WSO Podcast | E203: WSO's Finance Research Internship | Weekly Meetup #5
Another fun sessions giving career advice to the WSO interns.
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WSO Podcast Episode 203 Transcripts:
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:06] Hello and.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:07] Welcome. I'm Patrick Curtis, your host and Chief Monkey. And this is the Wall Street Oasis podcast. Join me as I talk to some of the community's most successful and inspirational members to gain valuable insight into different career paths and life in general. Let's get to it. Another fun session giving career advice to the interns. Enjoy. So welcome to week number. I think five or six I can't keep track but of the weekly calls really appreciate all of you joining. We'll probably still have some stragglers coming in here in the next few minutes, but I'll try to keep letting them in as they as they come. Other than that, I think just for people, if this is their first week joining, if you want to. Quick questions in the chat about the internship, or even just raise your hand or unmute yourself. Feel free to go ahead. I think the group is small enough this week. We've got about 20 of us in here, 15, 20 of us. So if there's questions specifically around careers, your specific situation, the internship and in particular, even if you haven't started, I'm happy to answer those. So I guess we'll start it off by opening up questions about the internship in particular, anything that anyone is facing, any issues or any questions you have around the process there. Hi, Sagar. Welcome. You may have questions or everyone feels like they've gotten a good start. Just a reminder at the top of the at the intern group on the slack, there is an internship guy that has like step by step guidelines in terms of how to start in terms of all the things you need to do with hubstaff, tracking your hours, all that good stuff, and each has a question. So I'm going to unmute.You finish. Go ahead.
Intern 1: [00:02:03] Hi. Hello. Am I audible? Yeah, we can hear you. Yeah. So I'm basically going to start my internship on 15th of June. And, yeah, I just wanted to ask you if there's something some some prerequisites before I start the internship.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:02:28] Yeah, there's a set of things you should do prior to starting, but usually about two days before. We'll send you a reminder email and you can go in and there's. Are you a part of the Slack group right now?
Intern 1: [00:02:40] Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:02:41] So if you go there, everything you need is pinned at the top of the group. So there's an internship guy that has a step by step process of the things you need to do to get started. So it's like, step one, getting the hubstaff downloaded and watching the video in terms of how to do it. And that's usually a good place to start to get your feet under you. So you kind of know even how to begin because I know it can be a little confusing the first time you start on your first topic.
Intern 1: [00:03:06] Yeah. So nothing except for the internship Gatorade.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:09] Nothing except for that. Yeah. And there's submission checklists and stuff like that. But you can start with the internship guide and kind of that'll get you to a good place.
Intern 1: [00:03:17] Okay. Okay. Thank you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:19] And that's it? Yeah. I will send you an email a couple of days prior to your start date. Answer your question. Help them say.
Intern 2: [00:03:30] Hi. How are you? Supplied. Okay. So I wanted to ask like if I have four topics which is not mentioned in the tracker project, so how do I add those topics?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:43] So we'd like you to stick with the topics that are there initially. If you do have ideas for topics to add, you would just message Nabeel. Nabeel is out this week, so it's a little harder, but if you have ideas for new topics, we're open to that. But we'd like to get those just approved first before we do that, because the risk being we don't want you writing on a topic that's very similar to one that's already kind of set or one that's in there if it's completely new or different or it's something that we don't have a lot of stuff on, we'll probably say yes if it's interesting.
Intern 2: [00:04:15] So should I email another? Yeah, you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:18] Can email Nabeel or just send him a slack. He probably won't get back to you till next week though, because he's off on vacation. So if you want to start on one that's there and then send him a slack send him slack message to saying, hey, I'm really interested in writing about these three topics or these two topics. That's totally fine.
Intern 2: [00:04:37] Okay. Thank you. You're welcome.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:40] Any other questions about the internship in general? Then we get to the fun stuff, which is the more career oriented questions, which I hope there's I hope there's some. We had a fun discussion last week about MBA versus MSF versus all this stuff meshes on here. Bms works works with full time now. You're also welcome to ask questions if you have any.
Intern 3: [00:05:07] I wanted to share a quick reminder about the hubstaff activity levels. Oh, okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:13] Yeah. Oh, that's yeah. A good point. In terms of some people have expressed concern over the hubstaff activity levels. This is not like the primary thing we're looking at at all. It's just a way to make sure that that there is some activity there. And what's going to matter more is if you're engaged in terms of like putting out content, asking questions and articles and the quality of the articles. So we don't want people rushing through and just putting out whatever comes through, whatever comes to their mind. We want them to properly research the topics so that when you are starting to write, finally there's a good outline there. You have the header tags placed and the quality is is high so that there's, there's less kind of back and forth with the editors. So I think. In that sense, the activity level is just just a way for us to make sure there's some activity going on there, that there's no set level you need to be at. It's just a question of like if it's super, super low and there's like hours and hours going by, then that would be a concern.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:15] But it shouldn't be an issue even if you're researching and reading online about a topic. So I think there was some concern over that. I know when people initially see how staffers start out the first time, it can be a little bit. For some people, it can be a little bit like, oh, I don't. What does this mean? What are the expectations? I think last week or the week prior said that as long as there's a decent cadence of content coming out and that could be one article anywhere between it's a shorter one, probably 2 to 3 hours. If it's a longer one, it could be upwards of 7 hours. And we're not going to say, oh, my gosh, that took too long. If it's if it's higher quality and you did a lot of research and it's a longer form article, we don't have a problem with that. Welcome, Felix. Welcome, Christian. So. Yeah. Any other questions about our VMs? Thanks for the reminder. Anything else that I think I needed to address? Now. I think I saw another hand up. I wasn't sure. Did I miss it?
Intern 3: [00:07:18] I think you can also let them know that they need to use the desktop app because I think a few might be confused.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:24] Yes, it's for Hubstaff in terms of tracking your hours. So you get credit for them and you get all.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:29] The.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:30] Rewards alongside it. Make sure you're using the desktop app for that, not the mobile app or the browser app. Please use the desktop one that's that keeps everybody on the same thing. We get the same data coming in so we can track it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:45] So track it better. So that's.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:49] That's it. Welcome, Alvin.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:51] Welcome.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:53] I think it's. Any question, any other questions around the internship or anything else you think I should cover?
Intern 3: [00:08:03] I think everything else is covered in the internship, and there's no other concerns that anyone has expressed. Okay. Great.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:13] So if there's anything else, we got about 20 of us now, so I'll just open it up. You can put a question in the chat. Anything specific around? I can spend another 20 minutes or more here with all of you answering questions about specific careers, specific degrees, specific interview preparation, networking, what have you. Yeah, Liam, go ahead.
Intern 4: [00:08:38] So I guess the first part is a little bit of add or to kind of tell other interns in the second part of the question. But I had an interview this morning like a first person interview at a middle market bank for investment bank and some analyst role. And basically, like a lot of the interview was spent talking about what I do at Wall Street. So I just figured that other interns know that like this is really valuable to have. Like, I would say like 20 to 30% of the interview was really just talking about what I do here. And the second question this is just to Patrick would be I think I did well in this. It was on Zoom, the first interview where I think I'll be brought in for a super day. That's kind of what I was getting from the interviewer. So I guess kind of had obviously like I have an idea of how to prepare for the technical and behavioral questions, but just kind of you can kind of go over like interview adequate, especially for like a super day. Like kind of like what are you where like, how would you like introduce yourself? Like, I don't know, just kind of like your advice for like interview adequate. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:40] I'm just changing my name here on the things people know that I'm the. My name is Patrick. Just in.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:46] Chief.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:46] Monkey here. So. Yeah, good question. First off. Yeah, thanks for for calling that out. People, we've heard from interns in the past that entire interviews have been about the Wall Street experience. And I'll tell you why that often happens is because it's different. It's because they want to know, like, oh, what's that? They know Wall Street is from the community, so they're curious. So that's the good news is you can talk about like the work you did, you can talk about the financial modeling courses you took, you can talk. So it really makes it like a more fun, friendly discussion rather than drilling you on technicals. So hopefully that's that'll help me and hopefully the rest of the people here will, will experience the same thing you did in terms of interview etiquette. I would be business formal. So sorry. There was like a loud motorcycle here when you were saying something about like the middle market bank. It was a first round at what bank.
Intern 4: [00:10:34] It was like along the lines of like RBC and BMO. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:39] So. It's a good bank, so I think it's going to be pretty down the fairway. So you'll probably want to in terms of like interview etiquette. Definitely, I'd say business formal, wear a tie, be clean shaven, don't be like me with a white beard. You can have a beard, but probably better just to play it safe. Be conservative, be clean, you know, show up really early. Um. Are you close to where you'll be interviewed?
Intern 4: [00:11:10] Yeah. My schools. It's. My school's, like, 40 minutes away on the subway.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:16] You may want to do that trip once prior, just to get a sense of where you can go. I'd arrive like a good hour or an hour and a half prior to the thing does mean check in, but get right next to where you need to be. Go to a coffee shop and study your resume and your materials and your answers.
Intern 4: [00:11:36] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:38] Just so there's no nothing could happen. There can't be something in the subway, breaks the bus, nothing. It's if that happens, you're ready and you can get an Uber or you can do whatever and you're not rushed and stressed about that. You want to be in a good spot. Come play when you're when you're going in. So in terms of. Etiquette, do you mean? Like how to come into the room and stuff like that?
Intern 4: [00:12:01] Yeah, just because I've really never had, like, an in-person interview before. I've only had Zoom interviews. Yes. I think just.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:08] A good, strong handshake, eye contact. When you first meet people. Great to meet you. Thanks so much for the opportunity. You know, kind of like standard. Don't get. Don't give them flimsy handshake. Give them a strong handshake and look them in the eyes. Yeah. I think in terms of knowing if you're doing anything odd is important. So I think actually when is the when is the super day?
Intern 4: [00:12:33] If I were to here, if I were to get into this super day, like invited to it, it would be two weeks from now.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:37] So, yeah, you have time. So what I would do is. Record yourself. So get on a Zoom chat and hit record and literally just start pretend like somebody just gave you go through the interview. Course from that interview course on. So literally just start going through the basic questions and answering them. Pretend like you're talking to somebody. Or even better, get somebody on there to, like, ask them to you. So you feel like it's a little bit more face to face. Record yourself, record your whole upper body to see what you're doing with your hands. See if there's any if you're doing weird things with your head or your little things like that, just so you can be aware of it. Are you saying, you know.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:18] You know.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:20] You start picking up on patterns like that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:22] Mm hmm.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:23] So I just said, see.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:26] So if you start if you.
Speaker2: [00:13:27] Start picking up on little cues you're doing in terms of filler words, it's really helpful to to hear it, hear the recording back and say, where could I tighten that up? Where could that have been better? And that's really important for how you're mapping your behavioral and fit questions. So a lot of people will focus on the technical questions because they're nervous about it. But what can make or break you in the interview is really the standards, like why do you want to be an investment banker? So and knowing that these behavioral questions, it's a lot more about what examples you're pulling in rather than a generic, because I can learn a lot from smart people.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:07] Right.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:09] Which is fine. The answer is good. But I think being more specific around like tell me about a time when you struggled with leadership or you disagreed with leadership. What did you do? Tell me about a time when you had a conflict with a group. What did you do? Tell me about a time when these are like tough questions, but so what you need to have in the next two weeks, you need to make sure that you have specific stories from your past, from this internship, from other internships, from schoolwork that you can map to those questions. So as soon as they start asking you one of these like weird behavioral questions of like, what would you do and what would you do specifically if you disagreed with your superior or you didn't agree with somebody, you you are already in your head thinking, I'm going to bring in this story. I'm going to bring in this example.
Intern 4: [00:14:56] All right.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:57] So it's not so if you have to, you can give the generic answer. If you don't have a story that can map. But almost always you want to point to a story where you had that experience and how you dealt with it and why you think it would be a skill you develop that you feel like is relevant to the to the position and can help you. So I think that's probably the best bet is actually doing those Mocs mock interviews because it's going to I know it's a pain, but sitting there and doing like, let's say in the next two weeks doing five mock interviews, if you're six, time is going to be your best time, definitely your six time doing the answering. The question is almost guaranteed going to be your best time. So like if this is a really important job and really important interview for you, don't you shouldn't you put in those 5 hours in the next two weeks.
Intern 4: [00:15:45] Yeah, especially this is my last week. Wsoc.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:48] Yeah, that's it. That's it, man. Like this is. This is it. This is the whole reason you did this internship. So, like, go in with going with the, like, really these next two weeks. And if you want it, if you want to send me through like what your what your stories are and the examples you're using, I can kind of give a thumbs up, thumbs down on them over email. Hey, here are the ten stories I'm pulling for. Showing leadership, showing I can work long hours showing all this stuff.
Intern 4: [00:16:20] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:20] So, like, when they ask, what makes you think you can do this? You know what the hours are like, right? If they ask you a question like that or like, what makes you think you can handle these hours? You don't say, like, I'm a really hard worker. I've always been really hard worker. You say, Well, you know, just as an example, last semester I had a full time this. I did an internship, I did this, I worked, I supported myself through that. That's what you want to do? You want to build list those those things out rather than it being. I'm a hard worker and I'm going to outwork everyone. Yeah, show them. Don't tell them that. You always want to do that. And always at the end that you tie back about how this skill set feels, makes you feel like you're really prepared for this this position, and you understand what you're getting into.
Inter 4: [00:16:59] I also used the WSO interview guide and that's helped a lot to. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:05] So just really study that in terms of map but don't like the example answers in there. Don't just say the same thing. You obviously have to map it to your area. You have to map it to your own experiences. The technicals you can pretty much stick with on that, but understand the concepts about like the flying of the through the three statements like what happens if depreciation goes up $10? Yeah, you got to know that. You've got to know that one. That's very common. You gotta understand working capital. If a R goes up ten days, what's going on? You know what I mean? That type of stuff. Let's get to some other people here. Emmett, I think, has had his hand up for a while. I met you on two.
Intern 5: [00:17:43] Shoot your question. I've asked, how are you? I'm doing okay. Thanks for your advice. Last week I managed to get one offer, so really grateful for your help.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:54] Awesome. I can't even remember. What did we talk about?
Intern 5: [00:18:01] I think I think it was just kind of advice about, you know, if I get two offers, how should I approach it?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:06] Should I say, oh, yes, I remember now. Yes, yes.
Intern 5: [00:18:09] Yes. I got one. I haven't heard from the rest. I'm not too optimistic. But look, I've got one that can start in June. So really really that to help anyway. My question was regarding the regarding the internship that we're doing now, I think you'd agree that when the bullet points that you put down under the experience to lessen your CV, it's you know, it's pretty good advice to put down metrics, stuff that can measure the impacts that you had on the in the role that you had. So would you have any advice on which what kind of numbers and metrics we could use to produce internships? You know, obviously the number of articles could be one example, but maybe page hits, increase in viewership, etc., etc.. Are there any sort of metrics there that we could use?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:00] Yes, absolutely. I put in a link to the chat right now that has an example of how to put it on your CV. In there. I quantify say wrote 50,000 plus words across 20 articles on detailed financial blah, blah, blah. And in there I say research appropriate subtitle developed examples to help with search engine optimization, resulting in a 30% month over month growth to the new resources section of the site over 200 hours of self-study. So there's a lot of quantification in those bullets. Um. That, I think, looks really strong. So I have some stuff in there. We have seen significant growth in the resource section, which are where these these articles are going. So you can use that as part of it wasn't all you. Obviously it's the full team, but you can use that as as a specific for showing numbers.
Intern 5: [00:19:48] Okay. I was. You includes maybe received training from Wall Street Oasis on financial modeling.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:54] Oh, yeah, that's all in there. I just sent the link in the chat. It has all that there. You should absolutely say that.
Intern 5: [00:20:00] Okay. Is this. This isn't Snapchat. Is this. Yep.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:03] It's at the top of the Snapchat. But I also just posted it into the chat.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:06] Of the.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:07] The group here.For people.
Intern 5: [00:20:09] I don't think I can say it, but look, I look in the slot. Thanks for your help there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:14] Yeah, no worries. I'm pretty sure it's in the slack, right? Yeah, it's at the top. It's called. So, internship example. It's I would I would do something very close to that. The only difference is if you want to make it just the top.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:26] Two bullets.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:27] And even make the financial modeling and valuation courses it's own. Like if you need to fill up more space, you could take that and put it under like skills, a skill section near the bottom as like or even education if you really wanted to be more aggressive in terms of. Highlighting your financial modelling and valuation skills. I would recommend for somebody who's like a liberal arts major potentially to do that, to really like if you're a history major or something like that and you really want to show finance on your resume so you have a shot at getting more interviews, that's a good way to do it.
Intern 5: [00:20:59] Perfect. Thanks very much.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:00] Yeah, no worries. Let's see who else had their hand up? Alvin, you want to?
Intern 6: [00:21:07] I like the wall. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, it's my. It's my favorite animal, like, I. It represents me in kind of. Oh, okay. So first of all.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:20] You'll know what to answer when they ask you in an interview. What animal would you be? If you're going to say, Wolf.
Intern 6: [00:21:27] Yeah, exactly.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:31] I was going to ask you.Why right after, but you don't have to answer that now.But go ahead.
Intern 6: [00:21:34] So thank you for having me here. Actually, this is my first major call and I'll be starting my internship actually on the 5th of May because this week I just finished with my exams.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:50] Congrats.
Intern 6: [00:21:51] Yeah, I'm a third year finance student and I'll be graduating next year. So I have three question. Three questions. My first question is for this internship. I wanted to know, like whenever we are writing an article, which from which resource should we take our in order to write the articles from which a resource should be like do some research Google.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:25] Primarily Google, you should be looking at what what other articles on the topics are ranking at the top. So if you look in the top of the the top of the Slack group that you're in, the internship guide, we actually have a video going through exactly how to do the research. Mm hmm. We even have a video where we do an example, and Nabeel and I go through it and we ask questions like, okay, what will we do next? What's the next header? What's the next section? How do we build out this outline before we even start writing? So I would watch that because it's going to make make things much clearer.
Intern 6: [00:22:54] All right. So like given like for me in my course, I did some modules on financial markets and financial like M&A. So I can also use some of my knowledge, right? Like whenever I'm.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:08] Yeah, that's great. That's why we have a lot of finance majors, internship.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:12] And people.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:13] In accounting, major accounting majors who can go in and help us with the accounting terms and topics and stuff like that. So yeah, for sure you could definitely use your knowledge. What I would suggest though is don't just lean on your knowledge because it's not about like academic writing or knowledge per se. It's also about how you're structuring the article and how you're structuring things such that a visitor finds it easy to follow. So like breaking it down, showing examples. So like I think the example in the, at the top of the internship is cash conversion, cash conversion cycle. So it's not just like what the definition of cash conversion like is like. Here's an example, here's another example, you know, stuff like that.
Intern 6: [00:23:55] All right.
Intern 6: [00:23:56] Okay. So in my second question is.
Intern 6: [00:23:58] Soon after graduation.
Intern 6: [00:24:00] I'm planning to.
Intern 6: [00:24:02] Work for one or two years, after which I would allow I would like to do a master's in finance since.
Intern 6: [00:24:09] I'm planning to get into investment banking.
Intern 6: [00:24:11] In the top firms. So I wanted to know if doing an MSC is a good option or should I do CFA or keep working?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:23] If you're looking for investment banking, I would push you towards the masters in finance and not the CFA. If you're looking to be in the markets, meaning hedge fund asset management equity research, then I would push you to the CFA. So really it depends what you're trying to if you're trying to do mergers and acquisitions, valuation type work. The CFA is where you want to go or spend your time.
Intern 6: [00:24:44] Like for me personally, I'm very passionate about like M&A, investment banking.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:50] Don't do the CFA, do the masters, do the masters in finance or even better. Try to break into an investment bank prior to a small boutique investment bank. Get that experience. Experience it before deciding to go spend £50,000 on a master's or so. Let's say I'm I don't know. I assume I don't know where you are, but a lot of people head to London for like LSE or they go, yes.
Intern 6: [00:25:12] An even I'm thinking to go to London like in. I was thinking in business school because I'd be graduating in Australia. So yeah, since I'd be graduating in 2023, maybe I could work for one and a half year and then go for.
Intern 6: [00:25:30] My masters in.
Intern 6: [00:25:31] Like end of 2025, like after getting like one two year experience.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:36] Yeah. You're in Australia you said.
Intern 6: [00:25:38] Yeah, yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:39] Yeah. I mean can.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:40] You.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:41] Get a position as an. You don't think it's possible for you to get a position as an analyst or an intern at a small boutique bank locally.
Intern 6: [00:25:49] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:49] Is that possible?
Intern 6: [00:25:51] Oh, yeah. Like we have.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:53] Like you said, work, work 1 to 2 years. I get the sense that you're aiming for jobs that are not banking for some reason.
Intern 6: [00:26:00] I don't know. I guess I'm thinking to work, let's say, like a finance analyst or junior equity research analyst, since we will be getting to your post, your work. Right.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:11] That's great. Yeah, those are relevant. But why wouldn't you apply for analyst programs coming out of uni as well? Or are you? Like some banking analyst roles. You're going to apply for those two as to.
Intern 6: [00:26:27] Okay. So if I'm planning to get into. Investment banks right after graduation, you'd suggest me to apply for investment rules instead of financial analysts. So that's what you mean?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:37] No, I mean, imply apply for investment banking analyst rules. A finance analyst usually. Maybe it's different Australia. But finance analysts, you usually think of like corporate finance type work. But if you can work for an investment bank like Macquarie, Macquarie, I don't know how to say.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:54] It.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:55] But. Um. They have a big office there right in Sydney I believe.
Intern 6: [00:27:00] But yeah. In Sydney.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:02] Yeah. So like. That should be your target. For sure.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:07] You should be.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:08] Pounding down the door now, working like a maniac to try and get an interview there for the analyst roles. It might be a little too late because you're third year, but there may be small banks in Sydney and Melbourne that are just two MDs or two partners and an associate and they may want an analyst. And you say, Hey, I'll work for I'll work for very cheap because I just want to get the experience you work for there for a year or two, then you start and during that time you're, you're networking with people at Macquarie and you keep telling them, Hey, I'm available if you guys ever need me, I'm available. Boom, you lateral after a year they're.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:44] Into.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:45] Into the big bank. You don't need a masters in finance. Suddenly you just saved yourself £50,000.
Intern 6: [00:27:53] Okay. Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:55] You're in your investment banking. You're doing what you want to do. It doesn't mean you don't go there for optionality value later. It doesn't mean you can't still go because maybe you'll start doing invest banking. You'll get promoted straight to associate after three years because you're really good. And then suddenly you're saying, Hey, wait a second, this isn't for me. Then that's when that's when I feel like business, school and MBA and SMSF is actually a nice reset for us. So what you want to do now?
Intern 6: [00:28:21] Now? Yeah. Yeah. All right. Thank you for you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:25] If you strike out if you strike out all the other jobs that you said you should be applying for those as well, because equity research valuation analysts working at a big four under transaction advisory services, these are all great related careers and roles that can lead to where you want to go. You get those transaction advisory services to groups at the Big Draw. You. Have you heard of those?
Intern 6: [00:28:50] Um, I was looking for Jp morgan and Goldman Sachs.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:56] What were you going to do for them? The.
Intern 6: [00:28:59] I don't know. I was just trying to look a bit on the positions, like some of the requirements. I was just doing a small research.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:07] Yeah. So what I would always say. Is go to a smaller name where the work is more relevant to where you want to be rather than just chasing the name early on. So go get evaluation work at a big four which is respected. Go get it. Has a name, but it's not like like the KPMG. People be like, Oh, it's KPMG. But if you're doing valuation work and you're working at transaction advisory services, guess who the banks look to when suddenly they're there to analysts leave and they're like, the search group leaves and they're like, Oh, we need to hire an analyst now. Like and then.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:41] Like.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:41] Where do they pull? They pull straight from that group. How good it is. And then they're going to know you because you're going to be having read the networking course and you'll be already having talked to them, letting them know that you're interested.
Intern 6: [00:29:53] Exactly. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:54] They're going to know. And so because jobs aren't posted. People need to realize this group. And in general, 90% of the jobs are never promoted. They're never posted. So you're not going to you can't be like scouring their site, looking at the jobs and like dropping your resume, thinking you're going to get a job. It's the worst way to go about getting a job. It's. Whoo hoo! Do you have a relationship? Do you know any analyst there? Are you graduating with anybody who actually gets a job at a career at KPMG or TWC or wherever? Are you staying in touch with them? Are you being helpful to them? Right. I feel like I'm talking to a wolf, but that's okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:34] Thanks, Alvin. Yeah. Thank you. So. Yeah. Yeah. Good luck. Yeah. Thank you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:41] Let's see. Let me see the chat. I haven't answered any questions. Well, there's a lot.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:45] Okay.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:50] Raghav. Thanks for the kind words. Um. Chris said, Oh yeah, this is a private message. Yeah, you can just approach Victor from Fidelity. Just yeah, I'd say, you know, say you're an intern for us. If he doesn't. If he doesn't help you out, I'll kill him. So just tell. Tell me if he doesn't respond to you. I'm just kidding. Here we go. Ahmed asks. Interesting question. What do you think is better to a financial analyst position, a CFA or a CPA? Most corporations prefer CPAs over CFA in such positions. Cpa. So CFA is again, like I mentioned before, it's really more if you're going to be working in the markets. So like hedge fund asset management. So like anything around the stock market, the bond market options trading, stuff like that is very well respected there. If you're working in like a financial division within a company. Yes, the CPA, an accountant, it tends to be a little bit more valued. But CPA is often also overkill, as is the CFA for front office investment banking roles. It's a huge time commitment, so just depends on where you want to go. I'm like, I don't know. Like financial analyst position, it can mean like 50 different things. So it depends what you mean by financial analyst position. If it's at a corporate at a Fortune 500, it's different. There's there's like rotation programs, a lot of like these large companies like FP and Rolls, what they call it, corporate development, FDP. Financial leadership development programs are a great place to be. They give you a taste of like all the different divisions of the company. Some are very well respected. So I'm at I need more a little bit more info in terms of like the question because it kind of just depends what you're going after. Cpa obviously, or CPA way, way better for like if you want to do something in tax audit accounting, especially for the big four, they love the CPAs. So it's it's probably the safer.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:55] Of.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:55] The two degrees, but it's a huge investment of time. So kind of tough because you got to know what you want to do in five, ten years. In someone remove our assigned tag from any type of tracker and write that topic. It is. Is it possible? Sara. I'm not sure I understand the question. Are you saying can someone change if you've already assigned it to yourself? I don't think most people should be the only one who can do that, but I'm not sure I understand the question if you want to clarify it in the chat. Today as an interesting question. What do you think is the best way to break into consulting? And just like any job, the best way to break into any job is really just knowing the right people and getting into the right programs and hearing about jobs that aren't marketed the best, the easiest easier than that in terms of like not having to talk to people. It's going to a top target school and being on campus recruiting so that you get high grades. You study your case consulting, case interview prep really well. We have a consulting case interview prep course you can get for free if you with the hours you put in this internship. If you study that, you'll be ready for like how to structure your cases, your thinking, your your consulting math. So you could do you can do all that prep. But really to get the interviews out, like in McKinsey, Bain, BCG, even Oliver women, these other top consulting firms, you need to you need to be networking. You need to be talking with people. Of course, there are like cultural differences depending on what country you're.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:30] In.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:31] And how how networking is looked upon by. At least here in the US, you can be pretty aggressive and get a lot more opportunities if you're building out that network.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:41] Um.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:42] Happy to answer more specific questions tonight if you have.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:44] If you have them.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:46] Now let's see here. Macquarie. Thank you. Yeah, I meant I always, I always think of it in five different ways to have heard it so many different ways. Ahmed. Ahmed said more in the trade analyst positions. Trade analyst positions like at a bank. You mean so like you're settling trades and stuff.
Intern 6: [00:35:09] Similar to BNP Paribas?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:12] Um hum. So like, what's the role of financial analysts? But like, what? What's the job.Description?
Intern 6: [00:35:16] So like managing clients, portfolio, stock market analysis in this type of position.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:25] Cfa, CFA for that. Yeah. Cfa for that all day. Is that what the question was, CPA or C. Yeah, I would say CFA would be looked on more highly there because it's giving you a really nice view of the whole markets and you're going to understand options. You're going to stay on trading, you understand portfolio diversification, you're going to send all that stuff. That's really important, especially speaking to clients. Yeah, especially you want to move up. They won't let you speak to clients.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:47] You start.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:49] But as you move, if you want to move up, you're going to need to do that.
Intern 6: [00:35:53] And I have one more question. So basically, I'm based in Canada, Montreal. I was thinking, what do you think is better Bay Street or New York if it's. Like Toronto or New York as a position. Where to start.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:11] Where to start? New York.
Intern 6: [00:36:13] Okay?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:14] For sure. If you can get it. Right. But like, you know, I think the visas from Canada aren't as hard.
Intern 6: [00:36:21] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:23] So you can get it. Absolutely. Go for New York, but getting a job in Toronto is not easy either.
Intern 6: [00:36:28] Yeah, that's my issue. Like I'm trying to apply for a lot of positions, but like, they always look at a lot of experience. In a way like they want you to be a new graduate, but like, you have.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:43] To tell me your background and I can give you more specifics. So what did you graduate?
Intern 6: [00:36:47] Finance, banking and finance. My undergrad is a BBA and I have a Graduate Diploma in Business Administration Focus Management. So it's like I'm one in the French system as a master's one, and I have my investment funds, Canada, which lets me deal with mutual funds and in any bank or financial institution. And I was planning on taking like I have my CFA level one exam in August.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:20] So and you want to get into like private wealth management or asset management for.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:24] Clients in the banks. That's the goal.
Intern 6: [00:36:29] Basically like any trade analyst position.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:34] So. The CFA I think is a good step. All the other stuff, it's just confusing. To the HR people and all that stuff. So you're not going to get anywhere because they they have a certain person they want coming out of undergrad with a set boxes. You're outside that box.
Intern 6: [00:37:50] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:50] Do you understand? Like, they're not even thinking, like, what? This guys graduated a long time ago. He has this master's, but they don't know where to put you. Yeah, so they just throw your resume away.
Intern 6: [00:38:00] Anyway.Yeah
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:01] So like, that's what's going to keep happening. So how do you get around that?
Intern 6: [00:38:05] I'm trying, like, let's say, to minimize my experience, everything on LinkedIn, just keeping it. What's the job description that I'm applying for in a position?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:17] But are you applying directly? That's good. But are you applying directly just through LinkedIn and stuff like that in online?
Intern 6: [00:38:23] No, I'm connecting with the the one who landed the post at first, then the like without me filling the application. They tell me that we're going to do an interview with you. Great. But like I always pass the first one. But the second one is the most like they start telling me that like here in Montreal, they tell me that you don't speak French. It's a reason why you can continue.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:38:49] So why don't you go to Toronto?
Intern 6: [00:38:51] Because I finished this summer in my degree, the Masters. So after I finish it, I'm going back because I'm an Ontario resident. So I was born in Ottawa. You can just.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:01] Say. You can just say. So start applying for jobs in Toronto, I think is the answer.
Intern 6: [00:39:08] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:10] Yeah. Start applying for jobs in Toronto, in New York. You know, don't don't limit yourself to just just because you're there, you know?
Intern 6: [00:39:17] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:18] Yeah. I think that's the that's the key. I think you're doing smart things. You're not just like mass applying. Yeah. To like everything. You're being targeted. If you're getting past the first round, that's good. But like, if you know, you don't speak French, you're going to be kind of shit out. If that's a requirement, you're going to be shit out of luck in the second.
Intern 6: [00:39:36] Like in Quebec, it's mandatory. If you don't speak French, you can't work.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:40] Yeah. So you should just be. Forget Montreal.
Intern 6: [00:39:43] Yeah. I'm just, like, waiting until I finish this summer. My degree. And that's.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:47] It. I wouldn't wait. I'd start applying now because it's soon. Like You don't want to be coming into your degree and you have no job.
Intern 6: [00:39:56] Yeah, of course.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:57] So I'd be applying now to places in Toronto. I'd be doing 10 to 20 applications, 2010 to 20 applications. But with the with the short message, be like, I just applied for this role. I'd love to chat over phone, you know, I'd love.
Intern 6: [00:40:09] To, yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:10] Blah blah. Doing kind of what you're doing with the reducing your LinkedIn. So it's a little bit more tailored.
Intern 6: [00:40:16] Yeah. And I also like used to do the coffee interview like, like let's go to the coffee shop, you can speak. And so it used to work but like not everyone is like open to such, such a thing and we're like.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:33] Oh no way. Yeah, if you can get one out of 30 people that go meet your coffee, that's good. That's a good ratio. That's a good ratio.
Intern 6: [00:40:44] Yeah. It was a bit hard at first, but like now I'm a bit used to that. But like I'm always trying to book connections making. I don't want to like.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:40:54] How many connections you have on LinkedIn? I'm checking, so you better not lie to me.
Intern 6: [00:40:57] Okay. I have like 72. My LinkedIn account is like I created, I think five months ago.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:06] I see you. Yeah. Okay, so way too narrow. You should have over 500 connections by next week.
Intern 6: [00:41:15] And I'm trying, but, like, I don't mean.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:18] Like, literally 30 seconds.
Intern 6: [00:41:21] Yeah, I know, but I don't want to add any any person that is out of the field. I'm trying to add I'm going to make it like Taylor Howard only finance. Professionals.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:33] Yeah, but what's stopping you from running a search? Seeing everybody in Toronto that's in private wealth management, asset management, whatever, and adding them, be like, Hey, Dad, I'd love to. I see that you work in Toronto and I'm looking to make the move in a few months. But once I graduate with my masters, I'd love to chat at some point.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:50] In the future.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:50] Just starting to get those connections. You could send out 100 of those messages, probably 10 to 15 of them. We'll accept.
Intern 6: [00:41:57] Yeah. Lately I've been a bit lazy about this specific thing on LinkedIn because, well, you have this.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:04] You have this.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:05] Internship, you have school.
Intern 6: [00:42:09] Yeah. And I also have another job. So with the university. Yeah. So it's a bit like I have a full schedule, so. Yeah. So.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:19] I hate to say it, but that takes priority.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:21] Over.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:22] Everything.
Intern 6: [00:42:24] I'm trying. Like I added, let's say like next year I'm going to be in the field. I will secure a job.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:33] Yeah, but so like, my whole point is 74 connections over 4 to 5 months. Like, you can get 74 connections a day. Not not a day. That's not true. Because there's LinkedIn will stop you after like 100 ish to 150 requests a day. Yeah, but you could send about six 700 connection requests per week, of which you'll probably get 100. Yeah, in a week.
Intern 6: [00:42:57] I'm going to start doing that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:59] I need to read the networking course once you can from the from the site. Like, that's the most important thing. It's the most important skill. People downplayed it. They hate networking, but it's like it's really that's what matters because you're going to hear about jobs that don't aren't posted. And suddenly, like, you're just going to be able to get more phone calls, you're going to get more coffee chats and you speak well. There's nothing to be afraid of.
Intern 6: [00:43:21] Yeah, of course.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:22] So, like, you're nothing to be afraid of. It's just a question of just putting in the time, like, literally just carve out 30 minutes a day.
Intern 6: [00:43:27] And that's all I should to do that. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:30] It's like anything, man. It's like with the way you put in the work, it'll. The dividends will come. But that's that's an important place to.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:36] Put.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:36] Put put work in because with graduation in three months or however many months it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:42] Is.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:43] You want to have that network established, not when you're unemployed. Or you're unemployed.
Intern 6: [00:43:50] Yeah. The good thing about the degree that I'm doing now, is that it? Let's let's say it helps me avoid the over qualification because not a lot of people consider as a master's, but they consider it as a graduate study.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:07] So it's it's seen as a more junior credential.
Intern 6: [00:44:09] Yes, in a way. That's why, like I got multiple offers for Masters and I got accepted in, like good business schools in Canada. But, like, I prefer I prefer to choose this one because. It gives me, let's say, a bit of knowledge in the Canadian market, but it wasn't over qualified.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:27] Yeah, not smart. It's really smart. Now you just need to. Now you just need to get out of your own head and start talking to more people. You started doing it, it sounds like. But then you kind of like. Got busy.
Intern 6: [00:44:38] Yeah. Anyway, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:40] Just make sure it's priority because that's the thing that'll really pay dividends and most likely to get you interviews. In Toronto where you don't need a know French.
Intern 6: [00:44:49] Thank you a lot.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:51] Good luck, man. You keep us updated. I'm curious where you end up. Some people still straggling in here. Hey, pass. M.a.. Yeah. Liam says use a free month of LinkedIn premium. Good advice, Liam. Um. Who has your hand up, Felix? You've had your hand up for a while. How are you? Where? Where in the world are you feeling?
Intern 7: [00:45:18] Hi there. Nice to meet you. Hopefully I'm in London at the moment, actually. Looks like San Francisco behind you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:25] You look like you're close to me.
Intern 7: [00:45:29] I put that filter on. Yeah. No, I'm not starting yet with you guys till I get back home to Australia. But I just wanted to jump in and say hello and I like this. It's a good little coaching session from you. Thank you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:39] Yeah, it's fun. Yeah. If you have any questions, once you start or for personal career stuff, I'm happy. I'm happy to answer it. I expect in the summer these are going to be much larger groups, probably closer to 40 or 50. But now it's kind of nice. It's a little bit more intimate with 20 to 30 people.
Intern 7: [00:45:55] And I just thought I'd mention I'm interning right now at a small M&A firm in London in Mayfair. And I just wanted to second your comment before about looking at the smaller firms as well, because I've been able to already in just the first couple of weeks be exposed to so much and do so much because it's a smaller place. Right. So they'll actually get you to do a lot. So right now, I've been working on a deal because we're mostly sell side, so we're already working on a deal, essentially listing up potential acquirers and then trade comparables with recent deals, etc..
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:46:37] So you're building the strongest resume. Yeah, just just by it doesn't the name on the resume is a lot less important than people think. It's the skills you're building. So.
Intern 7: [00:46:44] Yeah. Yeah. I just wanted to highlight that because I thought what you said was exactly right.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:46:49] Yeah, I appreciate that.
Intern 7: [00:46:51] And in the interview as well, they just loved when you talk about what you learnt from the experience. I think Liam was chatting before about some stuff. That's what I found really helped is whenever I mentioned an issue, even if it was failing, long as I mentioned what I learnt out of it, they looked at.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:47:09] Tell us the time you failed or fell on your face or, you know.
Intern 7: [00:47:13] They loved that show.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:47:15] Yeah. Not giving a not giving a fake failure, actually. Talk about a time when you did fail is good. Great. Thank you, Felix. Great to meet you, I think. The other thing I'll say about that is interesting because we had we had an intern, I don't think he's on here who recently went through the program. And he was emailing me and he was saying he's transferring from community college and when should he be applying to the bulge bracket banks and I'd just like my brain like almost exploded thinking like what is this obsession with bulge bracket banks? Like maybe it's Wall Street oasis. Everyone has like this group of like, I need to make it to a bulge bracket bank. Like, no, no, no. There's a lot boutiques out there. There's very strong middle markets sometimes that pay more and have better work life balance than the bulge bracket banks. So it's you don't need to be at a bulge bracket bank. Like it's not going to define who you are. There's great careers. And by the way, that bulge bracket bank will be begging you to come work if you get strong experience at a middle market or a boutique bank in a few years because a lot of people who start to build bracket, they they don't last. They want to get out. Do you know the demand at the analyst experienced analysts to associate level? It is through the roof. It is through the roof. Banks can't hold on to their analysts because they're working in 90, 110 hours a week. So if any one wants that, if you actually want that after working in a middle market bank and you want to upscale the name or the brand on your resume, you'll most likely have that opportunity to do so if you're good. Right. If you're good at the work at the at the middle market or the boutique and you're doing real deals, you're getting experience like feel like you're spreading comps, you're doing all the things that the analysts have to do. They're desperate for bodies. So I'll say, like the worst thing you can.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:48:56] Do is.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:48:58] Miss entire recruiting sessions because you're.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:00] So.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:02] You don't understand where where you stand in the hierarchy.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:05] And you think.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:06] Incorrectly, that you have actually a shot at these bulge bracket banks. No offense to the intern. He's transferring from a community college to a four year institution. He's not even talking about going to like a a target school. And I'm like, what do you mean, you should be applying to every single bank transaction, right? Big four. And you should be ecstatic if you get a big for transaction advisory services rule. Ecstatic because you're on the track now. Yet if you if you apply only to bulge bracket investment banking jobs, number one, you probably won't even get an interview if you maybe get one or two. You're probably going to get blown out because it's super hard and competitive. They'd be like, What are you doing here? Why would I hire you over the kid with a 4.0 kids with 4.0. From Harvard. Yale, Princeton. London School of Economics. They get rejected every single day in these places. So, like, people are delusional thinking they can get into these bracket banks. Like with coming from a no name school or from like a lot of you have this huge uphill battle coming with visa issues like it's a nightmare. So like, just be realistic. You know, be super hardworking, be realistic, get the right experience on your CV and then you have a shot with the ladder. That's that's the best I can tell you. But don't be delusional.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:20] First of all, I.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:21] Was the same way when I was 20, though, so it's like it's easy to preach to preach it now.
Intern 7: [00:50:26] Yeah. And for sure, like when I was chatting with the managing director at our place. He also hires a lot of people out of the accounting firms too. So it's not like a horrible place to go start and then you can try and move over into the banking stuff, it seems. And one of the one of the guys in my first week who came from KPMG initially then moved into this. Impressed a client so much that he is now the CFO just starting this week. So he got poached. So you never know what you can get out of the little, little places.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:59] That's amazing. I love that story.
Intern 7: [00:51:00] Anyway, thank you, Patrick. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:04] This is like my little soapbox every week. It's great. I get to rant, rant and rave to all of you, even if you don't want to hear it. Emmett, did you have another question or your hand was raised or is that the old one?
Intern 5: [00:51:16] I do have another question. Maybe too. I'll try it as quick as possible for anybody else who has any. One was for the writing that we're going to be doing for the articles. Is it okay if we put in maybe time sensitive content? So for example, if we're explaining M&A, could we write something like in 2021, there is 5.8 trillion worth of deals or what you want it to be? Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:43] It's a great question. Yeah, it's tough. I prefer to be a little more evergreen, but if you give something that's like instead of 20, 21 only, but you want like 2021 and you went back and showed a history of it. I think it'd be a little more interesting, I think, in terms of transaction volume. Is that what you're talking about? Like transaction volume over time or something like that?
Intern 5: [00:52:01] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, that makes sense.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:52:04] Ah, you can give like example deal. Yeah, you could give example deals of like in 21, 21, 2022, this happened. I think that's fine. Usually I would say no because I'd like it to be a little more evergreen, but I think we're going to end up having to go through back through these articles and updating them anyways. So yeah, I think so. I think that's fine. Yeah. Make it evergreen if you can. But if, if it's really nice for like examples and you want to put the year I wouldn't use like the year as like an H to like as a whole category. But if you want to have like example, hostile takeover mandate or whatever, you know what I mean? Like you could use the Twitter Ellen example, for example, you know what I mean? Like, is it kind of an interesting deal? Absolutely. You can use those as examples. And it doesn't matter what year it's from so much as like if you're highlighting a specific type of mini.
Intern 5: [00:52:55] Okay. Okay. Thanks for that. And the next one was you were talking about networking earlier. I'm based out of Ireland and my target region is London. But if I want to go for coffee shops, it's actually not very economical to go for flights every time you get an invitation. So how would you approach cross-border networking? And then my kind of follow up question for that is what kind of topics should you be talking about with these people? Because obviously, if you just keep asking about the culture of ones, you know, they probably get that a lot, a lot, and they just get bored of us. It might be worth the time. At the same time, you can't really ask them what deals you're working on because that's confidential. So what are the best topics that you can bring up with them? Make it stimulating, make it interesting for them, and also show them that you're interested. You know what you're talking about and you're worth keeping in the loop about opportunities.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:53:55] Yeah, I think this is a life skill that takes time to master, but as you do more and more of these, you'll get better and better at reading the person. So what I mean by that, so let's let's address the cross-border stuff first or just the long distance stuff. So this is the same issue that people in Arizona deal with trying to recruit into New York. It's the same issue. Know you've got to your you have to get on a flight to to really get a coffee chat going. So the good news is Zoom's a little more acceptable nowadays. You can do. Hey, do you mind doing a quick five minute, ten minute, 15 minute zoom chat just to to meet and greet? You could always do that. The other thing is, if you're a little bit further along or you're like you have a you have more set target of like group group of firms and say there's like 15 or 20 firms. You're like, okay, this is probably where I'm at. These are the firms that are probably the best shot for me. And you could network with those people and then say, I'm going to be I'm going to be in London from these over these four days. Is there any time you'd be able to grab coffee? And you can say that once you built up a large enough pool of contacts in.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:03] London.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:04] Let's say you have. 200 to 300 contacts. Right. In London specifically, you could go through that entire list and. A month, let's say you could book a ticket that's relatively inexpensive, say a month or six, 6 to 8 weeks out. You could say, I'm going to be. And then a couple months out, you could say I'm going to be in London from this date to this date. I'd love to catch catch coffee if you're in town and you send that to them out of those several hundred. You'll probably get like a 40 ish response back saying, Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure. And out of that, you'll probably get.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:41] The.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:41] Week before you just remind all those people like, Hey, I'm going to be in town. How about we do this time at this day with this work, and you start trying to fill up your calendar for two or three days. You actually go into London, you go meet with, say, 15, 20 people because it is powerful and is worth it. If you can if you can afford the flight. I don't think it's too expensive for Ireland. Right.
Intern 5: [00:56:02] It's no, it's okay. It's maybe I guess one of the earliest ones there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:09] The budget the budget airlines is Spirit or one of those other budget airlines. Whether you could.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:14] Either.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:15] Yeah, Ryanair. You could do this like the standing seats and stuff.
Intern 5: [00:56:22] But I tried to do that a few years ago and the government were like, absolutely not.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:27] Yeah. So I think if you can spare spare the time, you're still in you're still in.
Intern 5: [00:56:33] School and uni. Yeah, just about.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:37] Yeah. So you're. Yeah, you're a couple of years. Yeah. Great. Time to go. Maybe this summer you could go.
Intern 5: [00:56:44] Yeah. I'm due to go over in May anyway, so maybe I could try and do some networking now. Some express networking.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:56:53] I would, I would try to scale it up right now. Let people know when you're going to be in town and see if they're willing to meet you. Because even if it's only five. Even if it's only five people, it's still nice to get that face to face meet up and that could turn into the one that helps you get the job.
Intern 5: [00:57:11] I mean, I am scheduled to meet one or two, but maybe I can try and push that a bit more and try to get it pushed. Five, six, seven. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:18] Yeah. Try to push it up because it's really it's really helpful. It's really helpful to have those those face to faces. And then your second question was more about specifically, what do you talk about so.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:29] Well.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:57:30] If the guy is from Ireland as well, you can talk about where you're from in Ireland. You can talk about specific sports clubs you like if you're a soccer fan, you can talk about if they're into me, I'm looking at your your LinkedIn, if they're into whatever, X, Y, Z club or group or hobby because you've done research on that or you know that, that's great. That's a great icebreaker. If not doing research about their firm is always good and you can ask more generic questions, say what deals are you on? But you can say what? How are the how are the groups structured in terms of power deals staffed, for example? It's a good question. Basically, is it one analyst to analysts and the associated VP or is it just one? One does. Sometimes they're non associate there. I'd love to hear more about what the day to day is like. And so that's good because it shows you showing a little bit in terms of you understand that deals are staff you understand buy side are you doing more buy side sell side work? Are you doing restructuring work? What is that like? Is it debtor or creditor side? So like little, little subtle questions. The nuances of the types of work the bank is doing still can show without knowing the exact deals they're doing, can still show a lot of knowledge and that you've done your research.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:58:47] So it doesn't have to be all like that. I try to. You know, you could even reference stuff in pop culture if the person is like seems like they don't want to talk about this and they're just rolling their eyes bored out of their mind. You could ask something. Outside of finance or it's something that's in the public consciousness, something that's the big news in whether it doesn't have to be big news just in the Financial Times or a Wall Street Journal. It could be something big news globally. So. You know, you could talk about that. You can talk about some things that personally have you been going through or what they're going through and just ask about life and life and London. What is it like to really live here and stuff like that? I think that's a little more interesting and exciting for them to talk about rather than just be like, Tell me about the culture of your bank. Like a generic question like that is usually going to fall flat and not not be well received.
Intern 5: [00:59:43] Awesome. Thank you, Patrick. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:59:45] Yeah. Good luck. I'll definitely try to up that, by the way. Try to get to ten people, if you can. If you're gonna be there for two, two days or five days or seven.
Intern 5: [00:59:54] I haven't booked it. I could probably push it. I was thinking of maybe two, but I can push that if I go the dates and yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:01] People start saying, yeah, well we'll meet, we'll meet and try to get it to three or four days and just meet as many people as you can.
Intern 5: [01:00:06] It'd be good. Mm hmm. Perfect. Anyway, thank you very much.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:11] Good luck. Yeah, I can take.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:14] One.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:14] More question. So let's see who's been waiting. Manase. You want to go ahead?
Intern 8: [01:00:26] My manager.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:00:28] Hi. How are you?
Intern 8: [01:00:29] I'm good. I'm good. I'm from India, actually. And today's actually my first in the internship. Welcome. Yeah. So I took the topic today, first of all, big ass buyout and I was sorting through all the three 4000 topics, which one should I took? And I went for buyouts. So I always wanted to ask like for the further topics. Should I go for a topic like which is more popular? Like maybe suppose I have a topic mutual fund and another topic that is suppose the lobster lobster trap. And so one is very popular and another one is interesting to me.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:01:09] What do you mean by. What do you mean by popular?
Intern 8: [01:01:13] By popular, I mean, like, it's, you know, it's commonly sold on the Web.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:01:17] It's like it's it's probably a high, high volume keyword, you're saying. Yeah. So you said the first one you did is buyout like a leveraged buyout.
Intern 8: [01:01:27] Just about.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:01:29] Okay. I didn't even know that was a term. Under what? So, yeah, go ahead. So, I mean, the answer really is whatever you want in us. So like, I would I would not focus on like, what's popular. I would focus on what's most interesting to you, and I would focus on grabbing keywords from a variety of different topics, some a little bit more technical, some a little bit more like macroeconomic oriented, because it'll make your when you list those terms on your CV, it'll probably make it look a little more well rounded and it'll make it a little more interesting to it won't be like just accounting terms.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:02:00] Or.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:02:00] Just financial modeling or just macro. It will be like a blend of of all of it. And it'll, it'll make you look probably more well rounded.
Intern 8: [01:02:10] Thanks.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [01:02:12] Okay, everybody, thanks so much for joining this week. I appreciate all of you. I'll be here again next week with Nabeel. And so hopefully I'll keep my voice. But other than that, thanks again. If there's any questions, I'll post this to the group for everybody by next week. And yeah, thanks again. We'll talk. We'll talk soon. Take care, everybody. Have a great week. And thanks to you, my listeners at Wall Street, Oasis. If you have any suggestions whatsoever, please don't hesitate to send them my way. Patrick at Wall Street Oasis dot com. And till next time.