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Wall Street Oasis » Forums » Get a Job
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'Business' in China: Anecdotes
 

ibhopeful532's picture
ibhopeful532
      O
 
(King Kong, 1,016
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 6:37am
fortune cookies.JPG

Hi all,

As you know, a while back there were many discussions pertaining to working in Asia. Specifically, a lot of discussions centered around the perception that the rising "Dragon" that is China would soon become the dominant economic force in the world. And then there were the talks of China being the so-called "land of honey and milk". Will this be the case? I don't have a crystal ball. But I want to share an experience I've had during my stay in Beijing for the past several months that lead me to strong believe that the United States won't be displaced from its hegemonic grip on the world anytime soon.

I recently went to a chain dry-cleaning store in Beijing to get my Brooks Brothers suit ready for a presentation I had later that week. I was initially reluctant- but the store looked like any dry-cleaning laundromat littering the states. I asked them to be extremely delicate with it, and was assured that it would be taken care of. Can you guess what happens next?

I come to pick up the suit a few days later. They seemed fidgety- my Spidey sense told me something was off. After 30 minutes of searching for my suit, they brought it out- my heart tanked. In front of my, was my $1000 Brooks Brothers suit- splotched with patches of white. Yup. I've seldom been speechless, but this was one of those occasions. What do you say? They apparently accidentally spilled bleach over it. Yup. I demanded to see the manager right away, but was told he's unavailable. I then demanded payment for my suit (or at least as much as I could recover)- their response: "There's no way" (in Chinese). I panicked. I called the police and they told me they don't deal with these situations. I called my uncle who is a corporate attorney in China. He told me that the only way to realistically get these guys to compensate would be to hire some "大哥's" (Big Brothers) and intimidate them. He offered to call his cop friends to "intimidate" in an unofficial capacity. Ultimately, two guys came out from the basement of the store, and told me forcefully to leave the premises. Needless to say, I never got compensated for that suit.

Summarily, just wanted to give everyone who perhaps has never had the chance to work in China some perspective. China, for the foreseeable future, is a society governed by “人情”- relationships, and power hierarchy. It is a society in which the rich and well-connected routinely mold, bend, and break laws to further their own self interests. It is a country where who-you-know is often a sufficient condition to do whatever you need. All people, from the poor, to the rich,live in fear. They fear a change to the status-quo of the power hierarchy.

Do some of these problems exist in the United States as well? Yes. They exist in all societies. But, there's one fundamental difference between China and the United States. US society is governed by the rule of LAW. Personalities will always have an influence on society,but they do so within the bounds of what is allowable by Law. And if the Law is violated, every person seek legal reprisal.

Anyway, just a rant. Still pissed off about that suit.

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Tags:
  • china
  • Get a Job
ElijahPrice's picture

They don't call it Guanxi for

ElijahPrice
      IB
 
(Orangutan, 282
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 1:39am

They don't call it Guanxi for nothing.

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KC's picture

should have intimidated

KC
      IB
 
(Chimp, 12
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 1:42am

should have intimidated

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PiperJaffrayChiang's picture

The US will be the dominant

PiperJaffrayChiang
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 765
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 1:46am

The US will be the dominant power until the end of the world... in 2012.

Anyways... I'd imagine bankers in China are more well off than 99% of the population. Are you saying that we're in a position to step on the backs of the poor & powerless there?

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ibhopeful532's picture

No absolutely not.

ibhopeful532
      O
 
(King Kong, 1,016
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 1:49am

No absolutely not. @piperjaffray.

Power >> Money in China because the CCP is an authoritarian government that controls everything. No matter how rich you are, if you piss off someone who is in the power hierarchy in the CCP, you will lose all your assets like that/

Power > Money. Bankers can have all the money in the world, but perhaps even more than in the west, they can be fucked over big time by 'big brothers'.

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PiperJaffrayChiang's picture

So this incessant corruption

PiperJaffrayChiang
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 765
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 1:56am

So this incessant corruption among the rich and those in control will hinder China from being the ultimate economic power eh? I can just imagine having to pay an exorbitant protection fee to these "big brothers" with tire irons just to walk across the street every morning. How is the situation in HK where it's mostly governed by legacy British rule of law?

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ibhopeful532's picture

Oh Hong Kong is completely

ibhopeful532
      O
 
(King Kong, 1,016
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 1:57am

Oh Hong Kong is completely different story. Definitely much, much better. The legal structure there is very mature and definitely comparable to the State. Hong Kong also has legit dry-cleaners.

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PiperJaffrayChiang's picture

I've heard about rudeness in

PiperJaffrayChiang
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 765
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 2:05am

I've heard about rudeness in China like people spitting on the ground or bumping into you like it was nothing, but spilling bleach on your expensive suit at a well-known laundry chain and then telling you to GTFO is just medieval man.

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runningcitylikediddy's picture

you gotta pull out your glock

runningcitylikediddy
      EN
 
(Baboon, 143
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 2:27am

you gotta pull out your glock like we do in the states....

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Edmundo Braverman's picture

ibhopeful532

Edmundo Braverman
      ST
 
 
(Human, 14,408
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 4:18am
ibhopeful532:

Summarily, just wanted to give everyone who perhaps has never had the chance to work in China some perspective. China, for the foreseeable future, is a society governed by “人情”- relationships, and power hierarchy. It is a society in which the rich and well-connected routinely mold, bend, and break laws to further their own self interests. It is a country where who-you-know is often a sufficient condition to do whatever you need. All people, from the poor, to the rich,live in fear. They fear a change to the status-quo of the power hierarchy.

I'm really not seeing how this is any different than the States...

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guts's picture

you are stupid. i will

guts
      IB
 
(Senior Orangutan, 387
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 5:32am

you are stupid. i will elaborate later.

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ReadLine's picture

I don't know. If a small dry

ReadLine
      O
 
(Senior Orangutan, 490
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 5:43am

I don't know. If a small dry cleaner in the US fucked up your suit do you think they will pay $1,000 just like that? I don't doubt your claim that china has much more corruption, but the US is far from perfect too.

In the US I suppose you could go to court for your suit. But that would take alot of time/effort. And if they refuse to pay after the court sentence than it will take even more time. Most people would probably just give up and end with the same result.

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accountspayable's picture

In the US, banks control the

accountspayable
      IB
 
(Senior Baboon, 188
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 6:02am

In the US, banks control the government. In China, the government controls the banks. It's no coincidence that the Chinese stock markets are highly correlated to the successes and failures of governmental policies

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AstonMartin's picture

China did not start

AstonMartin
      ST
 
(Senior Orangutan, 429
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 7:48am

China did not start modernizing until about 30 years ago, the U.S. has been at it for 200 years...what the hell are you expecting? Are India, Brazil, and Russia any better? For China to have gotten to where it is now in such a short span of time is already unprecedented. True, the legal, financial, and government systems in China have not kept up with the pace of economic growth, but give it some time. There's a reason China is still a "developing nation."

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she_monkey's picture

ReadLine wrote: I don't know.

she_monkey
     
 
 
(Senior Orangutan, 402
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:01am
ReadLine:

I don't know. If a small dry cleaner in the US fucked up your suit do you think they will pay $1,000 just like that? I don't doubt your claim that china has much more corruption, but the US is far from perfect too.

In the US I suppose you could go to court for your suit. But that would take alot of time/effort. And if they refuse to pay after the court sentence than it will take even more time. Most people would probably just give up and end with the same result.

exactly my thoughts... my suit got shrank by a NYC dry cleaner and I got about 5 minutes of "i dont understand what you're saying" when I tried to explain that they've fucked up my only-interviewsuit-in-college (okay I had bought more at the time but this was really my first investment of that scale) of >$500. the other owner came out and basically told me to bring the suit and somehow prove that it was shrunken ... yea didn't happen

when you demanded your refund, did you tell them that it was a "$1000-us-dollar" suit? any small business owner of the right mind would do whatever they can to avoid that payment. the bleach could've been just a mistake..

sorry to hear about your suit though ..

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ideating's picture

The real shocker in all this

ideating
      O
 
(King Kong, 1,548
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:06am

The real shocker in all this is that you paid a $1000 for a Brooks Brothers suit?

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CharmWithSubstance's picture

Nothing in that post was

CharmWithSubstance
      VC
 
(Senior Baboon, 225
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:08am
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abacab's picture

The future of Chinese Economy

abacab
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 852
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:31am
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BCbanker's picture

IDK if evidence of corruption

BCbanker
      IB
 
 
(Gorilla, 633
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:33am
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eliteculture's picture

I agree with Power>money but

eliteculture
      IB
 
(Baboon, 132
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:42am
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abacab's picture

China's stimulation package

abacab
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 852
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:50am
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cdnbanker's picture

brick wrote: The future of

cdnbanker
      IB
 
(Senior Baboon, 180
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:54am
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IBD4PE's picture

$1000 Brooks Brothers

IBD4PE
      PE
 
(Monkey, 33
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:57am
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Stalking_Horse's picture

Big law suits take a lot of

Stalking_Horse
      IB
 
(Senior Monkey, 68
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 11:05am
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levelworm's picture

US will be the dominating

levelworm
      O
 
(Orangutan, 285
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 11:30am
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bankingrox's picture

Honestly, that is by FAR not

bankingrox
     
 
(Senior Monkey, 76
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 12:09pm
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abacab's picture

The Rio Tinto guys in Chinese

abacab
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 852
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 12:31pm
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BCbanker's picture

cdnbanker][quote=brick

BCbanker
      IB
 
 
(Gorilla, 633
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 1:19pm
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prospie's picture

Fucking hilarious thread.

prospie
     
 
(King Kong, 1,682
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 2:03pm

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rebelcross's picture

Everyone seems to be missing

rebelcross
      IB
 
 
(King Kong, 1,466
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 2:23pm
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jackofalltrades's picture

It's cranberry juice...

jackofalltrades
      IB
 
 
(Senior Gorilla, 761
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 4:03pm

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gorilla4sandracing's picture

That's why you always ask a

gorilla4sandracing
      PE
 
(Senior Monkey, 76
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 6:01pm

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you a CEO, CFO or other executive facing these or similar charges?
Why should you go to jail for a crime someone else noticed?

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ideating's picture

jackofalltrades wrote: It's

ideating
      O
 
(King Kong, 1,548
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 8:31pm

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CarolinaHeels12's picture

actually they don't have

CarolinaHeels12
      ST
 
(Monkey, 52
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 9:21pm
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PiperJaffrayChiang's picture

Well in America you can sue

PiperJaffrayChiang
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 765
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:18pm

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brutalglide's picture

You generalize your

brutalglide
      VC
 
(Senior Orangutan, 451
 
Points)
 on 3/19/10 at 10:41pm
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h.e.pennypacker's picture

PiperJaffrayChiang

h.e.pennypacker
      IB
 
(Senior Orangutan, 494
 
Points)
 on 3/20/10 at 12:47am
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Wapping_Banker's picture

Im sorry, but you yanks are

Wapping_Banker
      ST
 
(Chimp, 4
 
Points)
 on 3/20/10 at 5:21am
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Orang Utan's picture

Pardon me, but "关系" is Guan

Orang Utan
      IB
 
(Chimp, 3
 
Points)
 on 3/20/10 at 10:19am
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Derivs's picture

I don't think the anecdotal

Derivs
      IB
 
(Baboon, 133
 
Points)
 on 3/20/10 at 10:47am
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MarkyMarkWahlbergWasAwesome's picture

You could always just throw a

MarkyMarkWahlbe...
      ST
 
(Orangutan, 289
 
Points)
 on 3/21/10 at 1:11am

------------------------------------------------------------------
"I just want to be a monkey of average intelligence who wears a suit. I'll go to business school!"

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amande96's picture

thats such a dumb example.

amande96
      O
 
(Baboon, 171
 
Points)
 on 3/22/10 at 7:56am
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Ricqles's picture

it might be just one example.

Ricqles
      O
 
 
(King Kong, 1,270
 
Points)
 on 3/22/10 at 8:17am
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Tasteful Thickness's picture

Lol at him asking for them to

Tasteful Thickness
      IB
 
(Monkey, 60
 
Points)
 on 3/22/10 at 3:47pm
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j0k3r's picture

OP: I agree with your

j0k3r
      ST
 
(Chimp, 13
 
Points)
 on 3/23/10 at 1:05am
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h.zhao's picture

Sorry about your suit.

h.zhao
      EN
 
(Chimp, 2
 
Points)
 on 3/24/10 at 1:45pm
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BigFatPanda's picture

Should have said this: Wo cao

BigFatPanda
      AM
 
(Senior Baboon, 214
 
Points)
 on 3/24/10 at 1:55pm
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jtbbdxbnycmad's picture

This has been a black eye for

jtbbdxbnycmad
      O
 
(Gorilla, 610
 
Points)
 on 3/25/10 at 2:06am
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Use and Disclosure Limitations

The Company only uses personal information about its Web site users for specific purposes. We do not share user information with third parties except when we have told users about the disclosures, when we have prior consent, or when required by law.

Use Policy: When the Company gathers personal information from users, we ask for permission first. We also disclose, at the time of collection, how the information will be used by us. Personal information is used for activities such as auto-completion of commonly-used forms and helping us contact you when you solicit information from us.

Disclosure Policy: We do not normally disclose personal information to anyone outside of the Company unless we have previously informed users about the disclosures. However, some data may be used from time to time by outside contractors, including auditors or consultants, to assist us in carrying out necessary financial or operational activities. These uses will be consistent with this privacy policy and all contractors using this potential personal information must agree to safeguard it, to use it only for the authorized purpose, and to return it or destroy it upon completion of the activity.

The Company might be required to disclose personal information in response to a valid legal process such as a subpoena, search warrant or court order.

Although unlikely, it is possible that we may have to make certain disclosures to ensure the security of our Web site, to protect its integrity, or to take precautions against potential liability. In any of these situations, we will take any reasonable steps to limit the scope of the data disclosed.

Web Logs: The Company maintains standard Web logs that record basic information about visitors to our Web site. These logs contain: * The Internet domain from which you came to our Web site. * Your IP address. An IP address is a series of numbers which uniquely identifies your connection to the Internet. Although it is possible in some instances, certain types of IP addresses may be used by interested persons to identify users but we do not attempt to identify users in this way. * The type of browser (e.g., Internet Explorer or Netscape) and operating system (e.g., Windows 98) you use. * The date and time you visited the site, and the pages you saw.

We use Web log information to design our Web site, identify popular features, and in similar ways. We do not try to identify individuals from Web logs or to link Web logs to other user information. However, if someone tries to damage our Web site or use it in an unauthorized or illegal way, we may share Web log information with law enforcement agencies. The Company may provide aggregate information such as the number of users who visit particular pages of the site, or the number of people who link to certain external sites from our site, to other parties.

Changes to Privacy Policy

The Company's features and services will change over time and our information-gathering practices and policies may also change.

While our philosophy of protecting user information from inappropriate uses and disclosures will not change, this policy will be updated occasionally to include any change that materially affects the collection, maintenance, use, or disclosure of personal information.

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  • So I just finished up my junior year as an econ major at a target in NYC. I won't post my whole story, as I've done that before on here, but I decided very recently that I wanted a career in investment banking. Because of that, I have no relevant experience. However, I managed to...
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    Should I stay, or should I go?
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  • Whats up Monkey's? I hope everyone is as amped for MDW as I am. Anyway I read the discussions on this site all the time but have barely ever joined them or posted anything. This is because 90% of the time I spend browsing this site is done from my workstation computer. As you all know...
    Posting on WSO at Work
  • Was curious if anyone has any idea what National Sales group does at BB PWM. Obviously it involves sales, but how do BB National sales groups stand out from different more regional teams within the BB PWM groups. Anyone have any experience with these types of...
    Group Placement
  • How realistic is it to land and interview / job offer as an american non-target student applying for an IB analyst position in London? I feel like they wouldn't even bother considering candidates in the U.S ... let me know what you think.. Thanks...
    How Realistic
  • Hi, I'm very curious about the difference between being a sell-side or a buy-side equity analyst. Of course, one main difference is that you don't talk to clients when you are a buy.side analyst and that your reports aren't published, as they are for internal use only. but what else?...
    Difference between sell-side and buy-side equity research (culture/ atmosphere, salary, career paths, etc.)?
  • I'm wondering if I should transfer to an ivy league school in order to get look better on my resume for i banks and, ultimately, MBA programs. I'm going to be a sophomore at a T25 private school (think UVA, Emory, Notre Dame) where I'm majoring in finance and minoring in art history...
    Should I Transfer??
  • Basically, what is expected out of an intern in asset management? Particularly, at a mutual fund? Think about 10-15 billion in AUM. Am I expected to generate ideas, get coffee, work on models? What happens if I mess up? I'm planning for next summer and was wondering if anyone's...
    what is expected of an intern?
  • ...
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  • Pretty slow with it being the Friday of a long weekend, wanted to know if you guys had anything interesting going this weekend? How many of you will be studying for the CFA? I'm hitting a concert tonight (Juicy J) then doing some sailing on Sat....
    Long Weekend Plans
  • I've been trying to score an internship this summer in an investment bank, but nothing has developed over the last few months that I've been e-mailing and calling firms all day long. As a last resort effort, I'm trying to reach out to anyone here to see if they know of any openings...
    Still looking for an internship this summer..
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I was writing an email to a fellow monkey who is about to start as a banking analyst in the summer. It's been a little over 5 yrs now since I was a wee young first-year analyst in restructuring for one of the Moelis/Houlihan/Evercore type firms (I call them the firms where most people will...
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<em>Mod note: Best of Bankerella - this was originally posted 10/1/12</em> I occasionally get PMed by people at colleges I’ve never heard of before, asking if they have a shot at IBD. Folks, why IBD? The finance world is broad and varied, and there are a million ways to...
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Fellow Primates, We are looking for 1-2 students on each campus to help WSO in its sales efforts to student clubs/career centers, and overall promotion at your school both online and on the ground. Below is a description of the position and benefits...thanks in advance for your help! <a...
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