WSO Podcast | E68: LevFin Analyst at JP Morgan from Middle Office... to Tennis Pro?!
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In this episode, Maxwell Peara, former leveraged finance analyst at JP Morgan talks about how he broke into JP Morgan initially as a credit analyst coming out of Fordham. How he managed to transition to the front office in leveraged finance and why he left to pursue his dream of playing tennis professionally.
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WSO Podcast (Episode 68) Transcript:
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:06] Hello and welcome. I'm Patrick Curtis. Your host and chief monkey, and this is the Wall Street Oasis podcast. Join me as I talk to some of the community's most successful and inspirational members to gain valuable insight into different career paths and life in general. Let's get to it. In this episode, Maxwell Peara, former leveraged fin analyst at J.P. Morgan, talks about how he broke into JP initially as a credit analyst coming out of Fordham. He also covers how he managed to transition to the front office in Levin and why he left to pursue his dream of playing tennis professionally. Enjoy. All right, Max, thanks for joining the Wall Street Voices podcast.
Maxwell Peara: [00:00:55] Yeah, happy to be here.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:00:56] It would be great if you could just give the listeners a short summary of your bio.
Maxwell Peara: [00:01:01] Sure. I graduated from Fordham University back in 2015, worked in credit risk. My first two years of JP Morgan transitioned into leveraged finance in the General Industries Group thereafter. And then this past February March, I recently quit my job to pursue professional tennis as a career professional tennis.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:01:25] Awesome. So we'll get to that. Let's go all the way back for starting kind of when you were beginning. Yeah. Well, not the beginning, the beginning. But let's start back at Fordham. So you're there, you're in the city. You're not actually a business major, though. You're your finance major with a minor in India, and you did really well there. So was it always like was finance and Wall Street always kind of on the in the picture?
Maxwell Peara: [00:01:51] No. I put it quite bluntly, to be quite honest, for me, I had a background in tennis. I was went to online high school. I travelled Europe and South America playing junior tournaments. So most of my high school experience was tennis focused. And then when I went to college, it was sort of a shell shock of, OK, what now? Because my plan had always been tennis first and then school. But this sort of through wrenching it all.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:02:18] Why did you change? Why was it? Why didn't you just continue the tennis?
Maxwell Peara: [00:02:21] So about 16, 17, you know, I was decent, about 500 ish in the world and juniors, but I wasn't sort of getting the results I wanted. Also, it's fairly expensive, you can imagine. So the burden on my parents, it just didn't feel like I was going to make it then. So transitioning to getting a scholarship, going through the college route, getting education made sense. So yeah, and then finance was well, my entire tennis team was all business majors. My dad was in finance, so it was sort of like a everyone around me did it. So it's just like, oh, this is interesting. This is a new field. This is curious. So I sort of was
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:00] Where your parents from. I am I picking up an accent or no, my you are.
Maxwell Peara: [00:03:03] But I'm from England, born and raised. My parents are actually both American and they got ship to. Yeah, they got shipped to England before I was born for my dad's work. He worked at Prudential and then Lehman went down. Yeah, but they shipped over to London in that span. So I was born and raised in England.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:03:22] Awesome. Very interesting background. So you're you're obviously an amazing player. You're ranked around five under the world, but you're obviously to make real money. You've got to be what top what in the world.
Maxwell Peara: [00:03:34] So to clarify, I was founded in juniors. Ok, OK. Just as clear, I want to be 500 professional. Yeah, but for perspective? It costs around 40 to 50 grand, maybe you could do 30 grand a year for travel equipment, whatever professional athlete, professional tennis player, you probably need to be in the top three hundred maybe to 50 to sort of hit that I'm making maybe five 10k. You know, I don't know the exact numbers, but once you get to about 200, you're probably making a little bit of money. You have a coach traveling with you. Yeah. Then then it's sort of like golf and other sports where it's individual, where it's just an exponential growth as you go through the rankings. But like the first hundred in the world to like three hundred, you make nothing you make.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:23] So, OK, so your parents were like, Look, you're really good. But I think college as a backdrop makes sense. So everything flipped from tennis, tennis, tennis, tennis to yeah. So were you not a good high school student or were you sure?
Maxwell Peara: [00:04:38] Let's put it that way. I go to three. I think I graduated three, two, three one,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:04:46] Horrible, considering you didn't really care.
Maxwell Peara: [00:04:48] No, but it was also home school. So OK. The standard of, you know, three one three two, if you compare it to something like the prep schools of New York or the prep schools of other cities. I wouldn't think that I still get a three two if I went to high school at the time sat, I think I was 13 hundred ish. So again, not awful. But yeah, it wasn't my focus at all
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:09] Because you're clearly a sharp guy. You ended up. Getting into Fordham, was it mostly it's tennis? Is that how you got in or is it mostly? Yeah. I mean, you would get in. Probably, though, with the thirteen hundred sat and get some good.
Maxwell Peara: [00:05:21] Yeah, I passed enough to get an education with me. My grades tennis was sort of the route that that led me to go to that school. And then also transitioning from tennis. I was like, I wanted to go to university for education rather than pick a school that has a little bit better of a tennis program, right?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:05:38] And so you were in New York? Yep. And you kind of the best place to be. You're at a good school there. Tell me so your whole all your teammates are in finance and business, so they're kind of influencing you like you've got to do this. Yeah, they're all going to bulge brackets or to like,
Maxwell Peara: [00:05:56] Yeah, no, they pretty much they pretty much like, let's see. My roommate went to Goldman and JP, my other teammate who was my year went to Morgan Stanley. Another one went to Morgan Stanley and I went to Wells Fargo. Like they all like at least half of my within a year of me graduating and went to, if not investment banking, sales and trading or leveraged finance
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:06:19] Is the path for athletes like that that are at the upper echelon or college athlete. Do you feel like there's that connection with the alum of that sport that helps you like, are you getting recruited or do you feel like just the kids in tennis were just good students too? Like, do you feel like the reason they're also successful? I mean, are they going into front office investment banking jobs? Are they going into like so?
Maxwell Peara: [00:06:45] Half and half the team went front office, half the team didn't. But I will say coming from Fordham and if we want to go that sort of route, if you compare that to some of the names of schools that are front office roles in these banks. Fordham is definitely lower on the totem pole. Yeah. When I was in la fin, it was Duke and UVA had like a huge presence. Autumn was like there was me, and I think one of the person on my floor of like 200 people. So it's just sort of like, I don't necessarily I don't know if it was more just the tennis itself or that tennis attracts people as a whole who are a little more academic focused because I will say that in college tennis and other teams, I did notice while I was playing most of the other teams that we played against. Most of the people were in business majors. Very few other tennis players I met were non-business majors.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:07:32] But you know, to be fair. Yeah. Business isn't the easiest or the hardest major, right? But you were you did a minor in computer science. I did. So you get you get some props for that. Ok, so tell me a little bit about just the the process. Like, did you get internships, the typical financing? Going through Fordham and then tell me a little about the recruiting process and how that one? Sure.
Maxwell Peara: [00:07:54] So I interned with JP in credit, my junior senior year. The internship itself. I actually there was some case competition that J.P. Morgan hosted at Fordham, and they did a few of the New York City schools. I imagine they have the same other banks do the same sort of process. My team ended up winning. And the three or four of us who were on a team got interviews for credit risk through that process. So I sort of lucked into the internship in the sense of I really only applied to two internships, and one of them was by default because of the competition.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:31] But why did you only apply it to just because you got it early on? Yeah, I got yeah,
Maxwell Peara: [00:08:36] I got the competition started. Pre-interview season, got it. So I already knew the internship was already occurring.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:43] Is that a tricky way for them to get ahead of anything else? They call it a case competition because they're recruiting kids that they want.
Maxwell Peara: [00:08:49] Honestly, it wouldn't shock me because I feel like every single year when
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:08:53] It's something new,
Maxwell Peara: [00:08:54] There's something new. Or I hear from a freshman friend or like a teammate who's like, Yeah, they started recruiting a month earlier and a month early. And it's like every year it just happens earlier and earlier, and it's just actually insane.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:09:05] It really is. It's yeah, it's like now where diversity recruiting used to happen, like sophomore year. It's like happening one year and now accelerating. It's happening sophomore year. Like these kids don't even know what they want. They're like 19 20. You're like, You want to be an investment banker? Yeah, join us. Anyway, so say you're there. You're kind of you. I'll say luck into this internship, but you still have to perform on the job. Tell me what it was like on that first summer.
Maxwell Peara: [00:09:34] It was it was tough, you know, besides our high school kind of jobs that you do where it's like, you know, you sit at a shop and watch over it or you bartend or that kind of stuff. Yeah, this was a formal job in a bank, you know, suit tie meetings, you know, 70, 80 hour workweek. Like, you know, it's a complete difference of. You know, I've never experienced anything like it, you know, is
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:00] That a shock? The hours was that the hardest part I was putting on a suit? The hardest part,
Maxwell Peara: [00:10:04] I don't like wearing a suit personally.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:07] How do I look? Can you tell? I mean, like a T-shirt?
Maxwell Peara: [00:10:09] I love the hat, by the way.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:12] But no, the hours weren't.
Maxwell Peara: [00:10:16] The hours are OK. It really they're really the opinion in the hours, I think when I first went to internship and the internship feeling of the hours is very different than the job because the internship was a sprint. It's like, you know, there's a time limit, you know, it's going to end. You know, there's sort of a goal in place. So you can kind of put the hours in the past and whatever they don't really matter and just grind through it. Yeah, I think the hardest thing that I personally had was just. You know, I came from an athletic background being in such a formal environment with that was my most challenging thing. I just wasn't comfortable, always being for lack of a better phrase, prim and proper. Yeah, you know.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:10:54] Yeah. And so you felt like a little bit of pressure. This was in New York, correct? Yeah, yeah. Did you feel a lot of pressure? I mean, I feel like with the British accent, you could just get away with saying whatever you wanted and people would just assume you're that's not true. Is that not true? No. No, you're not wrong.
Maxwell Peara: [00:11:13] It does actually help out quite a lot. Yeah, it is a little bit of a power. But then you have other international kids and you sort of lose your, your special, you know, special status.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:11:23] Ok, so you kind of coming in, you're working those kind of long hours at first. Yeah. Did you feel that there was? I don't know. How do I say like there was anything special about it to get the offer? Was the return offer rate really high? So out of the gate for the credit?
Maxwell Peara: [00:11:41] Yeah, for credit risk, at least the return rate was pretty high and I have noticed that when I was working at lesson, it was the same thing where 90 percent plus would get the return offer. It really was a more of a it's yours to lose rather than yours to win, because I think that the interview process and the recruiting process itself is so hard that they sort of wean out anyone who sort of gets at that point probably has enough to get it, like probably to experience or skills to
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:08] This reverse, then back to the internship. So you win the case competition. Was the interview process still very difficult or did you feel like we wanted you?
Maxwell Peara: [00:12:16] It wasn't. No, no, no, no. My interview was they literally told me in the first two minutes, this is a formality. The case was kind of an interview, and they thought that was enough to give me the internship. So that's also why I say luck into it, because technically I didn't have a formal but what internship
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:33] Interview were your other? The other people on your team also just granted offers. Or was it just oh, it was just
Maxwell Peara: [00:12:41] Me, it was me and one me and one other kid got caught on offer.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:44] And was that because you guys were the only people on your? You guys formed one team? Or was it because
Maxwell Peara: [00:12:48] They like it was? It was a team of four of us.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:51] They just liked you.
Maxwell Peara: [00:12:53] They like me and the other kid. Yeah, they just liked us from that process.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:12:56] Let's talk about that. Yeah, of course.
Maxwell Peara: [00:12:58] Yeah. My money's on that. Me and the other kid that and I think I remember the last name, but first name was Andrew when we were talking, it was we were typically a little more outspoken when we did, and it was sort of like it was only it was not only just analysis, it was. We had to present the case as well. And I don't quite remember the exact case. I think it was. A standard finance case where it's like, here's a company, do you buy, do you sell valuation, that kind of stuff? And I just think that we presented the case in the material in a lack of better phrasing, educated setting, we were able to speak to the points.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:37] Well, they like, were they?
Maxwell Peara: [00:13:40] They spoke less. And I and I don't think I mean, if I were to put my resume up against theirs and I don't remember too well, but I don't think anything at the time would have been like, Oh, that gets better.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:13:51] Like all of the time,
Maxwell Peara: [00:13:54] We were all the same. Like, there wasn't like they was like, Oh, this guy has like a much higher GPA right now. We're all pretty much the same spot. I just think it was in the presenting part of it. The two of us would have just stood up and said more, and I think that was what
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:08] Made them happy. Is that planned beforehand or was it more like the Q&A portion?
Maxwell Peara: [00:14:11] You know, it was more Q&A.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:14:14] So yeah, that's what matters. On the on the cuff, you guys could handle stuff like that. So it looked like you did a lot of the work because you needed because you guys better. And was that true? Did you guys do a lot of the work?
Maxwell Peara: [00:14:26] No, it was very split. I just think that I'm not one to I'm one to always speak first. Even if I'm wrong, I don't necessarily mind being incorrect. I really don't mind. I just like to keep. I like to answer. I like to ask more questions. I like to just be out and like, Oh, what's this? Explain this, explain that. And I think they like seeing that outgoing this rather than even if, let's say, the heavy part of the lifting of the analysis was done by someone else. Unfortunately, it felt like if you spoke up more, even if you don't necessarily understand the material as well. Yeah, that is a slight edge.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:01] Ok, so you. Thank you for that going back. So you're about we're back at the internship, you kind of our grinding, you're doing what type of work? No idea, like what the day was for an intern there.
Maxwell Peara: [00:15:13] So in credit risk, most the internship revolved around what they had. These things called a like review packages. So we'll be looking over companies and the balance sheet debt that we had as a firm to them, and we'd be basically going OK, writing up like a 15 ish page or 10 to 15 page package. That was sort of a review of the company, its financials, you know, writing out its credit risks, its credit strengths. Where do we see problems coming down the road? Where do we not that sort of thing. And that was one aspect of it and the other aspect of it. So are you
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:15:50] Looking at covenants and where they may be? Yeah, ratios all that.
Maxwell Peara: [00:15:53] Exactly. Yeah. And sort of going over legal documents and taking a look at the company like, all right, they have a two times or three times coverage ratio given the company performance. Is that fair? Is it not true? You make it tighter? Is it OK to give them a little bit of breathing room because they're looking to take on more debt like that sort of analysis and that sort of work?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:12] Fair. So I continue. So like, you're doing those those review packets as an intern, you're helping. Yes.
Maxwell Peara: [00:16:18] Yeah. So we had oversight from, you know, an actual employee,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:22] But who's actually reviewing those like the
Maxwell Peara: [00:16:24] The associate? And then we would have sign off. We'd have to then present them to the ED.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:32] The executive director, yeah, and they would then do what with that work.
Maxwell Peara: [00:16:37] So the package itself? And I don't know how much I can get into because it's sort of talking about JP Morgan practice.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:16:44] No, no. Sorry. So, you know, no, that's fine. Talk about just tell me, like, what was the end goal is to be able to give advice to the yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:16:52] So we would work side by side with the front office teams. Yeah. And be like, OK, you guys want to pitch X, Y and Z.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:01] We're not comfortable. Bank got it. Here's how much.
Maxwell Peara: [00:17:04] Ok, so as much as a bank, we're not comfortable. What? We are comfortable doing
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:07] That sort of thing and they'd argue with you be like, we're going to leave it a hundred percent. You're going to 100 percent. What the hell is wrong with you guys?
Maxwell Peara: [00:17:14] Like, that's a very familiar statement.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:17] Yeah, yeah, pretty much. That's kind of how it one. That's yeah, that's what I would expect. Yeah, a lot of money at stake, you know, huge fees at stake. These bank front offices are probably going to push you guys to go as far as he can. And there's that tension, that healthy tension. I'll call it
Maxwell Peara: [00:17:33] Healthy tension, let's put it that way.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:35] Okay, so you're going through this as you're going through the internship. Do you thinking, this is my career? This is what I want to do long term? Or you're thinking, Hey, I just this would be good to take some pressure off my parents get a full time offer and get some money.
Maxwell Peara: [00:17:47] Yeah, more of that. Definitely not. I never thought of it as sort of a long term career.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:17:53] By the way, are your parents now that you were they in the U.S. at that point? Are they still were they still in the UK?
Maxwell Peara: [00:17:59] They had just moved back to America.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:01] Ok. Yeah. Around, you
Maxwell Peara: [00:18:04] Know, no, they were there in North Carolina. Ok. Yeah, they they love it there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:10] Okay, fair enough. So you're this you're kind of thinking, let's just get the offer. You get the offer. What does that feel like? Do you feel good about it? You kind of like,
Maxwell Peara: [00:18:18] Yeah, no, I feel great about it. I mean, besides the fact that it's your first time seeing a number like a salary number that high like that in itself was like, Wow, that's shocking.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:30] What was it? I think.
Maxwell Peara: [00:18:33] Yeah, I want to say first, Janice, 80.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:18:36] Yeah. And so do they give you a sense of bonus potential for this?
Maxwell Peara: [00:18:42] Yeah. So at least when I, it's changed dramatically since then. But when I started, we were tied with the front office as well. We were all pulled in the same bucket. But I know that our bonuses weren't like our salary was tied to this and our bonuses were haircuts. They weren't haircuts much, but they were haircut that compared to the front office
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:01] Like 50 percent of what they got. Because they would get a front office, a front office first year was going to get like 80 plus at least like 50 or 60 sometimes.
Maxwell Peara: [00:19:11] Yes, that top bucket, they'll get like 50, 60,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:13] 50, 60.
Maxwell Peara: [00:19:15] Our type kit, I think, was around 40 ish for first.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:18] Ok, that's still yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:19:19] So we were pretty, I don't know. I think compared to most of the street credit risk of JP Morgan again when I was there. It's changed in St. Louis since then and
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:19:28] Was tied in cut significantly.
Maxwell Peara: [00:19:30] Yeah, they've changed payment structures. They've trying to reorg how it operate. I think that was I think it's in the news that they're starting to shift the credit risk jobs to different cities as sort of like they're trying to. Yeah. So they're trying to just cut costs where they can. The function itself still works and not like trying to reduce it for regulatory purposes. But it felt like when I was sort of in the transition of leaving that they've sort of they've changed the priority of the role to sort of become more of a regulatory role. And so a lot of analysts who went in and sort of like you did and a few others did where it's like, Oh, you didn't get front office jobs, do credit risk for a year and jump over. As people noticed, it was becoming a lot more regulatory focus. Kids were like, I don't even want to take the risk of going to credit risk on the off chance that because it's siloed so far away,
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:22] It can pigeon you. Or even worse, your job is somewhere else outside of New York. Exactly. You have no chance to network and actually get another job
Maxwell Peara: [00:20:30] And working from a different city. It's very hard.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:20:33] It can be done, but we've seen it many times on Wall Street Oasis, but it makes life so much easier. It's funny on this other podcast we're launching soon called Monkey to Millions. I'm mentoring for kids now, three kids and one of them is a freshman. She's a freshman at Fordham. Actually, no, I'm just like, You have such an advantage being in New York. It does help. It really helps a lot. And she's a freshman, so I'm like, You have like, she actually doesn't have a ton of time given how crazy accelerated things are, but she already lined up for next. Oh, wow, OK. I'm like, Yeah, I'm like, This is done. We're done with, you
Maxwell Peara: [00:21:09] Know, mentoring you.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:10] Good. So OK. Yeah, that's actually really helpful that that kind of trend, that shift. I hadn't heard that in terms of credit risk and how they do it. I have heard about a little bit about the moving more regional cities. And you know, Goldman has the Salt Lake City Office stuff like that, so makes sense that other firms are following suit. So, OK, so you're getting through this, you get the offer. It's a huge salary for some kids who've never been paid. Anything coming out of your psyched? Yeah. You go into now, what is your senior year with it? It's a it's a party. Yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:21:46] Last year it made senior year a lot more relaxed.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:21:49] Yeah. And then you graduate and then reality hits. You start coming into work. And what is it? Is it long hours is like the 70 80 hours? Is it that crazy?
Maxwell Peara: [00:22:03] I was in, I was in ttmt in my internship. So technology, media, telecom and I transitioned into hedge funds and asset managers in between. So my first, my first day, there it was. It was an entirely different team that I had internship with, so that was sort of in itself quite different. I interview with them and like, check the boxes, but that process itself. All right, it's a new team. I haven't been with you for eight weeks, sort of. I'm still feeling everyone out. And that team unfortunately was worse. Hours like the TMT was around the 70 ish. These were like working. I think my first year I worked pretty much every weekend and it was credit risk. It wasn't front office. So that was sort of just I'm very confused when I showed up getting that kind of experience. So you were doing
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:22:57] Plus hours a week? Yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:22:59] Yeah. And. I felt that the job itself was good for the first year, like it really was a good experience. You learnt a hell of a lot about how companies operate, how to analyze a company truly in depth and actually understand cash flows. You know, we got to look a lot
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:16] About the balance sheet. I mean, it sounds like a restructure. I was in restructuring. Ok.
Maxwell Peara: [00:23:21] Ok.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:23:21] Yeah, I understood. Like all the crazy debt structures and the side, we would see companies like going like this, like all this crazy stuff going on. But I'm sure you saw some crazy structures too and some weird debt. Yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:23:35] I think after about a year and that sort of had a big turnover rate, especially on my team, which was a big team where it's sort of it's less corporate finance. It's a little bit more unique and nuance like I dealt with BDCs and private equity firms rather than like a Nike. So it had a very different cash flow structure in a very different way of approaching them. Yeah, and very different sort of how you look at them. From a legal perspective, the legal documents are entirely different because the covenants you would apply don't really apply to a big company. It doesn't match up
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:05] Where your revenue.
Maxwell Peara: [00:24:07] Yeah, it's like, Oh yeah, tier. That doesn't make sense. But after about a year, I started one of my other buddies actually left the team and that got me into like, right, maybe I should have to consider moving. And that's sort of what led me into life in. It's a pretty natural progression. A lot of fin analysts
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:28] Have front office.
Maxwell Peara: [00:24:30] Yeah, left in front of a big, a big pool of credit, rich people who transition into less than.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:24:37] I assume that's tough, though. Is it probably everything in every single credit analyst trying to make the love fit? Yes, especially from your group even already working the hours? Yes.
Maxwell Peara: [00:24:48] The only helpful thing that I will say is because you're working credit risk, you know, you work on a lot of debt products. So we work quite close in hand with love fin as a whole. Yes. So you are you are building network by being in that role, you're building a network with your left wing counterparts. So that makes you
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:05] Say a little easier. What's the key for people who are internally want to make that move? Network Oh yeah, network.
Maxwell Peara: [00:25:11] Obviously, 100 percent like, that's all of that's all.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:25:14] But like how? How often are you bothering like, so you're already working with the team. So like, are you like just going into the office of like some MD on live fit and just pop them down for a coffee or like, how are you approaching it so that you buy them and don't see like a try hard?
Maxwell Peara: [00:25:29] That's a really good point. I can make you. How did you do? So my own experience with it was I worked on an elbow of an asset manager like a few months before I left, worked with the associate quite closely along the long nights and meetings. So I didn't go after some Mindy or Ed who, as you put it, don't want to bug them, don't want to come to trial. And also, these meetings are very busy. They don't necessarily like being bugged by someone so junior. So I use the associate and was like, Hey, I'm interested in transitioning. And he and I had a rapport with him through the process and through the deal. And he, you know, he was happy to help out. And then he was like, All right, here's a couple of analysts I want you to get in touch with. So he gave me a couple of names on his team and a sort of like I just met back and forth with like four or five of his, like his analysts on his team. And then I then he sort of let me know he's like, All right, there's a job opening in a month. Apply for that one. You know, I've already got the support of him and like two other analysts, and they can. Then when my resume comes through and I learned all of this when I went to left in and saw the process in reverse. But at the time, it was just so like. I was told there's a black. Yeah, it's like I have no idea what's going on. I'll give you my resume. Hopefully it gets in the right hands and sort of put on the pile.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:26:50] That's just who you know. And you had that one line from that one associate that kind of told you, OK, well, now go talk to these four people. Exactly. Because if I have a couple more people supporting you on the whole team, it's done.
Maxwell Peara: [00:27:01] You're basically exactly OK if you want me to get into because I did this, I did his role when I was in left field for another credit analyst, so I know the exact opposite. Yeah. And what I notice when the rules were flipped was that, I mean, there was an analyst opening and it was like a stack of 200 plus resumes, right? And how do you mean that? Like how do you even get the time to win that down, especially when if you look at all the resumes, about one hundred of them have three eight three nine four O's. So then how do you know these top tier candidates? And then you got like a bunch of them or Ivy Leagues and a bunch of them, it's just like, how do you even approach trying to get the list down? Do you even conduct interviews? And that's where that associate vouchers for that one kid or that MD is like. He went to my school and that's when the networking really comes into play, is
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:49] That do you feel like the kids in the outside have an advantage over the internal transfers because you were going to go reset and go back to first year analysts,
Maxwell Peara: [00:27:56] Right? I did reset and go back to
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:27:57] First year master. You write, they force you to. Yeah, because they know you want it. They know they can feel that they have.
Maxwell Peara: [00:28:03] They have all. They have all the leverage at hand to make you do it.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:06] So you. Yet even with that, every single credit analyst wants to get it to love fan or any front office job. And so they all apply. Plus, you have just the crazy amount of applications from externally coming in. Yep. Yeah, that's for a lateral roll. No, it's for first year analyst role.
Maxwell Peara: [00:28:23] Yes. Yes, it's lateral in the sense that you're moving within the bank, but it's it was resetting yourself to a first year.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:30] No, but like I'm saying, there's two hundred resumes. You're talking about that. Like, how do you even cut through all of that? Yeah. Is that for just looking at the people in thought that was?
Maxwell Peara: [00:28:39] Yeah, that was oh no. That was for internal and external. That was like internal two hundred. And then they did. They did a first wave process of internal and they opened it up to external as well. And it was again another nice chunk of resumes.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:28:50] But then how did you end up? How many did they bring over? Just one.
Maxwell Peara: [00:28:54] So I did the process with another by on my exact team, which we then got our our old team kind of got in trouble for because they got mad that left them with stealing people because there's two of us in the exact month after month, but it was like it was there was. For analysts openings and left thin across a three different groups. And it was 800 resumes. Um, and they weaned it down to like I think the first set of interviews was maybe 40 kids. Ok. And so again, it's sort of like if it's still to go to if
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:32] You get selected for
Maxwell Peara: [00:29:33] The first. Yeah. And it's like if you don't have that associate with that VP or that ED to be like, oh, he went to my school great. Or if you've not never with them, there is a high likelihood that your resume may never even get looked at like even if you submit it. Yeah, there still was a big chance that the staffer doesn't have the time downloads like 50th resumes and says, OK, hey, we'll start with this stack and we won't even get to that stack, you know what I mean?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:29:56] Yeah. So I think it's an important lesson to, you know, always.
Maxwell Peara: [00:30:00] A little bit.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:00] Unfortunately, it is. It is. Do you think it's going to always be like that? Or do you think like technology is going to eventually be able to like do something because a resume is just a piece of paper? I mean, there's a review. Have you heard of those video interviews, the higher reviews? Yeah. It's like trying to read your facial cues and stuff like what kind of person? I don't know if I buy it, but it's kind of interesting.
Maxwell Peara: [00:30:24] I don't know if it will transition in our lifetime. Yeah, because I feel like people are too comfortable with that setting. And also, it's still a personal business. You still have to have connections with you at the human beings. And so. The networking world, it's not going away. People are always going to network
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:42] And they're always going to like hiring people they like.
Maxwell Peara: [00:30:44] Exactly how would you be like, Oh, does that candidate who I don't know who's got a fantastic resume and that kind of do I know he's got a good resume? But I know him personally.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:30:52] So tell me about this interview process internally. So you get you get you're one of those 40 kids initially selected for. Yeah. And does your credit team know about this yet or how is it like? Is it my
Maxwell Peara: [00:31:02] Manager does not my whole team? I spoke to him.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:06] I gave them a heads up. Yeah, were you told to give him a heads up or were you did you do that on your own?
Maxwell Peara: [00:31:13] I did that on my own because I had a good rapport with my manager at the time, but I was then told in the interview process actually at the end of it to be like, we're going to call once it was all done, we're going to call your manager for feedback. Does he know? So I would advise if those people who are battling or trying to get into these jobs and you have a manager, just read the room. If your manager is very comfortable and you like them, please give them a heads up because they definitely don't want to get a phone call out of the blue and get completely slightly out of the night. Oh, I'm glad he's leaving. Yeah, yeah, OK. But it wasn't necessarily forced.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:31:52] Ok, so luckily, he was supportive. Yes, luckily. And you make the transition and is it? Is it very different now you get into the love and group? Is it similar work or more interesting, more modelling? What's it like?
Maxwell Peara: [00:32:07] It's more interesting, for sure. I think I mentioned earlier on while I was there near the end, the credit roll was transitioning into sort of a regulatory focus. So while in the beginning it was a lot of corporate finance, by the end I was doing a lot more admin regulatory related work. So my load of actually working on companies and how they operate, so to dwindle. So when I transitioned over, it was a nice refresher. Ok, I'm actually working on companies, understanding them, figuring them out, that kind of stuff. Got it. But I think the biggest transition for me was from left in left in was there was a lot of capital markets work that I had no exposure to before and the interview process, they actually asked me about it and I told them I was like, I'll be honest with you guys. I have no idea about anything to do with capital markets, but it's a big reason why I want to come on the team because I don't have that knowledge and I really want that knowledge.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:32:59] Ok, so what did you feel like? Was it really steep learning curve again, like when you joined or did you
Maxwell Peara: [00:33:05] The quote unquote, the deal material where it's like a company comes in, analyse its cash flows, model it out, pitch the company, go back and forth, create a deck. That stuff wasn't actually that much of a learning curve that was just sort of the credit. And I think that's why the credit risk roll lends itself to people going to left and right after it, because that part of it was kind of very similar. It was the capital market stuff for me where it was, you know, pitching bonds and pitching loans at a certain price points and understanding the interest rates. That stuff for me was brand new and that's where I had, I think, the hardest learning curve to get over.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:33:41] How would you say people should prep for that? Is there any way to prep for that?
Maxwell Peara: [00:33:45] Oh, I mean, I tried. It didn't help too much, but they also fully expected it, which was nice. Like, the team was very aware that it is a very different way of thinking about things. And so they didn't expect you to have that knowledge coming in. So they gave you a lot of time to sort of figure it out. I would say. What help for me was, you know, the typical Wall Street Journal looking at bonds and trying to read the economy and looking at interest rates and trying to just trying to really understand the relationship between the debt markets and the economy and how if one changes, the other one goes. I did also have a really good friend at the time who was in a research, so I bugged him a hell of a lot with all of my questions to try and be like, Help me understand markets better. Yeah, but again, most of the learning was done on the job.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:36] Cool. Ok, so you're kind of there. You're still working long hours, I assume.
Maxwell Peara: [00:34:41] Yeah, it was kind of fun.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:34:44] Was it worse? Was it even longer hours?
Maxwell Peara: [00:34:47] So, It was very sporadic coverage, definitely had it worse from whenever I work with them on deals they had, it's so much worse. But I would have, let's say. You know, one week would be 60. It was like, this is awesome, but I had no idea going in. It would be a 60 hour week, right? And the next week was 90. And the next week was one hundred and five, and then it was 70. It was just there was so little consistency in it at all that I couldn't go in on a Monday being like, I know how my week's going to pan out, right? I think that was the big struggle, mainly because we had so many pitches or last minute requests.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:25] Tell me about the pitch to actual live deal.
Maxwell Peara: [00:35:28] Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:35:29] So you get some good transaction experience on your resume?
Maxwell Peara: [00:35:33] Yeah. And I did quite a few. I think also when I did show up, it was a pretty hot time in the market for issuing. But I would say. Now, half my time was pitch work and half the time was due. And again, that would transition with how the market was flowing at the time. But. And when you're working on deal stuff, you know, it wasn't just working on one deal. Typically, you had two or three deals at a time to work on. Plus you had like three or four pitch decks to work on which that's where the hours really came in. Got a little
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:09] Crazy?
Maxwell Peara: [00:36:10] Yeah, a little bit.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:12] Yeah, I remember those days super fun, right? Yeah, it's brutal. So you're kind of you'd already done a full year in credit risk. You're now kind of let's say you're finishing up your first year, you get your first bonus. Is the first bonus nice, at least after putting in a brutal year, you're getting a good.
Maxwell Peara: [00:36:29] Yeah, first year was first year in credit risk. Getting that bonus is really nice. You know, I
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:36] You mind sharing.
Maxwell Peara: [00:36:38] Yeah, I was. An MBE plus, I don't know if that means anything.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:36:44] It's like a. Oh, like your middle,
Maxwell Peara: [00:36:48] Middle and middle of the pack isn't all like the middle of the pack was that I wasn't the top bucket. I was like between middle and yeah, between middle and top bucket. I think my first year, I think my first year was thirty four, thirty five and then my second year I ended up in the same spot and I got 50 and then I transitioned over to 11. So that was getting a bonus. Definitely helps a lot. I think one thing that all of us did as a group, which I don't advise any people who are currently in finance doing is to calculate your hourly wage. It just makes you depressed as well. It just really ruins your mood. You have friends. You work in other industries, working a nice nine to five and they make way more than you on
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:36] An hourly wage. Yeah, that's funny. Don't do that for all the listeners out there.
Maxwell Peara: [00:37:42] It just hurts.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:37:43] Yeah, you can't look at the I see it as really a learning experience, so tell me. So obviously, obviously, it's not sustainable to keep working at this rate. Yeah. For all the most, unless maybe the people who just love, love, love the work and just see it because of life, lifetime bankers or else. Well, it would put up with it, but tell me, like, when did you start thinking of, Hey, I need to change gears or I'm looking to do something so sort of creeping into your head and kind of what you looked at? Do you? Yes. Private equity, were you? What was the thought process?
Maxwell Peara: [00:38:19] So it's a little bit mixed up with the whole tennis thing, but. I sort of before even getting the left hand job, I was in a transition period. All right. Do I stay in banking of the year, improve the resume or do I quit now and just start playing tennis? And at the time, the way I thought about it was. And my resume showed credit risk it didn't show for an office a show credit JP Morgan, the name itself is good, but the fact that it was lacking front office would mean that if and when I do come back to the financial world after tennis, it doesn't help. It's not as impactful as, let's say, Oh, I got to work in a front office role in my working life.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:39:02] One hundred percent agree your super symmetric do those two years of
Maxwell Peara: [00:39:05] So yeah, so like, well, no, you can. You can, you can take it, you know?
Maxwell Peara: [00:39:11] Exactly. So a bigger probably the biggest reason of why transition to Levin was it was for me, it's my Plan B. You know, I knew going into Levin, I was going to quit after a year, year and a half or whatever it was to go play tennis. I just wanted to have that experience to learn what I wanted to learn. Have it on the resume because if I'm being frankly honest, I'm twenty six trying to pursue a career professional athlete. You happen to think the odds are really in my favor. The odds are super stacked against me, so I tried to be like, All right. If I'm being just realistic, getting that resume experience, getting that job experience, getting the network and the connections that I built through the left field position, if I do come back to finance in three, four or five years or if I go back to private equity or try and go, some of the role I do have, like you said, I have the proof that I was able to do it. And it just makes that transition a lot easier.
Maxwell Peara: [00:40:05] No. Yeah, for sure, one hundred percent. That makes a ton of sense. I think it was really smart for you to get that front office. I can tell you you'd be in super high demand if you were like, Hey, I want to come back and you know how many people want, like experienced analysts with like two or three, but you would have no trouble. Yeah, there's tons of lateral positions at solid boutique banks that would give you a lot. So even middle market or even bulge bracket? Yeah, with the proper networking. So, OK, so you're you kind of had this plan, did your team know that you were kind of going to end it?
Maxwell Peara: [00:40:38] So actually, my credit risk manager knew because I was close with him. My team didn't know until about my last s00ix months and then I told my staffer. And as we spoke, I think we mentioned it really early on when they hire you and they make you a first year. They have all the cards at hand because they know you want to transfer. I didn't want to risk my chances of not even getting the position by being like, Hey, I'm going to dip in a year.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:04] Right. Makes sense, so you kind of you walked into your staffers and you say, Hey, I'm going to go play professional tennis. How did that go?
Maxwell Peara: [00:41:12] Actually, my leaving went really well. I had like full support for my entire team. Everyone was super happy. It was a nice way. It was a nice experience versus and I feel bad for all of my other friends who left Levin after a year or two, and they had a really crappy experience in anything.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:31] Why? Why is that? Why was this such a bad year for them?
Maxwell Peara: [00:41:35] It was sort of a lot of the senior folks believe that it was a longer than a year commitment. And so people who left before two year mark, they just sort of said and especially if they left to private equity or credit funds or whatever, they just were upset that they sort of put the time in the effort to train them. And then they left after a year.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:41:53] So they basically be screaming at you like, you're dead to me, you're dead.
Maxwell Peara: [00:41:57] Yeah, you can go that way. It's some form. It's basically some form of that.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:03] Got it. So they were supportive. So tell me about that first, that first day, not going into the office. Well, first off, well, actually before before. Tell me about. Like, had you been training at all, had you been playing tennis at all through this whole so.
Maxwell Peara: [00:42:18] So yeah, so...
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:20] I think your Mike might be unplugged a little bit and a little bit of a little bit of feedback or
Maxwell Peara: [00:42:25] I don't know any...
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:42:26] Better. Yeah, I think it might be your internet connection. It's fine. I can hear you fine. I think it's coming through OK, but so continuously tell me about like, were you training during the I don't think you need to hold it. I think it's just the connection internet connection. But.
Maxwell Peara: [00:42:36] Gotcha. Yeah. So I was training from about. I was training before I left left. Before I left credit, I was starting to train. Unfortunately, what a desk job will do to you quite quickly is. It will ruin your body. And so within my first two months of training, I got hurt and I spent about a year and a half just going through rehab and getting into shape and getting back into it and that whole nine yards.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:02] And so I think I would. You do like tearing ACL or something?
Maxwell Peara: [00:43:06] Nothing is actually sort of a weird injury. I got tendonitis in my knees and then. I forget the exact medical phrase, but long story short, my left hip just sort of lost muscle control from, I guess, sitting all day long. And so it was just a compounding of like I wasn't able to control the left, my left hip very well.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:43:32] And so your thyroid, you everything gets really painful. If your body's going to be a mess after playing tennis, you're playing.
Maxwell Peara: [00:43:43] Yeah, so I spent about a year and a half just getting through that injury. I will say that. I had to quit because I would have loved to have stayed working and practice and trained because I would have had money coming in rather than where I am right now. Yeah, but I could only do the physical like I was in the gym. Like I say, my workday was. Eight to 10. I would get up and I work out from like five to seven. Go to work and then I work out again from like seven to eight or eight to nine and go back to the office. So that was my sort of my time in there. Yeah, my time and left. Then I were not my first few months because I was just getting the new role. But after a few months, I was doing a morning workout and then an evening one, or I go play tennis and come back to the office or work from home and log in. But I realized that I wasn't really able to get more than five six hours a week at the absolute most while working. So I kind of had to quit because there was no way I could make both work. Otherwise, I would have loved it. I could have gotten paid, you know, close like low six figures and trained at the same time. It's been great. Financially, it would be amazing shape.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:44:52] Yeah. So, OK, so you're basically going through all this. You're you quit. You get a little injury. You get you're dealing through that. You're rehabbing. Tell me, how how's it going right now?
Maxwell Peara: [00:45:03] It's going well. I fortunately again, I managed to get injured, which is, I guess, part of the whole transitioned into it again. Yeah, different part of the body. But my shoulder this time. But you know, I'm on the court two hours a day. I'm working out three hours, two three hours and including of rehab, as well as like weights, hoping to play my first tournament, my professional tournament, March April. But it's been, I think the biggest struggle that I've had is. Having a job where you got about two and a half three grand a pay check every two weeks to now just having negative and just a bank account just continue to go down.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:45] So what's the point? How are you going to on?
Maxwell Peara: [00:45:48] Well, probably working with you guys. Yeah.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:45:50] You know, I have
Maxwell Peara: [00:45:52] A variety of odd jobs that I do on the side. I tutor. I'm working part time with my cousin in his retail business. Other stuff for you guys. I string rackets. But those are all just sort of temporary ones to help. The plan is sort of play a first few tournaments, get a few wins under the belt and then use both the network that I have built in finance over the years in New York, as well as the network. I'm building down here to help get sponsorships and sort of working through that because as of right now, it's just sort of I'm burning my own savings and that's sort of the plan going in was to do that. There was no other way to go about it. Yeah, but I will eventually need to have sponsorships who can help support because I can't make enough money on the side as a part time role to offset the burn like my expense burn on a day to day basis.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:46:44] So tell me a little bit about. Are there any programs I'd be curious to hear? So there's I know, obviously, like most athletes are just sponsored, right? Yeah. And so the goal is to get up to a certain level where they want to sponsor you because you have an exposure and blah blah blah. Is there any program similar to how have you heard of these things where college students will, like, sell a future part of their? Is there anything where athletes can sell a few?
Maxwell Peara: [00:47:07] Actually, it's funny. You mention that I want to say NPR or I've heard of Freakonomics. Yeah, one of those guys had a podcast literally on a company doing this. Yeah, and I've reached out to that company if they would do it for tennis players, because right now, I think they do. They do baseball. And I want to say football, and they do grad school kids where they have like a pooled income and like pay-out. If one person does really well to sort of help make it so much less of a home run like a home run chance. They didn't mention they have tennis, but I did reach out. So I just like any chance you're interested in doing tennis players. This would be fantastic.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:47:44] Yeah, it's interesting because it's the same sort of economics where it's like, if you do get to the top 50 or top hundred in the world, you're getting paid. What are you getting paid a couple million a year?
Maxwell Peara: [00:47:54] No, depends. If you are a marketable brand, you could be top hundred and make a couple mil like if you have a good presence, good sponsorship, you come from a unique country. You could sort of be that country's whatever. You probably be making million dollar range and sponsorship and prize money in the top 50. You'll probably start to. That's so hard to get there.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:48:17] Yeah, it's where do you think you're reasonable to?
Maxwell Peara: [00:48:21] The goal is three years to hit about three hundred in the world and that sort of like my marker of all right. Let's evaluate. Should I keep pushing it if I don't get a 300, maybe I wasn't quite good enough to make it. I would love to be in the top 10. I mean, God, they'd be fantastic. But I'm also trying to be realistic as I'm getting older of I have age in my body, plus finances to take into account. So it's sort of a
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:48:49] Secret, I guess. Is that typical for to take three years to get where we were? Yeah. Where would you rank yourself now? I mean, you don't have any sense thousand.
Maxwell Peara: [00:48:59] About a thousand, I guess. Yeah, roughly like roughly a thousand because it does take it does take quite a while, know the beginning. A couple of tournaments and like especially like the lower increments is a huge grind because you have. Not only do you have professional players who are 800 in the world also like that range of quality. You also have the top talents of juniors in the world who are also trying to break in. Then you have like Division One players who are on their break trying to play so that that whole like lower ranked tournament level of
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:31] Buckets,
Maxwell Peara: [00:49:31] Variety. It's just such a huge supply of these like very, very good players. And as you get higher and higher, it sort of sure, the players are really good, but there's less of them. Yeah. So it's a little bit easier to sort of that first few years is very hard to break through and then it's just a matter of repeating and repeating and repeating. So that's a theory, I haven't done it yet, so I have no idea.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:49:54] So you haven't done it because you just put the injuries you've been kind of. Yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:49:58] My shoulder won't let me serve. I can't really pay a on without serving. So I've just been training and training and training and getting into better shape.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:07] So do you feel like what happens if your shoulders never recovers or you've injured again that
Maxwell Peara: [00:50:13] That would really suck? I think. A big reason why I quit was because I just want to walk away from this entire experience being like. You know, I'm good enough, yeah, I went for it. Am I good enough? Am I not good enough? Ok, at least I have an answer. So even if I do manage to get another bloody injury, I still think I would go through the rehab process of trying it one more time because I still have enough money to try to keep going. Yeah. But the signs and I don't have any wouldn't any but knock on wood, the signs are looking good that this injury is looking good, that it should be recoverable. The physical therapist thinks it's not going to be a problem. Yeah, it's just a matter of
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:50:56] Did you enjoy it?
Maxwell Peara: [00:50:59] No, I enjoyed it sort of. In my first few months after I quit trying to get back into the sport, I was playing a little bit more than I should have daily. And just, you know, I used to play four hours a day when I was a kid, but I was a kid playing four hours a day every day for a few years. I quit a job not playing every day, so I just played too much too soon.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:20] Yeah, there it's like, you're excited. Yeah, I was six hours. You have no idea how excited it was after I quit. Yes. Tell me about that. Like you, you wake up. There's no alarm to wake you up or you're getting an alarm.
Maxwell Peara: [00:51:35] It was great. I was super lazy for the first like. Few days didn't do anything was fantastic, yeah, just hung out, saw my friends, saw my friends who have nine to five jobs, who get out decent hours. I saw them, which was just it was fantastic. Yeah. And then, yeah, after about a week, I started getting back into. All right, let's get the ball rolling. That's next thing, you know?
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:51:59] And are your parents supportive of you? Or do you think you're crazy?
Maxwell Peara: [00:52:02] Very, very supportive. I lucked out very well with them.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:52:07] That's awesome. That's huge. A lot of people can't say that, you know, in terms of having the support from their parents and stuff, it looks like you froze for a second here. Hey, we're back so sorry. You had really I just said it's really lucky you have your parents like that.
Maxwell Peara: [00:52:24] Yeah, no, they've been incredibly supportive and very happy, and I have spoken with them and sort of I quit as a junior because I just seeing the financial burden I put on them when I was a kid. Yeah. You know, it's just not something you want to do to your family. So this time around, it's sort of like I'm doing my absolute best to sort of g1et outside money and not resort to family. Yeah. So it's just been it's been nice having a little bit of a I'm not entirely insane. I do have some people who think it's possible.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:52:58] It's possible, man. I mean, if you feel like you have the talent and you have, it sounds like you have the work ethic. So a lot of it's going to be grinding. I bet, you know, there are a lot of grinders out there, though, right? It comes down at some point it comes down to like it's like it comes down to like how hard you grind. But then also, you know, technique so much of its like technique. But you start you started young, right? Yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:53:21] But it sort of if I'm comparing myself to other people pursuing it, yeah, I'm average, you know? I mean, I did the same thing. I did the same process. The only thing that differentiates me from that say other test by doing this is that I had a quote unquote four year gap working in finance. So if anything, that's a disadvantage in the sense of my body is so not where it would be if I did four years. The last four years were training their fair.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:53:46] Well, talking to a lot of the listeners that are a little bit younger than yourself, maybe in college, do you have any advice for them kind of coming through? Yeah.
Maxwell Peara: [00:53:56] If you're still in college, have fun with it. You know, it's the recruiting process of starting earlier and earlier. And yes, it's important to get the internship to help with the job. But you know. Have that photography class, have that wine glass go, have the extracurricular? You'd be surprised and I know it's hard to see it from the perspective of freshman or sophomore that all of your resume needs to be. I intend and I did finance and I did this, and it's all economics. And but you'd be surprised how many interviews that I conducted or was part of the part of the room conducting it where that one personal connection, because that one kid did mountain biking where he was part of the ski club or he does are on the side and it's completely non finance where the VP was like, That's fantastic. I love you for it. And that personal connection got them the job, not because their resume was better than the other kids, but literally because their side passions in life got them the job.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:54:50] Yeah, it's so true. The intersections are so massive. That's so important. The same girl that I was talking about at Fordham, she put a I'm like, Where are your interests? Like, she had like something generic photography. I'm like, what type of photography? Yeah, she's like fashion photography. She's like, that got me like an interview. Somebody love that. I had that. All right. Yeah. You know, I think that's great. Exactly. I think that's great advice. Always have an intersection. It should be specific to. It shouldn't be some, just like traveling and aware. Exactly. So I think we'll end on that. I think is a really cool story, man. I think we'll enjoy it. I think it's one and I want to I want to get an update from you. I'm going to be following you. Your world ranking as it clients from housing up to five hundred, up to three hundred. Yeah. Right. I think you're going to get there two years, not three. That'd be
Maxwell Peara: [00:55:37] Great. So save me some money.
Patrick (CEO of WSO): [00:55:39] Yeah, exactly. Exactly. All right, man. Well, thanks for taking the time, and let's stay in touch. Yeah, thank you. And thanks to you, my listeners at Wall Street Oasis. If you have any suggestions whatsoever, please don't hesitate to send them my way. Patrick at Wall Street Oasis dot com. And till next time.
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