Is Being an Atheist Bad for Business?

Nobody will care if you work in New York. You don't have to volunteer that info either.

In before the shitshow.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/x0ZqQznblZo

you will have a problem

you could have just asked a simple question - and you would have gotten a simple answer instead you decided to explain your reasoning which is tbh pretty shallow

i am pretty sure that average priest/monk/whatever could convert you to their religion in a short conversation

in short - don't disclose that info and don't speak about what your thoughts on the subject are, and you'll do fine

Ironic as fuck. Just saw a cross made out of rusty pipes in a dump/industrial storage area while passing by on the LIRR, minutes after posting this. Still not enough for me to believe in you God. Sorry Grandma.

There's no real reason religion should come up in the workplace, and more importantly no real reason you should feel obligated to tell people what you believe in, whatever that may be

If you want to be accepted in any worthwhile social circle, you'll want to stick to your religion. Most people don't really believe in what the bible says, they just go to church and be Christian because that's what's acceptable.

If you want to be a loud-mouthed atheist, that's fine. But don't start crying when nobody invites you to join the country club.

Yay, another religion discussion on WSO!

To answer your question OP, I assume no, it won't hurt you. Champs46 stated it well, it shouldn't come up.

As a believer, I assume I'm in the minority here. Also, re: Forbes 400, I don't recall the Google guys or Gates, for example, being religious. Zuckerberg is on your A-team for sure.

LOL Eddie, that's gotta be the most smug commercial in the history of commercials, I must have missed that while I was fuming over the shitty calls against my Niners. I'd grudgefuck the one girl, though.

shouldn't be an issue... oh wait you are in the states, better run from some bible belt creationist atheist hunter bro!

Doubt this comes up too often, but to be honest the majority of people I know, while technically christian, are actually if you dig down deep into agnostics.

But at the same time, if you said you are atheist (meaning you don't believe in some sort of higher power) then I would dislike and think you a fool. Not that I disagree with your thesis about using religion as a form of control.

Nothing has even remotely come up on the topic except that I said I was taking off early Friday for good Friday. Hallelujah!

I'm not going to get involved here because everybody should know by now that you can't win this argument when two people are clinging to opposite poles of the religion spectrum. All I'd like to point out is that LEAPS is very, very wrong about there not being atheists on the Forbes list. Hell, most of the self-made guys are not religious at all, and the amount of agnostics and atheists is definitely out of proportion (to the upside) to what you'd see in the general population. Larry Ellison had a good explanation for refusing to have a Bar Mitzvah at age 13:

"While I think I am religious in one sense, the particular dogmas of Judaism are not dogmas I subscribe to. I don't believe that they are real. They're interesting stories. They're interesting mythology, and I certainly respect people who believe these are literally true, but I don't... I see no evidence for this stuff."

Sure, feel free to tell everyone you want. Just don't expect them to be all too receptive. Religion does not, and should not, be represented as giving tithe to a church on Sunday morning. Religion, at least to me, is something you determine yourself and it it stays there. People who expose morally or think that they have some great moral imperative given to them by god are just as nuts as those who believe the polar opposite. Find your middle ground and be happy. Most people turn to religion because it's hard as shit to think that your just gonna fade away into the ground once, as you put it, the blood stops flowing. Your happy with that? Good! I'm glad. Your probably a better man than I am in that case. I'm not religious in the least but it sends chills down my spine to think that one day there will just be nothing. Sure, maybe I won't be cognizant or conscious to care but still. I try to avoid thinking about it because I simply don't know. I really don't.

The worryI have with what you state is that your obviously not looking for answers nor comfortable with what you believe. It seems like you are looking for confirmation bias of that fact, which is totally fine. If you want I'll gladly say that I agree with you in many respects and that it is very, very hard to come to grips with either something that is omnipotent and all powerful or that we are simply here by sheer randomness. Frankly I hate both of them because it takes control firmly out of my hands which most people don't like very much. Whatever makes you happy and content, go for it. At the end of the day it really doesn't matter if you throw yourself at the mercy of a god, sheer randomness or a freaking cow. We all end up at the same place and some will be right and some won't be.

What happened to people not talking about religion, sexuality and politics in the office??

It doesn't come up in the work place. If anything, most people you come across (in NYC, especially) won't give a shit one way or another. Sky Wizards, real or not, shouldn't have an impact on your work (or life in general, or anything else for that matter.)

Look, if you're an atheist, you shouldn't be putting too much time thinking about it. There certainly is no reason to spend converting people to your point of view. It's not like there's any upside, like heaven, if they convert to your beliefs.

Also, as far as CEOs (or other wealthy people) not touting that they're atheists...why would they proclaim that publicly? They might lose clients who are offended. Do you really think Obama believes in God? No...he just has to play that part to get elected, just like every other politician.

Just have your beliefs and stfu about them. Nobody cares.

I'm atheistic about atheism.

I go to church and pay homage to the gods and then go about my life. People who feel the need to preach or hold other people to their own personal morals seriously need to have their meds adjusted. Don't screw other people over, that's pretty much as far as public morality should be enforced, everything else is on YOU. Be a big kid, that's all. As for whether or not it's good for your job...honestly dude, if you're making money and getting results, most people really aren't going to care. Especially in NYC, no one cares, I've get every religion in my office and guess what...

No one cares.

Hooked on LEAPS:

I personally believe religion was created as a means of social control and people bought into it and continue to do so, because it gives an explination to the most basic human questions. Why are we here? What happens when we die? Are good people rewarded for good deeds in the after life and bad people punished?

Guess what? There are no magical fairies up in the sky to help you answer all those big questions. We are here because of an improbable set of events that allowed us to evolve. When the blood stops flowing to your brain, you die. Being good or bad in this life does not change the inevability of death.

Is this all too depressing and non-conformist to admit to? Should I keep telling people I'm a Catholic, because I made my confirmation and still celebrate Christmas? I don't recall seeing any Atheists on the Forbes 400.

Being long reason and logic (atheism) is a huge advantage in business. Success in the markets is all about seeing reality better than other people, and if some people choose to intentionally handicap themselves with false beliefs in life or business, all the better for you and me.

Re the 400: Buffett and Gates are atheists and they seem to have done alright. There are lots of others. I would bet that most of the successful financiers on the list are atheists.

Your personal beliefs won't become an issue if you keep them to yourself. There are practically no upsides of advancing any religious views in the workplace, while there are substantial downsides if you make your views known and they offend people. Dropping an inflammatory/demeaning comment like the one in your initial post could have serious (negative) consequences on your career trajectory, especially if the recipient of said comment is a believer. Nobody likes an overly outspoken atheist just as nobody likes a soapbox fundie.

I'd say don't let people on to your views no matter what they may be.

Also: *inevitability

Ravenous:

Being long reason and logic (atheism) is a huge advantage in business. Success in the markets is all about seeing reality better than other people, and if some people choose to intentionally handicap themselves with false beliefs in life or business, all the better for you and me.

I think the issue here is less about what someone actually believes and more about how they interact with the viewpoints of others.

The one thing I think that atheism sucks at is conversion, and it's warranted - you get nothing for converting to atheism, but you get basically unlimited upside for converting to a religion. Why? Because of the afterlife/reincarnation factor. Anyone with half a brain would pick religion.

Imagine this is the middle ages - people killing people in the name of God, murderers and whatnot with religion in their eyes dictating that it was God's will. Hard to believe that nowadays people forget the past and what fanatics/religion was like in the early days.

Personally I believe that being genuinely nice/helpful is a lot better than just doing something and spewing some crap like "good Christians will do this" or "I just saved your soul."

Oh and fck those Christian Crusaders for Christ or whatever the equivalent is. Swarming me on the streets when I'm trying to get to work doesn't help anyone.

Hooked on LEAPS:

Should I keep telling people I'm a Catholic, because I made my confirmation and still celebrate Christmas? I don't recall seeing any Atheists on the Forbes 400.

Hey, if you don't like the Church, you gotta do what you gotta do. I'm not here to judge you. But it's a very very VERY strong social network and there are a lot of benefits to membership that you may not be aware of...

It's illegal to ask what religion one practices during job interviews (along with a host of other religious questions). So, it shouldn't hurt you during a job interview because it shouldn't come up. As for the other areas of business, if you make a point to stick to why/how you can make a profit, or help make a profit for your client, the question of religion shouldn't come up. Presumably, you should have plenty to talk about as it relates to making your client some money for this to not come up. Even if this isn't the case, I have no idea why it would come up in a conversation before topics like current events, sports, shared hobbies, or the weather.

It appears that the OP is trying to backdoor a religious conversation so he can talk about how logical atheism is and how the religious are foolish and naive. But, perhaps I'm being cynical.

See, this is where Atheists get it wrong. Just because you believe in God doesn't mean you are illogical.

Believing in God is related to creation. I spend zero part of my day thinking about how we got where we are. I don't care if I came from an ape or fairy dust. I'm here and I have better shit to focus on.

So yay, you don't believe in organized religion. Here is a cookie. Hawkins is a logical genius. You are just a normal dude who believes what other people know and regurgitate it. Try and have some humility.

Yea it does hurt your career, since you cant blame fucking up as a sign from God.

As others have said, there's little upside potential to bringing it up (other than padding your own ego), and plenty of downside. I used to be an outspoken atheist like you, but then I realized how much of a douche I was. If ever asked, just say something along the lines of "I'm not religious" and change the subject.

In this day and age, being an atheist shouldn't hurt you in business, but being a douchebag about it might.

OP, I'm an atheist, and I also happen to think that believing in invisible sky gods is a sign of weakness (both intellectual and emotional), but you shouldn't go around openly bashing religion like that. It serves no purpose and makes you come off as a douchebag.

Bro, you should be more worried about what Hell is gonna be like for you, and not how much money you can make as someone who believes in nothing.

everybody should watch this once:

http://www.youtube.com/embed/EjaGktVQdNg

I just don't care at all. I guess I'd be classified as an atheist but I really never think about it unless someone brings it up. But if someone asks me, I'd probably say I'm Jewish. I still don't know why. I feel Jewish even though I can't take the religious aspect seriously.

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How will you be able to do gods work if you don't believe in him?

Logically speaking, shouldn't Heaven be a really boring place full of people who didn't have a lot of fun during their lifetimes and thus won't be livin' it up in Heaven either? Sounds like hell to me.

...Wait.

Atheism is good for business.

You might say you an Atheist. Thats good. But in reality you are directly or indirectly are governed by the religious laws. Constitution of every country is mixed with religious laws.

I work in a large bank in Australia, and this very discussion came up in my team a few weeks ago. Of the 14 people in my team, 12 are atheist. Any intellectual circle (including banking) is bound to comprise principally people who are atheist. I know that this forum is mostly comprised of Americans, but in Australia, it would be rare to admit that you were religious for fear of being ridiculed.

Adding my $.02. Renouncing the religion I was indoctrinated in as a child and grew up believing in was one of the more difficult things I've done in my life, more specifically the habit/addiction I had of praying to "God." It's been about 6 months since I last prayed and I still get an urge here and there, but it is mostly gone and when I discover someone who through his own thought process and rational logic also renounced his religious beliefs, I have an immediate respect for his intelligence and a better relationship is formed.

Of course, if you'd come at me years ago as an overbearing atheist, I'd probably just retreat immediately to my indoctrination and write you off as "lost." Not so good for a business relationship.

I guess people never heard about not talking about religion, sex and politics at work. I'd rather work with people who kept shit like this to themselves.

Atheist =/= Intelligent

I am sorry, but intelligence is independent of religion. Maybe scientific educational attainment is directly related to a persons religiousness and maybe fundamentalism is related to intelligence, but evolution and biblical teachings play no role in the vast majority of careers. How often does evolution come up in finance? Or accounting? Or American History? Or as a Spanish teacher?

http://www.4shared.com/document/8zRB7XRv/Average_intelligence_predicts_…

There is his paper. I'll read it tonight as I have come down with the Swine Flu and need to recuperate, but looking at average IQ for nationals and the % who don't believe in God, I don't see Atheists being much smarter. Honestly, how much intelligence does it take to not believe in something?

And one more thing. Looks like he is evenly weighting Asian religions and Western Religions. This doesn't seem appropriate as there are too many differences to evenly compare. Japan and China has some of the higher average IQ's (105) with Japan at 65% atheist and China at 12%. But are Japanese and Chinese really "atheist" in the sense that we use in the West?

Even among European nations you have some with high religiousness and high IQ and vice versa.

IMO, people that want to portray religious people are dumb or lacking intelligence fall into this one dimensional intelligence fallacy. People can be religious and intelligence. People can believe in creation and still know complex derivatives.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

Intelligence enters the equation when it comes to the probability one assigns to the existence of a supernatural architect of the universe who inexplicably has nothing better to do than micromanage the lives of his myriad creatures and dole out eternal rewards and punishments according to the edicts revealed to illiterate tribesmen thousands of years ago.

For example: I'd assign a near 100% probability to the sun rising tomorrow. I would assign this probability based on the fact that the sun has risen every day of my existence, I've seen it firsthand, and every other human being in the history of our species has seen it firsthand each and every day of their existence. I know the sun exists because I can see it and feel its warmth.

I'd submit to you that the probability assigned to the existence of an invisible puppetmaster controlling every aspect of the lives of billions upon billions of creatures (on this planet alone) would be rather a lot lower, based on the utter dearth of any verifiable evidence of his existence whatsoever. (And no, the "God of the gaps" doesn't count.)

Why is "atheist" even a word? There isn't a term for those who don't believe in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny. Atheists do themselves a disservice by even dignifying that term for their absence of belief.

The reason atheism is so unpalatable to otherwise intelligent people is that once you admit that absence of belief you become instantly accountable for the life you live. Once you believe this is all there is, if you waste it you feel like a complete jackass. The religious get a pass in this respect, because they can waste their lives in utter mediocrity as long as they believe they're going to get a cosmic do-over for all eternity.

Since man has existed we've worshiped something. Now that we think we have a decent control of things we want to worship ourselves. Lets all be true. While believing in god might be a stretch, believing in science isn't always a sure bet. Theories are revised, tweaked, etc. New facts are found. I'm not doubting gravity here, just saying the vast majority of atheists simply think god is silly and science knows what's up. Unless you're rocking a PhD in bio or something you are putting your faith in science.

Just look at human reaction to everything. We crave an explanation to everything. Maybe reading all Nassims shit has made me skeptical of both sides.

IMO, I'm pretty short organized religion and man. I generally pay no attention to either.

Same here. I'd never say there is no God with 100% certainty, because anything is possible. I'd just say the probability is very, very low.

IMO, once you become atheist you morph into turbo asshole. All these people mocking prayer. It's just friends keeping you in their thoughts. People bitching when they thank god for making it through a surgery or winning the Super Bowl as if these people don't also thank the surgeon and coaches.

And what's this shit how atheists can blame religion for all these past horrors but you can never blame atheists for shit. Like religion sucks because of witch burnings, but when you try and counter that Stalin, Mao, hitler, whatever wasn't religious you can the claims that "athiesm isn't a belief system so it can't cause that". Gotta be nice to be jello isn't it.