WSO Podcast | E136: Wharton to Moelis to Travel and Back
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In this episode, BoutiqueBananas shares his path from graduating near the top of his class at Wharton, why he ended up at Moelis for two years and why he decided to travel for a year after his analyst stint. Learn how he got back into investment banking only to be laid off soon after and how he is approaching his next search.
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WSO Podcast (Episode 136) Transcript:
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:06] Hello and welcome. I'm Patrick Curtis, your host and chief monkey, and this is the Wall Street Oasis podcast. Join me as I talk to some of the community's most successful and inspirational members to gain valuable insight into different career paths and life in general. Let's get to it. In this episode, BoutiqueBananas shares his path from graduating near the top of his class at Wharton. Why he ended up at Mollis for two years, and why he decided to travel for year after his analyst didn't learn how he got back into investment banking, only to be laid off soon after. Now he's approaching his next search. Enjoy. Right, boutique bananas, thanks so much for joining the Wall Street Voices podcast.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:00:55] Thanks for having me.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:56] It'd be great if you could just give the listeners a short summary of your bio.
BoutiqueBananas:00:00:59] Sure. So I grew up in New Jersey. You know what I think is a typical suburb America I went to, I went to a local high school for college. I wanted to study business, so I was fortunate enough to get into Wharton. There, I kind of learned about investment banking that whole world. I'd kind of heard about it just in pop culture and news and like CNBC and stuff. Uh, so I started pursuing internships in the field, I worked at a family office and a hedge fund while in college, and then eventually I was kind of told the best thing to do is go down the investment banking analyst training program. So I started recruiting, I learned about different things like restructuring that I never knew about before. Eventually, I worked in at Houlihan Restructuring Group for a summer, then full time and moved over to molas at a good time there. After that, I took some time off and then worked again at Houlihan.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:01:57] Well, all right, so let's go back to kind of your time at Wharton. Did you know you said you kind of heard of investment banking and pop culture, did you? Was it more like A. Wharton's like a little bit of a pressure cooker for banking recruiting. It's like such a feeder into wall Street. Tell me a little bit of what it was like kind of going through that. I mean, obviously you did really well in school, but was there a lot of pressure from like your parents to do it? It was your family in it? Or was it all new to you and you were just learning as you went and kind of just from just being in that atmosphere, you kind of absorbed a lot.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:02:31] Sure. Want to show the school all I really knew about finance or banking, I wasn't really even dead set on finance. All I really knew was like sales and trading. I had in high school we did like a tour of Goldman Sachs. Someone in my class like new partner. Mm hmm. So I did like a day there, so that's all I really knew. Um, but then when it came time for like, you know, getting closer to graduation, I needed to find a job. My parents, like, you know, you should probably pursue investment banking. It's like a good career. I said I learned about the M&A advisory business. I started reading a lot of books. I found your website a decent bid. There was some good stuff on it, so I definitely appreciate that. Good, good resources here and I would speak to my friends and all that, and I would do the recruiting. I throw my resume everywhere. I started running around doing interviews.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:19] You said you had a. Yeah. You said you had a restructuring internship plan. Is that accurate?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:03:24] Yeah. I had no idea what restructuring was until maybe I showed up for the interviews and stuff like that. Like, I started reading more people started telling me to do that. So I read that I found that interesting. It was a good space, and I just like the people, had a good friend that I didn't turn in that group the year before me. So he helped me kind of, you know, get a nice to the top of the pile or something, or at least get recognized for interviews. Yeah. And I met the guys there. They're all really nice. I still remember them. I still remember my conversation with the guys like one of them. I remember he just made fun of me for the interview, but like, he made fun of the cover letter. That's not really me. Just about the fact that a lot of these cover letters are so generic. And he was like, who writes this stuff? I'm like, It's like a template or whatever. And eventually the guys are like, Listen, we like you. If you want to come work here, please do. I said, Sure. And I was kind of. It sounds like it was a little bit informal.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:14] Do you feel like because you had kind of that vouch for the person who had like the friend from Morton saying, Yeah, this kid's sharp? Do you feel like that was kind of the main interview. And then the interviews were more just like they were just more check a box.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:04:27] Would be like, were they were they technical,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:30] Were they like asking you about like capital stacks and like priorities on like a bankruptcy chapter 11 or something like that? It could be, but but
BoutiqueBananas: [00:04:37] I don't know, for me, the technicals are never really tough, I studied a good amount, I learned it, so I never really even like when I did the mole stuff. People told me that's like a technicality, but I never really found it too difficult. Yeah. So you just sort of ask stuff and I have like this. Yeah, I mean,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:53] For people who are listening, I think. For you specifically for the guest here, I think. I think it's important, though, to realize that for you. You were you placed first in a lot of different competitions that show that there's a lot of intellectual horsepower there. Is that fair?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:05:14] Sorry, my connection went out a little bit.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:16] I was saying there's a lot of intellectual horsepower, potentially in your brain, so do you feel like that's fair, given how well you did at Wharton?And then like all the how well you did in high school and all that stuff?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:05:27] Yeah, generally, I felt like the Volt guys were a little basic by the time I was interviewing. Yeah, so
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:32] You so you went in there, there wasn't a problem with any sort of technical questions. It was more like Check the box. Did you feel like with any of the other interviews, did you want to go to like an elite boutique? Did you? Did you consider any of the bulge brackets?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:05:46] I really threw my resume everywhere. It was pretty easy just, you know, filled out a form and dropped your resume. And I mean, I interviewed had a bunch of places I just liked. These are the people that I got along the best with, I think.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:57] Tell me, tell me why you think that is? Like, did you have other offers at bulge brackets?
BoutiqueBananas:00:06:02] I not know for no, but I had first hand interviews and they just felt a little colder. They were generally with like older people and it was a nice interview and all that kind of stuff. But it wasn't just with the people like a whole animal. It was just I enjoyed the interviews more. It's just nice to meet the person we just spoke with in. Because I'm, like, so formulaic, you didn't feel as much like a job.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:25] Got it. Ok, cool. So you're you kind of did the internship and did you think about going into restructuring Houlihan full time or you kind of came back with the offer in hand your senior as you were wrapping up your junior summer? And then how did you kind of did you end up
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:41] Shopping that to molas? How did you end up at Mollis full time? Right out of school?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:06:45] Yeah, so it was a good summer, I learned a lot. I like the people definitely was. It was a very attractive offer. I wasn't so set on doing just restructuring, though that was kind of like the one thing that I felt like held me back. Like restructuring was great all at the time. Maybe I didn't realize how big it is, but it felt pretty limiting. The first job out of school, so I started interviewing around. I spent a long time interviewing around, and I just kept meeting people and really feel like time pressure, and eventually someone told me most is looking to hire. So I entered their process. I met a few people and it just sounded like one. Obviously, I like the people that I met. There were nice people, and the generalist program, I think, was just sounded a little different than the Houlihan only restructuring program.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:25] That's fair. Was there a was there like an exploding offer from the human side that you felt like you just you didn't feel pressure on that? You felt like you'd land something?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:07:34] I didn't well, the offer was very nice, and the fact the fact that they're like, if you accept pretty quickly and I think some people in my class accepted that day, they're like, we'll give you an extra 10 grand or whatever it was. I don't remember, but we'll give you like a signing bonus. Then if you don't, I mean, it's still outstanding, but you just don't get the signing bonus. Got it. Ok, that's interesting. Yeah, I think I'd heard of that before.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:54] Ok, so you're kind of you didn't you obviously didn't sign right away. You thought, OK, I'm going to just. Try to I'm not sure if restructuring is where I want to be right at a school, maybe too little, too niche. I ended up actually I ended up restructuring at Rothchild. I don't know if you knew that from two to four. So I worked full time there for a few years and it's very it is very different. It's like longer engagements can be very complex in terms of you're dealing with some disaster companies with very complex bad balance sheets. But so we you're coming out of. You're interviewing you get the offer for multiple time and then basically senior year. That's it. You just accept and you kind of coast through your senior year. You finish early and. Is that accurate and you basically have six months and what do you what do you do in those six months you travel?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:08:41] Yeah, I did a little bit of travel. I think in the beginning of, I remember over new years and then I went with my parents to Hawaii. My father likes that place, so they took me. That was really nice. I did some other travel, I think, but otherwise I kind of hung around campus that was like researching. I was working on my own kind of stuff. I was enjoying, you know, the last semester of college. That was that was really it it wasn't like I was kind of getting ready because I had heard that most is a pretty intense place. I was like, you know, I might as well get some sleep now. I don't know if I really thought about it like that at the time, but it definitely in hindsight, I'm glad I took that time to just kind of enjoy that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:16] And so, yeah, you're a molas for a good two years. Tell me a little bit about those two years and the work you did there. It sounds like you did M&A or structuring capital markets. A whole variety of things, but I assume ours were 90 plus hours per week or, you know, at least 80 plus for most on average, scaling up to one 10 plus, I assume. Is that accurate?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:09:38] Yeah. Yeah, it was definitely a full time job and a half for sure.And do you did you tell me
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:45] About your experience because like you were pushing, you seem like you, you push pretty hard in undergrad. Maybe it was. Maybe school was easy for you. So it wasn't getting the super high gpa and doing so well wasn't so difficult for you.But tell me how that was, how school was so different from a full time job.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:10:04] Yeah, yeah, for sure. So one thing I'd also heard about Warren before I showed up is that it's cutthroat and there's like people putting all nighters.I never felt any of that at school. I never had to pull an all nighter once unless it was like for like social stuff, like a fraternity thing or whatever. Yeah.School was never like. I'd also taken accounting in high school, so a lot of the courses weren't that difficult or I had known them already. Yeah, but work. It wasn't that the work itself was hard. It was just I had to be in the office for so many hours and I had to like go through lines and lines of spreadsheets and like many, many slides and all this kind of stuff. A tremendous amount of stuff to do. And I was like so many deals in this and that. This time in the sleep and the mental sanity that was like the hardest part.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:45] Yeah, I know I was there with you, man sleeping. I had a pillow at my desk and I was sleeping in my IMD's office plenty of nights. So or like trying to get two hours of sleep and putting my phone on super loud so it would wake me up when somebody would ring or putting my back. Then we had we had blackberries, putting it on vibrate like near me, so it would wake me up. And so tell me, kind of as you progress through those two years, did you ever consider private equity? What were you thinking of as you were working this super long hours? Did you feel like, Hey, I need a break, I need to get out? Or were you feeling like this is really good for me? Tell me, tell me as you approach kind of as you were finishing up your one and then what your thought process was heading into your two like, I'm sure some people recruited for private equity right away, but I'd like to hear your thoughts.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:11:31] Yeah, yeah, so when I actually showed up, I came in pretty gung ho that I was going to leave like pretty soon and go to like pee or hedge funds. I was actually interviewing for those in college and full time, and I was considering doing that. Ultimately, I thought, you know, if I went to molas for two years and people told me, like, Yeah, you could go to a nice fun now. But if you do, like most one of these banks for a couple of years, your options are night and day. So I was pretty set on going on the buy side. I went through the recruiting process and I did a lot of networking and I met a lot of funds. I did all these final rounds and stuff, and at the end of the day, I was like, this really isn't that different than my current job? I mean, yeah, maybe the money was like significantly better, quicker. But at that point, I'm like, I'm making plenty of money now that I really don't have time to use. So I remember I pulled out of some processes and I came close to some others. And then eventually, before I left, I was actually pretty close to joining with the hedge fund. And I was like, it just doesn't I just wasn't too excited, I was like, If I stay here, I'm happy just to stay at. So did you end up getting any offers at it through the buy side recruiting or because you pulled out and you didn't have your heart in it, you didn't.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:39] You didn't end up with any offers.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:12:42] I think I was very close to one, and like I remember, I was discussing with the head on there on camp or things like that, and eventually I was like, You know, I'm just it was tough for me to say, I'm going to commit to another few years of doing this that I think was the hardest part for me. So I didn't.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:54] Did you feel like potentially there was something of a bias given like you probably had a ton of looks given your track record and more than top GPA molas, top bank working on a ton of deals, right? You're working on a ton of deals while you were there. Good transaction experience. Yeah. Yes, like you're probably getting a ton of looks, do you feel like? You are a little bit disillusioned, I mean, I know I was, I was, I was exhausted, I didn't know what to do. So private equity was almost like an escape for me. I ended up at a middle market shop called Tail One, which was like a 50 60 hour work week. So it was definitely a difference. Did you ever consider going like middle market or something less kind of intense?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:13:36] I did, yeah, but I don't know when I'd interfere with something you just didn't really excite me that much. Like, you know, also, especially when I had a good amount of savings piled up, I'm like, I might as well just do something that that does excite me since I've been working so hard for it, you know?Yeah. And so like. Tell me about
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:51] That thought process. Like, I think it's pretty rare because I think when people like looking at your background, it's almost like top of the class in high school, top of the class war, Wharton driving to Mola like to me, you seem exactly like the person that's like on that track, right? The track that everyone talks about, then to have kind of the alcoholic courage just to say just to step off, say, Well, I'm not going to go by side, I'm actually going to go travel for a few years. Tell me about that. Tell me about like the thought process behind that. You said you had some savings, so it gave you some comfort. Was there? I know when I was when I first jumped to private equity, I was burnt out, I end up getting fired from my first private equity job. Was there any sort of like burnout from after the two year because you were there for over two years, Melissa was there. Burnout was there like, I just need to breathe to just think of my next step because I've heard that from plenty of analysts. For sure, some of
BoutiqueBananas: [00:14:44] That and actually one of the ED, one of the directors I worked with, told me that he thought I could use some vacation actually at the time. Mollis is anyone that got invited to stay on for more than three years. They required you to remember to take a month off at least. So initially when I left, it was just kind of part of that program. I was like, Listen, you know, I'm staying. Let me at least just get a break, a breather, and then, you know, I'll come back or we'll see.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:07] So tell me, tell me how that yeah, how did that evolve? So you kind of went away for a month thinking you'd come back?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:15:12] Yeah, initially, I just kind of took a leave of absence somewhat in line with with the program they were doing at the time, I don't know what they're doing now, but at the time I remember one of the guys that became an associate like he took a month or two off and then came back. I don't remember exactly. Yeah. So initially it was just kind of a leave. And then eventually I was like, you know, I'm kind of happy here, so I extended the leave.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:31] Yeah, yeah. Fair. So, yeah, so tell me what you tasted your freedom and you're like, I'm not going back. Ok, so tell me a little bit about that. So where did you go? What were you thinking? You had family still in Jersey? I assume so. Like, were you living at home when you when you finished?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:15:48] You know, I actually went I went abroad to Israel, that was like something I thought about doing in college, but you know, I didn't really have the time or the money or like, you know, any family, any sort of like family, like, OK with it. So it was more of like, that was a good opportunity for me to kind of go explore a passion of mine.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:05] And so tell me what you did there. How was what was that like? I'd love to hear about it because you were there for how long? How long were you in Israel?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:16:11] I was there for a little over a year. I was learning in a yeshiva there. It was a really nice experience, you know, just kind of intellectual learning. The first thing I did, which was great, was get eight hours of sleep a night again. That was a lot of fun. Nice. That was like a pleasure. So I ate, well, you know, I slept well. I have family on Israel, so I took some time to see my grandparents out there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:32] Nice. So you were
BoutiqueBananas: [00:16:34] There? You were kind of. Yeah, you were studying. Technically, yeah, studying in a yeshiva is a little different than like a college, just because they weren't really great, it was more of like just learning to learn the material and get to know it and make new friends and all that kind of stuff.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:49] And how was that? Was it like socially really rewarding? Was it something where you felt like it was good for your soul? After some a couple of tough years, for sure.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:16:58] Yeah. And instead of instead of spreadsheets, I got to deal with actual people a little more often. That's awesome. So you're kind
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:05] Of finishing up that year in Israel and you're thinking of your next steps. What's going through your mind?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:17:12] Yeah, so, you know, it was time for me to come back. You know, my family really wanted me to come back and obviously I only had so much in savings. So I came back and then I started to look for a new job. And fortunately, I ended up getting another dig at Houlihan again. So it was really nice.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:26] Nice. And so you're back as an analyst with Houlihan.And then just doing a bunch of deals there. Tell me,how that progressed. And then specifically kind of your thought process of going back into banking and yeah, what was next? What you see is next for you?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:17:46] Yes, I was really just looking for a job. Obviously, you know, with the background in banking and finance degree, those are kind of the jobs that were a little. I was a more attractive candidate for.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:57] Was there a lot of skepticism, though? Like from a from a bank like the bank's perspective, like you want to come back like you took a while off where it was there, where they skeptical that you'd want to do it or no?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:18:10] I don't know. I mean, in my discussions with them, it was it was just kind of like, it's a lot of it was like off cycle people would stay like off cycle a little harder, like I wasn't on. I can't do like campus recruiting, which is a big cycle for the banks. I can't do like private equity on like recruiting, so I'll just really just applying to jobs like, I guess, like a more normal American. I don't know what to say, you know?Yeah, no, that's fair. Ok, so you're applying there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:36] Did you consider applying to private equity or any sort of anything like that or you still like you like? It sounds like you liked banking. You like the actual work. It was just more of a question of like lifestyle.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:18:47] Yeah, yeah, it was applying to banks, private equity hedge funds, I had plenty of interviews, a lot of things like it was more like one off things. It's like opportunities arise doing all that kind of stuff.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:58] And so did you have like a thought process of what you would prefer? Or it was just like anything in finance, just like you just get me a job coming back.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:19:05] Listen, I mean, everyone, everyone would, I think, prefer a job that you know, is better ours, better pay, more interesting work, better people. But you know, it's like those are a little more subjective to in some sense because. But ah, it depends how you budget the hours, what time of the day and all that kind of stuff. Weekends are what. So I was really just trying to find the best job I could get, but it was more like finding a job. I had no job.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:26] You know, it's interesting to me because, you know, with your background, I was surprised you weren't able to get. A lot of by side looks, even with the time you had taken off and maybe, maybe because it was a bit had been a little while. Maybe that's why I was a little bit. Maybe some recruiters were a little bit more like hesitant to put you in processes because it had been a while since most. But your background super impressive. So. So anyways, you worked in homeland for a while and then ended up. Did you end up kind of leaving there or thinking, I need a I need to do something new and then COVID hit? Or what's the what's the what's the latest and what are you looking for now?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:20:03] Yeah, so I actually got laid off, so not like the previous time, right, I kind of voluntarily left. And then since then I've really just been looking for a job and, you know, doing other things. Now I saw you guys have like the mentor thing. So I'm like, that's that can be a good opportunity. So yeah, and tell me about tell me about like
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:21] The layoff in terms of like what you think happened stuff like that. I know when I got laid off in private equity, my first private equity gig for me, it was, I think I went to the buy side and I was I was in one environment where, like, they told me when I could go to the bathroom, then I was put in another or there was no guidance at all. And I didn't make that transition well, and it ended up a year later. I also found out that the fund was kind of a lot of big bankruptcies coming, and so they went from 20 investment professionals down to like four. I'm. But tell me kind of what was what you think the what do you think happened over at Julian?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:20:56] Yes, I'm really not too sure. I mean, I'm still in touch with some of the people there a little bit. They just kind of one day called me into an office and said, we have to let you go and I'm like, Okay, okay. So I showed up and I got like the one book I had there or whatever, and I just kind of left it kind of like a weird thing.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): 00:21:16] Yeah, they didn't give you any sort of feedback. You didn't. You didn't try to seek any feedback, try to figure out what was going on. What was it like, deal flow related? Or was it something else? I mean, the person that the staffer
BoutiqueBananas: [00:21:26] Is a very nice guy. Yeah, I think he questioned whether I was really that interested. I get it. I mean, some of the some like the real like face time this that I don't know. Like, I mean, I did my best to do it, but I don't know. Like, there's a lot of like hazing stuff like maybe you understand, I see you're nodding. Yeah, I don't know. There's the bullshit.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:49] There's the bullshit turns at three. Yeah, there's the bullshit turns at three a.m. for a pitch book that's never going to see the light of day that you don't really need to be there for.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:21:56] Well, some of the hazing stuff, maybe I was like, you know, not not the best pledge college. I was a very good pledge. Or at least, you know, I think I was I tried to be a good pledge there. I was a little less focused on being the best pledge possible.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:09] There and. Why did you come back as an analyst? Why not come back in as associate? Have a little bit more. Were they not willing to give you an associate role?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:22:16] You know, the job I applied for, I think, was an associate job,But I think they they like, think people there on one of the one of my closest friends there told me that sometimes when people lateral whatever, they'll think that my year.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:28] Got it. So you were like more like a third year analyst or a second year analyst when you joined.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:22:32] They never really told me. They just said, You're an analyst. Here's your pay. So you got it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:37] Got it, got it. Ok, well. I appreciate the story, I think. Any thoughts in terms of like how kind of since since that, you know, it's been obviously 20 20 has been a tough year for a variety of reasons. Have you had a lot of looks coming out? I mean, with your background, I assume you're getting interviews or getting some looks. So tell me about like what? What's going on in there? Is there a lot of confusion around that? I know coming off of a layoff, I know for me when I was interviewing. It was incredibly tough. Because everyone said, well, what happened there? You know, I had to say something like, Oh, it's cultural, that it? I didn't know what was going on, I don't know why I was let go. I didn't know the true reason it happened to be. A year later, I ended up finding out that the fun was going under. But for sounds similar to you or you don't really know too much, maybe you felt like, OK, your heart wasn't in it. But have you thought about like what other types of roles could leverage your? Leverage your expertise, your financial kind of financial skill set. Like maybe Corp Dev Corp and something like that.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:23:56] Yeah. Yeah, it's basically a similar process that I ran before I got that Houlihan job. I'm really just applying to, You know, anywhere. Have you been
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:04] Getting have you been getting interviews? Have you been getting looks?
BoutiqueBananas: [00:24:06] Yeah, yeah, definitely. Plenty of interviews. No offers yet, but I'm working on the interviews, for sure. Cool. Cool.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:14] Well, any wisdom, any guidance given your past so far in terms of like pushing hard and high school college, doing being at a boutique for a couple of years. Any guidance you'd give to younger people that maybe were in a similar place, either in college or kind of the right out of school, any guidance you give them? Looking back at your path.
BoutiqueBananas: [00:24:37] No, no. I'm sure the smart kids, if they're actively dealing with you and researching and working, I'm sure they're fine.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:44] Okay, well, I appreciate your time. Let me know if I can be helpful. Let's stay in touch. Okay, man. Okay. Thanks, Patrick. Take care. And thanks to you, my listeners at Wall Street Oasis. If you have any suggestions whatsoever, please don't hesitate to send them my way. Patrick at Wall Street Oasis dot com.And till next time.
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