WSO Podcast | E214: Real Resume Review LIVE (Weekly Intern Meetup #12)
Another fun chat with our interns. To apply, go here: https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forum/off-topic/wall-street-oasis-finan…
Or Listen to the Podcast Here:
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WSO Podcast Episode 214 Transcript:
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:06] Hello and welcome. I'm Patrick Curtis, your host and chief Monkey. And this is the Wall Street Oasis podcast. Join me as I talk to some of the community's most successful and inspirational members to gain valuable insight into different career paths and life in general. Let's get to it. Another interesting chat with the interns. If you're interested in applying to the internship, please check out the show notes. There's a link right there. Enjoy. Oh, my. Okay, everybody, welcome to the July 15th, 2022 intern weekly call. For those of you, that's the first call. Typically, what we do is we have a few minutes to answer questions about the internship, specifically for the finance research analyst internship. So if you have questions about the research, the writing, the process, anything, feel free to go ahead and do that. You can raise your hand or drop your to to ask over audio, or you can ask it over text as well. And Nabila can help. Remind me when I'm forgetting to check the the chat box. I'll open that up now actually. So I think and then this week we'll also be doing a resume review from one of our interns. We've anonymized it and will be going over that resume kind of once, once those questions are answered. And then we'll if we have time, we'll open it up to kind of also some questions around anything around your specific career interview or networking or other other efforts you've been making as you kind of try to land a career in finance.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:01:49] So we'll start off right now again, as usual. Welcome, everybody. I see a lot of familiar faces. I widgets there. I see Colt's back on Amazon. So good to see everyone. I see her being. So let's start off. Anybody have questions about the internship? In particular. I see one question, Iman as how can one get promoted to chief editor to get promoted to chief editor? It's pretty simple. You have to show really great writing. You have to basically be putting in consistent hours, go above and beyond, and just be really kind of engaged with the internship. And that tends to be the people we we promote to help us on the editing side. So if if you're struggling on the writing side or following the directions or it's taking longer, it doesn't mean you won't get promoted there. It just means that it might take longer if you're kind of doing the minimum and just getting the internship on the resume to help yourself, that's fine, but it just means you're probably not going to. Probably not going to get promoted to the editing side. Still letting more people in. We have a pretty good group this week. I assume it'll probably get 5 to 10 people more as we go. Any other questions about the internship specifically or Nabil? Anything I should mention? Uh oh.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:16] I did want to mention we are exploring other potential business business lines at Wall Street Oasis, specifically around supporting investment banks in some of their valuation work, potentially some private equity funds with portfolio companies. Just because we have such a deep talent pool, both from our mentor network and even from here, from the group that we have. And we feel like there's a lot of really smart people that are in this group. And so we're we're starting to explore opportunities for potentially consulting type work with with Bank, where we're providing both junior support and even the private equity portfolio companies, stuff like that. So that's still in the idea stage. That being said, I think it's important to note because. If we do launch that, if and when we do launch that, I feel like it's potentially a really great opportunity for some of you that are do really well to continue with us, if that's what you want, if you want to if you're still in school and you're an internship. Then you want this just to help that. That's great. But I know some of you are looking for full time work and it's potentially a nice stepping stone to potentially working at an investment bank. You come work with us for a year or two in a paid capacity doing similar type work. I think it would be great for the for the CV and a nice potential way to kind of build that skill set directly.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:42] So let's see, we've got a question from Paul. If you haven't started the internship, is it possible to interview for the chief editor role some examples of very high quality you have done? Hey, Paul. No, we we just require you to actually show it like in the internship and it won't take a long time. Typically, if you're doing a great job and putting out great output and the writing quality that does a very good job mean we have a we have a bottleneck at the editing stage. So it's not that we don't want to promote, it's just that we have we have a very high bar for that to be able to, to edit other people's work. So. So that's why we rather have a bottleneck and slow things down than us rushing things through and and publishing content that isn't really high quality. So that's that's where we're at. Um. Let's see. Oh. Chin, Chin. Chin may ask, Can I repeat what I said? Thinking of launching more like a consulting business or a junior support consulting business for investment banks and other finance firms that need help with evaluation, work, stuff like that. We've noticed that there's a lot of investment banks, especially boutiques in middle market, that have an attrition problem and that have they're losing a lot of their analysts to larger banks and elite boutiques that kids will join there and then quickly, quickly lateral or go to private equity.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:00] And there's a lot of seats open at the both brackets in the boutique because those kids are the ones getting poached by private equity so fast. So we think there's a place where we can support, potentially support investment banks and other finance firms with kind of more valuation work, that type of stuff where you're spreading comps, doing some of that stuff that that work. Publicly traded Hibs, public public information books, stuff that can help the senior partners and managing directors at these firms have a little bit more support. So that's that's we're looking at potentially launching no real timeframe probably in the next probably closer to September timeframe. We stopped to work on a specifically what we want to go to market with. And if if we feel like there's a way to do it in such a way that is beneficial both to the client and to us, So we need to figure that out. It's not an easy launch by any means, so. See what else we got here. Oc? Josh asked. Hi. I just wanted to know how much time does it usually take for an article to be uploaded after the preliminary review is completed? Well, Josh, good news. We just hired, I think three more paid people out of the group, people who would finish the internship. We just offered three, three jobs. So that's to help us with getting reviews done faster and getting the uploads done faster.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:17] So we have a we do have a bottleneck at both the upload stage and the editing stage. So right now it could take a month maybe. I don't know. Longer. I mean, probably to being honest, there is a bottleneck there. So we're trying to reduce it, at least make it so that people who are we don't want you to get to the end of your internship and not having had feedback. So we're really pushing hard to get more help there. But it could take a while, which is why we say don't wait. Continue, continue on with your your next topic. But yeah, we're working on growing both of those teams, the editing team and the upload teams that actually are getting live. So I think we have something like only 200 and articles live and there's probably about 800 or 900 of them in process. So it's a lot. It's a lot. But yeah, so that's where we're at for for that. Any other questions? Let's see how the companies sign contact with ours. Michael I'm not sure I understand your question. How the company. Signs of contact with hours. Thanks, Colt. Appreciate the kind words. Let me let in a few more people. We're up over 30. So, Nabil, anything else you want to mention about that? About which one? Yeah, the consulting potential consulting or outsourcing.
Nabil: [00:08:44] Oh, I think you've had it pretty well covered, so.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:49] And then specifically. Good. It's a good question, Josh. We're trying we're working as hard as we can to try and reduce some of the bottlenecks. We're letting a lot fewer people into the internship now. It's the bar is much higher to try and kind of make sure we get our feet under us so we don't have too many writers at once. Um. Michael asks. How the company finds a contract with others? I'm not sure. I'm not sure I follow.
Nabil: [00:09:19] Is this about the consulting business?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:21] Consulting business. But I'm not sure I understand. Um. If the article makes it to Ready. You want to answer that one brand? Nabil The brand. Brand? Yeah. I mean.
Nabil: [00:09:34] Nothing from your end after that It's just and ready for upload. We have our upload. Look at it. Publish it online. That's pretty much it. So once it's ready for upload, there's nothing.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:43] There's nothing for you to do. Once it's ready for upload that's your your.
Nabil: [00:09:46] Considered complete.For you. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:47] Yeah. Yeah. Will the company sign a contract with ours. Oh, with you. No, I think you'd be working for us and we'd be signing the contract with the company. And if you were to work with us, it would be a full time role and we would bring you on to help with probably continue with the SEO work. But then when we have clients coming in doing more like the valuation work and more of the financial modelling work, that type of stuff. I think that answers your question. Object. Question.
Intern 1: [00:10:18] Okay. So actually going off of valuations, I was wondering if you are doing like trying to make our own portfolio and we are using DCF modelling. It usually takes a lot of manual work, like it takes like 20 hours to model a company and takes like literally makes up like 20%. We find some arbitrage of some sort. So like can we optimize in some ways in that process? Is there any way we can do?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:44] You're talking about discounted cash flows or a way to make it more efficient. The modeling of DCFS. It depends what the use case is for. Are you trying? I mean, you're building it for your own portfolio. You said for trading. Yeah. I think there's really I mean, to be able to correct me here, I don't think there's any shortcuts, really. I mean, sometimes the hardest part is the hardest part is kind of just the projections. You could if you had a license to like one of these other things, you could take like consensus projections. So you're not having to build out a whole crazy operating build and just try to try to get down to cash flow.
Intern 1: [00:11:22] I was also thinking some of the learning processes you can use some Evita, Evita or something like that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:28] Like comps. The valuation metrics.
Intern 1: [00:11:31] Yeah. Yes.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:32] Creating comps, EBITDA revenue, revenue to EV, if there's no cash flow or earnings, although those have been compressed, all those high growth companies that were trading at ten X revenue and net trading like 2 to 3 X revenue. So, yeah, you've got to be careful, right? The time period you're looking at. But even precedent transactions, same thing if you if you're taking the valuation modeling course from W, So that's great practice in terms of getting yourself up to speed on how to do those. I think even if you just look at one. But yeah, it's tough to say there's any shortcuts. I think I think comps tend to be easier because you can just grab them quickly, see the multiples pretty fast, although you got to be careful because sometimes the way companies report, you need to make adjustments for like one time items and that's a little bit more of an art than a science in terms of like, what's the one time item, What's a recurring item? What's what's something they're saying is one time, but it's actually recurring. And so for like your personal portfolio that you're building, like you need to be a little bit more investigative around that to get comfortable. And it's, it's hard. That's why a lot of people like subscribe to these like these people who trade and do these like manage these portfolios to that that run these analyses. Have you heard of a company that most mostly borrowed ideas? Have you heard of that guy Mbye? The big Twitter follower actually.
Intern 1: [00:12:55] No. Followed through this. I used to watch the stream. It just used to make this DCF model putting on numbers on exit to the side to do that. And just to.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:06] Give you a sense of how long it takes, this, there's this guy who runs a subscription business. I think it's only $10 a month that he charges, but he spends a whole month researching a company and trying to say whether he thinks is a good, good or bad or where the valuation is in upside. And he runs a super detailed operating model, DHCP, all this stuff. And even then sometimes he's like, and I don't feel like I know it because he's like in terms of equity research analysts and like if they're spending time on few names and covering, covering them in super in-depth, he's like talking to those people. He's actually doing channel checks. He's talking. So like that's, that's where it becomes really hard. And that's why a lot of people say you can't really beat the market. It's relatively efficient in terms of at any given time. That's what makes it hard. Did that help at all or no?
Intern 1: [00:13:51] Yeah, I kind of did. Yeah. I mean, you can reference other people, so that definitely helps.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:57] Yeah, I think you have to. I mean, if you're going to try to do like 100 DCF, there's there's other ways to do it. Like if you're trying to build algorithm. I know. Remember, you're like more into the algorithmic trading there's ways to.
Intern 1: [00:14:07] Do that's sort of my ideal thing is I'm trying to just merge those two things. I think there's never a thing between those things either. It's completely fundamental. It's completely like just computational trying to somehow merge those things.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:21] And I think the hard part is the pure computational technical analysis that's using all these signals is immediate or almost immediate.
Intern 1: [00:14:30] It's very short.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:31] And the fundamental analysis, you're only getting quarterly results, right? And it's super chunky. And even when you get that quarterly result out, it probably takes several hours, at least at a minimum, even if you have a thing ready to to update the model and put it up. But that's what happens every quarter. That's why it's crazy for these equity research analysts. Every time a quarter comes out, they're literally just sprinting to get their models updated and try to figure out was that good or was that a bad quarter? Right. So sometimes the headline numbers look good, but actually they gave guidance that it's that revenue is going to be in middle of the range. But actually that you thought that they were going to be high end of the range so their guidance and suddenly boom, that drops your price target by whatever 20%. So that's a. Yeah. I mean, I think it'd be cool doing what you said. I just think it's hard to merge it, right? Yeah, I think there are. There are funds that do that though. They have. They'll have like a. More fundamental team and a more technical team. The technical team is telling the fundamental team, we're getting these signals here. And if the fundamental team agrees, hey, this is a good entry price based on what I'm seeing then.
Intern 1: [00:15:33] Yeah. So there's there's only point just getting the entry. That's the only way we can actually use computation. Domes of fundamental.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:41] Yeah. You mean use the technical to figure out if it's a good a good. At least they have to match up with the interference. Yeah. I mean, the technical can sometimes miss the news if there's a.
Intern 1: [00:15:57] It doesn't make sense to use technical completely. Yeah. Mathematically, some.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:02] People argue you can use technical completely and then they'll try to sell you a trading software for $300 a month and then you realize, wait a second, if this really worked, why would they sell this to me for $300 a month? Yeah. That makes no sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:20] But you can.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:20] You can learn a lot from some really smart people in terms of how to analyze businesses. And I think it's a good practice either way, because it's you're building great skills for the long run. Paul is asking, do I think it would be a very steep uphill battle to go from a sales and trading internship to a hedge fund analyst for full time? Um. Might be tough right out of school just because. I think most hedge funds don't take kids right out of school. So like in order to break into it as a hedge fund or right out of school, you've got to be like. It's not that the internship is holding you back or helping you that much. It's good because it shows like you probably hustled to get an internship. But I think what's more important is showing that you actually have some sort of either detailed research edge or something to the hedge fund that like where you can bring value. And that's and that's going to be mostly based on the ideas and your write ups and your your thesis and your track record and all that stuff, if you can show it. That's where like branding yourself online. If you have a long history of writing for a few years about different names. I think that's where it can really come in handy. Although a lot of people are doing that and thinking they're geniuses for when the bull market was happening for like 12 years and then like suddenly, boom, the market hits and like, okay, now you know who is actually who is actually timing this, Right? Who had wrote who had rotated enough out of growth, stuff like that where they didn't get hit as badly. Right. So. I know I didn't I didn't rotate out enough or as aggressively as I should have. So it's one one sample size. So what else should we jump to the resume review? Maybe. All right, let's do it. All right. We have a non resume here as well. Let's see. Can you guys see the screen? But they try to make this bigger.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:20] Zoom.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:23] Like 120. Here we go. Let's get rid of this. Okay this so we can see better. So here's on the right I just have our our template on the left is the resume we received to review. Right off the bat. So one thing I'll say about, like the person here that anonymous resume is targeting, I think, consulting or business analyst role. So it's going to be a little bit different than some of the. Some of like the banking type specific advice I would give. Although coming out of undergrad, it's still important to have similar things. So a couple of things I'd probably let's just track changes here. Review track changes. I think probably this is a waste of space right here. I would do similar Bachelor of Science in Business Administration finance major like you could just have it in one line and I would again bring it over to this format with a little bit cleaner. These are super dark lines. It's nice to. It helps my eye, but I don't think you need to have like these bold lines all the way across because your alignment looks pretty bad here. Like, if I would write a line that if you're going to keep these bold lines, this looks like it's floating somewhere in the inside. It sounds super anal and crazy, but when you get in, if you're going to a top consulting firm or recruiting for consulting, the level of detail is crazy in terms of presentation. So I notice something else. White space. You're not using any white space to help my eye. You're jamming up the next section right up against this bullet. Um, which makes it really hard for me to read. So, like, you'll notice here, there's a little bit of space here. There's a little bit of space here. It helps the eye kind of scan through the scan through the resume. Are you with me? And on. I don't know if he's unmuted.
Intern 2: [00:20:25] Yep. I'm with.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:26] You. Okay, cool. So. Yeah. I don't think you need to use this much space for this Bachelor of Science. And it's great that you're have these. Are these all majors?
Intern 2: [00:20:35] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:36] Yeah. Okay. So you could say triple major. And now if you're going to do consulting.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:44] The.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:46] I'd probably want to do management first, then marketing and then info. No, actually they're all good actually, for whatever you think. A minor and then minor because this is great. But again, you might want to have this in one line or two lines since you have so much. Then the GPA you bring up. The other thing you might want to do here is listen relevant coursework to get more. So like here we'll say financial statement analysis, advanced financial that it does so for like consulting. If there was a strategy core, did you do any like strategy coursework or anything?
Intern 2: [00:21:25] Yeah.Strategic management.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:25] Yeah. So like get that in there, relevant coursework, anything around like accounting and other stuff that you did?
Intern 2: [00:21:34] Yep. Basics of accounting or financial and managerial accounting. That's the basics.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:39] Yeah, I've got to get that in there because managerial accounting is pretty important, especially for something because like you're looking at different units and the economics of different business units and stuff.
Intern 2: [00:21:48] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:50] So I'd get that in there. Just. Just a line for a relevant coursework. See if I can meet a lot of. Background noise, but you guys can just make sure you're on mute. And then in terms of like so skills rather than having skills up so high, I'd kind of like loop it in with certifications. But to bring this down to the bottom under, I just had to have work experience, relevant work experience. And then I would definitely have the show internship listed there, along with kind of how we we drafted it here. Like this. You can even try to get this on to two rows. If you need the space, you can get that on two rows, right? So basically, yeah, get the one in there. Marketing intern. Let's see, communicate with all the parts. So let's.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:46] Talk about the.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:48] There's, there's too many bullets here. There's too much like bolded stuff. But get, let's just say for now, let's just move this down here and we'll talk about it after. Let's go to the work experience, which is more important and talk about your your bullets specifically. So Global Education Office, Peer, Recruiter and Orientation leader. Was this a paid internship during school? What is this?
Intern 2: [00:23:11] Oh, so it's basically I was I welcomed the new students and I work with the office right now for the new students. So I was a link between professors and the international professor staff with the students.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:25] Got it. Okay, so that's really good because it shows you're like a leader, you're helping orientation, you're good with communicating with people, but I don't think it should be four bullets. It sounds like it's a little bit more like, I think you want to give the space to the stuff that's a little bit more like technical shows. You have skills. This is like this is a lot of space to give something like that. Let me look let me read the marketing intern and let's see Allegany Auto Summer and communicate marketing events and creating marketing campaigns for new vehicle models helped sponsor. So like first comment on all of these bullets is like you're not quantifying anything. Got it. Like, you need to quantify everything. That's the first comment. Like you literally have no numbers in any of this. You don't tell me like how many. You don't tell me what the result was. You're just saying I kind of did this with this. So I'll give you an example. Assist in international student orientation. How many students have you helped approximately you know assistant over edited a. You know, Tell me more about that. What maybe the result of that is. They were just more comfortable. So it's hard to quantify, but at least tell me how many students you work with recruit potential students via email and the and the buddy app. How did you do that? Tell me. That's kind of a little bit more interesting because that's a little bit like sales and marketing. Like, what do you how many leads did you go through via email? How many emails did you send? You know, I have no idea what this unit buddy app is, so I have no clue what what that means or.
Intern 2: [00:25:00] If it's basically a partner app at a university where of students who are interested in the university, you can talk to students who already are present in the university, so if they.
Intern 2: [00:25:10] Want.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:11] That makes sense. So like I think, just tell me how many, how many phone calls you did over how many weeks.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:17] It.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:17] All that stuff. And did any do you have any of the data around the people who talk to you actually ended up coming.
Intern 2: [00:25:25] I could get it when I go back, but I'd.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:28] Be really cool. I'll be like. Spoke with 32. Let me give you an example of a bullet that looks much more interesting. I spoke with 32 potential students via. Viacom. Forget the anybody at. No one's going know what that is. You can say via email and phone to resulting in five students joining full time joining the university. Conversion rate of that at a higher higher to ex higher than the average. What you were going to call this peer recruiter.
Intern 2: [00:26:02] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:03] And it shows like, oh, you're actually you're good at selling. You're actually good at communicating and showing them what the benefits of the school are.
Intern 2: [00:26:10] Good.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:10] It synthesised proper communication between current students in correct department and it's kind of like feels like a soft bullshit bullet. You don't think you really as much there and this informed potential students of all the amenities. That's kind of the same as the recruit potential students I just think make that second bullet bigger and stronger and you can remove these next to good it. And then once you put it in W so you're going to need space for that. That's going to make things look better. And then let's talk a little bit about. So it'll go doubly so. Global Education Officer Couple of bullets communicate with all departments to ensure vehicle availability. So like. Which departments? Is this like an inventory check or something like that?
Intern 2: [00:26:57] So we were shooting ads for the vehicles and we had to make sure that the car was not booked by a client or it was not going out for a test drive. Yeah. Or it wasn't going out to any of the staff members if they required it. So that's.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:09] Good. But it's a little administrative work, right? It's it's not really using your brain. It's like, Oh, let me check if it's available on the system.
Intern 2: [00:27:18] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:19] I mean, do you agree? Am I wrong? Am I wrong there? Is there some sort of complexity there that I'm missing?
Intern 2: [00:27:23] I mean, there was no complexity. It was I basically just had to go to each and every department. It was not a spreadsheet per se, but I just had to make sure that it wasn't booked. So it is a more of an admin role than.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:35] Yeah. So like, how much value is this adding? So let me keep going. Assisted in creating marketing campaigns for new vehicle models. This is more interesting. Were you doing this? What were you doing? What programs you're using in this marketing campaign?
Intern 2: [00:27:48] Or we were just mapping out ideas as to how we could promote the product and PowerPoint.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:53] And PowerPoint.
Intern 2: [00:27:54] Yeah, in PowerPoint.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:55] Okay, great. It's this in creating seven marketing campaigns in PowerPoint. Across seven new vehicle models, across five new vehicle models during during my three month tenure.
Intern 2: [00:28:10] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:11] Leading to 20% year over year gain on sales of these models.
Intern 2: [00:28:20] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:21] Or. I don't know. Compared to.
Intern 2: [00:28:23] Previous. I'm not sure about the actual number as to how.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:26] That last number that I threw in there. That's like the dream scenario. If you can get those numbers, Great. And if not just giving more information around how many marketing campaigns you use in PowerPoint, that's relevant. So it shows, Oh, I mean, he probably has some PowerPoint and marketing skills that's good for consulting. Consulting is like PowerPoint heavy, right? So you want to screen PowerPoint all over this. You don't want to be necessarily screaming linear regression, logistic regression, discriminant analysis. Good, right? Although this is good because this makes me feel like, okay, he has the the analytical chops to be able to handle any sort of complex work. But I want to see really, you're good at marketing, you're good at PowerPoint presentations, and you're a good communicator.
Intern 2: [00:29:06] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:06] Okay. So helped inform a partnership and sponsorship contracts with other companies. Super vague. Tell me, how many, how much? How much money?
Intern 2: [00:29:16] There was just one contract where it was a big contract. I don't remember the number, but I could get the number again because I'm still in touch with my boss.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:26] Yeah. Helped informing. I mean, what does that mean? You, like, generate the lead? Did you deal with the partner? Do you. Were you on the call? Even if it's just one 200,000 or 50,000 partnership contract, that's good for an intern. It's amazing, right?
Intern 2: [00:29:39] Or even on the call. I didn't do much, but I was just observing. And I also went through the whole contract and spotted errors.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:46] Okay. Well, I mean, even that, like, maybe it's not you helping forming the partnership. Really? Then it's more like you supporting the partnership. So you're supporting a 50,000 sponsorship contract. Contract with the with the. It's a dealership, right? Yeah, with the dealership through contract review. Resulting in whatever. If you could say something like quantify in terms of like, did you find a lot of savings of X, Y, Z or something like that? But if you can't, it's okay. If you just said helped or supported contract review with the largest sponsorship dealership that did over 50,000, something like that. It shows you have technical attention to detail, stuff like that. So it's good. Recommended Marketing strategies to boost sales. Again, it's vague. What types of marketing strategies email, phone, what? What specifically did it result in? Any changes? Did you guys actually implement any of them? That's much more interesting to me and what they're going to ask you in the interview.
Intern 2: [00:30:50] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:51] So just give me a little more meat here, a little more detail, a little more numbers, or just or just remove it.
Intern 2: [00:30:56] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:57] Okay, so, yeah, this could be two or three bullets. This probably two. You'll have three with W so it'll look much, much better on the work experience once you have that formatting again, needing to be right aligned or just to move it to this format. Again, easy way to move it to this format. You take this, you copy a line copy on formatted text. You don't bring in the formats from over here to here, so you just go line by line copy on format, copy and formats, and then you can and then you can work in here once you're in the new template. So you don't have to like if you start copying and pasting it, it starts, it'll start messing it all up. It's a.Disaster.
Intern 2: [00:31:30] Make sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:34] Okay. Looks like you have a spelling error right here.
Intern 2: [00:31:38] Oh, no, that's actually name.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:44] Borat. Yeah, that's unfortunate because it looks like you're, like, potentially supposed to be bored.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:48] I mean.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:50] Like a board seat. You know what I mean?
Intern 2: [00:31:53] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:55] What is this conference presentation?
Intern 2: [00:31:59] Yes, it was an article that me and my colleague did, which was which our professor really liked, and he took it to a presentation and it was going to get published.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:08] Did it get published?
Intern 2: [00:32:10] It was supposed to, but he's told me it's been delayed.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:15] So. That's not clear from this bullet at all that you authored an article or helped co-author an article.
Intern 2: [00:32:24] It's all three of our so-called co-authors. You What? It's cool. That's a cool.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:32] Thing to do. To say. Coauthored a research paper on supply chain disruption during the pandemic. I think like, I don't know what. Saskatchewan. Saskatchewan. Getty.
Intern 2: [00:32:43] So the three are the three names of the people who are three names of the co authors.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:47] And that means nothing to me as I'm reading this. I'm reading this resume. I have no idea. I don't care their names.
Intern 2: [00:32:52] Make sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:54] I care. What did you do? You co-authored the Supply Chain Disruption. An article on supply chain disruption. That's interesting. Now, I have something to ask you about. And that's actually really interesting. And I probably a lot of it I hope you know the article really well because a lot of the interview might be on that. How do you do the research? What was it about? How did you even get involved with that? Right.
Intern 2: [00:33:18] Got it. Cool. Yep.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:33:21] Awesome. And then. Let's see. And then for this stuff here at the bottom. So. I think that's good, but I don't think it needs a whole other section, by the way. Conference presentation. I would put that under additional information and have it be almost under like a. Under like certifications or under. Instead of computer, let's say like this stuff python AR, pivot tables, visualization, tableau power bi. Ah all this stuff should be under like a skills level and you have a lot, right? So I think what you want to do is have this go this skills y probably go to two lines then modeling I think you'll want to have like completed Wall Street Oasis self study courses, valuation modeling, LBO modeling, or have something more consulting friendly. So maybe there is a case in point or strategy books you could put here. Like how? Like Porter's Five Forces. Something where it shows your you're a student of consulting and of strategy consulting.
Intern 2: [00:34:33] Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:36] Okay. So maybe instead of modeling and it being so finance heavy because you already are going to seem really, really analytical and skilled on the, on the skills portion if you're putting all this linear regression. And again, I don't think you need linear regression or logistic regression. I don't think the whole point of the resume is not to like dump all these skills you have on you. The point is to get across the fact that you have a lot of skills around data manipulation and this stuff, right? The problem with all these skills is it doesn't look like you used a lot of it in any of your work experience. Am I right or wrong on that?
Intern 2: [00:35:07] You're right.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:08] How about in the article or in the research in the article? Did you use any of them there?
Intern 2: [00:35:13] Barely.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:14] Barely. Not really. So my point is like, it's good you have that all that. But like, it's taking it's like a huge portion of top of your resume right now. I think you need to move it down. Say you have these skills. It would actually be more. It would be more believable to me. Anon, if you were to say I love calling you anon by the way. If if you would tell me like your your actual skill level on these. So like python and ah, which one are you better at?
Intern 2: [00:35:47] Oh definitely.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:49] So you could do our expert Python Intermediate Excel Intermediate pivot Pivot tables, expert visualizations, expert Tableau, Beginner Power BI beginners, something like that.
Intern 2: [00:36:01] Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:02] And maybe remove the beginner and only have the intermediate and the expert because you don't necessarily want to be drilled. If you say you're an expert at pivot tables, they could suddenly start asking you something about index match and you just get confused or. Or pivot tables and. And then in terms of machine learning, I doubt you get challenged on that, but are you an expert in this stuff?
Intern 2: [00:36:22] With regression and our discriminant. Yes, but K means clustering is still a work in progress.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:26] I'd remove that. Unless you're applying to more like this, you're applying to roles that are much that would use this. So if you're applying for a business analytics role, you may want to you might want to kind of versions of the resume, one that's a little bit more.
Intern 2: [00:36:42] Consulting based and one more analyst is exactly.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:45] Like because I know with data analysts and business analysts this is this could be really helpful and they'll want to see that. But if consult strategy, consulting especially, they're going to be like.
Intern 2: [00:36:56] I have planned.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:58] And so I think it would probably be better on the computer networking, web design, whatever, Right. I don't think that that's unless you're an expert, unless you're an expert in some of these, you may want to throw it in down here, but it could probably go without. It's not that. That interesting. Unless unless, again, you're applying for more technical roles.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:20] Okay.
Intern 2: [00:37:21] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:25] Now let's talk about certifications. What's an Excel Yellow bell?
Intern 2: [00:37:31] It was just a certificate that we were forced to do in class to show that our profession excel. And our professor was like, Put on your resume. What it has. Not a.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:41] Black belt.
Intern 2: [00:37:43] Yeah, I had the same question.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:46] They call it a yellow belt.
Intern 2: [00:37:48] Yeah, they call it yellow. And sadly, there is a black belt.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:51] So how do you get to it?
Intern 2: [00:37:54] You will have to take it if to buy the course? I think so. And then take the black belt.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:01] So. But the school. Paid for it.
Intern 2: [00:38:03] I don't think they paid for the black bread day before the yellow one and we paid out of pocket. That was part of our course material, so.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:09] Got it. Okay. You might want to just replace with, like. Instead of like.
Intern 2: [00:38:14] Some officer with the WSU Excel course.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:17] Yeah. You may want to do more like of the keywords from the Excel course, like the modeling. So like rather than saying like a yellow belt, which I have no idea a level two, I have no idea what that means. Just tell me more specifically, like in the modeling section interest down here, tell me more specifically like what you can pivot tables. That's where I would put this stuff, like index match, data manipulation, sorting, advanced sorting. You could even do stuff around saying you understand what's called validation. And but the more advanced stuff in all the Excel modeling course put that stuff in there because then they'll be like, Oh. They are actually proficient in Excel. They're not just saying it here. And then maybe, like I said, maybe you don't have a computer thing here because it's. Less relevant for consulting and you can have it for your data analyst roles. You can have more of this data. This Tableau Power behind our visualizations is more important. Got it. And then the certifications, I think this is good. Fundamentals of Digital Marketing. Google Analytics for Beginners. I think that's good for certifications and even put you could put like the Excel credential and certification for for the deputy. So if you're taking that course and finished it.
Intern 2: [00:39:39] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:39] And then what do you have for interests? Nothing.
Intern 2: [00:39:43] I have not put anything my interest.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:44] What are your interests? What do you do outside of school?
Intern 2: [00:39:48] Mean, this is amateur cryptocurrency. Looking at the market fall gives me joy.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:52] Surprisingly looking at the what.
Intern 2: [00:39:55] Market fall gives me joy.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:59] In terms of why.
Intern 2: [00:40:02] I mean, the more the market falls, the more convinced I would I would be putting more money in, basically. So it's it's getting more value for my buck, basically.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:15] Okay, but you're talking about crypto specifically or the stock market.
Intern 2: [00:40:19] Or crypto specifically. And I used to be interested in the stock market. I still am, but I'm just more different crypto right now because yeah, I don't see stock the stock market fall by like 20% in a day.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:31] So yeah, so are you. So you're an investor in crypto.
Intern 2: [00:40:37] Yep.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:38] So are you up or down?
Intern 2: [00:40:40] I'm down. Definitely I'm down.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:43] So I don't know if you want to highlight that. On your resume.
Intern 2: [00:40:46] I should be up in 2024 for sure, but not right now.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:50] Right. Or there could be a crypto merger for five years instead of three.
Intern 2: [00:40:54] Yep. Right? Mm hmm.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:58] Maybe not. Maybe it will be Bitcoin. I mean, I invest in crypto, too. I'm not. I'm not a hater. I just don't know for a consulting or for it. Like, I'm thinking of the people you're gonna be interviewing with. The data analysts were all people actually are probably more crypto bros than the consulting are or not because they're more technical they appreciate blockchain. Probably a little bit more.
Intern 2: [00:41:18] Definitely.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:18] So I think you might want to have like for interest if you're going to put crypto and trading crypto as an interest here, you just want to be very careful because they might ask you like, okay, what are you tell me about Defi or tell me about this? They might if they're somebody who really knows their crypto, they could start drilling on you.
Intern 2: [00:41:35] Mm hmm.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:35] And if you're comfortable doing that, that's great. If you're not, just be careful. Like putting that as an interest. Any other anything else you like doing?
Intern 2: [00:41:43] I've been working out, but I don't think I could put that in any sports. I used to play cricket. I play table tennis.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:51] Are you good at table tennis? Do you watch any sports? Any sports teams?
Intern 2: [00:41:54] Cricket? Definitely. Cricket.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:56] Okay. You could put cricket here and then. Are you a fan of any specific team?
Intern 2: [00:42:01] Uh, India? Definitely.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:03] Okay. But there's no there's no, like, club teams there that play.
Intern 2: [00:42:07] So cricket, basically, there are leagues that happen with countries like within countries.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:14] And I'm just trying to think like, can you get more specific on any of your interests? So I think putting cricket would be good. I think putting crypto would be good, maybe not for the consulting ones, but for the data analyst.
Intern 2: [00:42:28] Or inputs or something.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:30] You can you put away poker. Poker? Yeah. I think poker would be great. But I'd be even more specific. This is poker. Texas. Texas. No limit or other types of poker limit.
Intern 2: [00:42:42] Oh, yeah. I don't play with actual cash. We just play for fun.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:46] That's okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:47] But Texas. Texas Hold'em. Which Which one?
Intern 2: [00:42:50] Texas Hold'em. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:51] Yeah. So I'd, I'd write that. Yeah, that's good. And then what about travel? Definitely travel. How many countries have you traveled to?
Intern 2: [00:43:07] Off the top of my head. I'm pretty sure I would do around ten.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:10] Okay, so it's borderline, but. You could say travel and it's something you really enjoy doing and you could say travel since you're from. I won't say to give it away where where you're from. But you know, clearly you've traveled a far distance. So any questions around this or does anybody else have questions around some of the advice? Oh, and then we're not done actually, because this leadership in community work. This is, again, the same bullet problems that we had above with no quantification at all. They're going to be like, I mean especially this club. International treasurer, analyze the yearly budget forecast of future expenses. I mean this is this is going to put me to sleep.
Intern 2: [00:43:57] I could easily quantify that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:59] Easily quantify that. And like, well, what did you you know, did you help do anything? I had funds for specific events that would bring in revenue. How much revenue do you bring in? What how many how many events? Which events? Negotiated? The Finance department approved funds. You mean for your club?
Intern 2: [00:44:18] Yep. So we had an event and we wanted some funds in. The Finance Board was pretty reluctant on it. And we came to an understanding as to why we need the funds. And I think that's.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:28] Good for your.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:29] Interview.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:30] I don't think it needs a bullet on the resume. I think that's a really good story to have for your interview, to show how you work through something that where there is a disagreement.
Intern 2: [00:44:38] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:39] But I don't think it's kind of funny that, like, you're an internal like part of the club and you're like, you're negotiating with your own finance department to get approved for a club. Theoretically, you're all on the same team, right? In in a.
Intern 2: [00:44:51] In a way. Yeah, but they they think that we're going to waste the money so they don't want to give the fund to students.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:57] So I think better to rather than show that negotiation, show me that you actually generated funds for the club. Go. Got it. And how much and and how much that was over the expected or whatever know what percentage did you overachieve quota or whatever or what your estimate was for the finance board with detailed expense reports for events. Again, kind of a blah whatever. Let's see. Motivate students to voice their concerns. Yeah. These could be like two bullets. Designing a rough website for the club. What does that mean? Are rough website designing. So did you put up the website or not?
Intern 2: [00:45:40] It's in the process.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:42] So. Maybe remove that until it's up.
Intern 2: [00:45:47] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:48] Because you may ask, what's the what's the domain? Pull up their smartphone. Look at it.
Intern 2: [00:45:52] Yeah. Makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:53] That looks bad. And then we talked about like instead of certifications having to send additional information or. Section with kind of more bringing a lot of this stuff down. Right. And being a little bit more in that format. So I think, yeah, this could be definitely you can save a lot of space here, save a lot of space bringing this down. This is work. Experience is going to be pop almost double. You're going to move some of these bullets, but with the debris. So it's going to almost double in size. You're going to save some space here by bringing this up. It's going to be more like two bullets with a little bit more length here. You can also save some space if you bring it over in the header. This is a ton of space you're wasting right up here.
Intern 2: [00:46:33] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:46:34] If you bring it over to this format, it's going to that's going to make it fit as well. And I'm happy to take a look once you're done with all these sets.
Intern 2: [00:46:39] Perfect.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:46:44] Any questions about not just not just from you. Anyone else have questions around this or thoughts that I missed?
Nabil: [00:46:53] For the again? I'm in the chat. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:46:56] Can you read some? Because I don't have it pulled up. And this is remember, this is for consulting. So it's a little bit different than like an investment banking thing. We don't want to be screaming finance all over it. I would say that Anon has a little bit too much in the this is this is more like a data analyst resume. This would do much better on a data analyst application than it would on a consulting. Yep. Sorry. Go ahead. Yeah. Oh, by the way, your GPA is kind of hit in. It's excellent. Like it should definitely be right up there. The first bullet right under here. Go ahead, Bill.
Intern 3: [00:47:33] Do you think it's good to add test scores for management consulting roles? I don't have SATS, A.C.T. just off total international baccalaureate exam scores.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:47:43] A great question. So what were the what were the percentiles, if I'd say if it's 90th percentile or above? I don't think it's it hurts if it's like 95th percentile or above, definitely include it. If it's like 80th percentile, I wouldn't.
Intern 3: [00:48:01] And then the next question is also for remote jobs Watch report for the location.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:48:05] Let me actually carry out that. Let's say you have a really going back to the source. Let's say you have a really bad GPA. Like, this isn't the case here. But let's say you had a29 GPA, so you have to leave it off and you have an 85th percentile to fill in some other or GMAT and you scored a 680 or 700. In that case, I might actually put those on because it's you're trying to show them like something quantifiable that like you have the intellectual, intellectual rigor to actually complete the job, whereas the GPA is going to make them doubt you, Right. So so that's the only caveat. I'll say, if you're really weak on the GPA side, including those scores, slightly below 90 percentile might actually help you a little bit. But I'd say below 80. It's definitely not. Unless you're applying too much less competitive positions. Go ahead, Bill.
Intern 3: [00:48:55] Oh, yeah. The other question was far more jobs. What should you put for relocation? But.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:01] Hmm.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:03] Great question. You could put remote. I think it looks better to have a location and so you can put the headquarters of the company. So, for example, here we have Saratoga, California. That's where the business is located. So you can do that. Yeah, I would just use the location if you're like. I would say, even if you're right outside of like New York, if you're like in Queens or something, just put New York, New York and put like Queens, New York, put in New York, New York. It's a borough of New York. So if you're in the metropolitan region of a specific city, don't put like the borough, put the actual city there because it's just much more relatable. And plus, you probably will visit a city while you're there, or theoretically, if you're remote, maybe not, but at least it's more relatable. Any other questions?
Intern 3: [00:49:54] If the article it is ready for upload, can I use it on my résumé as a reference or not?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:00] Yeah, absolutely.
Intern 3: [00:50:02] Okay. And do you think it's good to add LinkedIn URL in the header? Great name, I guess.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:12] Yes. Yes, I do. And that's not in our our template, but I think you could definitely add that you could put it here. Let me share my screen and I can show you how to potentially do that cleanly here. Under here, you could do like a vertical line and go LinkedIn and just like this right here. To your length then. That way, you're not taking a lot of space. It's clean. When you pdf this again, you shouldn't be sending out your resume. Um, as a word document, because when people open it up with different versions of word, it completely mess up the way it looks. You should pdf it so it's much more stable and then the PDF can hold the links. I don't like the way this looks with the blue email, so I usually like to like change it back to black. It's still clickable so they can click on it if they want in the pdf. Same thing with your LinkedIn link. I wouldn't have like the only place where blue on your resume is right here. Just another little formatting nit that shows attention to detail. Any other questions?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:16] Or do.
Intern 3: [00:51:16] We? Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:18] One more thing. 20 more? No, just kidding. Okay.
Intern 3: [00:51:22] Yeah. So with certifications and press investment banks.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:28] Which certifications impress investment banks Modeling. I don't think the CFA hurts. I just don't think it's that helpful. In terms of investment banking, if you're looking for an office.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:42] I think more and more partnerships like this one's. Yeah, yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:46] I think just showing, modeling, showing modeling on your resume, showing that you've taken the time for self study I think is is probably more important and having like relevant internships is a lot more important than like some any sort of certification you can get. But having gone through that and actually quantifying how many hours you've put into it. You know, you just got to be careful. You know, it's 200 hours of financial studies, self study, financial modeling, training. You'd better be ready to talk about depreciation of the cash flow through the income statement, balance sheet and cash flow statement. You better be ready to do all those questions. If you say your valuation model, you take the valuation modeling course, you better know the ways of valuing company trading comps. You better know that the common multiples, what it means, all that stuff, not just write it down because it may help you get the interview, but then you're just going to get blown out. And go home crying. Just kidding. I don't think you'll cry, but. Anon, you have a question about your resume?
Intern 4: [00:52:43] Oh, yeah. Do you think it should change the format? If I'm applying for business analyst roles as well to the format on the right?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:52:50] I think so. What I would put more your skill section will definitely be much broader and you could even you could even increase this by two or three lines. So it's something where you could have like a data you could combine today data manipulation, visualization to one for example, and put these you could do machine learning into one. Right. But I would definitely put it down here because you haven't really done it in your. Work experience is still like still self study skills. I rather have more information around like how many hours you spent in each of these programs or like giving the reader an indication of expert level versus intermediate. And you can do that all here.
Intern 4: [00:53:29] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:53:30] And I'm not saying you limit this. This could be seven high. I wouldn't go much more than seven because then it starts looking kind of odd, if you like. You're all the way up to here. You're like, all way up to here. Like it's going to start looking odd. But yeah, as an undergrad, they're not going to expect you to have like a bunch of necessarily data analyst internships. It would have been better, right, if you instead of doing marketing. And even so, if you had worked for us like data manipulation and Tableau doing, working on our tableau would probably be better for your applications to data analysts, right?
Intern 4: [00:54:07] Yep.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:08] But still, this is good. I mean, it shows that you're actually putting in a lot of work and you're more familiar with like these. And I don't know what. What have you chosen for four articles? If it's articles around data analytics and stuff.
Intern 4: [00:54:23] I've gone more towards trading. Why strategy? Because strategy. Because of strategy for consulting. Yeah. And trading. Because she liked learning about the different indicators.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:36] Okay. So, yeah, I mean, so of the data analyst stuff. Yeah, I think I would I would still move it down because I still think this is a little messy.
Intern 4: [00:54:46] Makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:47] And I think it it'll look much cleaner here and it'll still look good. You just need to give me more details on each of these and maybe cut out some of the computer networking. The less impressive ones are the ones that are a little weaker.
Intern 4: [00:54:59] But do you think I could showcase the skills by projects?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:06] I would normally say, yes, that would be great. You mean projects you've done in school yourself?
Intern 4: [00:55:13] I've learned the skills in school, but the projects I'm doing on my own.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:18] You typically don't do. It's a good question because I think. You're talking about. You're talking about specifically for a data analyst resume, right?
Intern 4: [00:55:30] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:32] You could if you want to make it more, if you want to leave this smaller and instead of leadership, you cut out a lot of this BS and you expand more on specifically these like project. You could say instead of leadership and community work, you could just do. You could just literally because the community work. You already got a lot of that in this peer recruiter stuff, right? You could put it in more around in here as one line, right? But for data, you can say data, analytic data, analytic projects here as a whole section and you could have to two projects and talk about like data manipulation, visualization. You could talk more specifically about that. I think that would be very strong and powerful for data analyst roles. Yes.
Intern 4: [00:56:16] Go ahead.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:17] Yeah, I think that'd be nice. And that would feature it a little bit more, Right, Because I think you're going to get a lot more bang for your buck from that rather than this leadership and community work.
Intern 4: [00:56:30] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:31] I still think you want this. You just want to make it. Sure. Yeah. Shorter and still quantify it. You still want it in there. But just give me some numbers now.
Intern 4: [00:56:40] Perfect. Thank you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:42] You're screaming for numbers all around this resume. Tom, go ahead.
Intern 5: [00:56:48] Hi, Patrick. Can you hear me? Yeah. Here you go. Okay, so I was wondering, can we get a copy of the template on the right side? Like that sample?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:59] Yeah. Can you send it in the chat, the link to that?
Nabil: [00:57:02] I just did some.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:03] Oh, you did?
Nabil: [00:57:09] Yeah, I just thought. Yeah.
Intern 5: [00:57:48]And then second question is, would would interest, like, be a huge thing? Like, would people really are, recruiters would look at your interest and stuff Because I had it I took it out because somebody told me, like, nobody cares what you do, man. They just want to see what you what you've done and what you have accomplished.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:27] So that's a horrible advice.
Intern 5: [00:57:29] No, really. I want to hear your advice on that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:32] Yeah, it's horrible advice. Not because it's going to necessarily stop you from getting interviews, but when you have the interviews and the person pulls your resume out and they guess what? They haven't reviewed it. Guess what they're going to look for to break the ice.
Intern 5: [00:57:48] Or you're the first.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:50] Thing they're looking at. You're like, Oh, so you write a run or Oh, you're so you're a poker player. Oh, me too. What do you play? Oh, have you heard that? Boom. Suddenly there's a mutual connection. There's like, Oh, you like to travel? I mean, maybe there's nothing that they know about. Maybe it's. You're like, Oh, you're an Olympic curler or whatever. I don't know. Like.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:58:10] You did that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:58:10] Wow, that's cool. Tell me more about that. And then suddenly half the interview could be about an interest that makes you more interesting or dynamic as a person. So it may not help you like lay in interviews as much. It's less important that stage is really important in the interview stage, I feel like. And it could help you land interviews if there's somebody, if there's shared interest from the person that's looking through it.
Intern 5: [00:58:32] Thank you so much.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:58:33] Yeah, no worries. That's why I said it's bad advice. Yeah. Go ahead and.
Intern 6: [00:58:41] I have a question. I've heard some advice about basing numbers on my resume.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:58:45] Yes, great question. Bullshitting numbers on resumes. Tell me about it. Go. What's your question?
Intern 6: [00:58:52] Is it a good thing? Because there is no way to confirm it now. I always thought, what's the point of being something while Why aren't you standing on two feet? But then, if it could give you a competitive edge because there's no way to confirm it. What do you think about it?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:08] I think if you're bullshitting numbers, that don't really matter so much. It's not the number. It's not the amount. So much is the fact that you're showing the person reading your resume that you understand how to sell. How to sell yourself. That's all the resume is. It's selling yourself. So I always say actually err on the side of conservative numbers. But give me numbers as much as you can. So it's not about overinflating what you did, because then you can get called out and be like, really? You increase the the revenue of that business as an intern by 30%. Really? Then you're going to get called out. You're going to look like it's going to go really poorly.
Intern 6: [00:59:48] Right. Exactly. Like 5% would be you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:51] But if you say something like helped save 3% on the largest account, then it saving the company 3000, something like that. It's totally believable and it's great. It shows that, like you had a small win and help the business somehow. Right. You're able to quantify it. So it's it's not trying to be like you came in and ran the business and you're like this crazy guru. It's more about just showing that you had an impact.
Intern 6: [01:00:18] Right. Except.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:20] And even if you feel like it's the most admin boring work, you can at least quantify how you were able to shovel that much shit through your internship. Because guess what? A lot of this job is at the entry level is shoveling a lot of that and all the tedious BS work is going to flow down to you. You got to be able to be willing to do it and do with a smile on your face. So if you can say cold, call 300, 320 plus people per week, guess what a lot of them be like. That's actually really.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:47] Good, you know.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:49] For like, know like, wow, he actually did that like and they may challenge you on it be like you really call that many people like yeah they actually wanted me to do 450 but I couldn't like I couldn't get through all of them just because like occasionally one would go an hour, but then I'd get hung up on like for the next 80 of them and then, you know, you can talk to it. So like a good interviewer would be able to kind of tell if you're BSing, because then they'll start asking like, what was your best call? What was your work? What was this? Tell me, like, what was the percentage of people that would actually not hang up on you? That will give you a rough numbers and then all of a sudden you're like, Oh, but if you actually did it, you should be able to answer some of those questions, you know what I mean? At least.
Intern 6: [01:01:26] Yeah, it makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:01:28] Ballpark.
Intern 6: [01:01:29] I mean, now when you put that perspective, it makes a lot of sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:01:33] Yeah, it's like it's like they've done studies actually showing that numbers on your resume, like quantitative quantification. It just makes it so much more tangible. And it's not about like lying. It's about just giving the person something to hold on to. Like our brains need something to hold on to in terms of quantification. It just makes it more understandable of like it gives me a framework in my mind of like, oh, he worked on three presentations. He helped, I think you said here, like to insure for new vehicle models. How many models? 20 models. Two models.
Intern 6: [01:02:05] I have no idea.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:02:07] Five? Yeah. Cool. And maybe I'm a car person. I want to know what models.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:02:14] Oh, let's talk about cars.
Intern 6: [01:02:16] I mean, I could actually. Yeah, That makes cheeses. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:02:20] See what I'm saying? Like, give me something to hang on to. Don't give me these vague BS bullets. Like, I know you feel like you didn't do much there, but you actually probably did a lot more than you think. If you can quantify the stuff. I mean, look at how we wrote the Bullets for Wall Street versus Finance Research Analyst Intern. Realistically, you're doing research and writing about a topic, but like the way we wrote it, it's like I wrote 50,000 words across 20 articles in these specific topics. Suddenly you're like, Whoa, The person is like, Whoa oh, I did over 200 hours of self study. The person would be like, Wow, they did a lot, right? Uh huh. And it is a lot. This internship is a lot, but it's something where, like, you're you're giving them something like that. You can't fit, you can't fake like they're able to hold on to it. They're able to give you full credit. They're able to give you so much more credit than a. Assisted in creating marketing plans for new vehicle models.
Intern 6: [01:03:08] Yeah, that just too vague and doesn't give something. Yeah, I get you. I get it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:03:12] Doesn't give me something to hold on to. To give me something to hold on to give me a little bit more. Like use the space on your resume. Like it's just a quantification thing. And this is very common, by the way, not to like rag on you, very common omission, really. It's not a mistake necessarily like this is this isn't a resume. People would be like, oh my gosh, this is so bad. It's just there's definitely room for improvement on it.
Intern 6: [01:03:33] Got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:03:34] Yeah.
Intern 6: [01:03:35] Thank you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:03:36] Yeah. I mean, your GPA is way up there. You're coming from a non target, so it's not like people are going to be coming knocking down your door. You're going to have to break down some doors. And then once this is cleaned up, ramp your networking like a maniac.
Intern 6: [01:03:53] Yep, that's the plan. Honestly, in my last semester, I really could not care about my GPA anymore. It's all networking.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:04:01] Exactly like. Yeah. Your schoolwork. And I would have said last year to do that, But here you are.
Intern 6: [01:04:08] I was a bit gloomy.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:04:09] It's okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:04:11] Live and learn. You're still super young, by the way, so you have your whole career ahead of you. Don't feel like people sometimes are.
Intern 6: [01:04:17] Like, Oh, that's motivating. It's like I did.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:04:21] I didn't get I didn't.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:04:22] Get the job out of school. It's like, dude, you have like a 30 year career ahead of you. Like, what do you think if you have to do like, one year at the non ideal job, like your life's over? Like, by the way, even if you get into the most prestigious like. Job in all of finance. You're like half your times in Excel, like spreading comps and PDBs and like aligning logos. And it's not, it's not glorified, it's not crazy. Amazing work. Yes, you're going to get paid really well and you have great exit ops and all that great stuff, but you can get there if you really want it. You just have to continue to grind, even put in the time. And for a lot of people here who are not in the US or they're not in a big city or they're not in London or they're not in Hong Kong, it's really about getting yourself to those regions and getting yourself work authorization. Such that you can actually be even in the conversation for these jobs.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:05:15] Right.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:05:16] So it's like, get yourself anywhere, any job, any any way possible to those cities. And then you have a much better shot because suddenly you can start meeting people with people. Suddenly your resume is polished and you have all this you showing all this qualifications. Suddenly you speak really well because you've talked to 200 people already and all of a sudden, boom doors, doors, doors open, open, open. And you start hearing about interviews that nobody else hears about because you're actually following up with your the people that you spoke with and keeping them up to date on what you're working on. You know, few people do that. You know, few people actually do that. Like it's it's crazy. We preach it over and over and over and over and over again because it's hard. Do you know how few people actually complete this internship successfully through and through? It's not a lot. It's not a lot and like. We have like paid opportunities right here, Like.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:06:09] We have like.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:06:11] It's there, but people just don't do it because it's hard. It's like you've got to actually have you've got to actually have discipline to sit down and like, do it right. And then like, we're giving you we're giving you free stuff. We're not giving you a cash, but we're giving you free training and stuff. You actually got to go in and do the training to. Right. And then you're dealing with school on top of it. It's a lot like I get it, I get it. But I can promise you, it's easier than banking. I can promise you you have a lot more free time than you think. A lot more free time. As much as I like Netflix do. Or whatever your social media of choice. It's long. It's 110. Any other questions? Now Mark was laughing at.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:06:53] Me or with me.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:06:56] Hopefully he's nodding because he knows he's been in the mark. He's doing the same thing. He's hustling. He's grinding. Marco.
Intern 7: [01:07:04] Yes. Yes. I mean, amazing, amazing work, you know? That's that's true, guys. We may think that we all have time, but then when you work, you know, we are we have a team, the staff, the budget, the headline and deadline. So it's much more complex.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:07:24] It's a hard transition from college to real world, man. Oh, man. You go from, like, so much for your classes. Like, sometimes you can arrange it to your classes are like Tuesday and Thursday, and maybe you have, like one evening class.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:07:36] You have three days with what are you doing? Like three days off a week, plus the weekends.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:07:42] You're like, there's parties. There's all this stuff. Like, I don't know, I just. And then suddenly they throw you. Like if you get in one of these jobs where you're expected to work 80 plus hours a week. It is. It's actually like existential. It's like existential crisis immediately at age 22 people, people are like, what is what's the meaning? What am I doing here? Like, is this really what I should be doing? And you see that you see the burnout really fast happen. It's why the attrition is so high. It's because it's it is really tough. Although I got to say, people who are coming, who are hungry or who come from less tend to be able to put up with a lot more shit for longer and get the promotion to associate or be able to kind of stick out the full two years. So for whatever that's worth, I don't know if that's helpful, but. Um, anything else? There's a couple. Did I get everything in the chat?
Nabil: [01:08:38] Yeah, I think so. But Evans has the hands up.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:08:40] Oh, sorry. Kevin. Yeah, go ahead.
Intern 8: [01:08:44] Hey, Patrick, in the book.
Intern 8: [01:08:46] You hear me, right?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:08:47] Yeah, I hear you. Great.
Intern 8: [01:08:49] Awesome. Thank you for the buy so far. I was actually. I had two questions to mine regarding networking. Yeah. Yeah. The first one would just be just getting that referral. So right now, I've been trying to reach out to people in the region. So I'm in SoCal. So I was just wondering, the first time you talk to someone and you and a conversation, good to know, let's say, would that be too early to ask for referral? I know I've been kind of doing that so far. I've been getting good responses, but I just don't want to be like, pushy about it, you know, first time meeting someone that asking for another connection. So yeah, I was hoping that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:09:29] All in the tone. Kevin I think you seem like a polite guy. Like, if you're as long as you're saying something like, You know what? I'd really appreciate all your advice. If you think there's anyone else that might be helpful to speak with or you had mentioned, you know, some people in X, Y, Z, I don't know if you know anyone that might be willing to chat me first for 10 to 15 minutes. That would be amazing. But no pressure, obviously. And just want to thank you so much for spending the time with your advice. I'll definitely follow up with you once I make progress on that. I think if you do it that way, I think that's totally fine. And, you know, they may not actually help you, but probably 30% or 50% might actually introduce you. And that helps that that just saves you so much time. It saves you 100 messages on LinkedIn to get that one call.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:10:12] You get another call from it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:10:13] Right. And that's good, I think. And then don't forget to like follow up to. Yeah, totally. Like six weeks later, three months later, even like a year later, I'd be like, Hey, remember our chat about this here? Just give a refresher. Here's where I'm at right now. Really appreciate it. I took your advice on that. And then they feel like they're like. They're part of your success story. People want to help people who they've already helped write. They're like, Oh, Kevin, actually, you should talk to this person. And like you're like, Okay, oh, they have an opening here, and then you're in so much better shape we're in. So are you.
Intern 8: [01:10:48] I'm a rising sophomore at USC, so I'll be entering. Oh, awesome. Yeah, I'm studying business. They're having good programs that actually kind of follow us up to my second question regarding location. So being so cool, I got lumps that work mostly in the L.A. offices compared to like, let's say, New York or Dallas, other places. So I guess let's say if I'm worried networking with people, let's say in Morgan Stanley in the L.A. office and then due to like my, I guess, different interests in industrial groups, I actually want to be applying to another office, let's say New York or Houston for energy. Would those connections still come in handy while I apply, since they're in, I guess, a different location?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:11:38] If you don't end up talking to anybody in those other offices, probably not as as helpful, but. Like to be frank. Like, if you get the job in LA, I think you take the job in LA. Right. Even if you want Houston or New York. Do you want Houston or New York? Is that why you're saying that?
Intern 8: [01:11:58] Not necessarily. I was just kind of thinking about, you know.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:12:00] I mean, I think like a lot of people overanalyze like you're like they overanalyze and they overestimate the odds of them breaking in even in a front office. Role.
Intern 8: [01:12:10] Right.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:12:11] Like, so like. Oftentimes we'll get like threads on the forums being like, what? What should I take like this private equity analyst role or this? Everyone's like, just get the offers.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:12:22] First, like, you know.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:12:25] Like and then make the decision. And so I think I think your question is, is is genuine in the sense of like you're just trying to figure out like are all these connections are making in LA, is it actually going to benefit me if I'm applying to New York?
Intern 8: [01:12:38] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:12:40] And my my whole thing is I think oftentimes it's a general pool you're applying it to. And even if, like, you end up doing the interview in LA, like, I think usually final rounds are in the headquarters. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't know. It depends probably by bank.
Intern 8: [01:12:57] I do understand. So some firms I've been talking to, they do have generalist programs. So like you said, they will consider you for role after excepted. And that's kind of where you choose your location. Yeah, of course. Other firms, you're kind of like right off the bat your ally application. You have to put in your location preferences.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:13:17] Yeah. So for, for the ones that are generalist pools where they're like, you're choosing the location after you get the offer, those, those connections in LA actually are super valuable because it's going to help you get those interviews. This first rounds, right, for the ones where you're like putting it in initially the the LA connections there, if you're saying like New York number one like it, it might be a little harder. You probably need to talk to somebody and you may want to talk to people at not just USC alum, you may want to talk to Irvine alum, you may want to talk to us D or us. Universal San Diego Yeah. Anybody near you like SoCal, any school. So I know there's not as many, but like, is it like Pomona or something.
Intern 8: [01:14:01] Yes.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:14:01] Or Claremont McKenna. Any sort of all you do instead of like. During the USC connection. You talk about the. You talk about like the SoCal connection.
Intern 8: [01:14:15] Right. You're saying.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:14:16] Hey, I'm also in Southern California trying to figure out how you made it to New York, and then that's how you get in touch with a few more New York. People.
Intern 8: [01:14:23] Mm hmm.
Intern 8: [01:14:25] For sure. Yeah. I'll definitely keep that in mind. I've been so far, I've had the most success, obviously, by emailing alums from school. But yeah, I'll definitely try to branch out in the future. But yeah, thank you for that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:14:36] Cool. Yeah. Good luck with everything. See, you're on the right track. You're on the right track, so just keep it up.
Intern 8: [01:14:41] Thank you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:14:44] Let's see. Let's see. I'm curious, since we are discussing about resumes, would there be a discussions for cover letters? We have a cover letter template. And is that online the cover letter template?
Intern 8: [01:14:57] Yeah, it should be. I'll just share it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:14:58] Yeah, we'll share it in the chat as well. Yeah, Cover letter is one of those things where it's not going to you're not going to get the interview out of it, but it could just hurt you. So you want to keep it really plain vanilla. Pretty, pretty, pretty clean, not over. Don't definitely keep it to under one page, one page or under. Don't go trying to write about your life story. Talk about like who you are, what's where you're at, how you appreciate the opportunity to work at their firm and you're really excited about it. And then the short closing and you're done. And again, it's not going to help you land an interview. All it could do is just get you kicked out of the process if you're if you go overboard. I have so much passion to work with this investment making. Ever since I was eight years old reading the Wall Street Journal. Yeah. Don't do that.
Intern 9: [01:15:42] Hi. Patrick. So when making the cover letter, should we include all of our points in the resume or.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:15:56] No, no, no. Definitely much shorter. A much shorter one page. It's just a couple of highlights of why you think you'd add value to the team. All that good stuff.
Intern 9: [01:16:08] Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:16:09] Thank you. Yeah. And you should look at the template. That's a great guide in terms of how to do it. Harvin says, Will you be doing a resume review next week too? Sure. We can do another one if you guys like it. If you think it's helpful. Maybe by the end of this we'll have done like half of the half of the crew.
Intern 9: [01:16:29] Even have cover letters in the first place. Sorry.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:16:34] If they don't require it now. It's not a lot of places require it, so you're kind of forced to throw it together. I think it could be a nice touch for smaller companies. Where it's like somebody actually might read it and it's like you maybe, you know, somebody or you spoke with somebody in the company, they'd be like, after speaking with X, Y, Z, because shows like some sort of relation there. But that's almost like you're applying less through a portal. You're applying through like a person, like directly messaging HR or, or somebody who like the connection through there that might make it look a little more formal, make it look like you're serious. And if you have a template, you can go off of it and then modify it slightly based on the company. That can save you a lot of time. Um. Anything else, Nabil What am I forgetting? Thanks, Alan.
Nabil: [01:17:28] Nothing, I.Guess. I think that's it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:17:31] Okay everybody.It's a lot of talking by me. Hopefully it doesn't get annoying. Yeah, I think that's it. Usually I'm in sweatpants and sweatshirt, but this is. We had a lot of sales calls lately, so.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:17:45] And this.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:17:48] Looking all professional today. So you guys off. So yeah, if there's anything else. And then Anon, thanks for sharing your resume. You can always just shoot it over to us after I'll have it take a quick look and give the thumbs up. Perfect. Thank you. It might be cool to actually see it next, like next week or in a couple of weeks. Kind of re relive it and see how people think it's better and we can show side by side. That is pretty.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:18:14] Cool.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:18:17] But yeah, or you know, if you want your resume reviewed in this format, send the word version of your resume to Nabil at Wall Street dot com and we can we'll select one for next Friday. Thanks so much, everybody. Appreciate your time. Appreciate all your efforts with the internship. You guys are kicking butt and we're really appreciative. We're super excited once we get this bottlenecked, this upload bottleneck. We're really excited because, like we can see every time we publish more articles, like we can see the rankings of these in the traffic of the site steadily climb. So we're really excited just to get get alive. And we got a lot more people come come to the rescue to help us. So thank you. Thank you, everybody.
Intern: [01:19:04] Thank you. Bye bye.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:19:06] Bye bye bye. And thanks to you, my listeners at Wall Street Oasis. If you have any suggestions whatsoever, please don't hesitate to send them my way. Patrick at Wall Street Oasis. And till next time.
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