WSO Podcast | E196: Real Estate Private Equity. From Italy to London

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In this episode, member Real_Estate_PE shares his path coming from a top target school in Italy. We learn what he did when he got no responses for his Summer internship applications, how he was able to land an off-cycle internship at a bulge bracket bank, why he ended up in real estate and how he is headed to a megafund soon.

 

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WSO Podcast Episode 196 Transcripts:

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:06] Hello and welcome. I'm Patrick Curtis, your host and chief Monkey. And this is the Wall Street Oasis podcast. Join me as I talk to some of the community's most successful and inspirational members to gain valuable insight into different career paths and life in general. Let's get to it. In this episode, member Real Estate P shares his path coming from a top target school in Italy. We learn what he did when he got no responses for a summer internship. Applications how he was able to land an off cycle internship at a budget bracket bank, why he ended up in real estate and how he is headed to a megaphone soon. Joy OC Real Estate. Pe Thanks so much for joining the Wall Street Oasis podcast.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:00:54] Thank you for having me, Patrick. Good to be here.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:56] It'd be great if you could just give the listeners a short summary of your bio.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:01:00] Sure. So I'm originally Italian, as you can probably tell from my my thick accent. And from a small town in northern Italy, I studied at a Target school in Italy as well. I did the pretty standard Italian finance path that is basically a bachelor in finance. And then like straight after continuing with a master's also in finance, there is like the standard five year uni path for for Italian students. And then yeah so doing my my bachelor I studied in the US actually it was a wonderful experience, something that really, really helped me figure out what I, what I wanted to do. Like, you know, getting in touch with a different culture in the US, you know, in Italy the university is very academic while in the US is much more like group projects and much more interactive. So it was.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:02:18] Are you saying we party more than in Italy?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:02:21] A lot more. A lot more Americans are.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:02:27] They have a lot of fun in college, is that what you're saying? Whereas Italians had to study hard.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:02:33] Much less library, much more bars and pubs. Yeah, absolutely.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:02:38] Well, that's good. That's good. Okay. Sorry. Go ahead. Continue.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:02:42] Yeah. So during my master's, I didn't as everyone in my class, I applied to 100 submarine opportunities both in Milan and in London. And then I wasn't very lucky with the recruiting processes. I had an okay GPA. I mean, I had a good GPA, but nothing that really differentiated me from the others. And given that London pretty much attracts applications from all over Europe, especially if you come from an overrepresented background, it's very, very difficult to land a spot in a summer internship if you don't have like a strong previous experience or something that really gets you out of the of of the competition. And so with that, I started to be a little bit worried because, you know, everyone else is getting the internship and then graduation is approaching and you don't really you don't even know what to do. So I figured I better start working now, even if like, it's like during classes.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:03] But you never landed a summer. You never landed a summer A traditional.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:04:07] Not even a phone call. Not even a phone interview. It was it was rough. And then so I start to think I better start doing something now that helps me differentiate out of out of the others. So in Italy, the system is different, so you don't really have to attend classes as far as long as you do your excel, your final exam at the end of the course and you pass it, it's fine. So attendance is not is not something that is strictly required, although it is very, very much encouraged. So but I came into a situation where I thought I better, I have to do something now, otherwise it can be too late because. You miss all the other shooting cycles and you end up in a swamp. So I landed an off cycle opportunity in a small in a small fund manager in Milan doing real estate. What I knew at the time is that if I were to do.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:19] Let's back up and we'll just dive right in. We don't have to go through through everything. Let's, let's, let's dive in. So you're what year did you start applying? So you have your masters, right? You're getting your masters at this point, correct? Yes. And you.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:05:32] Have first year out of two of my.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:34] Master. You're dropping your rise, you're sending your resume and you're not getting a single callback. Nothing. So what do you do that summer? When that summer comes or you started panicking right away and you said, I need to get something now during the school year?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:05:45] Well, I actually managed to get my off cycle opportunity in the middle of the first year. So I started even earlier than a normal summer internship because the recruiting cycle is usually in October, September, October. Yeah. And I missed that. And I started recruiting for other places in December and I started working in February. I think you.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:11] Quickly you quickly found a different path, a way to get an internship without having the official internship in the summer.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:06:18] Yeah, it was kind of an off cycle internship in Milan. They're really common because the teams, the the, the offices are really small, so there is no it is difficult to find something structured where they have a class of interns that joins. And then there's the there's a structured program. It's more like we need people that helps us doing the actual job and interns cost less, so they hire a bunch of interns.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:49] So how did you how did you even get that? How did you even know where to look for that off cycle internship? Was it something where, like, okay, you realize you weren't getting the traditional summer? She said, I need a recruit. So then what did you what did you turn to? So you said you started recruiting in December and you ended up finding something in February and you started right away, it sounds like. Yeah.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:07:10] There is. There was an application portal on the university website where like people could apply, you know, local firms and businesses, even large ones, published the opportunities there. And then like you can, you can apply and usually the start date is ASAP. So it wasn't. And also it's a requirement often that is ASAP because they need the people. Now they know the people in six months, like the big banks that have 2000 employees, these guys had like 20. So. Right. So yeah, I found that it was a private equity real estate fund manager. So not really an investor. It was more like a service provider or they provided transaction advisory or structuring to international investors that don't have a presence in Italy. And yeah, so I started there was starting it was pretty, pretty challenging. And then why.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:23] Do you think you were able to land that though? And, you know, isn't that super competitive or because it's start date immediately, it's not as competitive.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:08:31] Um, yeah, part of that, it was a kind of a I don't want to say a no name place because they have their name in Italy. But yeah, definitely less competitive than, than banks and that kind of stuff.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:50] It wasn't, it wasn't a bulge bracket. Right. So no.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:08:52] No, absolutely not. And, and um, so, and real estate in Italy is not like as I understand in the, in the US is a much more like a foreign asset class and a lot of people want to go into real estate like from the first day of, of university and there are programs and bachelor's and master's majors that refers to that in Italy is much more unknown and people just end up there. They don't look for it most of the times while yeah, so.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:32] It's less competitive, there's just less people. So when you applied you actually got a response back?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:09:36] Yeah, Yeah. And as I said, these people need the interns because it's not like a program that they run because they want to find like.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:47] They actually actually use you as, as Yeah. So tell me what that, what would that you said it was super hard so you know you did almost a year Almost a year with that.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:09:57] Yeah it was kind of Yeah. Six months like full time. And then I did a little bit of back and forth with some part time.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:07] How did you how did you pass your classes?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:10:09] It was extremely hard. So studying at night, starting during work when like the workflow was less intense and my GPA took a hit.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:21] But how many how many hours were you working per week when you're doing full time?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:10:26] I would say it was not as bad as investment banking was. I would say 52. Maybe the average was like 60.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:37] 50 to 60. It's still a lot with full time. Your full time school to master's.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:10:41] Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was kind of it was tough.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:44] It was tough. So tell me, like your GPA took a hit, but were you. Do you get into a rhythm of sorts, or did you feel like you could still do it? Like you realize, I can do this? And was it I don't know where you were? You thinking like, I got to get I got to stop or I got to find another? Were you thinking I got this on my resume now I need to get to another bank or another place? Yeah.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:11:07] I mean, it was. At first I figured, yeah, I can, I can do this. And then the exams were approaching and I started to get scared. So I kind of asked my, my, my, my, my manager if I could have one or two days off, because, like, when you're an intern, you intern for six months and you have no holiday, no PTO whatsoever. So I asked them, I really need this week right before the exams and because otherwise I won't even pass. And they we came we got along so they were interested in retaining me and they, they figured if he doesn't pass the exams, we can hire him at the end of the of the degree. So it was kind of they had to give me something to study sometimes just to study.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:06] And so they did. They gave you two days off or three days off to.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:12:09] Study before they left, maybe a week or like, Yeah, a couple of days, something like that. And yeah, they were pretty understanding. They were good people. Yeah, it was kind of a it was a positive experience.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:21] Yeah. And so you didn't stay there. So tell me more about like how you started thinking about moving to the next internship. Like where now you were thinking, Hey, I could do this a year round. I'll just not go to class and just study right before the exams somehow to get my master's. What was it? What was the thought process there? Well, yeah. And do you, do you recommend this path for other people who can't get the summer? Or do you think, hey, if you get the summer internship, just go that path. And this is like a way for people who aren't getting responses or interviews to kind of get in a different way.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:12:49] Well, I think I think maybe they can wait, like because like the first year out of the two of the master is the most intense from an academic point of view. So I would suggest to at least wait until the first year is gone, because then, like you have the the bulk of your exams are done and you are a little bit more free to you have some some electives and if you choose the easy ones, then you can like manage it. Doing like I did was pretty rough and was, I don't want to say out of desperation, but.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:26] But it gave you insurance too, though.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:13:29] Yeah. Yeah, kind of. Yeah. Because like, when I, when I finished my.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:34] If you had but if you had waited till your second year and you didn't somehow for whatever reason, because you didn't know that for sure you were going to get that right. So if you had waited till your second year and then suddenly, like, you don't get anything there, then it's kind of really scary.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:13:48] It's an additional risk. It's also a risk that you seriously damaged your your academics. And in Italy, they're pretty important. So either you then like, learn something serious, like more more of a brand name for your next next job opportunity or there's a risk that you are damaged from that point of view that prevents you from landing other jobs like at a top level. So. So yeah, you got to manage these these risks. Is I in this situation I wished I got that summer internship.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:31] Did did you end up working through the summer then. Right. With this initial place. Yeah.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:14:35] Yeah, yeah.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:37] That became your internship. And then tell me how you kind of approached changing internships or going to a larger firm.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:14:45] Yeah, it was mainly again, I was continuing to scroll on these on this portal and I on this university bar, and then I found that these bulge bracket bank was recruited in Milan for kind of the exact same position I was.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:04] Already doing.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:15:05] At that time. So I figured this is for me, like this job description is tailored for me and it's from a budget bracket. So I applied and we did, I think, 2 to 3 rounds of interviews and and I landed a job. So at that time, my university was not not yet done. And I had to take the decision, do I want to even take more risk and go to the bulge bracket where I'm going to work much more and it's going to be much more intense when I still have to do like a lot of exams. And I.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:50] And you did it.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:15:51] I kind of jumped at it and I did it. So there it was, another six month experience. I started, I believe, in 2018, 2019. And and yeah, it was it was a much different experience. The people were much less nice.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:17] More intense, more intense.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:16:18] Much, much more intense.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:20] Hour. Did the hours jump over 70 per week?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:16:23] Absolutely. Yeah. It was like more like 80 is bare minimum.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:29] While you're still trying to get your second you're in your second year of math, correct? Yes. I can't believe they even allow that. Like, aren't they nervous about you? Like failing out.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:16:40] Because as I said, the interest in in Milan are much more like a replacement for a full timer. Yeah, that is much less expensive. And the teams are very small. So the the internships are rolling and you get, you get an offer only if you're good. And if there's a spot and it's very difficult, you're going to be very lucky that a spot that is part freeze up either because they increase the headcount for some reason or because one of the junior leaves. So the people there kind of know that after six months you're gone. So they don't really care about keeping you happy and happy about the firm, excited about the team so that you you can join afterwards. It is it is a little bit rough. It looks like your you are a little bit mistreated and used, but at the same time, it was the opportunity that really allowed me to learn how these kind of big firms work. And it was a great brand to put on the CV that eventually was my ticket to London. Absolutely. I would never have the opportunity to recruit directly for the buy side in London if I didn't have that brand and and that experience on my CV.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:15] Absolutely. Let's talk about that. Let's talk about kind of as you're going through the bulge bracket internship and it's difficult. You're doing 80 hour weeks. Did you ask for a similar time off to like prepare for your finals? You're in the second year.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:18:30] I can't remember exactly. Maybe, yeah, but just a couple of days or like afternoons stuff and stuff like that. The good thing is that the interns were not allowed a mobile or a laptop, so your, your weekends were pretty free because you were out of reach.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:48] That's huge.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:18:49] So, yeah, it was kind of nice. It meant that during the week you were extremely long.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:57] You're like sleeping at the office almost all night.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:18:59] Yeah. Yeah, kind of like that. And and so unless you got very unlucky and the associate told you on Friday, make sure to show up on Saturday, the office or like you were kind of free to go for the weekend. So that was really useful to allow me to continue studying and getting these exams done because it was haunting me. You know, this workload is study load. It was, it was kind of stressful as well. So.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:37] So tell me, as you're approaching the end of that internship, was there a defined end or as you're kind of thinking of recruiting, was the. Side, like in your mind now you're thinking, Hey, I have a bulge bracket internship, I want to go straight to the buy site. And what were you looking at? Were you looking at generalist private equity funds as well, or were you looking at just staying in real estate? And how did you come to love real estate? I'd love to hear about that.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:19:59] Well, I kind of like real estate. And I mean, part of that is because I ended up staying in real estate. So that decision came part of apart from the fact that I really liked it. So I think it's an interesting asset class that is overlooked a bit in Europe from a professional point of view. Yeah, and for that reason, because it's overlooked, is overlooked is less competitive. So I found that there were a lot of opportunities there to like go straight to a good firm keeping, let's say, the investment banking experience that is kind of essential to land buy side jobs usually. So choosing the real estate path allowed me to fast track or to to to skip the experience that I was interested in M&A and that kind of stuff. But I knew that if I were to do that, it would have been only to land then beside jobs. So I figured, yeah, let's go straight for the buy side.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:14] So you said, let's just go for the back. You knew that's where you wanted to be. So you started. Let's, let's go for it. So then were you using again your, your school strong kind of on campus recruiting or what were you using and were they, was it specifically an analyst program for people coming right out of the Masters? How what was it like?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:21:30] Well, during my final month at the budget bracket, we. I lost track. So during my final years at the age bracket, I started to get emails and LinkedIn messages from dancers because most of the firms in London are very small. So they again, they don't have structured programmes. Only a bunch of them really have one. Yeah, I could count them on, on my on my right hand. Yeah. And so you get these, these calls, these emails, and you start to understand how that works.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:23] So the recruiter is basically saying, Hey, what are you looking for? So what did you do? What did you how did you answer those questions? Because did you say they're saying, hey, a real estate fund? And you're saying, I guess or.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:22:36] Yeah, yeah, kind of. I mean, they said, well, we're looking to recruit the juniors for this fund. They recently raised X million. It's a team of six or something like that. And so I, I figured I interviewed for, for the funds that I thought were where were interesting and again I didn't really apply a very strict let's say. A very strict.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:16] Criteria.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:23:17] Yeah. To them, because I was looking for a job and I wanted to go to London.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:22] So you weren't super picky. Let's put it that way. You weren't super picky. You said, Hey, if I can get something decent.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:23:27] Kind of everything.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:28] Works. Get to London. Get to London. Yeah.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:23:31] Yeah. And so I interviewed for I was, I would say, 5 to 6 firms. And I landed actually, I landed three offers at a time to start right after my, my master's completion. And, and so my decision making there was one offer was from a pension fund that had a direct private equity real estate team. Another one was like a platform of a megaphone. So these these, these platforms owned by Mega Fund were investing in a specific asset class all over Europe. And then the third.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:13] One in a specific asset that was it real estate or something else.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:24:16] Yeah. And that's because within real estate was a logistics platform and, and the third one was a straight like middle market fund, private equity real estate fund, so much more eclectic, much more diverse experience. And that that's what I took at the end. The pension fund maybe was like a more safe decision, but I figured, yeah, while I'm still at the start, I want to have as broad as possible exposure to asset classes and more fast paced environment.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:56] And and when you say like broad exposure in different asset classes, like you say, you're not looking at just like commercial or just multifamily, just you would look at like hotel everything for, at, at the middle market fund you had more like just opportunistic. You could do anything. So you're looking at a lot, a much wider range of different types of real estate.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:25:17] Correct. And when you work in a small fund, you actually get more much more in depth in, you know, in what you invest in. So while at a at a pension fund, you're you have so much capital that you most often work with JV partners and they they do most of the work like most of the operating work, the diligence, they understand much more about what's going on, on the investments and.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:50] How did you know that?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:25:52] Well, it.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:53] Just obvious that obvious.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:25:55] That you get you talked to people at the age bracket. I among these bad environment, I managed to make friends with the associate there and he acted like as kind of a mentor. And I was able to ask him, what do you think is better? What, why, and that kind of stuff. So I got some, some, some guidance from him that was very, very good. Very, very useful.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:28] Any any other networking that went on during this whole kind of process of stuff where where you really I mean, it sounds like you're probably barely keeping your head above water with the internship and the school. So you were just kind of networking and building relationships with the people you are working with and classmates.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:26:42] Yeah, it was yeah, I participated to some some events in London, Breakfast, that kind of stuff. There was also a job fair held by by a university there. But yeah, I didn't network intensely also because culturally I think in in Europe is less is less important than in the US is still very important but it it happens less less often that you get a get an opportunity or get a job through connections or a networking compared to the standard application portal and that kind of stuff. So yeah.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:29] So I guess tell me what happened. So you're kind of interviewing where there are cases thrown at you or their modeling tests. What was it like recruiting for private equity, real estate type roles?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:27:40] Yeah, it was. The standard is you get a first face to face, like 1 to 1 interview, either over Zoom or over the phone or face to face. And then you get a case study, you get a modeling test or a case study or both sometimes. So you get like a rent roll. You need to analyze an asset and came up with a pricing. And then there is a discussion session where you're asked to substantiate your assumption to show your working and and so on. I ended up being pretty proficient in financial modeling for real estate, thanks to this guy at the budget bracket. And my previous experience as well was very, very useful. So for my I was recruiting for like Analyst one But I really had skills that went a little bit beyond that. So it was kind of easy for me.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:45] For those I'll give a little plug for ourselves. We have a real estate modeling course for people who are looking to kind of get exposure to different asset classes and modeling. And we have case studies and modeling tests that are that were delivered at actual real estate funds for their candidates. So take a look under courses for that. But yeah, no, sorry, I continue. I just thought I'd throw a shameless plug in there in the middle, actually. But so you were you were pretty advanced. It sounds like you were. So these these cases weren't that hard for you. So that's probably why you had so many offers. Three, three out of five out of five places you had landed three offers. That's a lot.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:29:20] Yeah. Yeah. Part of that is, as I said, the few few candidates specialize early on, so there is a permanent supply demand imbalance in real estate, private equity recruitment for very junior professionals.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:35] So tell me about let's talk about that's crazy to me because here I know it's super sought after Tell me about pay is pay lower for private equity, real estate versus generalist or do you know like tell me first what they were paying you as an intern if you can like from not just the bulge bracket but the previous place and then, oh, and it can be arranged. It can be arranged just to give me exact numbers, just to get a feel. And then how was that first kind of roll out of out of your master's. What what was the pay jump look like?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:30:04] Sure. So my first internship was paid $1,000 per month. That's extremely low. But I mean, 4 million is pretty good. Yeah. And at the age bracket, the bunch was minimal. So I was making 1000 something per month. Again, that equated to I made the math, it's like €3 per hour. But, you know, you do it for for a brand, you do it for the, for the learning. You don't do it for money at that stage. And in Milan is pretty that's pretty standard. And then when I recruited my base was on par with IB probably a little bit when I started in London. So at the London Fund it was on par with with IB maybe a little bit of a discount to other funds, especially to mega fund. And then.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:05] Oh, are we talking like I have no idea what I can't remember what analysts like 60 or 50.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:31:11] At the time was. 50 K £50. Yeah. And then you get a, you get a bonus that was up 200%. Yeah. And yeah. So maybe if you factor in the bonus you were a little bit above I b first year IB.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:30] And you had a good bonus you're close to 100% or you got.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:31:33] I was Wow. I got to say yeah I was, yeah it was nice.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:38] So your first year out of first year out of matches, you're clearing six figures in pounds. That's pretty good.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:31:43] Yeah, there was very, very good. Yeah, I really. You're admirable.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:48] You are. London is expensive, so you kind of need it, but. So you're. You're basically. You're doing well here. So it sounds like you just continued there and things have gone well.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:32:03] Yeah. So I stayed there. I'm still here on paper. So it's been two years, almost and a half. And yeah, I got promoted to associate in in January this year. It was usually it's a three year path, but there was kind of a shakeup in the team. So a bunch of people left, and I like to think that I pretty good. So they they promoted me when you're earlier than the normal and yeah so everything was pretty pretty good. But again the supply demand imbalance in the real estate private equity loan market kicked in. So during my the second half of my second year, I started getting a lot of calls from much larger funds. And it's kind of difficult to say no when they, you know, they tell certain brands certain names. So I did a bunch of interviews again after, you know, you get the calls, the the process is pretty the same as as I did when I first interviewed for my first job. Of course, the modeling test is a little bit harder and the technical interviews are more intense and more in number and in time. It takes a significant amount of time. And so you ended up I ended up interviewing for. Maybe a dozen places, some of them just the introductory call. And then I said, you know, this is too sector specific. This is to counter specific. Maybe I don't want to go doing only logistics in the Netherlands. Right, because that's too specific. I'm not Dutch. So is it kind of didn't make sense and I manage I managed to get an offer from a so called mega fund to join as an associate in a couple of months. So I'll leave my current employer a couple of months and join the new team and. Yeah. So it was more opportunity driven than being willing to move move places, of course.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:55] Yeah. We're seeing that across the board right now. I mean, it's insane market right now for Junior Talent, not just in banking but in private equity as well. And I think megaphone can probably pay you more or pay you more. So like the raise is nice. So were you making close to sick with the associate promoter? I assume you're getting close to like 100,000 or so.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:35:19] A little bit less than that.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:21] Like 90 ish and then.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:35:22] Kind of. Kind of. Yeah. And then same bonus.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:26] Summer bonus, Right. Which is so great. I mean, it's a lot of money. And then what about what about the mega fund? Did they increase that significantly?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:35:34] The base is a little bit higher, not crazy higher, but the bonus potential, the target bonus and the bonus potential is considerably higher. So overall, in total, I'm looking at a 30 to 40% more.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:50] Yeah. Is that because it's over 100% the bonus potential?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:35:52] Yeah.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:53] Is that coming from Carrie or is that coming from just pure cash bonus.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:35:57] Pure cash carry? I think it kicks in at the bill level, level. Yeah.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:02] So, so what's the, you think long term you want to just stay in this space? I mean, obviously it's very lucrative.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:36:08] Yeah. I mean, I would like to. Let's see how. How my next opportunity goes. As I'm joining a mega fund. There's a more, there's less job security, let's call it. So it's like 2 to 3 years up or outs more or less. So I'm very much I very much want one to understand how that goes. If, if, if I still like it, if I like it more, if I like it less, and if I'm able if I think I'm able to to climb up the ladder and then, you know, there's a part of me thinks that real estate is a little bit of a niche and in at least in Europe, and it can become a little bit boring sometimes because, you know, maybe it's an office building in Milan, maybe it's in Munich, maybe it's logistics in the Netherlands. But it's it's pretty much of a cash flow all the time. And it's it's still it kind of it can be always the same stuff and sometimes it's boring. So I kind of I would consider moving asset class maybe, but that can be difficult. That could require going to to business school.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:41] So that's on the table potentially in a few years. Business school.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:37:45] Or something? Yeah, potentially, yeah.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:47] Where would you look at? Would you look at INSEAD or would you look at some of the US schools at all?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:37:52] Probably both. I would really like to go back to the US for a period because I think it's just.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:59] You have fond memories of us.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:38:01] Yeah. Fond memories. And yeah, the business schools are, I think, more attractive. And in my also in my in my mind, there's possibility of moving to the US and maybe these US mega opportunities will opportunity will allow me to do that in in a few years. So there's kind of that. So I still I want to see how how this goes and then and then just make pros and cons, make some evaluations and.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:43] Well, let me know if I can help. Let me know if I can help when you get there that that that decision. And then looking back at like where you are right now, anything any kind of final words before we call the pod. Any final words that you want the listeners to hear, words of wisdom from from your path?

Real_Estate_PE: [00:39:00] Well, what I want to say is that a lot of people, including me, when I, for example, didn't get the summer internship, can be can get really discouraged or and like which industry completely or you know, abandon the finance path even if it's something that they like. I want to say that if you can start building your CV, even with small experience in non empty places, if you like, keep, keep grinding and you keep like believing that you can do it even if your friends are going to Goldman and you are going to the non end boutique in Milan, you can still end up in pretty good spots. It just takes you just take a different path that can be harder, take more time. But if you if you think it's it's what you want to do it yeah let. Go for it.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:11] I love it. Let's end on that. I really appreciate your time and your story. Thanks for sharing with all of us.

Real_Estate_PE: [00:40:17] Look our.

Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:17] Patrick. And thanks to you, my listeners at Wall Street Oasis. If you have any suggestions whatsoever, please don't hesitate to send them my way. Patrick at Wall Street. Oasis. Dot.com. And till next time.