abuse, and anything else you could possibly imagine. Torturing someone and showing a video about it would not deter these kids(It might even piss them off) these people are uneducated and have nothing to lose. Most of them recognize that they will not make it to adulthood. Why should they fear far away Americans that could torture them if they have so many people and elements near them that could kill them and their families. These kids turn to piracy to merely survive and protect their own, I obviously don't condone piracy but I understand that it is a consequence of the oppression and poverty of the third world masses
Most US maritime academies do not offer weapons or force-on-force training. That’s because most shipping companies follow a long tradition of merchant vessels remaining unarmed – which makes them easy prey for pirates, but prevents bloodshed and damage to the ship.
It's not a tradition, it's because of international maritime law, and because most countries have strict weapons laws which would prohibit an armed ship from entering their territorial waters.
Here is the real question. What in Somalia are they buying with millions of dollars? They get the money from the ransoms, then what? I don't see any mansions or car dealerships lining the streets. Are they just taking that money to buy more guns, so they can overtake more ships? What's the use in that, it's a never ending cycle in that case.
^^they were giving it to Madoff...Madoff collapsed and now they are in need of more capital -> so they need to hijack more ships...this is pretty obvious
What really needs to be done to stop it? Stabilizing Somalia. The country is a mess, has been for a long time. Was before we left in the 90s, was (and is) even more so after.
But lets be realistic, I could name 10 other countries in a minute or two that are in similar situations, and its probably not going to happen, particularly with this administration. The UN will probably draft a resolution condemning the pirates' actions, and we'll all forget about it in a few months (even though nothing will really change).
The coastline is too vast and the pirates too agile for the Navy to pose any real threat with any half-assed strategy on the pirates parts, without significant use of Naval resources (which is likely not going to happen). Don't expect a whole lot to change.
Oh and Somalia has a huge black market that would willingly gobble up US dollars, hell the country is a black market. It also makes it easy to purchase more weaponry and recruit more to the ranks. And I wouldn't be at all surprised if some groups of pirates have relations with the warlords that run the various partitions of the country.
It's not like we haven't faced this before. The Marine Corps has had pirate contingency plans on the books for 200 years now:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presley_O%27Bannon
about stabilizing somalia--did none of you ever watch black hawk down??? that's in somalia, btw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Somali_Civil_War
about taking down guerrilla groups--does FARC or the colombian civil war sound familiar? the US has invested billions in "solving" this problem w/o any success http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombian_Civil_War
about following the geneva convention--were you guys asleep w/ the whole guantanamo thing? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantanamo_Bay_detention_camp
As for filming you guys torturing them, did you guys forget this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib_torture_and_prisoner_abuse How's that war in Iraq going?
And even if you were to assume that the collective logic was anywhere close to rational, only 1% of the somali population has access to the internet. http://www.internetworldstats.com/africa.htm#so
great ideas guys. keep it flowing.
LMAO!!!
Congratulations, you watched BHD. A great movie, no doubt.
But lets look at the situation through the lense of reality. It was a failed mission, backdroped by poor design of stabilization strategy (by removing a prominent military leader)... sounds like this has happened before... and after. The way we went about it was wrong. Pulling out like we did as an populist overreaction, arguably worse.
Pirates Attack Again (Originally Posted: 11/28/2008)
Looks like these Somali pirates have no visible writedowns, but are very long on commodities. Good for them.
When will this start to affect crude prices?
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5iPPJ5oeH8vFtPkAUfYR0Q…
Book was much better, I'd suggest you read it and Killing Pablo, also by Mark Bowden, it will give you a much better idea of why pulling out was such a mistake.
Never...ninjas will free the crude from the pirates' grasp.
I don't think it would ever affect crude prices right now...they really would have to kidnap a whole bunch of ships to have an impact. Just one tanker or two is an insignifcant amount overall and it also doesn't install a lot of fear in the system....juxtaposed to the bad economic outlook in US/Europe.
going to have to steal a few more before we see it at the pump.
Torpedoes and rocket launchers on every ship.
Problem solved.
Yeah, or a couple of .50 cals machine guns on each side of the ship. They'll rip those pirate speedboats to shreds long before they get into boarding range. Relatively inexpensive and safe too (compared to rockets and other explosives).
I think these Somalian pirates are justified in what they do. They have my full support, just as I have theirs.
Ya a little late on the kidnapping. I think they would have made a little more in ransom money had they done it a few months earlier at $140 a barrel. Yet another lesson on how planning ahead in the markets can get you killed.
what i'm trying to point is that a vast majority of US stabilization missions turn out to be failures that are then magnified by the political situation.
fine, there's some sample bias there, but still...
Pirates' "maritime companies" funded by local Somalian "stock exchange" (Originally Posted: 09/27/2012)
This is fascinating.
"Four months ago, during the monsoon rains, we decided to set up this stock exchange. We started with 15 'maritime companies' and now we are hosting 72. Ten of them have so far been successful at hijacking," Mohammed said.
"The shares are open to all and everybody can take part, whether personally at sea or on land by providing cash, weapons or useful materials ... we've made piracy a community activity."
Haradheere, 400 km (250 miles) northeast of Mogadishu, used to be a small fishing village. Now it is a bustling town where luxury 4x4 cars owned by the pirates and those who bankroll them create honking traffic jams along its pot-holed, dusty streets.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/12/01/us-somalia-piracy-investors-i…
The wonders of the free market!
Fascinating
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